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Self-imposed Handicap Runs


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So it's pretty commonly opined that this is among the easiest FE games, at least on Hard mode.  Among the reasons for that are:

(1) Wyvern Class bonuses 

(2) Dismounting/Remounting

(3) Close Counter

(4) Divine Pulse

(5) Stride

(6) Dancers with actual combat prowess

(7) No weapon locks.

As such, I've been thinking about how to impose some handicaps on myself. Below is my current plan for a handicapped run.  I'd love to hear some other ideas for runs.

Blue Lion, Hard, Classic:

(1) No Divine Pulse

(2) No Wyvern Riders/Lords. 

(3) Limited to 2 Pegasus/Falcoln Knights, who must remain mounted at all times

(4) No Warp, Rescue, Stride, Dancer, Blue Lion Dancers

(5) Close Counter can be used as an Archer/Sniper only.

(6) Class must be mastered before reclassing.

(7) Outside of Noble/Commoner, class must use weapon types for which it grants a skill bonus with it (e.g. Brigand can only use Axe/Fist.  Cavalier can only use Lance/Sword).

(8) Relics restricted to match crest (Sacred weapons like those from Seteth/Flayn paralogue may be used freely).

Edited by freewaffles
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I'm currently going for a no-mounts, no-recruitment run on the Black Eagles - Edelgard route. So no Wyvern Petra, Paladin Ferdinand, or Dark Knight Hubert.
Though the no recruitment thing is something I have done since my very first playthrough, at least when it came to recruiting students from other houses. I have recruited and used Hanneman, Manuela, Alois, Cyril, and Shamir in previous playthroughs, however. This time I won't recruit anyone at all and only use the units the game gave to me when I picked my house. I also won't use any Relics, so no Aymr or Sword of the Creator.

6 and 7 of your list is something I will add to my own run, too, if I may, because that sounds interesting (particularly the "forced" class mastery).

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I have been thinking about a rather extreme run I will call the coma run. The idea is unless the game forces you to do otherwise the only activity you may take is rest. When you are forced to perform a different activity, you may only perform the activities the game is forcing you to. I am thinking about adding further restrictions to lectures but haven't fully decided.

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5 minutes ago, Eltosian Kadath said:

I have been thinking about a rather extreme run I will call the coma run. The idea is unless the game forces you to do otherwise the only activity you may take is rest. When you are forced to perform a different activity, you may only perform the activities the game is forcing you to. I am thinking about adding further restrictions to lectures but haven't fully decided.

I get not using the extra battles to level grind but that means you don’t get the any of the paraloges either...

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9 minutes ago, Eltosian Kadath said:

I have been thinking about a rather extreme run I will call the coma run. The idea is unless the game forces you to do otherwise the only activity you may take is rest. When you are forced to perform a different activity, you may only perform the activities the game is forcing you to. I am thinking about adding further restrictions to lectures but haven't fully decided.

So no paralogues either.  Nice.  In C1 will you do the Sylvain/Flayn/Dedue quests?

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I have 2 challenge runs in my mind as of now.

(1) Hard/Classic No Divine Pulse, No Aux battles run (ironman)

(2) No Crest Bearer/Relic run

Considering the 2nd one on Golden Deer route, getting through the final boss without them would be quite a challenge. Prologue is obviously an exception map on this rule.

Edited by Garlyle
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14 minutes ago, iavasechui said:

But you are forced to field byleth and lord

You could leave them at the starting point after Prologue though.  A non-crest team could include:

Hubert (Edel only), Dorothea, Caspar, Petra, Dedue (BL only), Ashe, Raphael, Ignantz, Leonie, Manuela, Shamir, Alois (not Edel), Cyril (not Edel), Gilbert (BL only)

On that list, Hubert, Dorothea, Petra, Leonie, and Shamir are all solid characters.  The others will require some effort, but certainly usable.

 

Edited by freewaffles
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The only run I've seen with self imposed challenge was a stream where Twitch chat would vote on the GD classmates including Claude at the start of the first lesson plan for that character. This would also include neutrals like Catherine Seteth and Flayn. Byleth I think was streamer's choice. This run kind of showed how insane base stats from classes give and can make any choice somewhat usable and maybe certain builds aren't as awful as they seem. Mage ignatz with his high dex and tomes being almost all crit based could be potentially more useful than him as an archer. Bishop Raph's healing being carried by the bishop passives and constantly healing his own HP every turn. Hilda's spell list being useful even though her offenses were a bit lackluster.  Even more rules were added as well.

