Jump to content
Fabulously Olivier

If you could buff certain characters, how would you do it?

Recommended Posts

Surprised I'm the first to say this, but Ingrid needs some strength boys. The likes of Ashe and Ignatz are okay with their absimal strength because they're archers anyways, so you just use them (okay Ignatz maybe not since you have Leonie and Claude, but still, he's not bad, he's just not as good). My god that girl can't kill ANYTHING, she doubles everyone sure, for 4 damage.

Also Linhardt is weak. He needs more Mag, because right now there's not a single reason to use him over Hubert or Dorothea (unless you're going LTC and really need Warp).

His bro Caspar needs help too, he's definitely missing something. A good personality that is, but also some stats.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Would say Switch Annettes Personal skill to something like crit +10 instead.. Also changing one of her spells to a brave like one? Add a class which focuses one Axe and Magic, like Oni Savage to make ist easier for her to level up both. It must not be a Masterclass because ya know..

Ignatz just needs a little more Attack growth 10-15 would help him. Maybe also additional Speed I think 5-10 would do. Also Personal skill is actually not that bad I think. Also give him more combat Arts for bow. I don't know but I had some bad luck with him.

In generell I would like to see certain combat arts on certain characters. 

For Mercedes, I would have been happy if they add a Combat Art for bow which relies on Magic, takes a bit long until she can use Magic Bow and only Magic bow is a little limited...

 

 

 

Edited by Stroud

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, timon said:

Surprised I'm the first to say this, but Ingrid needs some strength boys. The likes of Ashe and Ignatz are okay with their absimal strength because they're archers anyways, so you just use them (okay Ignatz maybe not since you have Leonie and Claude, but still, he's not bad, he's just not as good). My god that girl can't kill ANYTHING, she doubles everyone sure, for 4 damage.

Also Linhardt is weak. He needs more Mag, because right now there's not a single reason to use him over Hubert or Dorothea (unless you're going LTC and really need Warp).

His bro Caspar needs help too, he's definitely missing something. A good personality that is, but also some stats.

Linhardt is actually pretty comparable. 10 base magic (compared to 11 and 12 for Dorothea and Hubert). 45 growth (compared to 40 and 55). 

 

He's damn near identical to Dorothea, with a better Faith pool and worse Reason pool. However, access to Caduceus Staff fixes his lack of 3 range. Super underrated unit.

 

Regrettably his main flaw is lack of Gremory. He can go Holy Knight to fix his issues and gain movement, but this required investment.

Edited by Etheus

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Etheus said:

Linhardt is actually pretty comparable. 10 base magic (compared to 11 and 12 for Dorothea and Hubert). 45 growth (compared to 40 and 55). 

 

He's damn near identical to Dorothea, with a better Faith pool and worse Reason pool. However, access to Caduceus Staff fixes his lack of 3 range. Super underrated unit.

I got absurdly unlucky with Linhardt’s level ups during my BE run. I’m sure he can be good, but due to cursed rng, he had a pathetic magic stat in my run. As a result, I feel like I never got to see his full potential, and I eventually just replaced him with Lysithea after recruiting her. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Linhardt's main flaw really is lack of Gremory, and that's just because Advanced Tier mages lack movement. The sexist class system hits male mages pretty hard. 

 

Bishop has a lot to offer, but arbitrarily being locked to 4 movement is going to hurt Linhardt. Holy Knight or Dark Knight will be more difficult to achieve, but they do fix his movement issues. I'd say Dark Knight is probably better for him, if you can achieve it, because he is largely going to be using Reason for attacks (Nosferatu is his only offensive faith spell).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Increase everyone's growths by 5.

Increase all classes's growth bonuses by 5.

Give the armor tree a combat art that allows units to move 6-8 spaces at the inherent cost of no further action.

Make. Bows. Atk. based. On. Dex.

Edited by Hyper L

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That wouldn't help bad units in comparison to goodunits at all (except the Bow being based on Dex I guess, that would help Ashe/Ignatz/Bernie, but Shamir would still be better than them).

Some units like Ashe just don't have any upsides that justifies fielding them (except if you're super lazy and think checking the map in advance and buying Chest Keys is too much effort), the boy could really use some more strength and also HP/Def in case you want to put him on a horse or wyvern. Similar story with Ignatz/Bernie.

 

Edited by Abundy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
57 minutes ago, Glennstavos said:

He had natural 40+ strength at the end of the game. I missed Death Blow and he still snowballed to the end. There were several enemies that nobody but him could one round with 90+accuracy. I can see why people make him a wyvern, the just okay speed he nets pairs well with how much his strength drops axe weight and he'll maybe double something with an axe, but gauntlets and War Master were made for his stat line. Every encounter was 33x2 damage with 30+ crit rate on Hard mode endgame. Gauntlet proficiency also provides 20 avoid and Healing Focus (38 HP infinite vulnerary) so he could strike out on his own when bushes are in the equation. Quick Riposte is also allegedly broken but he mastered the class on the final map which was too late to actually equip and try it.

