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What little things really grind your gears?

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On 11/2/2019 at 1:39 PM, Hawkwing said:

Hiding Growth Rates and Support Points: I can live without knowing these, but there's really no reason at this point to hide this information from the player. It's not difficult to adjust the UI to add a percentage next to the characters stats, or show how many points a character needs to unlock the next support rank. These additions wouldn't be game-changing, but they would be solid quality of life improvements.

Lack of an Advanced Section: What I mean by this is is that if you want the hard data for how exactly skill affects accuracy or speed affects avoidance, you have to go online to find it. Again, I can live without knowing this, and the games saying "higher skill=higher hit and crit rates" is enough for some people. However, if I want to know exactly how luck factors into other equations or why my sword user is suddenly doing 2 extra damage against an axe user, I can't view that information in the game itself. Adding a section that contains all the formulas and equations would be helpful for the people who want that data, while people who are fine with the general descriptions won't be forced to view it.

God, I would definitely love these too!
As you said, there is no reason why this kind of information is not shown. Having to rely on online resources is not a solution; one should not need to check external sources in the first place.

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On 11/2/2019 at 12:39 PM, Hawkwing said:

Hiding Growth Rates and Support Points: I can live without knowing these, but there's really no reason at this point to hide this information from the player. It's not difficult to adjust the UI to add a percentage next to the characters stats, or show how many points a character needs to unlock the next support rank. These additions wouldn't be game-changing, but they would be solid quality of life improvements.

Agreed on support points, but I think hidden growths is actually a pretty good call. It keeps newer players from making snap judgments and letting them come to their own conclusions.

Still, it does remind me of another pet peeve I have: wide growth gaps. No Catria, all the shiny +1s you throw at me won't stop me from hating your 100%+ growths lead on other "growth" units.

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Ambush spawns- Do I really have to elaborate much? I remember in Awakening these things were completely unpredictable. Even if it's obvious where they're coming from, you never know when. It's not fun when I have to look up a guide to avoid a reset.

Divine pulse/Mila's turnwheel- Speaking of resets, Divine pulse isn't entirely bad. It's nice not to reset after nearing the end of a map. However, when the game is designed around it, it takes away the charm of permadeath. It's basically the new causal mode.

Avatar characters- Mark from FE7 is probably the only decent avatar because they hardly have any bearings to the plot. They tend to hog the spotlight and the surrounding characters are forced to jerk off to the avatar. I consider Byleth worse than Corrin. Byleth is just an empty husk and the only personality they have is the one that the player projects through dialogue 'choices'. Even if those choices are suppose to reflect personality traits, they're never conveyed well. At least Corrin had an established personality that the game didn't have to pretend to exist.

Some things that make 3H 'one step forward, three steps back'- I can't use statbooster from the convoy. I intentionally ignore supports sometimes because they're too overwhelming for me to go through in one session. Things are insisted rather than showed. Like, we get it Edelgard, you're really ambitious. If I hate or feel disgruntled about a character, the game pulls out a sob story out of their ass so I feel a little bad about it. I don't care what Bernie went through, most of her C-supports, especially in Japanese, are fingernails on chalkboards. Since the game has a lot of optimization, I feel somewhat obligated to do everything. It leaves me fatigued and if I skip it I feel bad knowing that I missed out on some optimization.

Since people are bringing up specific parts of the fandom that grinds their gears, I'm gonna throw my hat in. Ever since 3H, the fandom has gotten worse from what I've experienced. You got a bunch of 4D chess players talking down to me like I'm mentally challenged because I refuse to believe in their half-baked interpretation of a character based on a few lines of dialogue. After Fates came out, we could universally agree that it was poorly written. But with 3H, it's like people want to pretend that this game is capable of super duper deep complex writing when it doesn't. It's only like that if you don't parse through the story enough or if you don't consider pacing and structure when viewing a story. I mean, come on, Fire Emblem just isn't a game that has complex stories that are well written. Even the sacred cow that is FE4 isn't well written.

It also doesn't help that people, at least with the people on r/fireemblem, tend to poison the discussion by fanboying/girling their favorite character and will go through great lengths to ensure that the characters/story don't appear as poorly written as they actually are. One person had to stuff words in my mouth to make it seem I'm a lot more apathetic to a fictional character.

