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Jayvee94

Equippable Combat Arts Tier List

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Preliminary post, might edit later.

I'm thinking that we may need to make a community tier list specifically to equippable combat arts (both generic and dependent). This will be based on it's usefulness and availability on Maddening, no NG+.

I might do a poll. However, it may be a better idea to follow Fire Emblem Discussions' example of community tier list. But I'm gonna need help.

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8 minutes ago, Johnzin said:

What is non-equippable? Hero Relic and mastery combat arts?

Yeah. This one goes over Wrath Strike, Tempest Lance, etc.

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The big issue that I have with tiering combat arts is that for the most part you're just going to use what you get.

There's not much point in arguing over whether Tempest Lance or Knightkneeler is better when for the most part you're just going to have both equipped, because very few characters actually learn more than three different lance combat arts. If your character is primarily training in lances you might as well just equip all the lance combat arts.

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20 hours ago, Silly said:

very few characters actually learn more than three different lance combat arts

Is it really better to train in just one weapon?

I'd argue that Cyril's Point-Blank Volley is worth it despite only being his secondary weapon.

I'm not sure about the others, though.

However, I would like to bring your attentions to:

  • Healing Focus
  • Bow Combat Arts
  • Positioning
  • Effective Combat Arts
  • Magic Combat Arts
  • Stat lowering combat arts and their uses in maddening

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There are some combat arts that are usable from early game to endgame. S Tier (if that's what we are doing)

Smash and curve shot. Added damage / crit / acc/ range. Necessary for casual play and LTC 1 turning. 

(A?)

Swift strike

I found swift strike a combat art that is important to kill mounted, mage, archers, and sword units. But comes later, bread and butter for 3 units, extremely useful for maddening

Point blank volley 

Not as great... Useful for early game and to kill any flying unit with a flying Cyril or mounted Leonie throughout any chapter. 

Then there's combat arts that's extremely useful situational or early game then fades like tempest lance, deadeye, knight kneeler, helm splitter, diamond axe, exhaustive strike, wind strike etc... 

On a slightly note, I find encloser quite useful although situational. 

 

 

 

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Can we get one for spells too? I've seen a lot of discussions about characters which had a subtext of how good one spell list was against one another, and while some of those were based on obvious stuff such as spells that could do something unique (Thoron, Meteor etc.) when it comes to weighing the more bread & butter spells against one another, I'm not entirely sure which ones are considered better and why. Be interesting to see discussion of such laying it all out.

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One Two Punch is pretty underrated imo, it gives you a reason to use Dedue beyond the early game hell phase especially when he gets it at C rank Fists, + 8 mt and guaranteed double are nice, combined with Fistfare, Death Blow and a Str focused Battalion he can realiably one round a lot of enemies mid game. This combat art is not as good as Swift Strike and Point Blank Volley tho, since it’s not 2 consecutive attacks so you will take 1 counterattack before the second hit and fists have pitifully low damage so it balances out the +8 Mt.

Encloser is the best Utility Combat Art, it basically disables an enemy for 1 turn which leaves you some breathing room when you’re swarmed by a horde of enemies on harder maps.

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10 minutes ago, Ari Chan said:

One Two Punch is pretty underrated imo

I second this, it's an amazing Art. Especially because it disables enemy follow-up Attacks, so it can also be a way to deal damage without getting killed too.

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9 hours ago, Jayvee94 said:

Is it really better to train in just one weapon?

I'd argue that Cyril's Point-Blank Volley is worth it despite only being his secondary weapon.

I'm not sure about the others, though.