Speaking of, his specialties make things worse rather than better for him - heavy and inaccurate axes, and weak gauntlets (both of which I honestly consider the absolute worst weapon types in the whole game)? Also, War Master is garbage - investing in the two worst weapon types for that??? H-e-two hockey sticks no. 

1 hour ago, ZanaLyrander said:

Fair, but what I mean is that while you’re correct that Wyvern Lord is overpowered, Raphael makes it especially so: I had several Wyvern Lords in my GD playthrough and Raphael was outperforming most of them. He is so monstrously strong and durable, with the class fixing his lacking speed, he became unstoppable. His low speed was the only thing keeping him from being an absolute monster, with that problem out of the way, he was like a runaway bus, anything in the way was just paste. And even before I got him to Wyvern Lord, he was a good tank, and could shrug off hits like nobody’s business. The one on my team who was useless was Ignatz, who, by virtue of shitty stat growths and bad rng, was completely useless.

Speaking of tanking, I find it hard for him to tank because he's doubled so often, especially compared to Byleth, Hilda, and Leonie, who seldom have to put up with eating two attacks in whatever combat they face. Long story short, I find it hard to use him for tanking when he takes more hits than a Britney Spears video, and he's not exactly laughing those hits off.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Shadow Mir said:

Speaking of, his specialties make things worse rather than better for him - heavy and inaccurate axes, and weak gauntlets (both of which I honestly consider the absolute worst weapon types in the whole game)? Also, War Master is garbage - investing in the two worst weapon types for that??? H-e-two hockey sticks no. 

I'm... morbidly curious to see what you think the best weapon type in the game is. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Shadow Mir said:

Speaking of tanking, I find it hard for him to tank because he's doubled so often, especially compared to Byleth, Hilda, and Leonie, who seldom have to put up with eating two attacks in whatever combat they face. Long story short, I find it hard to use him for tanking when he takes more hits than a Britney Spears video, and he's not exactly laughing those hits off.

I mean you just got screwed, he obviously should be able to tank hits with much more effectivness than Hilda and Leonie, even if doubled.

If yours doesn't you just got RNG screwed, it happens, no need to keep the anti-Raphael campaign going... Don't get me wrong he's not exactly a good unit, but he does tank well.

And axes are really not that bad, in a game where hitrate is NEVER an issue, and with weight being fairly irrelevant to him (he's not doubling anyways) the sheer power of axes is perfect for Raphael.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, timon said:

I mean you just got screwed, he obviously should be able to tank hits with much more effectivness than Hilda and Leonie, even if doubled.

If yours doesn't you just got RNG screwed, it happens, no need to keep the anti-Raphael campaign going... Don't get me wrong he's not exactly a good unit, but he does tank well.

And axes are really not that bad, in a game where hitrate is NEVER an issue, and with weight being fairly irrelevant to him (he's not doubling anyways) the sheer power of axes is perfect for Raphael.

I wouldn’t say it’s never an issue... I’ve had below 50% hit chances against the Dark Knight and other particularly tough bosses before. It’s rare, but it happens. Still, Axes are definitely not bad in this game. 

Edited by ZanaLyrander

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Abundy said:

That wouldn't help bad units in comparison to goodunits at all (except the Bow being based on Dex I guess, that would help Ashe/Ignatz/Bernie, but Shamir would still be better than them).

Some units like Ashe just don't have any upsides that justifies fielding them (except if you're super lazy and think checking the map in advance and buying Chest Keys is too much effort), the boy could really use some more strength and also HP/Def in case you want to put him on a horse or wyvern. Similar story with Ignatz/Bernie.

 

More general growths would help characters with spread out growths like Caspar and Lorenz.

As for Ashe Make Lockpick raise Dex by 4.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've only played the Black Eagles route so far, so I can't say much about most characters from other houses, but I wish Manuela and Hanneman had better Skill Levels so that they can get to Dark Knight/Holy Knight more easily.

But really I have more issues at the moment with class balancing than with unit balancing.  Wyvern Lords do not need to be as OP as they are and fully optional dismounting can go die in a fire.

3 hours ago, Shadow Mir said:

Raphael: Better growth rates nearly everywhere but strength, defense, and HP, because seriously, what in the seven hells were they thinking?

"We have to have a joke character somewhere."

3 minutes ago, Shadow Mir said:

...heavy and inaccurate axes, and weak gauntlets (both of which I honestly consider the absolute worst weapon types in the whole game)?

