Self-imposed Handicap Runs

[freewaffles]

On 8/29/2019 at 3:52 AM, Garlyle said:

This is actually very concerning, and I thought it's a major roadblock for the whole challenge. What if Byleth is deployed as adjutant on aux battles to get some experience that way?

Update:  I decided to do the no crest, no relic run and added some additional conditions: No mounts, flying, master classes, or Close Counter.  Hard/Classic, no Divine Pulse. Characters can only use class proficient weapons.  I just cleared Flayn's chapter.  So far the only hard chapters have been Chapter 1 and 2. 

I was able to recruit Leonie and Ashe at C-support in Chapter 4.  I got Ignantz at C-support in Chapter 5 and Raphael at B-support the first week of Chapter 6 (earned the last week of Chapter 5 but he still didn't recruit).  

Shamir's B support is locked pre-time skip, and Level 3 with C-support wasn't good enough to get her.  I'm going to start funneling gifts to Manuela now.

Chapters

I soloed The prologue as Byleth(M since I didn't care if I had Sylvain) and reached level 3, but got 0 strength growth. Used Wrath Strike a lot to reduce how many hits I took.

Caspar burned through his vulnerary early and then got killed by Claude.  Hubert and Dorothea took care of Dedue/Dimitri but ran out of spells. Once Hubert and Dorothea ran out of spells, they were chipping with bows.  Dorothea's personal was massively important before she finally died to Hilda.  At the end, I had Hilda chasing Petra around while Petra healed in forests.  She was the only one left alive. Petra and Caspar finished at level 3, Hubert and Dorothea at level 2.  I don't think this is doable as any other house since you'd have fewer units and no healing at all.

Chapter 2 took me 24 turns, because I had to be very cautious.  I wasn't able to get heal on Dorothea yet, so I was still reliant on her personal and she only had 5 uses of Thunder.  A 9 def Caspar and 7 def Petra were my only tanks.  Byleth opened the chest for the bullion, but otherwise wasn't near by as I didn't want to activate his exp no us on the others.

Chapter 3 was smooth as I had heal on Dorothea (though not as a Monk so limited uses).  I had Leonie as my "helper" student, but didn't end up using her at all. Petra and Caspar were fighters already and handled most of the map.  Catherine took care of a lot of enemies, and I got Dorothea to level 5.

I ignored DK in chapter 4 since I'm going church route and won't have Hubert.  Nearly ran out of turns because I couldn't split group for both chests.

Chapter 5 was easy.  Dorothea had Physic and Thoron by this point.

Chapter 6 was a breeze.  Once again ignored DK.

My team currently looks like this:

15 Petra: Fighter with C swords, C axes, D+ Bow, and C authority. -> Going to go Merc after Deathblow for Vantage then Warrior for rest of game.

15 Dorothea: Mage with C Faith, C+ Reason, D Authority, D Armor, will stay Warlock for double Meteor and Black Tome.

15 Caspar: Fighter with C Axes, D+ Swords, C Armor, D Fists, D Authority-> going to get him Wrath then switch to Hero for the rest of the game.

15 Leonie: Archer with C Lance (can't use under rules), D Authority, C+ Bows.  -> Will be a sniper

15 Raphael: Fighter with C fists, C axes, D armor.  Will be a Grappler.  Might go Fortress Knight if I have to keep playingturtle

14 Ashe: Fighter with C axes, D+ Fists, C Bow, D+ Authority. -> Probably will end up a warrior or Sniper, not sure yet though.

14 Ignantz: Merc with C Swords, C Bows, D Faith. -> Will be dancer with second Physic or possibly.

 

[Rapier]

All I did to make my run 'harder' was to ignore Warp altogether (Rescue is fine though), avoid any extra battles that are not paralogues, avoid forging, forget about passing exams for stat bonuses for a class I won't use, avoid abusing battalions' gambit abilities (I kept basic E Authority battalions for my entire GD run).

It was fun enough for me, even though the game still isn't "hard".

[Garlyle]

Wow, so the first chapters are very harsh on no crest run. Keep this updated if you continue on.

[charcoalswift]

A "purist" run

- no divine pulse

- no save scum

- no online

- no recruits, use only default House members

- always Skip month

 

[MilodicMellodi]

When I get my Switch back from my girlfriend, I'm going to be doing a Beginner Emblem run. I'll also be restricting myself to allowing each unit only the first movement skill they get, as well as a "master class before switching" rule (so if they class into Monk first, they'll be inevitably restricted to Draw Back and won't be allowed to switch it to Reposition when they master Soldier). Depending on how difficult it ends up being, I might allow myself to have one of my units as a Dancer, as long as they remove Special Dance when they master the class.

In addition, I'll do it on Hard Mode so I don't get the temptation to grind. Obviously, the run ends when I'm forced to switch from Hard to Normal. If it ends up being too easy, I'll also restrict myself to, say...1 student per house, for 2 students in total, and only 1 teacher for a total of 3 max recruits.