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5 hours ago, Erinyes said:

Ambush spawns- Do I really have to elaborate much? I remember in Awakening these things were completely unpredictable. Even if it's obvious where they're coming from, you never know when. It's not fun when I have to look up a guide to avoid a reset.

Divine pulse/Mila's turnwheel- Speaking of resets, Divine pulse isn't entirely bad. It's nice not to reset after nearing the end of a map. However, when the game is designed around it, it takes away the charm of permadeath. It's basically the new causal mode.

Avatar characters- Mark from FE7 is probably the only decent avatar because they hardly have any bearings to the plot. They tend to hog the spotlight and the surrounding characters are forced to jerk off to the avatar. I consider Byleth worse than Corrin. Byleth is just an empty husk and the only personality they have is the one that the player projects through dialogue 'choices'. Even if those choices are suppose to reflect personality traits, they're never conveyed well. At least Corrin had an established personality that the game didn't have to pretend to exist.

Some things that make 3H 'one step forward, three steps back'- I can't use statbooster from the convoy. I intentionally ignore supports sometimes because they're too overwhelming for me to go through in one session. Things are insisted rather than showed. Like, we get it Edelgard, you're really ambitious. If I hate or feel disgruntled about a character, the game pulls out a sob story out of their ass so I feel a little bad about it. I don't care what Bernie went through, most of her C-supports, especially in Japanese, are fingernails on chalkboards. Since the game has a lot of optimization, I feel somewhat obligated to do everything. It leaves me fatigued and if I skip it I feel bad knowing that I missed out on some optimization.

Since people are bringing up specific parts of the fandom that grinds their gears, I'm gonna throw my hat in. Ever since 3H, the fandom has gotten worse from what I've experienced. You got a bunch of 4D chess players talking down to me like I'm mentally challenged because I refuse to believe in their half-baked interpretation of a character based on a few lines of dialogue. After Fates came out, we could universally agree that it was poorly written. But with 3H, it's like people want to pretend that this game is capable of super duper deep complex writing when it doesn't. It's only like that if you don't parse through the story enough or if you don't consider pacing and structure when viewing a story. I mean, come on, Fire Emblem just isn't a game that has complex stories that are well written. Even the sacred cow that is FE4 isn't well written.

It also doesn't help that people, at least with the people on r/fireemblem, tend to poison the discussion by fanboying/girling their favorite character and will go through great lengths to ensure that the characters/story don't appear as poorly written as they actually are. One person had to stuff words in my mouth to make it seem I'm a lot more apathetic to a fictional character.

Agreed. On pretty much all counts.

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14 hours ago, Erinyes said:

I mean, come on, Fire Emblem just isn't a game that has complex stories that are well written. Even the sacred cow that is FE4 isn't well written.

Deirdre and Sigurd falling in love instantly comes to mind...

Your point here though, probably shouldn't be "FE has shitty writing" but "People worship certain characters and yell at anyone who dares disagree". Fates had bad writing but I'll have to disagree on 3H having it, and I'll ask you what is "well written"? Well written is kind of subjective, not entirely. And to back up my claim, I consider a story well written when it makes me care about the characters and enjoy their interactions, not the only factor but a big one for me. Fates failed at this. To a lesser extent, if a story can surprise me with a twist it's not a bad story. 3H did this with "Jesus Christ the Pope is a dragon get in the car!" Loved it.

Edited by Dragoncat

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7 minutes ago, Dragoncat said:

Well written is subjective. And to back up my claim, I consider a story well written when it makes me care about the characters and enjoy their interactions. Fates failed at this. To a lesser extent, if a story can surprise me with a twist it's not a bad story. 3H did this with "Jesus Christ the Pope is a dragon get in the car!" Loved it.

Well if you wanna go down that rabbit hole I’ll say this. The line between subjectivity and objectivity in regards to the quality of story telling is a fine line and it can get very blurry but there is a distinction. There is a way to objectively measure a story’s quality cause if it were entirely subjective then an amateur writer could write the most weird, incoherent, convoluted, contrived, and plot hole ridden mess of story and you could say that would “good” and no one could argue with you because it’s entirely subjective. 

