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Edelgard and Byleth...

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Is it true that 

Spoiler

she “loves” them regardless of route?

because to me it only makes any remote sense if it’s during a Black Eagles or Church route playthrough. Some people say her parting words were a “confession” but to players who didn’t do her route... we are way less inclined to care/notice.

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My interpretation:

Spoiler

She's smitten from the beginning, thinking that Byleth might be someone who could understand her mission. At the same time, she's afraid to come out and say it, especially after that dumbass Kronya kills your dad (seriously, she was SEETHING at that revelation). In BL/GD/Church that's as far as it goes; she's willing to fight Byleth, however reluctantly, to achieve her aims. In her route, she's defeated at the tomb, and when all hope seems lost, Byleth reaches out a hand in friendship. That they would do that even after what Edelgard has done...that's when she falls in love.

 

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Weirdly enough, I did the BE Empire route first.

Spoiler

Her upbringing consists of experimentation, and watching her siblings die.  Her father didn't step in to stop this.  Such things give her nightmares.  Not surprising, because it's traumatic, and Edelgard has a genuinely caring side to her.  Her motivations, however wrong it may seem, stem from that - yes, dragging an entire continent to war sucks, but so does watching those you care about die, in the name of Crests and power.

Enter Byleth, who has a mystery Crest, and who then decides to head Edelgard's house.  This gives time for Edelgard and her classmates to get to know him/her better - and since Byleth isn't a total jerk, it's not a hostile relationship.  Byleth, who seems to have Rhea's undivided attention, suddenly decides to throw that away for Edelgard.  From Edelgard's PoV, Byleth is an authority figure who knew her past, and believed in her anyway.  I'd be a little puzzled if she didn't latch on to him/her tightly.

 

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I spotted a real nice post on Reddit touching that very subject recently (spoilered for length. And spoilers, of course):

 

Spoiler

 

 

A most interesting read about these two characters.

 

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Outside of Black Eagles (church included) I don't think it's affection as much as it is admiration. She doesn't hide the fact that she thinks highly of Byleth, and she's quite curious of them too. Even when they go to war, even if they weren't her professor, she still recognizes that they'd be a great help.

Honestly playing through the game I can safely say Edelgard is the first to realise Byleth's potential to sway a conflict, which is quite the reading for her considering all her trust issues and how unreadable Byleth is. The only other person who seems to understand their value is Rhea, but that's a different deal since she doesn't guess, she knows.

That said regardless of the order you play the game you'll always find references to your previous playthrough, it's a bit of let's call it "fan service" the writers put in. If you haven't played the path of a lord their lines in another route are less impactful, if you know their background you feel more. Edelgard's dialogue makes sense even on its own, but if you played CF before it's got a lot more value to it.

That's the case for everyone btw, I recall Claude in BL saying something like "take care of the alliance, I now want to follow my dream". Now if you didn't play GD and got to know Claude, this sounds just like "fuck off I'm tired of this, good luck lol" and would be in line with the apparent casual demeanor of Claude. But if you DID play GD then you know perfectly well what he means with that and that he's much deeper than he seems. It's just the game "winking" at the player.

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24 minutes ago, timon said:

Outside of Black Eagles (church included) I don't think it's affection as much as it is admiration. She doesn't hide the fact that she thinks highly of Byleth, and she's quite curious of them too. Even when they go to war, even if they weren't her professor, she still recognizes that they'd be a great help.

Honestly playing through the game I can safely say Edelgard is the first to realise Byleth's potential to sway a conflict, which is quite the reading for her considering all her trust issues and how unreadable Byleth is. The only other person who seems to understand their value is Rhea, but that's a different deal since she doesn't guess, she knows.

That said regardless of the order you play the game you'll always find references to your previous playthrough, it's a bit of let's call it "fan service" the writers put in. If you haven't played the path of a lord their lines in another route are less impactful, if you know their background you feel more. Edelgard's dialogue makes sense even on its own, but if you played CF before it's got a lot more value to it.

That's the case for everyone btw, I recall Claude in BL saying something like "take care of the alliance, I now want to follow my dream". Now if you didn't play GD and got to know Claude, this sounds just like "fuck off I'm tired of this, good luck lol" and would be in line with the apparent casual demeanor of Claude. But if you DID play GD then you know perfectly well what he means with that and that he's much deeper than he seems. It's just the game "winking" at the player.

I’ve played GD and seen playthroughs of BE and BL so I know what Claude was getting at. As for Edelgard... I didn’t want someone I consider a good villain held back by a crush on the MC so it’s good that it’s at least up for interpretation.

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I don't think that she "loved" Byleth in the other routes, save for the Church and definitely her route, but it could very well be possible that, given that they both bear the Crest of Flames, there's some form of resonance with one another. Or Edelgard feels it in Byleth. It could be that she was touched by how he protected her against the bandit. 