I'm not sure what difficulty we're talking here, but for me Axes having accuracy issues was really only a problem in the early game.  It didn't take long for Prowess Abilities to kick in and patch those up.

Gauntlets also feel strangely powerful when they can be used despite their Mt being trash.  Nevertheless, I would concur with Gauntlets being a contender for the worst weapon type if only because of their total lack of ranged attack capability.

1 hour ago, Glennstavos said:

I feel like a lot of the characters are good, it's just the classes who need work.

Basically.  I was working on a revised version of the class system, but I've been struggling to figure out how to make Master tier classes work.  Said revision also ditches Brawl as a weapon type entirely, so...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, ZanaLyrander said:

I wouldn’t say it’s never an issue... I’ve had below 50% hit chances against the Dark Knight and other particularly thought bosses before. It’s rare, but it happens. Still, Axes are definitely not bad in this game. 

Yes but that's just the nature of the though boss, in "regular" gameplay the hitting stuff problem is not there. Even when you start getting into crazy range later on with bows, with prowess skills and battallions, even the dodgiest enemies just never dodge.

In general though I agree that the game needs class balance more than character balance. We're missing so many roles, and some are so overpowered that they completely exclude everything else.

tbh I think the principle behind Master class is just a bad implementation. You can't have a whole tier for "sidegrades", especially if some of them are actually straight up upgrade and everyone gets more Mov by going Master. Also the requirements surely feel like an upgrade not a sidegrade.

Edited by timon

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Axes are far from bad. In fact, given their connection to Wyvern Lord, I'd call them busted.

 

Swords are much more situational given their lack of great master classes and lack of reliable 1-2 range options.

 

I don't view Gauntlets as a primary weapon type. Whenever you're up against a boss or demonic beast that you want dead, gauntlets will make them very dead. They are single target player phase monstrosities, and they are also quite good when you need to reduce the weight (increase attack speed) of your character for defensive purposes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, Von Ithipathachai said:

but I've been struggling to figure out how to make Master tier classes work.  Said revision also ditches Brawl as a weapon type entirely, so...

That is a game I am not interested in playing.

31 minutes ago, Shadow Mir said:

- heavy and inaccurate axes, and weak gauntlets (both of which I honestly consider the absolute worst weapon types in the whole game)

And I'm not sure I've played this game...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, ZanaLyrander said:

I wouldn’t say it’s never an issue... I’ve had below 50% hit chances against the Dark Knight and other particularly tough bosses before. It’s rare, but it happens. Still, Axes are definitely not bad in this game. 

A lot of this can be patched up via linked attacks (which I believe grant up to 40% hit, with 3 A supports in range + an adjutant). Getting the full 40% might be a bit unrealistic, but you can definitely get 20-30% extra hit relatively easily.

Also the Death Knight in particular starts on an avoid tile, I believe, in a fair number of his maps. Baiting him off the tile would also help your hit rate.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Make characters who join have their lower ranked class mastered or at least with some exp in.

A better spell list for units with Budding Talent in magic.

For units with a Budding Talent in magic, heavy armor, cavalry and flying, either don't make it a weakness or make them start with a better rank.

For Shamir replace Monster Blast with a Combat Art who reduce speed. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, 0 Def Cleric said:

I'm... morbidly curious to see what you think the best weapon type in the game is. 

Probably Bows. They are actually good in this game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Shadow Mir said:

How in the name of Anankos did you manage to make Raphael useful??? Because at this point, the one reason I have to bother with him is a paralogue that mandates his presence.

If you go with his canon class grappler, he has enough strength growth to keep his damage within range of others even factoring in the low might of gauntlets, forged training gauntlets have 10 crit and grapplers fierce iron fist allows for three hits of boosted crit turning him into the cheapest killer weapon class user experience n the game. So even if he has a slightly lower might he has three chances at a decent rate to crit and I did have him crit almost every combat encounter initiated on player phase. His bloated hp plays into the gauntlet combat art healing focus which allow him to heal half his hp total~30 pt heal and he'll rarely take that much damage thanks to his bloated defense rating.

i didn't do so but Since his weapons are natural braves he benefits most from strength stat boosters and his health loves defense stat boosters and health boosters, if anyone were soft enough to need these more they probably shouldn't be on the front lines anyway.

 

endgame golden deer he was one rounding any enemy and taking no damage except from mages.sometime he had a natural quad attack but fierce iron fist was better for getting crits. You can certify him in speedier classes or tankier classes to fix weaknesses but grappler seems to work best for him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, Troykv said:

Probably Bows. They are actually good in this game.