No, there is an objective component to writing no matter how small or obscure it may be. Let me put it this way. If a 6 year old kid with zero experience just one day decided to play the piano would they be as good as an adult pianist with more than a decade of experience and skill? If yes, then it is entirely subjective. If no, then there’s an objective component we can measure. Writing is no different.

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One thing that really annoys me is when characters are accidentally turned into completely reprehensible people. 

Being a complete jerk works for some people. Shinon is supposed to be a scumbag, a racist and a petty asshole and while he has a point Felix is supposed to be overly bitter. Even if I'll never find someone like Shinon likable he does get a certain pass on his behavior because he's always been intended to come off that way. 

But other characters come off as terrible people without the writing intending this to be the case. To some extend this can often mean they get away with their behavior while someone like Shinon would get called out on it. It also means that the writing team kinda failed with them. 

Clive is supposed to be a bit hypocritical but I don't think he was ever intended to abuse Alm for his own gain and discard him the moment he got what he wanted. The writing never intended this but that's still exactly what ended up happening. Clive was happy enough to keep Alm around when he could be useful but the moment Alm was done saving his wife for him Clive tried discarding him. 

Ophelia is supposed to be cute, quirky and maybe at times accidentally self centered. I don't think she was intended as a bully but she bullied Siegbert about his greatest insecurity just because the concept of princes intruded on her fantasies. 

The Black Knight is supposed to be a noble warrior and the ''last true knight'' but he still murders a man purely to see if he had what it took to murder him. And the whole plan to torture a little girl of course. 

And there's Hana who's supposed to be harsh but fair or ''not mincing words'' but who ends up treating Corrin terribly for getting kidnapped, memory whiped and forced to have Garon into his life. Harsh but fair means you got to have at least something resembling a point and she didn't have it when blaming a kidnap victim. 

The examples listed might be a little personal but I don't think I'm alone in this. The big backlash against Xander isn't about his Camus tendencies but the extreme disconnect about his dishonorable actions and the picture of the honorable Xander that Fates tries very hard to convince the player off. 

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9 minutes ago, Ottservia said:

Well if you wanna go down that rabbit hole I’ll say this. The line between subjectivity and objectivity in regards to the quality of story telling is a fine line and it can get very blurry but there is a distinction. There is a way to objectively measure a story’s quality cause if it were entirely subjective then an amateur writer could write the most weird, incoherent, convoluted, contrived, and plot hole ridden mess of story and you could say that would “good” and no one could argue with you because it’s entirely subjective. 

No, there is an objective component to writing no matter how small or obscure it may be. Let me put it this way. If a 6 year old kid with zero experience just one day decided to play the piano would they be as good as an adult pianist with more than a decade of experience and skill? If yes, then it is entirely subjective. If no, then there’s an objective component we can measure. Writing is no different.

I didn't mean entirely subjective. 

I guess my attempt at saying "3H had a good story and Fates doesn't, why do you think 3H's story is bad" nicely fell on its face.

@Etrurian emperor

Quote

Clive was happy enough to keep Alm around when he could be useful but the moment Alm was done saving his wife for him Clive tried discarding him. 

I don't remember this, can you show me the dialogue?

Edited by Dragoncat

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12 minutes ago, Dragoncat said:

I didn't mean entirely subjective. 

I guess my attempt at saying "3H had a good story and Fates doesn't, why do you think 3H's story is bad" nicely fell on its face.

@Etrurian emperor

I don't remember this, can you show me the dialogue?

Its the dungeon scene with Matilda. The cell door opens, the couple swoons a bit and then Clive tries to fire Alm. 

 

Clive: …… I wish I could stand by my choices, unwavering. I have always done what I thought to be right, even when my heart disagreed. But now I must face cold reality.

Mathilda: What do you mean?

Clive: I may have made a terrible error.

Alm: Huh? What are you talking about?

Clive: ……

Gray: Oh no. No, no, no. We’re not going down THAT old road now. Don’t you dare say that making Alm the Deliverance’s leader was a mistake. We’ve been through way too much to start in with second-guessing n

Edited by Etrurian emperor

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1 minute ago, Etrurian emperor said:

Its the dungeon scene with Matilda. The cell door opens, the couple swoons a bit and then Clive tries to fire Alm. 

