Rhea is an excellent foil for Edelgard *SPOILERS*

[Timlugia]

Since we are on this topic, maybe we can also talk about some questionable articles on FE wiki which I believe are mostly written by our fellow members

 

For example the one under Sothis

https://fireemblem.fandom.com/wiki/Sothis

Quote

Rhea, having seen Byleth with her mother's power, requests that they sit on Sothis's throne in the Holy Tomb in order for Sothis to overtake Byleth's consciousness, however a sudden interruption by the Flame Emperor, secretly Edelgard, puts Rhea's plans on temporary halt.

Her bond with Byleth had grown so strong that she could have erased their consciousness and overtake their body at any point. However, she disapproves of the choice as it would be no different as selfishly murdering Byleth for her own sake.

Can someone tell me where does this information came from? Especially the second paragraph. I have played all four routes and couldn't find any source mentioning event similar to this.

[Tenzen12]

You could probably make such interpretation of Silver Snow revelation, but it's really stretch. If nothing else Sothis never adressed that option in any way.

Edited August 30, 2019 by Tenzen12

[Nihilem]

5 hours ago, Timlugia said:

Since we are on this topic, maybe we can also talk about some questionable articles on FE wiki which I believe are mostly written by our fellow members

 

For example the one under Sothis

https://fireemblem.fandom.com/wiki/Sothis

Can someone tell me where does this information came from? Especially the second paragraph. I have played all four routes and couldn't find any source mentioning event similar to this.

Well it probably comes from the idea that Sothis no almost all about Byleth while Byleth knows almost nothing about sothis. She also can talk to him whenever she feels like it while it is certainly untrue the other way around. That make her the dominant type in their relationship. But - as far as i know - it is never stated that she can erase him/her when she wants that.

[StormyAngel]

8 hours ago, Timlugia said:

No, Nemesis didn't start either, he was just a pawn under TWISTD.

The two versions regarding ancient war were followed:

- Sothis was an evil goddess, jealous at human civilization, launched war to wipe out humans.

- Sothis was a beloved goddess who shared her knowledge to help human develop advanced civilization, later human started war fist against each other, then at dragons when they intervened. War between different human factions and dragons wiped out most humans, with survivors went to underground shelters, some of them became TWISTD and vow for vengeance against dragons. They sent Nemesis to assassinated Sothis, then turned her remains into weapon to massacre citizens of Zanado.

 

Personally I believe the later story being closer to truth. The game certainly depicted Sothis as benevolent despite arrogant somewhat. But she's willing to "sacrifice" herself to save Byleth and their students. On the other hand, both Nemesis and TWISTD are completely unredeemable villains, making their versions far less credible.

I think this is actually simplifying things too much. I think there were 2 ancient wars.

Sothis was a beloved goddess who helped the Agarthans develop an advanced civilization, and they eventually grew power hungry and attacked the Nabateans. Seiros led the charge in that war in defending her people (according to what I read somewhere, can't remember where). To be honest I think Seiros was completely justified in that war, and the devastation of the continent was an unfortunate consequence of a fight on that scale, so it can be laid squarely at the agarthans feet.

Seiros wins, the continent is devastated, Sothis restores it and is forced to hibernate to recover. At this point the 3 parties on the continent are: Nabateans (largely unscathed), A few surviving Agarthans (hiding underground), Other Humans reduced to the Stone Age.

It is unclear how much time passes. But eventually I imagine the humans repopulate the (restored) land, and the crazy big war becomes a thing of legend just because of generations of humans that never lived through it. Then, at some point external threats arise, and Nemesis starts looking for some way to fight them off. TWSitD point him towards Sothis, and the Red Canyon Massacre happens.

According to the Imperial Calendar, the War of Heroes (Which I called Seiros War) doesn't start for at least 32 more years after that. It's difficult to say with certainty when it actually began, given that we know the history has been actively manipulated, but I actually think it's probably that Seiros and Wilhelm spent a large amount of time building up their forces before attacking. Consider that first of all, Nemesis probably engaged in a large war against the invading foreign countries trying to take over fodlan after the red canyon, since that was the point of 'gaining power' in the first place. Seiros traveled to Enbarr where she started establishing her church, and later convinced Wilhelm to join her cause, but I highly doubt it happened within even a year of the red canyon.

So yeah: two separate wars, one of which Seiros was actually quite justified in, and the other one more an act of revenge and establishing her power.