However, I would like to bring your attentions to:

  • Healing Focus
  • Bow Combat Arts
  • Positioning
  • Effective Combat Arts
  • Magic Combat Arts
  • Stat lowering combat arts and their uses in maddening

It's usually better to just train one weapon type. The majority of good classes only have one weaponfaire, and you likely only want to equip one prowess skill, so by splitting between two weapons you're losing hit and damage. There are a few exceptions. Ferdinand/Sylvain/Seteth/Leonie/Cyril should also spec into Lance/Bow even if it is not their primary weapon type because the combat art is very good. And your can slap a bow on someone as a backup ranged weapon. But other than that it is usually better to primarily just use a single weapon.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Healing Focus is not very good. Not because it isn't helpful but because Gauntlet training is not particularly desirable for most units. If you have it, you might as well throw it on if you don't have anything better, but the marginal benefit you gain is not worth the amount of effort to train a unit up to B. If you need to spend an action to heal you should use an actual healer so that your combat unit can attack. If for some reason you can't do this, you have concoctions/elixirs, which mimic the effect of a combat art, except you don't need to train Gauntlets to use them.

Curved Shot is pretty useful on people who are training Bows. This isn't going to be literally everyone, but it's a fairly good skill for many of your units to pick up.

Smite is a good positioning skill because you can teach it to someone who doesn't really fight and deploy them as a filler positioning unit (but in that case it's not really competing for much because damage combat arts are useless on a primarily utility unit). Reposition is pretty good but might not be learned by the time you can get into an intermediate class without grinding. Other positional skills are less good. Overall though, your fliers get so much movement that the relative value of positioning skills is actually not super high, outside of Smite (which is necessary for certain LTC strats).

Some effective combat arts are situationally good. A lot of them are pretty garbage. Magic combat arts are also situationally good, but they can only really be utilized by units that have good magic growth. (They actually aren't that good at killing armors, because armors have massive HP pools and you can't double with a combat art, so they lose a big niche that magic normally occupies.)

Stat lowering combat arts are not very useful past the first few chapters. The big issue with debuffs is that you need to first hit the enemy with your combat art, then have a second unit come and hit them to take advantage of the stat decrease. They can be helpful at killing Ch 2 Kostas, for example, who is very bulky and takes many hits to deal with. Something like -Spd or -Def means you need less actions to actually beat him. But later on any generic enemy should be dead if you attack them with two of your units, regardless of whether you debuffed them or not. Debuffing here doesn't do much, as you're spending the same amount of actions.

For the most part, most characters will have less than three good combat arts to equip for most of the game, and later on they might have four or five combat arts that you will need to decide between. Many combat arts are situational though, so you can freely switch them in when they're relevant and take them out afterwards.

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Tempest lance is great in the early game because of its +8 damage. It allows for really easy kills on units who tend to have either amazing strength like Dimitri. Dimitri's early game is amazing and top notch. Later on he has to let his stats carry him as his other options may not be the most optimal.

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Anti-monster combat arts tend to perform a bit better, even without the effective damage, than most basic combat arts, such as wrath strike or smash. Their only restriction is that not everyone can learn them. Plus, having a guaranteed option to instantly destroy shield without using up a gambit is always nice.

As low tier,  however, definitely exhaustive strike : an art that destroy your weapon in exchange for boosted damaged based on remaining durability. I seriously don't know how to make good use of this... even if I sacrifice a recently forged steel axe, the damage doesn't really justify all the trouble to set it up.

Edited by Modirufa6317

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50 minutes ago, Modirufa6317 said:

Anti-monster combat arts tend to perform a bit better, even without the effective damage, than most basic combat arts, such as wrath strike or smash. Their only restriction is that not everyone can learn them. Plus, having a guaranteed option to instantly destroy shield without using up a gambit is always nice.

As low tier,  however, definitely exhaustive strike : an art that destroy your weapon in exchange for boosted damaged based on remaining durability. I seriously don't know how to make good use of this... even if I sacrifice a recently forged steel axe, the damage doesn't really justify all the trouble to set it up.

I found Bane of Monster (sword) good to get that extra 1 damage early game, especially on bosses/DK. But monster breaker isn't the same use as smash. Smash can give you that extra small damage, but I think it's use is for accuracy and crit. Monster piercer (lance) is in a worse situation, where tempest lance is higher damage and knight kneeler for the extra hit.