I figured that, but I forgot what exactly Clive says to "fire Alm". To the point I don't remember him doing so. Is there a script where I can find this online?

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Just now, Dragoncat said:

I figured that, but I forgot what exactly Clive says to "fire Alm". To the point I don't remember him doing so. Is there a script where I can find this online?

I just edited it it in. He doesn't exactly say fire himself but he does seem to want to to so before Tobin jumps in. When Tobin says its about him wanting Alm gone he doesn't deny it. 

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Just now, Etrurian emperor said:

I just edited it it in. He doesn't exactly say fire himself but he does seem to want to to so before Tobin jumps in. When Tobin says its about him wanting Alm gone he doesn't deny it. 

I see. I actually found it myself by googling.

So I can agree with your points. Shinon is the only one who really gets called out on stuff. Maybe Felix does though? Idk, but if he does not much.

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34 minutes ago, Etrurian emperor said:

Ophelia is supposed to be cute, quirky and maybe at times accidentally self centered. I don't think she was intended as a bully but she bullied Siegbert about his greatest insecurity just because the concept of princes intruded on her fantasies. 

And this right here is where I take issue with your argument. I mean was that not the point of the support? Like Ophelia gets angry at Siegbert for selfish reasons and attacks him in a vulnerable area which then leads Siegbert to strike back and try to amend the situation. Ophelia doesn’t listen so the conflict escalates until both characters are finally able to reason with one another and come to an understanding in the A or S support.

I could be wrong because it’s been a while since I’ve read the support but like the support is written the way it is in order to invoke those very feelings, somewhat. Like you’re supposed to to sympathize with Siegbert here and Ophelia is the sort of antagonist to this support chain. That much is obvious because it’s written that way. The fact that you feel the way you do about that support is quite frankly the entire point. Now if it was a little too blunt or could’ve been handled with more nuance or something that’s one thing but the fact that you dislike Ophelia in this instance for y’know initiating the conflict in a way that was in character for her that’s not really a problem with the writing really. I realize this is a nitpick thread and you are perfectly entitled to your opinion but still.

like my problem here is that you seem to arguing that a character shouldn’t deviate from their established “norm” if they wind up being an asshole in some way which is just kinda dumb because a character deviating from an established norm slightly is not an issue in fact to see characters in different lights is often a good thing cause it shows they have emotional depth and range that goes beyond what we already knew about them.

Edited by Ottservia

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5 minutes ago, Flere210 said:

The names of certain relic weapons. Holy mother of Seiros, why a weapons named "free bullet" is an axe of all things? Not even a throwing axe

Thats what "Freikugel" translates to? What exactly is the origin of such a word that'd warrant its use in various video games?

Edited by Interdimensional Observer

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17 minutes ago, Ottservia said:

And this right here is where I take issue with your argument. I mean was that not the point of the support? Like Ophelia gets angry at Siegbert for selfish reasons and attacks him in a vulnerable area which then leads Siegbert to strike back and try to amend the situation. Ophelia doesn’t listen so the conflict escalates until both characters are finally able to reason with one another and come to an understanding in the A or S support.

I could be wrong because it’s been a while since I’ve read the support but like the support is written the way it is in order to invoke those very feelings, somewhat. Like you’re supposed to to sympathize with Siegbert here and Ophelia is the sort of antagonist to this support chain. That much is obvious because it’s written that way. The fact that you feel the way you do about that support is quite frankly the entire point. Now if it was a little too blunt or could’ve been handled with more nuance or something that’s one thing but the fact that you dislike Ophelia in this instance for y’know initiating the conflict in a way that was in character for her that’s not really a problem with the writing really. I realize this is a nitpick thread and you are perfectly entitled to your opinion but still.

Ophelia being the jerk in that support chain is the point of that support but my point is more that the support missed the point about Ophelia. I don't think she's the type of character to play that role. Picking someone's greatest insecurity and tossing it in their face is something Shinon would do, Soren might do it if in a particularly nasty mood and tsundere's like Takumi or Severa might accidentally end up doing it when they get heated but nothing about Ophelia implies she's the type to do something like that. She seems intended as an endearing character who's odd but who doesn't have a mean bone in her body. That she has no other support where she's such a jerk is rather telling to me that the role is just naturally unsuited for her character. 