The additional rules

1. Fliers and master classes are banned. The exceptions were mortal savant and great knight. 

2. Certain gambits and items were banned like the Thyrus staff and impregnable wall. 

3. Recruiting of other house members were allowed but are only there for support and paralouge purposes. Neutral units were allowed and voted on class as well.

4. during the commoner/noble classes emphasis on using their final class weapons were used. If a character was to be a magic class but has no magic, they were allowed to use their normal weapons until they learn a spell. 

5. Characters are not allowed to use weapons outside of their intended class once you go past commoner/noble.

If you were curious on his final team it was:

Sniper Byleth

Assassin Claude

Mortal Savant Ignatz (was in mage classes before becoming a Savant)

Mortal Savant Marianne but was changed to dancer when the vote came for that.

Swordmaster Lysithea (magic weapons were allowed)

Warlock Hilda

Bishop Raphael 

Fortress knight Leonie

Paladin Catherine

Fortress knight Flayn

Fortress knight Seteth

Grappler Lorenz

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2 hours ago, freewaffles said:

You could leave them at the starting point after Prologue though.  A non-crest team could include:

Hubert (Edel only), Dorothea, Caspar, Petra, Dedue (BL only), Ashe, Raphael, Ignantz, Leonie, Manuela, Shamir, Alois (not Edel), Cyril (not Edel), Gilbert (BL only)

On that list, Hubert, Dorothea, Petra, Leonie, and Shamir are all solid characters.  The others will require some effort, but certainly usable.

I am actually not sure if No Crest Bearer/Relic run is possible or not, but I'm positive that it's challenging but possible to pull of a no pulse ironman.

No Crest challenge might rely on statboosters and some strategies with the class choices.

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Since Byleth won't get any levels, I'm not sure if you can recruit any of the monastery characters (since they are level based), but you can get the students through teacher training.  You'll also want to plant a lot of vegetables for meals and pump gifts early to get to B-supports ASAP. 

For a church route play through, you could do something along the lines of:

  • Wyvern Lord Petra
  • Wyvern Lord Caspar
  • Gremory Dorothea (or DK)
  • Bow Knight/Paladin Leonie
  • Dancer Ignantz
  • Warmaster Raphael
  • Warmaster/Assassin Ashe
  • Bow/Falcon Knight Shamir*
  • Wyvern Lord/Bow Knight Cyril (post Time Skip)

*Note: I'm not sure if Shamir will join you automatically at B-Support.  Because her recruitment is locked behind level, she might not be recruitable at all.

  1. During prologue, trade all 3 weapons to Byleth.  Attempt to solo the prologue with Byleth.  You're hoping for 15 strength and as high a level as you can get.
  2. Set goals for Petra to Lance/Flying until she passes Peg Knight (or go Brigand route) then switch to Axe/Flying.  .  Caspar set to Axe/Flying until he needs Lances.  Dorothea set to Reason/Faith until she gets Physic and then can go whichever way you want.  Tutor all of them in authority early and often since they'll want D-
  3. Prioritize recruitment on Leonie (best of the five), then Ashe (needs to have goals changed), Ignantz (need before dance contest), then Shamir (so you can start pumping flying/swords or Riding), then Raphael (who doesn't need any goal changes) in order.
    • Eat with all four of them every week.  You'll probably want to sing as well, even though none of these characters have bonuses to it.  Since you only have a few characters, you can plant a lot more flowers for gifts as well.
    • Focus all Teacher Training sessions on Lances (Dad, Shamir, Seteth and Gilbert) until you get Leonie, otherwise you won't be able to recruit her until Chapter 10.  Switch to authority to ensure you get Ignantz before dance contest.  
  4. Once you have Ignantz, pump his Faith to C so you get a second Physic.  Swords will allow him to counter attack and have high avoid during enemy phase in the event he's in trouble after dancing/rallying/healing.  If you activate Seal Strength, that will also make it easier to retaliate against anything that targets him during enemy phase
Edited by freewaffles
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Don't know about "easiest", since the GBA games exist.