I have found use for it on Caspar. He's not a great character in all means, it's better just to smash with killer axe + (at WM + S axe, ~90% anyone). But a steel forge, he's able to 1shot Ch 13 assassins/archers and most mages throughout the game. Still not great as an option as just smashing for a crit.

He carries 2 steel forge (unused) just for this purpose. 

Edited by Johnzin

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Wild Abandon is an easy bottom tier - axes are already inaccurate enough as is, -30 hit isn't helping. Ditto for Diamond Axe; having all the power in the world doesn't mean a damn thing if you whiff, and 7 durability is a lot to piss away on an inaccurate attack.

Edited by Shadow Mir

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1 hour ago, Modirufa6317 said:

Anti-monster combat arts tend to perform a bit better, even without the effective damage, than most basic combat arts, such as wrath strike or smash. Their only restriction is that not everyone can learn them. Plus, having a guaranteed option to instantly destroy shield without using up a gambit is always nice.

As low tier,  however, definitely exhaustive strike : an art that destroy your weapon in exchange for boosted damaged based on remaining durability. I seriously don't know how to make good use of this... even if I sacrifice a recently forged steel axe, the damage doesn't really justify all the trouble to set it up.

The only use for Exhaustive Strike is his paralogue with Mercedes where you need him to kill the Death Knight to get the Scythe of Sariel.  Exhaustive Strike + Steel Axe+ makes him capable of killing the Death Knight without having to pump (too many) levels into him at the expense of another better character.  (This is assuming Maddening difficulty of course)

Edited by Flores Salicis

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I tried to do a list on my own as noone has done so far.

Disclaimer: I didn't account for availability in any way. Neither on which units get to use the art nor on which skill level the units are expected to unlock it.

Imo almost all combat arts still have their uses. It's just that the higher ranked ones are useful more often or are offering powerful unique options.

 

S : Encloser, Windsweep, Deadeye, Swift Strikes, Sword Dance, Armored Strike, Glowing Ember, Frozen Lance

A : Break Shot, Point-Blank Volley, Monster Blast, Nimble Combo, Bombard, Finesse Blade, Vengeance, Schism Shot, Lightning Axe, Soulblade, Waning Shot, Curved Shot, Heavy Draw, Lance Jab, Tempest Lance, Reposition, Knightkneeler, Monster Breaker, Bane of Monsters, Healing Focus

B : Monster Piercer, Helm Splitter, Hexblade, Draw Back, Shatter Slash, Ward Arrow, One-Two Punch, Wrath Strike

C : Monster Crusher, Spike, Exhaustive Strike, Smash, Smite, Fading Blow, Haze Slice

D : Shove, Mighty Blow, Swap, Rushing Blow

E : Grounder, Diamond Axe, Hit and Run, Mystic Blow, Draining Blow, Focused Strike, Wild Abandon, Subdue

 

Feel free to disagree

Edited by GarEEE
Moved Frozen Lance down a bit

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16 minutes ago, GarEEE said:

I tried to do a list on my own as noone has done so far.

I did not account for the skill level, that unlocks the combat arts. e.g. in the case of Waning Shot being above Curved Shot, despite Curving Shot.

Imo almost all combat arts still have their uses. It's just that the higher ranked ones are useful more often.

 

S : Encloser, Windsweep, Deadeye, Frozen Lance, Swift Strikes, Sword Dance, Armored Strike, Glowing Ember

A : Break Shot, Point-Blank Volley, Monster Blast, Nimble Combo, Bombard, Finesse Blade, Vengeance, Schism Shot, Lightning Axe, Soulblade, Waning Shot, Curved Shot, Heavy Draw, Lance Jab, Tempest Lance, Reposition, Knightkneeler, Monster Breaker, Bane of Monsters, Healing Focus

B : Monster Piercer, Helm Splitter, Hexblade, Draw Back, Shatter Slash, Ward Arrow, One-Two Punch, Wrath Strike

C : Monster Crusher, Spike, Exhaustive Strike, Smash, Smite, Fading Blow, Haze Slice

D : Shove, Mighty Blow, Swap, Rushing Blow

E : Grounder, Diamond Axe, Hit and Run, Mystic Blow, Draining Blow, Focused Strike, Wild Abandon, Subdue

 

Feel free to disagree

I think you're giving Deadeye way more credit than it deserves - it's too inaccurate at long range to be practical.