Actually, we COULD think of it how this is the first time Edelgard truly felt being protected by someone unconditionally, whereas other times, she is protected because of a reason. She couldn't be protected by her own father when she was tortured and experimented on, and she any soldiers that protect her, or even Hubert, do more so out of an obligation because it is their duty. But Byleth protected her with no obligation. 

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I don't recall getting a strong impression of affection from Edelgard to Byleth on Azure Moon (she basically ignores him/her during her big scene before the Battle of Enbarr, that's all about her and Dimitri), and I've not seen it yet in Verdant Winds though haven't finished that one yet. In Crimson Flower it's extremely justified (and I'm not one who will easily concede that affection for a silent protagonist is justified).

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1 hour ago, Dark Holy Elf said:

I don't recall getting a strong impression of affection from Edelgard to Byleth on Azure Moon (she basically ignores him/her during her big scene before the Battle of Enbarr, that's all about her and Dimitri), and I've not seen it yet in Verdant Winds though haven't finished that one yet. In Crimson Flower it's extremely justified (and I'm not one who will easily concede that affection for a silent protagonist is justified).

Even in Blue lions

Spoiler

Hegemon Edelgard has a uniqu pained sprite in use when she attacks Byleth and specifically talks about how it pains her that they're fighting. If there wasn't some emotional connection on her part, if it was just admiration than to be physically (emotionally) pained to be fighting Byleth is just... odd.

and of course Ferdinand always states that Edelgard was "obsessed" with Byleth.

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1 hour ago, Rose482 said:

Not as much as Dimitri is in love with Byleth. 

Personally disagree considering in 3/4 routes, he doesn’t care about Byleth at all except his own.

Edelgard, whether it be love or simply admiration, will always say something to the effect of that she wishes she could be with you and even the theme song alludes to this barring her route since well, you’re on her side.  

Edited by Gardenia
Grammar

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It's clear she has some fixation on you and you're the person she least wants to kill lol, but I suspect that's emphasized much more in her own route for obvious reasons.

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She clearly has some kind of attraction in her route and an admiration at best in other paths since she universally doesn't want to ever have to fight Byleth. It's able to evolve into more when you side with her but I don't really see it as universal to all routes, but I've seen arguments for how it could be the case~

Personally, I didn't get that sense when playing any route besides CF

3 hours ago, Rose482 said:

Not as much as Dimitri is in love with Byleth. 

I like the way you think~

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I'm not sure she "loves" Byleth. I think its more like she realizes the potential they have in which they can determine the faith of Fodlan. It would explain why she states in her Flame Emperor disguise that she was the last person they wanted to be the enemy of, because she knew their power. Also in CF, she states that Byleth's return will change the state of war.

4 hours ago, Rose482 said:

Not as much as Dimitri is in love with Byleth. 

I love your thinking as well.

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This is just my personal opinion of course, but I never really got the feeling that she cared about Byleth as a person; while I understand her distrust of them considering she felt they'd back stab her any minute, it just never felt like a genuine affection. More like, they were worthy to usher in a new age with her. And of course she gets attached to them,  they save her, comfort her, listen to her, and so on. But that's latching onto the first source of comfort. It might not have anything to do with them. She just never came across as caring personally. If they didn't have all that talent and skill, I doubt she'd give em a second glance. I mean that's just how I felt so I dunno. The painting is really the only thing I'd say points to anything. I just thought it was kinda creepy. But that's just me as I don't like that kind of thing; it's not a bad thing or anything. 

Although, my bro did CF; and he said it was that she saw only them as an equal to her, he didn't see it as romantic at all. Same with other routes when I told him what she said on them. He was pretty adamant about it honestly. And he doesn't hate romance or ships so yeah. And when I asked why the heck he picked Sothis; he said that it felt like everyone was living out their lives and didn't need Byleth anymore.  So it was weird to marry him to anyone. He was just kinda there. And honestly, I felt the same on the church route. It seemed like he was just there to cut down enemies, especially compared to the GD and BL routes.  

But all that might be my bias talking. I'm just sick of people romanticizing friendships. (even if it can or does turn into romance) It's the same with Dimitri. While I admit, his relationship with F!leth progresses into romance very naturally, if I don't pursue it, it comes across as just a beautiful friendship. Like Chrobin. Actually no, I thought that friendship felt really one sided and the romance was...uh something. Claude's on the other hand, I had a really hard time seeing as romantic. Like ever. The proposal or lack there of and ending(no mention of any relationship whatsoever) just really cemented it for me.  He even refers to them as basically, well, brother in Japanese rather then calling them teach after the time-skip.  The eng ver even added the I love you bit, but that might be a cultural thing. Tho he isn't Japanese and other people say it so idk.

It felt like F! - BL/ M- the others, specifically church or GD but again, that's just me. It just felt more natural that way. 

Ah that got off track, but yeah I just don't see it as romantic. It could progress into that I guess but it's certainly nothing like say Eliwood/Ninian, Jaffar/Nino or other such pairs. More like Hector/Lyn but not quite that either. I guess it's just about perspective, but personally-no. 