Quote

 

Thats what "Freikugel" translates to? What exactly is the origin of such a word that'd warrant its use in various video games?

 

 

 

My incredibly shaky German skills make me think its German. Frei=free and Kugel=bullet. 

I'm at a loss about WHY IS thought those words combined into a great axe name though.

Edited by Etrurian emperor

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37 minutes ago, Etrurian emperor said:

Ophelia being the jerk in that support chain is the point of that support but my point is more that the support missed the point about Ophelia. I don't think she's the type of character to play that role. Picking someone's greatest insecurity and tossing it in their face is something Shinon would do, Soren might do it if in a particularly nasty mood and tsundere's like Takumi or Severa might accidentally end up doing it when they get heated but nothing about Ophelia implies she's the type to do something like that. She seems intended as an endearing character who's odd but who doesn't have a mean bone in her body. That she has no other support where she's such a jerk is rather telling to me that the role is just naturally unsuited for her character. 

And what’s wrong with a character showing sides to them that are somewhat different from their established norm? An endearing character like Ophelia does not need to be endearing 100% of the time that kind of thinking only leads to a character being one-dimensional. What I mean is that yes, Ophelia hit a sensitive area on Siegbert. It may have been unitentional on her part but she did it nonetheless and the reason given for her initiating the conflict makes sense within the confines of her character at least to me anyway. 

Like there’s a difference between a character acting out of character and a character showing an unusual side to themselves. Characters are abstractions of human beings and humans are complex. People don’t just have a singular “persona” they use all the time for every situation that’s just an absurd notion. Characters are the same. If Ophelia treated Siegbert like she does everyone else then that would lead to her being one dimensional. The fact that she treats Siegbert differently actually adds depth to her character because it shows a different side to her that we don’t often see and we also get to learn more about what sets her off. Now it would be out of character if the reason she disliked him was because he let her indulge in her fantasies further cause that contradicts what was already established. Seeing characters show different sides to their established norm is what gives them depth and emotional range. It makes them feel more realistic and it’s one of the quintessential reasons why tsundere characters are so endearing oddly enough.  

If I have misinterpreted your argument, I apologize but that’s certainly what it sounds like anyway.

Edited by Ottservia

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24 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

Thats what "Freikugel" translates to? What exactly is the origin of such a word that'd warrant its use in various video games?

The legend of der freishutz, the freeshooter. I don't really know the details, but is a story about an huntsman that made a deal whit the devil to get a rifle that never misses, or something similar to that. Freikugel is the name of the rifle.

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Just now, Flere210 said:

The legend of der freishutz, the freeshooter. I don't really know the details, but is a story about an huntsman that made a deal whit the devil to get a rifle that never misses, or something similar to that. Freikugel is the name of the rifle.

Incredibly ironic given that Hilda... always misses.

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On 11/3/2019 at 5:57 AM, Etheus said:

Sylvain is quite possibly the only actual womanizer in the franchise. He's the only one who operates with the express intention of "pumping and dumping" women, and he's the only one with a genuine contempt for women. But he skews better with female players because he also happens to be conventionally attractive, so his bullshit sob story is seen as sufficient to excuse his actions. This is not to say that there is anything wrong with fanservice aimed at female players; it's great, but it also shouldn't excuse genuine, major character flaws.

Time to sit down and think about what you've posted, because you've managed to make a point and miss everything about said point.
 

Spoiler

 

Sylvain is an established cheater.  I'm not sure if the other games went that far with their flirts.  I don't know how you managed to miss this, since it's established in a C support.  Contrast this to someone like Inigo who tries to pick up a woman and fails every time.

Next, that assumption about a sob story.  No, it's not just a "sob story", it's literally how Fodlan's society works.  Mercedes has a similar set of circumstances (namely, being valued because of her crest), so is she also a bullshit sob story?  Now go look at Sylvain's support with Dedue, which gives a lot of insight on the former without delving into women.