Essentially, they'll mainly have to rely on their own growths to stay relevant. I think I'll do it as Black Eagles, and if it's too easy I'll restrict myself to recruiting Felix and either Leonie or Lysithea, with Shamir as the teacher. This should be fun!

EDIT: I could also do it on Blue Lions to make early game a little easier with Dedue's PS...in that case, I'd change the recruits to Lysithea and either Caspar or Linhardt, with Catherine as the teacher.

Edited August 31, 2019 by MilodicMellodi

[freewaffles]

19 hours ago, Garlyle said:

Wow, so the first chapters are very harsh on no crest run. Keep this updated if you continue on.

After Chapter 6, I used Byleth as an adjutant on two auxillary maps.  Got him to Level 12, which was good enough to snag Shamir and Manuela.  Rest of Part 1 was easy, probably because I was over leveled by using a reduced team. 

I just cleared first level of time skip, which was was so hard I gave up on the "no Divine Pulse" rule. I started to wonder if this level was even possible without a leveled up Byleth.  Enlightened one only has 12 base defense and 14 speed.  All the rogues could double him with silver swords for 13 x2 damage while he was in a forest.

Turn 1 flew Seteth (the only flying I've used all run, and immediately dismounted him after that) to the bottom left corner to hide and put Byleth in the tree SW of starting position.  Because he gets doubled anyway, I pulled a steel shield out of the convoy for Byleth. Dorothea, Caspar, and Petra arrive on T2.  Goal was to get them to Byleth ASAP and plug the hallway.  I did manage to get all the chests though.

Linhardt, Ferdie and Bernie arrived in the NW corner and didn't move.  I lost Linhardt to an Archer but oh well.

Current Squad:

Caspar: 31 Hero - Wrath, Batallion Wrath, Death Blow, Weight -3, Sword Prowess 3.  He certified as a Fortress Knight for defense bump.

Dorothea: 31 Warlock - Magic +2, Reason 5, fiendish Blow, Bowbreaker, Weight - 3. 

Petra: 31 Warrior - Vantage, Wrath (just learned in last chapter), Death Blow, Axe Prowess 4, Lance breaker.  Might swap her to swordmaster or assassin soon.

Raphael: 29 Warrior - Axe Prowess 4, Batallion Wrath, Death Blow, Weight -3, Lancebreaker.  He certified as Fortress Knight for the defense bump.

Leonie: 28 sniper - hit+20 Bow Prowess, Authority 4, Batallion Desperation

Ignantz: 29 dancer.  Vantage, Sword Avoid, Special Dance, Sword Prowess, Axe Breaker.  (Need to certify him as Bishop for Magic boost)

Shamir: 27 Sniper - Bow prowess 5, authority 2, and Batallion Dsperation (has Hunter's Volley).

Ashe (need to re-recruit): 27 Warrior, Deathblow, Axe Prowess 4, Authority 3, Batallion Desperation, Weight -3

Manuela: 23 Bishop - Miracle, Faith 4, Sword Prowess 3, axebreaker, authority 1

I now have Alois and Cyril (just let them adjutant on last level pre-time skip.  Not sure how much I plan to do with them.

Edited September 1, 2019 by freewaffles

[Florete]

Weaknesses only run.

In battle, characters are only allowed to gain experience in skills they have a weakness in (you can still instruct and set goals in other skills for the purpose of getting certain classes).

Enjoy Bishop Edelgard, Gremory Petra, Fortress Knight Mercedes, Warrior Lysithea, War Master Linhardt, and not being allowed to use Byleth, Ferdinand, Ignatz, Leonie, Hanneman, Seteth, Flayn, or Gilbert.

[FoxyGrandpa]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned not using statue bonuses as part of a challenge run. On my first run-through of the game, I found it be reasonably difficult to keep pace with the level curve because I didn't invest into statues to get a higher exp gain.until the last quarter of the game. Once I did however, the game became considerably easier. I'm now on my second playthrough with every character recruited and I'm still noticeably ahead of the level curve.

[MilodicMellodi]

9 hours ago, Florete said:

and not being allowed to use Byleth, Ferdinand, Ignatz, Leonie, Hanneman, Seteth, Flayn, or Gilbert.

Except during their Prologues

Though even if you do skip out on the paralogues, you still have to use Byleth during every mandatory battle.

[Florete]

3 hours ago, MilodicMellodi said:

Except during their Prologues

Though even if you do skip out on the paralogues, you still have to use Byleth during every mandatory battle.

Being force deployed doesn't mean you have to use them.

[Garlyle]

@freewaffles Now that you mentioned it, I wasn't even thinking about the first post timeskip map when I came up with the idea of the no crest run challenge. Levels are looking pretty good, class choices look a bit unusual for me now, also turning Ignatz into a dancer feels really stupid - hope you know what you are doing. =O Not trying to be offensive, I'd rather choose Dorothea as my dancer for this.