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9 minutes ago, Shadow Mir said:

I think you're giving Deadeye way more credit than it deserves - it's too inaccurate at long range to be practical.

With +20hit from mastering archer + accuracy ring, the unit will be accurate enough to make deadeye worthwhile (until you make him/her a bow knight).

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52 minutes ago, GarEEE said:

I tried to do a list on my own as noone has done so far.

I did not account for the skill level, that unlocks the combat arts. e.g. in the case of Waning Shot being above Curved Shot, despite Curving Shot.

Imo almost all combat arts still have their uses. It's just that the higher ranked ones are useful more often.

 

S : Encloser, Windsweep, Deadeye, Frozen Lance, Swift Strikes, Sword Dance, Armored Strike, Glowing Ember

A : Break Shot, Point-Blank Volley, Monster Blast, Nimble Combo, Bombard, Finesse Blade, Vengeance, Schism Shot, Lightning Axe, Soulblade, Waning Shot, Curved Shot, Heavy Draw, Lance Jab, Tempest Lance, Reposition, Knightkneeler, Monster Breaker, Bane of Monsters, Healing Focus

B : Monster Piercer, Helm Splitter, Hexblade, Draw Back, Shatter Slash, Ward Arrow, One-Two Punch, Wrath Strike

C : Monster Crusher, Spike, Exhaustive Strike, Smash, Smite, Fading Blow, Haze Slice

D : Shove, Mighty Blow, Swap, Rushing Blow

E : Grounder, Diamond Axe, Hit and Run, Mystic Blow, Draining Blow, Focused Strike, Wild Abandon, Subdue

 

Feel free to disagree

I think Smash should be S tier, you can reliably get a crit once you start making killer axe +. and before that, it helps with shaky accuracy which is vital early game and endgame units. early game youre not even doubling for a while.  And for late game, having ~50 crit with Smash + killer + makes any wyvern able to 1shot anything besides monsters. 

I think Windsweep should be A tier, although amazing situational, most sword users will doubling unless youre using a sword unit vs. another sword unit.

Deadeye should be A, it can poke at best and aggro at worst. Accuracy isnt bad with help. 

I think Curved shot should be S because it adds alot acc and Range (important) and usable for secondary bow users who wont be using prowess (Cyril/Petra wyverns).

Sword dance should be E, I am not wasting a dancer turn. Their combat is suboptimal. Dance for another unit to do their battle.

Break shot/Schism/ Waning should be B, it is not useful after early game as stated in an early post, two units can kill 1 once stats pick up.

 

Edited by Johnzin

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35 minutes ago, Modirufa6317 said:

With +20hit from mastering archer + accuracy ring, the unit will be accurate enough to make deadeye worthwhile (until you make him/her a bow knight).

Problem is, accuracy rings are very rare (only three in the game; one from a Fortress Knight in chapter 5, one from Anna, and the last must be stolen from Edelgard (in chapter 7) or Hilda (only on Crimson Flower)). And even with that, I still think I'm looking at iffy hit rates before enemy evade, except against armors. Oh, and Deadeye's case ain't helped by only being learned by Ashe and Bernadetta.

Edited by Shadow Mir

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27 minutes ago, Shadow Mir said:

Problem is, accuracy rings are very rare (only three in the game; one from a Fortress Knight in chapter 5, one from Anna, and the last must be stolen from Edelgard (in chapter 7) or Hilda (only on Crimson Flower)). And even with that, I still think I'm looking at iffy hit rates before enemy evade, except against armors. Oh, and Deadeye's case ain't helped by only being learned by Ashe and Bernadetta.