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Romance in FE games is, uh, lacking in development and it feels intentional the way supports are set up. They don't really give you any conversations to make your romantic interest in someone obvious like in, say, Bioware games - and I can understand the reluctance to have other characters do the same without any player direction. The only similar instance this game gives you is the Goddess Tower event, and even that is pretty mild... probably because you can easily miss talking to Gatekeeper to make your choice.

So thinking one pairing is more romantic than others probably involves some imaginative wish-casting.

 

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Quote

The only similar instance this game gives you is the Goddess Tower event, and even that is pretty mild... probably because you can easily miss talking to Gatekeeper to make your choice. 

And not all options here are romantic, like I tried Ingrid option recently, and she was just happened to be there to stretch, had no interest in any romantic conversation. While Flayn, Bernie, Marianne ones were consider romantic somewhat.

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9 hours ago, Crysta said:

The only similar instance this game gives you is the Goddess Tower event, and even that is pretty mild... probably because you can easily miss talking to Gatekeeper to make your choice.

Why would anyone pass up a chance to talk to the illustrious Gatekeeper?

 

Anyway, I feel there's a difference between affection and admiration.

In the Black Eagles routes, you actually stand by Edelgard through the tumultuous times during the school phase, and likely even learn about her tragic past that no one else outside of her family and close servants knows about.  And in Crimson Flower, you stick with her even though her cause at the point of the decision might seem too radical to most and even though you would still have obligations towards the church.  So it'd make sense for her to feel affectionate towards Byleth in those routes, especially in Crimson Flower where she was sure they would probably have abandoned her.

But outside of that?  Well, I think it would be inaccurate to say it's a simple acknowledgement of Byleth's abilities.  She treats many other talented characters as simply obstacles to overcome, yet she always seems to make a special case for Byleth.  But affection?  I don't really think it's quite that.  She has some level of attachment to Byleth, but I wouldn't say it's likely to the same degree as when you are with the Black Eagles.

13 hours ago, Zelda2120 said:

Although, my bro did CF; and he said it was that she saw only them as an equal to her, he didn't see it as romantic at all. Same with other routes when I told him what she said on them. He was pretty adamant about it honestly.

She flat out says that she "sees you as more than a mere friend" in her A-support.  At the very least, there's a familial-esque bond there that goes beyond mere comfort attachment or admiration.  It's definitely not "she only saw them as an equal".

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10 hours ago, Timlugia said:

 

And not all options here are romantic, like I tried Ingrid option recently, and she was just happened to be there to stretch, had no interest in any romantic conversation. While Flayn, Bernie, Marianne ones were consider romantic somewhat.

or Felix's brutal rejection. holy moses did that sting. lol

 

21 hours ago, Gardenia said:

Personally disagree considering in 3/4 routes, he doesn’t care about Byleth at all except his own.

hmmmm
we're going to have to agree to disagree on that one. (I'll give you the GD path. but he was mucho Emoitri there)

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On August 31, 2019 at 11:25 AM, Hardric62 said:

I spotted a real nice post on Reddit touching that very subject recently (spoilered for length. And spoilers, of course):

 

  Hide contents

 

 

A most interesting read about these two characters.

 

ALL OF THIS!

In the the GD/Church routes:

Spoiler

Byleth is the one who finishes Edelgard off  Edelgard knows shes not going to live, but says in a very pained voice: "I wanted you to walk with me on my path...i...i....." Then shes literally cut off by Byleth  

It sounded to me that Edelgard had something very emotional to say to Byleth that came from the heart. 

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4 hours ago, daisy jane said:

or Felix's brutal rejection. holy moses did that sting. lol

It'd sting for me too, lmao, he seems like a decent guy underneath all that bitterness and fighting.

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1 hour ago, Ertrick36 said:

It'd sting for me too, lmao, he seems like a decent guy underneath all that bitterness and fighting.

 

the funny thing was - i was thinking okay - i'll S support you - you seem kinda cool.

and then. goddess tower scene happened and i was like. ... is game serious w/this? and i'm like i am not doing the final battle only to get like. Felix'ed. 
(so i Youtubed it saw it was actually a sweet scene and we're getting married. but that was like the most brutal thing i ever saw lol)

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On 8/31/2019 at 4:38 PM, CyberNinja said:
Spoiler

Hegemon Edelgard has a uniqu pained sprite in use when she attacks Byleth and specifically talks about how it pains her that they're fighting. If there wasn't some emotional connection on her part, if it was just admiration than to be physically (emotionally) pained to be fighting Byleth is just... odd.

 

Spoiler

 

Maybe it's due to both of them having the Crest of Flames, and since Sothis is inside Byleth, it literally pained her to do so.

.....maybe the Crest of Flames is why Edelgard is attracted to Byleth, lol.

 

 

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