Lastly, Sylvain's paired endings establish that he works on whichever flaw is brought up.  Which means he starts out as a little shit, and grows into a not-so-shitty person.  I don't demand perfection out of people, but I do appreciate positive growth.  That's why I like Sylvain, even if I generally dislike the team flirt.

 

 

On 11/2/2019 at 12:14 PM, Jingle Jangle said:
  • No merging items. Awakening is still the only game to have this.

*cries in the DS games*

8 hours ago, Fire Brand said:

Not being able to skip paralogue intros in 3 houses. 

Definitely.  Would love it if there was QoL patch that skipped to the last scene with the dialogue choice.

56 minutes ago, Flere210 said:

The names of certain relic weapons. Holy mother of Seiros, why a weapons named "free bullet" is an axe of all things? Not even a throwing axe

Hilda charges off in the direction of the enemy recklessly?  IMO I think someone thought it sounded cool.

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2 minutes ago, Dragoncat said:

Deirdre and Sigurd falling in love instantly comes to mind...

Your point here though, probably shouldn't be "FE has shitty writing" but "People worship certain characters and yell at anyone who dares disagree". Fates had bad writing but I'll have to disagree on 3H having it, and I'll ask you what is "well written"? Well written is subjective. And to back up my claim, I consider a story well written when it makes me care about the characters and enjoy their interactions. Fates failed at this. To a lesser extent, if a story can surprise me with a twist it's not a bad story. 3H did this with "Jesus Christ the Pope is a dragon get in the car!" Loved it.

I didn't say that FE has shitty writing in general, I meant that as in when it tries to be complex it just doesn't work. I consider the Archanea games and FE6 to be better written than something like FE4 or 3H because of its simplicity. Simple stories are easier to not fuck up and just like most stories, it's really the execution that matters. I'm not saying Archanea and FE6 are masterfully written or anything, but at least it paces itself as a simple story.

What makes something well written is the way it's structured and presented. A lot of crappy movies, TV shows, stories, etc. may have an interesting story/character/idea hook but is executed poorly. If I watch a movie that has good pacing and presentation but a dumb story to tell, then I can at least say it's a well-written movie that entertained me in the way the director intended to.

Spoiler for the movie Hot Fuzz

 
 
 
 
Spoiler

Hot Fuzz is a movie about an uptight cop in metropolitan Britain being transferred to a small village. The village holds a dark secret of murdering those that tarnish its reputation and assets that plan to move away to a different village that could benefit having them. They do all of this so they can remain as the best village in Britain. Since they're seen as the best village in Britain, the cops there grow aloof to their jobs which enables the schemings held by the people running the village. As you can tell, the plot is really dumb, and yet, the way it's executed makes it entertaining and is a nice love letter to action movies and buddy cops.

My issue with 3H is that everything is insisted and not shown, the way it is paced makes it feel I'm going at 70 mph in a school parking lot. Lines of dialogue insisting that Rodrige/Judith's men are supporting the war effort means nothing to me when I don't see it. I mean, wow, two armor knights? I'm sure the Adrestrian Empire must be trembling in their feet. The worst part is when I see characters flailing their character traits to remind me what their personality is. I remember after the GD mock battle Claude would not shut up about how much of a schemer he is.

Another thing is when the writers use sob stories as a substitute for writing a compelling character. A good portion of fan favorite characters from 3H have some sob story because why show me that a character is compelling when you can write a sob story to make me feel bad about them. I mean, seriously, I probably have PTSD from the stuff I went through as a kid but that doesn't make me an interesting person if it defines my personality. If Bernadette annoys the hell out of me then a sob story isn't going to fix it. Since sob stories happen in the background and is something we have to imagine in our head, that's less work for the writers. To me, that is incredibly lazy and it shows me that the writers are willing to use a short-cut and play it off as something compelling. This might not apply to all characters, but is annoying when I notice it.

It's perfectly fine to write a tragic backstory, but you still need to write a character with some level of effort. Hopefully this won't attract any foaming at the mouth Edelstans, but honestly, I would find Edelgard a lot more compelling if they rewrote her backstory and what she does in CF. Her entire motivations is dependent on her overly tragic backstory. Sure she has her own insight on some of the events in White Clouds, but those insights are incredibly naive and her ideology are eye-rolling platitudes you expect from a Shonen protagonist. It's also annoying that in CF, it feels like she's steamrolling everything. Byleth or BE don't really question her, at least during the story.