Although rare, I dont think its that bad of an issue. Ch 5, Bernie or Ashe should be getting Deadeye around that time if you are training their bow rank + tutoring + goals. And not many people are competing for it. Lets say mid to late game, you will have the Experience gem (hopefully if you recruit professors), 1 or 2 knowledge gems (paralogue/ch 11) for whoever needs, 1-3 evasion rings (depending on paralogues) for your wyverns, 1 ced staff / thyrus if you choose, 1 healing staff user, march ring, and theres other things to fill in. I dont think theres much competition for the limited acc ring. Dancers dont need anything

Only thing i can see competeing is giving the knowledge gem to bernie or ashe cause they arent the speediest and need that volley. 

I am uncertain on how dependent arts are being treated vs non dependent arts since it hasnt been brought up. 

Edited by Johnzin

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2 hours ago, Shadow Mir said:

I think you're giving Deadeye way more credit than it deserves - it's too inaccurate at long range to be practical.

Deadeye is in my S tier for multiple reasons:

  1. It allows units to attack when they couldn't without it
  2. Gives units a lot of flexibility on where to attack from, not necessarily competing with your other units for space
  3. no retaliation (which admittedly most bow combat arts share)
  4. +5 might is a good damage boost for bow combat arts
2 hours ago, Johnzin said:

I think Smash should be S tier, you can reliably get a crit once you start making killer axe +. and before that, it helps with shaky accuracy which is vital early game and endgame units. early game youre not even doubling for a while.  And for late game, having ~50 crit with Smash + killer + makes any wyvern able to 1shot anything besides monsters. 

I think Windsweep should be A tier, although amazing situational, most sword users will doubling unless youre using a sword unit vs. another sword unit.

Deadeye should be A, it can poke at best and aggro at worst. Accuracy isnt bad with help. 

I think Curved shot should be S because it adds alot acc and Range (important) and usable for secondary bow users who wont be using prowess (Cyril/Petra wyverns).

Sword dance should be E, I am not wasting a dancer turn. Their combat is suboptimal. Dance for another unit to do their battle.

Break shot/Schism/ Waning should be B, it is not useful after early game as stated in an early post, two units can kill 1 once stats pick up.

 

You make a lot of very good points.

I'll give an axe crit build a try at some point. You have me convinced with its accuracy boost though. It's definitely a game changer early game.

Windsweep will always be S tier in my opinion. Attacking without retaliation in melee against even those, that could otherwise retaliate regardless of range is incredibly powerful and rivaled only by gambits which are extremely limited and often not even that accurate.

About Sword Dance I've admittedly almost never used it for exactly the reason you mentioned. It's only technically that it would make for a great combat art. Charm can be pumped up pretty easily and the +20 avoid harmonizes well with dancers decent dodginess.

Break Shot has great value against monsters and great synergy with your speedy units and brawlers. I'd still value its usefulness a lot higher than Schism / Waning.

I also see your reasoning on curved shot, especially for secondary bow users, which I haven't really utilized so far. If I also accounted for availability Curved Shot might actually be the best equippable combat art overall imo.

Edited by GarEEE

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25 minutes ago, GarEEE said:

Deadeye is in my S tier for multiple reasons:

  1. It allows units to attack when they couldn't without it
  2. Gives units a lot of flexibility on where to attack from, not necessarily competing with your other units for space
  3. no retaliation (which admittedly most bow combat arts share)
  4. +5 might is a good damage boost for bow combat arts

Counterpoint: Having all the range in the world doesn't mean a damn when anything even remotely evasive laughs at your hit rates. And neither does the extra might.

Edited by Shadow Mir

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Piggy backing off of @GarEEE post.