[Tenzen12]

I think it's more plasauble for  Nemesis just fighting everywhere for thirty years then him just chilling out after going that far obtain power. It's possible he also faught foreign nations, but I doubt that's important part. Either way it's true there were two ancient wars that could have actually centuries between.

1st Sothis vs Agharta

2nd Seiros vs Agharta pawn Nemesis.

[Nihilem]

I actually (after the golden route) want the dlc pack to shed a little bit more light on the agarthian vs nabatean war. Would be cool if the dlc then actually plays at that time. I know the probabillity of that happening is nearly zero because the soldiers in that war would most likely use guns etc ..... but well advance war was a still and quite similiar to FE so .......

[StormyAngel]

6 minutes ago, Nihilem said:

I actually (after the golden route) want the dlc pack to shed a little bit more light on the agarthian vs nabatean war. Would be cool if the dlc then actually plays at that time. I know the probabillity of that happening is nearly zero because the soldiers in that war would most likely use guns etc ..... but well advance war was a still and quite similiar to FE so .......

I feel like there are actually multiple FE games written into the history of Fodlan. There's King Loog who famously had a tactician, and of course Seiros and the four saints with Wilhelm could easily be another. An advanced tech Fire Emblem game would be pretty interesting, but I also sadly think it's unlikely.

Personally, I'm hoping the DLC will flesh out the crimson Flower route with an actual battle against TWSitD, and they should clarify things like whatever the hell happens to Rhea in the BL route. But other than filling in the missing stuff, I don't know what to expect really. I wonder what they're planning.

[MrPerson0]

10 hours ago, Timlugia said:

Personally I believe the later story being closer to truth. The game certainly depicted Sothis as benevolent despite arrogant somewhat. But she's willing to "sacrifice" herself to save Byleth and their students. On the other hand, both Nemesis and TWISTD are completely unredeemable villains, making their versions far less credible.

Not only that, but it isn't farfetched to believe that once they realize that they couldn't beat Sothis, the Agarthians intentionally nuked themselves to oblivion, knowing that she would use up all of her power to restore the land and people, which would force her to go into a deep sleep, which would make it easier to kill her.

[Tenzen12]

I doubt it's the case. At least not intentionally. I think they just fired so many magical nukes they got caught in it. Not that I don't think they wouldn't able, but evil I just don't think they would be able put in faith in Sothis (or anyone on that matter)  goodness.

[Timlugia]

2 hours ago, StormyAngel said:

Personally, I'm hoping the DLC will flesh out the crimson Flower route with an actual battle against TWSitD, and they should clarify things like whatever the hell happens to Rhea in the BL route. But other than filling in the missing stuff, I don't know what to expect really. I wonder what they're planning.

I think it's going to be about Sothis actually, the official DLC logo is a wolf in the sky, it's also the logical choice since Sothis is the biggest mystery in the game.

Sothis (Egyptian name for Sirius) is known as Sky wolf/Wolf star in China and Japan, it's also her special move in FEH.

So it's unlikely to be Crimson Flower related, if any it would be Sothis maybe even Rhea's perspective.

 

Besides, she also teased played with

"This form you see... It is ephemeral. My true form is… Well, I cannot reveal it here."

[StormyAngel]

6 hours ago, Timlugia said:

I think it's going to be about Sothis actually, the official DLC logo is a wolf in the sky, it's also the logical choice since Sothis is the biggest mystery in the game.

Sothis (Egyptian name for Sirius) is known as Sky wolf/Wolf star in China and Japan, it's also her special move in FEH.

So it's unlikely to be Crimson Flower related, if any it would be Sothis maybe even Rhea's perspective.

 

Besides, she also teased played with

"This form you see... It is ephemeral. My true form is… Well, I cannot reveal it here."

That actually sounds like it would be pretty interesting. Sothis is kind of a linchpin of the story, but then she disappears one third of the way through the game. But I am still going to hold out hope that they'll fill in the missing crimson flower stuff. There's no reason they can't do that and something new.

[Vain]

I might have missed something, was one of the wars during the future? Where is that mentioned in the game?

[CyberNinja]

51 minutes ago, Vain said:

I might have missed something, was one of the wars during the future? Where is that mentioned in the game?

Can you be a bit more clear what you are asking about?

[Vain]

On 9/28/2019 at 6:37 PM, CyberNinja said:

Can you be a bit more clear what you are asking about?