Spoilers for Mr. Robot

 
 
 
1
Spoiler

Weirdly enough, my favorite TV character is similar to Edelgard except he's better written. Elliot is someone who has a tragic childhood, it's not an overly traumatizing backstory meant to lazily tell me his motivations, rather, it's a story that helps explain why he can't connect to people normally. His experience is much more grounded and is something I can relate to even though I never lost a parent because of a corporate cover-up. His ideology and motivation are fuelled by the injustices he's observed and experienced. However, those injustices are much more clear-cut than what Edelgard regards as injustice. I mean, corporate cover-ups are pretty clear-cut as something unjust compared to some sociopath that attempted to kill his brother and steal a hero relic because he was originally disinherited.

Elliot's intentions with ECorp is extreme, but instead of portraying him as a special snowflake that's always right, he unintentionally destroys the world around him and assisted the Dark Army, this show's version of TWSITD, into giving China the Congo and furthering their plans in global domination. Everything he's done caused more harm than good. The one-percent of the one-percent are still popping champagnes while small businesses are closing down. Edelgard's ending is all sunshine and rainbows, she takes down TWSITD and everyone and that homeless man that lives under the bridge that I have to cross live happily ever after. It doesn't address the fact that a war decimated an entire continent and the amount of property damage as a result. It doesn't tell me the kind of policies that Edelgard wants to enact. Okay, she wants to instill a system based on merit. Not really gonna change anything if it wasn't for Ferdinand to tell her about public education. Socioeconomics can be pretty boring and I don't expect the writers to take a college course on it, but I can't suspend my disbelief when the game handwaves it and say that she fixed everything.

Yes, you can argue that this can be said about every Fire Emblem game, but at least no one calls it a franchise that really understands racism or socioeconomics. I've seen people act as if Edelgard or this game's story is completely flawless and intelligently written. A video game can tackle dark or complicated subject matter, but you cannot expect me to see it as intelligently written when it doesn't have the balls to go deep into those subjects. You cannot handwave every realistic issue that Fodlan will inevitably face in CF and expect me to think that Edelgard is competent enough to handle it but not show it.

On a side-note, SigurdxDeirdre is a guilty pleasure of mine. Just like the game, I love it to death even if it's not well-written.

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10 minutes ago, Erinyes said:

I didn't say that FE has shitty writing in general, I meant that as in when it tries to be complex it just doesn't work. I consider the Archanea games and FE6 to be better written than something like FE4 or 3H because of its simplicity. Simple stories are easier to not fuck up and just like most stories, it's really the execution that matters. I'm not saying Archanea and FE6 are masterfully written or anything, but at least it paces itself as a simple story.

What makes something well written is the way it's structured and presented. A lot of crappy movies, TV shows, stories, etc. may have an interesting story/character/idea hook but is executed poorly. If I watch a movie that has good pacing and presentation but a dumb story to tell, then I can at least say it's a well-written movie that entertained me in the way the director intended to.

Spoiler for the movie Hot Fuzz

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Hot Fuzz is a movie about an uptight cop in metropolitan Britain being transferred to a small village. The village holds a dark secret of murdering those that tarnish its reputation and assets that plan to move away to a different village that could benefit having them. They do all of this so they can remain as the best village in Britain. Since they're seen as the best village in Britain, the cops there grow aloof to their jobs which enables the schemings held by the people running the village. As you can tell, the plot is really dumb, and yet, the way it's executed makes it entertaining and is a nice love letter to action movies and buddy cops.

My issue with 3H is that everything is insisted and not shown, the way it is paced makes it feel I'm going at 70 mph in a school parking lot. Lines of dialogue insisting that Rodrige/Judith's men are supporting the war effort means nothing to me when I don't see it. I mean, wow, two armor knights? I'm sure the Adrestrian Empire must be trembling in their feet. The worst part is when I see characters flailing their character traits to remind me what their personality is. I remember after the GD mock battle Claude would not shut up about how much of a schemer he is.