I might do a "I'm bad at this" run, where the only skills I can level via Instruct are the ones that a character is bad at.  No budding talents, either.

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I just finished a mostly backwards / meme / no mounts run on church, not too bad but a noticeable tick above hard. Also banned all non attacking gambits and lord battalions. Lack of movement was by far the most noticeable thing, forces you to deal with a lot more. My team was:

Byleth (Bishop), Seteth (Hero/Boomer), Flayn (Fortress Knight), Raphael (Assassin), Caspar (Warlock), Bernadetta (Dancer), Leonie (Gremory), Marianne (Warrior), Lorenz (Noble), Felix (Sniper)

Even with that lineup I never really struggled on any map, it wasn't even hard brute forcing the final map (kill all the beasts they said, lol them). Felix was my safety unit but Marianne ended up pretty good, Seteth was ridiculous, and Flayn with a bolt axe+ was unstoppable with her like 35/30 defenses. Even Lorenz was useful through the end.

The the funniest part was losing Lorenz after the time skip, having him as an enemy paladin, recruiting him back to my team and seeing him back as Noble with all his enemy stats poofed away.

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My first playthrough was a no Divine Pulse run on Hard/Classic until chapter 18 ish. Not so much my choice but my lack of a controller with the ZL button. I was using the gamecube controller in docked mode. Playing the game that way definitely made my decisions feel like they had a lot of weight. And I may be one of very few players to have seen the Game Over screen since I decided to hit no on the compulsory Divine Pulse when Byleth dies. But then I received a Hori left joycon for my birthday and I could start rewinding for dumb things. By that point of the game the enemies were no longer stronger than my guys.

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1. No pulse

2. 2 weapon class rule

3. Crest user only crest weapons

4. Pigeonholed recruitment and classes (meaning if Raphael is recruited into blue lions with c in axe and brawling, no gunning up his e rank flying to make him a wyvern Lord, keep him/others on the paths set)

5. Follow month pattern from 1st month, explore week 1, battle week 2?, Seminar week 3, and yeah let's force a rest week 4

Those are probably the only limits I'd go

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I much prefer a Pseudo-Canon run:

Canon part:

-No Recruiting.

-Must always deploy every student from your respective house.

-Relics restricted to canon owners.

Pseudo part:

-No Master Classes.

-Stat boosters only for stats below the unit's level.

-No Auxiliary Battles (Unless Quest).

-No Arena griding, only one torney per week (Unless Quest).

-No fishing (Unless Quest).

Edited by Hyper L
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Bans

  • Banned Classes: Pegasus Knight, Wyvern Rider, Wyvern Lord, Falcon Knight, Wyvern Master, Barbarossa, Bow Knight.
  • Banned Items: Chest Keys, Door Keys, concoctions, elixirs, stat boosting items, Thyrsus.
  • Banned Battalions: All battalions that provide non-attacking gambits.

Restrictions

  • Paladin is allowed, but must dismount at the start of battle and can not remount.
  • Classes may only use weapons in which they are proficient.
  • Direct heal magic (Heal, Recover, Physic, Fortify) may only be used by "Healer" classes (Commoner/Noble, Priest, Bishop, Holy Knight and Enlightened One).
  • If NG+, renown may be spent only on support raising (for purposes of month 1 recruiting) and statues. 
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13 hours ago, freewaffles said:

Since Byleth won't get any levels, I'm not sure if you can recruit any of the monastery characters (since they are level based), but you can get the students through teacher training.  You'll also want to plant a lot of vegetables for meals and pump gifts early to get to B-supports ASAP. 

This is actually very concerning, and I thought it's a major roadblock for the whole challenge. What if Byleth is deployed as adjutant on aux battles to get some experience that way?

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5 hours ago, Garlyle said:

This is actually very concerning, and I thought it's a major roadblock for the whole challenge. What if Byleth is deployed as adjutant on aux battles to get some experience that way?

I'm going to put my BL playthrough above on hold because the Crest one is more intriguing to me right now.  I'll let you know if I can get Shamir.

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