I was referring to this:

On 8/30/2019 at 9:10 PM, Nihilem said:

I actually (after the golden route) want the dlc pack to shed a little bit more light on the agarthian vs nabatean war. Would be cool if the dlc then actually plays at that time. I know the probabillity of that happening is nearly zero because the soldiers in that war would most likely use guns etc ..... but well advance war was a still and quite similiar to FE so .......

the Agarthian vs Nabatean war which already happened. Was it in the future?

[Nihilem]

11 hours ago, Vain said:

I was referring to this:

the Agarthian vs Nabatean war which already happened. Was it in the future?

Spoiler

 

Eh no it was around when Sothis still flied through the skies. Basically Three Houses plays in a post apocalyptic world where two advanced societies (Nabateans and Agarthans) went into a nuclear like war and completly destroyed the overworld. The Agarthans went underground and the became the TWSITD. Nabateans are the folks around Rhea, Seteth etc. Sothis (also Nabatean I think) healed the world but needed to go to sleep for that.

 

A few millenia of healing later and the world is patched up but nothing from the old nations is left. Just their underground Missile Bases. But thats another story.

 

So long story short, that war happened long time ago but because these nations were high-tech (with missiles and probably guns etc) it would be quite .... controversal for Fire Emblem..... but also something completly new ....

 

 

[Vain]

15 hours ago, Nihilem said:

  Hide contents

 

Eh no it was around when Sothis still flied through the skies. Basically Three Houses plays in a post apocalyptic world where two advanced societies (Nabateans and Agarthans) went into a nuclear like war and completly destroyed the overworld. The Agarthans went underground and the became the TWSITD. Nabateans are the folks around Rhea, Seteth etc. Sothis (also Nabatean I think) healed the world but needed to go to sleep for that.

 

A few millenia of healing later and the world is patched up but nothing from the old nations is left. Just their underground Missile Bases. But thats another story.

 

So long story short, that war happened long time ago but because these nations were high-tech (with missiles and probably guns etc) it would be quite .... controversal for Fire Emblem..... but also something completly new ....

 

 

Oh I get it now, it’s a bit tricky but technically three houses is the one in the ‘future’. Was that ever mentioned in the game or the lore? I would like to read more about the lore but I can’t seem to find it anywhere

 

it would be nice of them to touch on the subject in the dlc like you said, maybe extra chapters for Edelgards route. That would be nice. 
 

[Nihilem]

3 hours ago, Vain said:

Oh I get it now, it’s a bit tricky but technically three houses is the one in the ‘future’. Was that ever mentioned in the game or the lore? I would like to read more about the lore but I can’t seem to find it anywhere

 

it would be nice of them to touch on the subject in the dlc like you said, maybe extra chapters for Edelgards route. That would be nice. 
 

Have a look on the wiki. Otherwise Golden Deer Route gives a lot of Background information.

[H3lldriver]

Joining this because I finished the BE route yesterday. I like both of them and it irritates me how Edelgard used Kronya and the Death Knight to her advantage. They were responsible for Jeralt's death, transforming the students and who was it that ordered Death Knight to kidnap Flayn? Wasn't he a direct subordinate of the dear emperor?

 

But Rhea going full revenge trip and burning down an entire city, not giving two craps about any civilian lives doesn't put her in a good light either. It almost feels like doing the BE route reveals Rhea's true nature and intentions. But it also feels weird how there's no conventional true end to the story. Awakening had Grima, Fates had Anankos but TH? Apparently, Solon's gang is left untreated after he died. There was also no further info on what became of Kronya.

[Nihilem]

8 hours ago, H3lldriver said:

But Rhea going full revenge trip and burning down an entire city, not giving two craps about any civilian lives doesn't put her in a good light either. It almost feels like doing the BE route reveals Rhea's true nature and intentions.

I wouldnt say true intentions. Her true intentions were to resurrect Sothis go back to Zanados and live happily after. Its more like the worst mental state she could get into. Quite similiar to Dimitri in Verdant Wind and Edelgard in Azure Moon. Because everyone who opposes Byleth opposes gets a mental breakdown....

[Erosword]

3 hours ago, Nihilem said:

I wouldnt say true intentions. Her true intentions were to resurrect Sothis go back to Zanados and live happily after. Its more like the worst mental state she could get into. Quite similiar to Dimitri in Verdant Wind and Edelgard in Azure Moon. Because everyone who opposes Byleth opposes gets a mental breakdown....