Another thing is when the writers use sob stories as a substitute for writing a compelling character. A good portion of fan favorite characters from 3H have some sob story because why show me that a character is compelling when you can write a sob story to make me feel bad about them. I mean, seriously, I probably have PTSD from the stuff I went through as a kid but that doesn't make me an interesting person if it defines my personality. If Bernadette annoys the hell out of me then a sob story isn't going to fix it. Since sob stories happen in the background and is something we have to imagine in our head, that's less work for the writers. To me, that is incredibly lazy and it shows me that the writers are willing to use a short-cut and play it off as something compelling. This might not apply to all characters, but is annoying when I notice it.

It's perfectly fine to write a tragic backstory, but you still need to write a character with some level of effort. Hopefully this won't attract any foaming at the mouth Edelstans, but honestly, I would find Edelgard a lot more compelling if they rewrote her backstory and what she does in CF. Her entire motivations is dependent on her overly tragic backstory. Sure she has her own insight on some of the events in White Clouds, but those insights are incredibly naive and her ideology are eye-rolling platitudes you expect from a Shonen protagonist. It's also annoying that in CF, it feels like she's steamrolling everything. Byleth or BE don't really question her, at least during the story.

Spoilers for Mr. Robot

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Weirdly enough, my favorite TV character is similar to Edelgard except he's better written. Elliot is someone who has a tragic childhood, it's not an overly traumatizing backstory meant to lazily tell me his motivations, rather, it's a story that helps explain why he can't connect to people normally. His experience is much more grounded and is something I can relate to even though I never lost a parent because of a corporate cover-up. His ideology and motivation are fuelled by the injustices he's observed and experienced. However, those injustices are much more clear-cut than what Edelgard regards as injustice. I mean, corporate cover-ups are pretty clear-cut as something unjust compared to some sociopath that attempted to kill his brother and steal a hero relic because he was originally disinherited.

Elliot's intentions with ECorp is extreme, but instead of portraying him as a special snowflake that's always right, he unintentionally destroys the world around him and assisted the Dark Army, this show's version of TWSITD, into giving China the Congo and furthering their plans in global domination. Everything he's done caused more harm than good. The one-percent of the one-percent are still popping champagnes while small businesses are closing down. Edelgard's ending is all sunshine and rainbows, she takes down TWSITD and everyone and that homeless man that lives under the bridge that I have to cross live happily ever after. It doesn't address the fact that a war decimated an entire continent and the amount of property damage as a result. It doesn't tell me the kind of policies that Edelgard wants to enact. Okay, she wants to instill a system based on merit. Not really gonna change anything if it wasn't for Ferdinand to tell her about public education. Socioeconomics can be pretty boring and I don't expect the writers to take a college course on it, but I can't suspend my disbelief when the game handwaves it and say that she fixed everything.

Yes, you can argue that this can be said about every Fire Emblem game, but at least no one calls it a franchise that really understands racism or socioeconomics. I've seen people act as if Edelgard or this game's story is completely flawless and intelligently written. A video game can tackle dark or complicated subject matter, but you cannot expect me to see it as intelligently written when it doesn't have the balls to go deep into those subjects. You cannot handwave every realistic issue that Fodlan will inevitably face in CF and expect me to think that Edelgard is competent enough to handle it but not show it.

On a side-note, SigurdxDeirdre is a guilty pleasure of mine. Just like the game, I love it to death even if it's not well-written.

Okay so this entire thing can be summed as “IS should show don’t tell” without really any knowledge of what “show don’t tell” actually means. If you can excuse my bluntness anyway. Cause here’s the thing, a story doesn’t need to show every little detail of its plot for it to be good. “Telling” in some situations can be just as effective as showing so the story isn’t bogged down  with unnecessary scenes and such. Some things are just better told than shown. 

Also can we just stop with the whole “sob stories are an excuse and not actual character writing” bullshit cause that’s not good criticism cause essentially what you’re saying here is “oh I find this character annoying so they’re poorly written because I personally don’t relate to their backstory that makes perfect logical sense for their character” like ugh I absolutely despise that. Like just because you don’t like the character or you personally can’t relate to their backstory that doesn’t make the character bad that just means you don’t like them which is fine because opinions but please for the love of god do not use it as an objective criticism cause it is not.

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