This is totally up to debate since it is based on my playstyle and opinion only; but it needs to encompass other peoples playstyles. Especially for the repositioning arts and magic based. I find reposition arts only useful sometimes in early game. Even if you're trying to LTC or 1turn, if you have Lys/Lind/Manuala/Flayn and with flyer and stride, a lot of times you don’t need repositioning, especially since you'd calculating how far away the enemy is prior to the chapter. I never saw a use for making a flying Annette rally bot as a close range damage chipper (same as Marriane , Flayn, and Hubert) than as magic users but with combat arts. Should stay as magic or support.

I think some variables needs to be stated beforehand such as:

1) usefulness of the art throughout the entirety of the run and viability

2) Universal vs Dependent. This will play a role. i.e. lords get their own arts with in each class and subdue (both wont be included)

3) How situational the combat art is and how often you need to use it

4) Since its equip-able combat arts, learning through mastering a class is okay as long as it is equip-able (triangle attack / reposition vs. hunter volley / astra)  

5) NG and maddening, but this shouldn’t stop you from using mediocre characters like Caspar and Ashe but will consider some viability as a combat unit

* S - C are placed within their tiers, D and E are not sorted

S Tier – Vital and usable in early game to late game and accessible

Smash, Curved Shot

A - vital and usable in many situations when you get to endgame. Great attributes in terms of combat or utility

Swift Strike, Point-Blank Volley, Encloser, Windsweep

B – Situational but very useful in those times or incredibly useful early game fades in utility later on

Deadeye, Knightkneeler, **Tempest Lance, **Reposition, Monster Blast

C – Good uses early game but fades in usefulness or rare situation when needed

Heavy Draw, Helm Splitter, Monster Breaker, **Break Shot, Wrath Strike, Bane of Monsters, One-Two Punch, **Frozen Lance, Vengeance, Draw Back, Shove, Smite

D – usable-ish due to gimmick or very rare situational, but can easily sub this out with some other art or unit or weapon for same or better results. May need set up with stats or training a rank of a magic user

Diamond Axe, Sunder, Exhaustive Strike, Lance Jab, Armored Strike, Healing Focus, Lightning Axe, Hexblade, Soulblade, Mystic Blow, Finesse Blade, Shatter Slash, Glowing Ember, Monster Crusher, Bombard/Nimble Combo, Armored Strike

E – it exists for some reason. combat art sucks at combat or utility is nonsense

Triangle Attack, Sword Dance, Wild Abandon, Schism Shot, Waning Shot, Ward Arrow, Grounder, Haze Slice, Monster Piercer, Draining Blow, Mighty Blow, Fading Blow, Rushing Blow, Hit and Run, Spike, Swap, Focused Strike

**changed due to replies

I wrote my thesis here. Long story short, all axe combat arts can be replaced with Smash. RNG abuse with Divine Pulse til you crit when you are able to make killer + 

Spoiler

Smash - incredible utility throughout the entire game. Requiring only a D in rank. It is versatile on EVERYONE who uses an axe. Increased accuracy for enemies that are in terrain, early game shaky hits and high avoid endgame. A literal must if you are LTC, to rely on a wyvern crit with Killer +. Since majority of the strategies for killing bosses / 1turn is to warp / stride /  dance a wyvern over to swift strike/hammer/killer axe. The Divine pulse mechanic allows you to always crit, just RNG abuse (reset the roll) when you need that crit. Or just need that accuracy. Or even to abuse the RNG to get that 100% hit so you can reset it. You can always reliably crit an enemy due to the +55% crit and divine pulse.

Curved Shot - usable on ANY bow user or secondary bow user (petra / cyril wyverns). Requiring only a D in rank. Accuracy is really needed to hit terrain or distance shots, or can reset the RNG with divine pulse. The added range is a bonus too for all users. Usable from early game to end, can chip 2-3+ range on any bow user. 