Losing their waifu and husbando to another is a tragic experience.  They are just experiencing the sadness that comes with it.

[MoralityGames]

22 hours ago, H3lldriver said:

Joining this because I finished the BE route yesterday. I like both of them and it irritates me how Edelgard used Kronya and the Death Knight to her advantage. They were responsible for Jeralt's death, transforming the students and who was it that ordered Death Knight to kidnap Flayn? Wasn't he a direct subordinate of the dear emperor?

 

But Rhea going full revenge trip and burning down an entire city, not giving two craps about any civilian lives doesn't put her in a good light either. It almost feels like doing the BE route reveals Rhea's true nature and intentions. But it also feels weird how there's no conventional true end to the story. Awakening had Grima, Fates had Anankos but TH? Apparently, Solon's gang is left untreated after he died. There was also no further info on what became of Kronya.

The lords (including Rhea) in Three Houses are all a combination of good and bad traits. Having Byleth as a teacher/adviser/friend is what makes the difference; whoever Byleth supports will become the noblest and best possible version of themselves in any route, the rest will give into their worse nature and become fallen version of themselves. 

Thus in Edelgard's route, Edelgard becomes the hero who overthrows an oppressive and stagnant society based on feudalism and superstition and the other routes a dangerous and misguided radical who goes to insane lengths to enforce her viewpoint on a world that didn't want it. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 22, 2019 by MoralityGames

[H3lldriver]

But Claude is just... Claude in any route, I take it?

[MoralityGames]

33 minutes ago, H3lldriver said:

But Claude is just... Claude in any route, I take it?

He doesn't commit any notable atrocities like the other three, but he does become the worst possible version of himself (ineffective, shifty/unwilling to commit,  stuck with no way forward, unable to realize his ambitions). 

 

 

Edited October 22, 2019 by MoralityGames

[Jingle Jangle]

For me what do both of them have in common is:

• Losing their family due to crest related events.
• Putting disguises to convince people
•  Willing to lie to the public,
• Have the crest of Seiros
• Willing to change society 

But the thing that gets me the most is that one of Edelgard's biggest arguments against Rhea is the latter lying about the history of Fodlan. Yet Edelgard is willing to lie to the public about a town's destruction on a drop of a hat. And this is never brought up again same with the Flame Emperor. I'm unsure if this is a writing issue or intentional with Edelgard herself. Then again in her ending having an "unseen war" with TWSITD feels that she lacks self-awareness.

[MoralityGames]

On 8/30/2019 at 10:15 PM, StormyAngel said:

That actually sounds like it would be pretty interesting. Sothis is kind of a linchpin of the story, but then she disappears one third of the way through the game. But I am still going to hold out hope that they'll fill in the missing crimson flower stuff. There's no reason they can't do that and something new.

(a) It would be an admission they sold the game in a rushed and unfinished state. 

(b) it would tie up resources they would rather devote to other projects

(c) it could use up ideas they might want to reserve for a Three Houses sequel 2-3 years from now, which would be a lot easier than people probably suspect it is because: 

(1) they have the engine, systems, and assets ready

(2) they can start not too far in the future, before faction leaders can make any of the big changes they plan and you have to make the future version of Fodlan a radically different place from what it was when Three Houses ended (ergo, Fodlan is basically the same place with the same problems 1 year after the end of the war regardless of which faction unites the continent). 

(3) you can have any of the 4 faction leaders in the same location for all 20 chapters (probably Enbarr, with the Imperial Palace taking the place of the Monastery as the simulationist hub) 

(4) you can make TWSITD the enemy (they aren't genocided in any route and could regroup under new leaders even in the GD route) 

The game would be more linear and focused overall (sort of like a remake of FE7, with Hector/Eliwood/Lyn fighting the Black Fang, but instead Byleth and a small army fighting TWSITD). 

(5) can be argued a sequel like this has been foreshadowed. 

(6) they spent a lot of time world building Fodlan to just abandon it after one game 

(7) the cast of units was kept intentionally small, leaving it ripe for expanding upon in the next game (faction leader and their lieutenant would be the only ones sure to return in the next game, other characters could be added in order of popularity, along with new units). 

 

Point is, I think IS and Nintendo might want to reserve a lot of ideas that could be used in DLC for a potential sequel. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 26, 2019 by MoralityGames