[freewaffles]

8 hours ago, Garlyle said:

@freewaffles Now that you mentioned it, I wasn't even thinking about the first post timeskip map when I came up with the idea of the no crest run challenge. Levels are looking pretty good, class choices look a bit unusual for me now, also turning Ignatz into a dancer feels really stupid - hope you know what you are doing. =O Not trying to be offensive, I'd rather choose Dorothea as my dancer for this.

Dorothea is the only strong mage without  a crest other than Hubert, who isn't available post-skip.  She is too valuable as my primary magic damage to dance.  As a result, I needed a second Physic.  Ignantz, Ashe, and Leonie were the only options.  Ignantz is generally inferior to Leonie as an Archer.    He and Ashe have similar growths, but Ashe doesn't have sword proficiency and misses two additional chapters post time-skip (to re-recruit Ashe, I chopped him down to 5 hp with Shamir and then hit him with Byleth.  I then moved Byleth back to the starting point to sit out).

Other odd class choices (hero/warrior) were dictated largely by my decision to go no mounts and no Master classes.  It's allowed me to experiment with some classes (e.g. Caspar Hero with Wrath and a Killing Edge is really good as a front liner.  I'm tempted to try it on Raphael/Dedue in another run since it means their speed is less a liability). The lack of mounts for Canto, choice not to use Close Counter, reduced number of units, and general flimsiness of a lot of these units forces me to play slower and more cautious than I normally would. 

Edited September 2, 2019 by freewaffles

[Garlyle]

I was doing my Hard/Classic No Divine Pulse Ironman run. I reached Chapter 11, and decided to do the Hanneman/Manuela paralogue.

Aaaand Manuela died and the game asked me to use the Divine Pulse to turn back time. Would you call this Game Over? I didn't noticed that she was in the range of 2 enemy units, including a Brawler. I only used pulse once in this run, not because of a death, but because of a misclick. Also Petra is not dead, but she won't join me because she was defeated in Chapter 5.

Edited September 25, 2019 by Garlyle

[Jayvee94]

How about a no Flyer run?

[Shanty Pete's 1st Mate]

I've thought about any of the following:

- No batallions. Simple enough, I'm curious to see how much harder the game would be without them.

- No spending gold. Basically I'm not allowed to buy... anything. No more weapons, no extra seals, no additional batallions, no forging/repairing. Nada. I can only use the things I get for free (Quests, Chests, enemy drops, etc.).

- Nonvoy playthrough. I'm not allowed to put anything in the Convoy, all items and weapons have to be kept in personal inventories. If I get an extra item/weapon when full, it's discard time.

[Elephantus]

6 hours ago, Garlyle said:

I was doing my Hard/Classic No Divine Pulse Ironman run. I reached Chapter 11, and decided to do the Hanneman/Manuela paralogue.

Aaaand Manuela died and the game asked me to use the Divine Pulse to turn back time. Would you call this Game Over? I didn't noticed that she was in the range of 2 enemy units, including a Brawler. I only used pulse once in this run, not because of a death, but because of a misclick. Also Petra is not dead, but she won't join me because she was defeated in Chapter 5.

Technically, it is a Game Over judging by how earlier titles where only the main lord is a loss condition are usually played, though you could instead just opt not to use Manuela anymore, or kill her off in a different chapter.

[Arachnofiend]

A more mild challenge run that could be pretty interesting is restricting yourself to canon classes only. Required to beeline to a character's canon advanced class (IE one they have a unique post-timeskip model for) and stick in that for the rest of the game, no certifying for any other classes. This would mean no master classes and limitations on quantity for powerhouse classes more akin to older games in the series - a Crimson Flower run only gets Petra for a flier, for example, since I doubt you're going to be able to keep Ingrid in Pegasus Knight the whole game.

[LegendOfLoog]

Here’s an idea I thought about. What if you can only train a unit in skill proficiencies that they suggest directly to you? Not sure if there’s a list out there somewhere of their suggested Goals, but it would partially help with the flier issue since most units don’t recommend Flying in their Goals. Not sure if I’d include Authority here, but it could serve as a meaningful way to limit high level Battalions for some characters. I would probably combine it with a few other challenges to make the run more difficult, but this one at least cuts down on fliers and cavalry. 

[Shanty Pete's 1st Mate]

18 hours ago, LegendOfLoog said:

Here’s an idea I thought about. What if you can only train a unit in skill proficiencies that they suggest directly to you? Not sure if there’s a list out there somewhere of their suggested Goals, but it would partially help with the flier issue since most units don’t recommend Flying in their Goals. Not sure if I’d include Authority here, but it could serve as a meaningful way to limit high level Battalions for some characters. I would probably combine it with a few other challenges to make the run more difficult, but this one at least cuts down on fliers and cavalry. 

I like this! Combine it with always Auto-Instructing, and this could be the "lazy professor" challenge.