Swift Strike - i may be biased, but my playstyle is 1 turning when can. This is NECESSARY to 1turn many post time skip chapters. And it comes on wyverns units. Maddening mode has so many breaker skills, swift strike with a breaker skill and silver + / horseslayer /Assal will kill ANY mounted / mage / archer / sword master / assassin. Especially 2 of those units most likely have death blow. Requires some Str boosters, but well worth one shotting enemies you will never double and have axe breaker. There is only really 5 usable lance users (Sylv/Set/Ferdie/Dimitri/....Ingrid), you might as well make use of them while you have infinite axe users. 

Point Blank Volley - Double hit with higher damage and hit. Literally saves Cyril. With death blow and flying, he is able to kill any flyer and canto away. Leonie can also do the same, but without deathblow it hurts damage and canto would be at BK level. But nonetheless, will kill all the insanely fast flyers without the need of a brave bow. At worst, can double with high damage.

Encloser - This is situational but utility is high if you need to stop an enemy you cannot kill. also can literally allow the units who learn this solo certain enemies by chipping to death or if youre being overwhelmed. I have used this to stop Dedue-transformed-monster from moving for several turns and stopped SMs I could not kill. **Higher Accuracy than any gambit due to added hit and can use iron bow +, not including skills and battalions. 

Windsweep - You will be using Byleth, in either a WL or EO, and if EO this is an incredible art. Able chip without a retaliation. Early game (if speccing only into swords EO byleth) to kill DK or attack assassins/sword masters with blazing speeds. The actual use of it is the crit, same as smash, I use it from early game to late game to safely crit. Bane of Monsters have crit too, but this adds no liability of retaliation.

Deadeye - accuracy is shaky only sometimes, since you can go archer route for the only two units who get this. You have acc ring and battalions for + 15 - 30 hit. It is a great chip damage for early game and even sometimes late game if you decide to go bow knight. Snipers most likely will not use late game, since Hunter Volley.

Knightkneeler - great early game damager to mounted to even 1hko if youre dimitri. But what makes it shine is its accuracy boost. Great for early game Dedue / Dimitri / any lance. Carries through to endgame for Dimitri and the stated lance users above. 

**Break Shot - I personally dont use this besides early game. But brought to my attention people use for monsters. I would guess great early game and monster, but once you have volley, its not needed . Your archer should be doing more damage to the monster or can monster blast the shield or even far range battalion (often the hit bonus ones) anyways.

Monster Blast - Archers have +1 range, allowing no retallions besides those crazy titans from Rhea. Free breaking without needing a battalion

Heavy Draw - Useful for Felix and Shamir to 1shot Peg / Wyverns early to mid game before Volley, but need Silver / Silver + . Allows bigger chip damage with higher hit at worst if you cant double.

**Tempest Lance - Necessary to get that extra damage early game Maddening cause everyone def is so high. falls off though with Dimitri user with higher speed and overall huge str anyways. Will also fall off in use for the other lance users who will gain speed quickly. Swift strike will be doing much better. Ingrid who? **brought up high utility for the early game 

Helm Splitter - C rank on every axe unit. Useful occasionally early game for extra damage and finish off an armored unit without retaliation . Smash is better when you get killer weapons. 

Monster Breaker - same as helm splitter, useful to get that small damage in early game. Doesnt have the armor effect and is not available for everyone, but helpful for Dedue and Edel who will be front line

Repositioning (shove/smite/draw back/reposition) - if youre 1 turn Maddening, you would be recruiting Lys / Manuala / Flayn / Lind depending on your route. This allows you to reposition anywhere without these combat arts. Even in BL you dont need anyone besides Flayn and Manuala if you feed Manuala boosters for warp. You have dancer + dancer battalion + march ring + shoes of wind. I can attest I got Sylvain to Hubert in Ch 21 to swift strike with on 1 turn.  Smite requires too much armor rank, but free for Gilbert if switch goals. Swap is even more situational if youre 1 turning cause what enemy is close enough to your starting point to 1 turn. Pure LTCing though for chapters with route may want these a little more. **was brought up to consider draw back / reposition due to utility besides LTC, combat orientated.