Bows/Axes as the best weapon imo. Bows are the best all-around weapon type, and in a vacuum I would say they were the best. But Axes have the advantage of the best class in the game being good at them, plus high might which allows you to sometimes snag ORKOs on bulkier units. It helps that a fair number of axes are effective versus armor knights, which are the only enemy type that you actually need effective damage to ORKO sometimes.

I actually think Swords are pretty decent statistically as a weapon type, but they really suffer from the fact that all of the classes with Swordfaire are kind of underwhelming. (Compare Assassin, the best sword class, to Falcon Knight, for example). Basically, the weapon itself is fine but the users aren't as good as the users of other weapons.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pretty much only buffs, since nerfs rarely go over well with the average player, and are designed in a way to try and keep units distinct (or make them more distinct, if possible). Lunatic should be tuned accordingly to keep things hard before it comes out, of course. Changes to classes are needed as well to truly balance out the game, but I did what I could with only changes to characters (or character-unique spells/classes).

Byleth and Others

  • Byleth: At character creation, require that the player tag 3 skills as proficient and 3 skills as weak. Set base stats to 25 HP and 7 everything else, then have the player tag 3 of them to give +2 to (or, in the case of HP, +4) and 3 of them to give -2 to (or, in the case of HP, -4). Set all growth rates to 40, but the aforesaid tagged skills gain +10/-10 growth (positive/negative tags). Add Thoron (Reason C+). Add Silence (Faith B). Add Deadeye (Bow B+). Add Swift Strikes (Lance A).
  • Manuela: Improve personal skill to also grant adjacent allies Avo +10. Increase Magic growth from 35 to 40 and base Magic by 2. Add Physic (Faith C).
  • Gilbert: Give him a Swift Strikes equivalent combat art for axes at Axe A. Increase Strength growth from 45 to 50 and Resistance growth from 10 to 20. Increase base Resistance by 2.
  • Flayn: Change Flying from neutral to proficient. 
  • Hanneman: Increase base Magic by 3. Improve personal skill to also grant x2 Black magic casts.  
  • Alois: Increase base Strength by 2 and base Resistance by 2. Increase Strength growth from 45 to 55. 
  • Cyril:  Change Sword, Brawling and Heavy Armor from neutral to proficient. Increase base Strength by 1.  

Black Eagles

  • Edelgarde: Allow unique classes to use Reason magic (not Faith). Change Faith from neutral to weak. 
  • Hubert: For spell Death, increase might from 6 to 10. Give Luna at Reason B+. Increase Magic Growth from 55 to 65 and Resistance growth from 40 to 50. Reduce Speed growth from 45 to 40. 
  • Caspar: Change Sword from neutral to weak. Increase base Strength by 2, base Dexterity by 3 and base Resistance by 2. Increase Dexterity growth from 45 to 55 and Luck growth from 45 to 55.    
  • Lindhardt: Change personal skill to give +10% all stats other than HP and Charm for the next turn (enemy phase and subsequent player phase) on wait.
  • Bernadetta: Change Axe from weak to neutral. Increase base Dexterity by 5. Increase Dexterity growth from 55 to 60. 

Blue Lions

  • Dimitri: Increase move for unique classes by 1. 
  • Annette: Change Heavy Armor from weak to budding. Increase Strength growth from 30 to 35 and Defense growth from 20 to 30.
  • Dedue: Change Riding from weak to budding. Increase Resistance growth from 10 to 20. Improve personal skill to also grant +4 Resistance on wait.
  • Ashe: Improve personal skill to include Steal. Increase Strength growth from 35 to 40 and Speed growth from 50 to 55. 
  • Felix: Replace Recover with Physic (Faith B). 

Golden Deer

  • Lorenz: Increase Strength and Magic growth from 40 to 45. Reduce Dexterity growth from 45 to 40. Give Rescue at Faith A.
  • Ignatz: Add Point-Blank Volley at Bow B. Increase base Defense by 2. Increase Defense growth from 25 to 30. 
  • Raphael: Give him a Swift Strikes equivalent combat art for axes at Axe A. Improve proc rate for personal skill from Luck% to (15+Luck)%.
  • Marianne: Improve personal skill to also heal adjacent mounted and flying units by 20% in addition to self. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, CyberNinja said:

Basically I would make the weaker units effectively copies of stronger units because that is ideal balancing.

Personally i think there are 2 way of balancing: everyone is broken in a different way(AKA the dota 2 way) and everyone is the same. Imo the former is by far the most fun.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Flere210 said:

Personally i think there are 2 way of balancing: everyone is broken in a different way(AKA the dota 2 way) and everyone is the same. Imo the former is by far the most fun.

Well yea, emphasis on different ways. I just think it kinda funny to give everyone Ferdinand's combat art, axe edition.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...