Vengeance - gimmicky, easier to 1 turn with wyvern smash / swift strike. can kill DK early, but so can Byleth with the free steel sword + Bane of Monster or Knightkneeler + free Steel lance

Bombard / Nimble Combo - learned by Felix & Catherine or Caspar. Realistically only Caspar, who is not Dedue for front lining. Axes can give higher damage. Can provide higher hit than the axe, but very situational at best. Cause Smash exists + killer axe + RNG abuse

One - Two Punch - Useable on Dedue early to double with higher acc. Have used it on Dedue Endgame. Dedue as a tank and works alright. Easier to wait + killer axe + EP, and PP smash

Focused Strike - garbage + 10 hit compared to Smash, and not +3 damage or crit.

Exhaustive Strike - extremely situational for Caspar / Alois. Must use Forge Steel to add + 34 damage. Good only to 1shot mages (throughout the game) or early to midgame  archers / assassins. Not that expensive as people say, you have tourneys and too many activity points later unless you are grinding/questing/aux

Shatter Slash - like break shot but much worse, you can get hit. Good only on Gilbert, and he is not a good tank in Maddening. 

Hit and Run - really only useable on Ingrid, either do damage with tempest/burning quake or Alert stance is better than this art

Healing Focus - trades 1 combat art slot for inventory. Its not bad, because Dedue or Caspar can benefit. All you need is smash and One - Two punch / Exhaustive 

Spike- everyone gets Helm Splitter at C, you get this at C +, either you want more acc with Smash or do slightly more damage with Helm Splitter early game. Useless

Diamond Axe - as said by Shadow Mir, shaky accuracy from axes do not help. This is very situational. Its better to Smash than this

Armored Strike - only really useable by Dedue at A axe. Smash for the crit instead of this by the time you get this ranking

Sunder - Felix the best ish, since Ferdie and Dimitri have better classes to spec into than a sword. Can be used to bank on a sword crit like smash. Situational, the reason its ranked low is because sword users besides EO are not good endgame classes. Assassins can work, but still more situational than Windsweep. 

Grounder - you most likely are playing bow emblem early game and shooting wyverns with bows. it is very situational to add accuracy to a sword, since theyre already high accuracy. But to hit a pegasus knight, use a bow because they have sword breaker

Glowing Ember - Dimitri and Gilbert. very situational. Dimitri can often 1 round anyways, I find it easier to just killer lance +. Gilbert can use this btter with higher def stat. 

Monster Crusher - Raph only. He most likely will be doubled, battation instead. 

Haze Slice - combat arts banking on not getting hit with higher avoid is odd, rather do more damage or have utility or crit or higher acc. I cannot think of anyone who learns this to choose this over other combat arts.

Lightning Axe -  Annette only, either make her a rally bot / battalion bot or give her those mediocre capabilities as a mage. She will be able to chip with high movement, but so can any wyvern. 

Hexblade/Soulblade - same as lightning axe above. the physical units who can learn this most likely do more damage physically or use a hammer if you can. Very situational (looking at you low str ingrid). I dont think training Marriane other than a healer is worth, she can either support with battalion or heal rather than be mediocre combat. Same for hubert, stay a mage.  Lys / Dorthea have higher utility in magic by far.

**Frozen Lance - informed that people can use this on Hubert / Marriane to do higher damage than spells at certain situations. I cannot see this being that often used because of their 4 move will fall behind.

Finesse Blade  - Catherine most likely, maybe Felix. Adds extra 8 - 12 damage honestly. Situational at best to finish off an enemy

Monster Piercer - less damage than tempest lance and not as accurate as knightkneeler. Close range to break a barrier, which can be done with a battalion if upclose

Lance Jab - Leonie / Shamir either would use bows instead while Cyril would use Axe or two of those would you point blank volley. It can add ~10 damage but better options than this

Schism Shot, Waning Shot, Ward Arrow - not very useful cause lowering Str or Res or sealing magic. If requiring two units to kill most likely a mage, just chip with curved shot. and less str cannot be situational where you expect the second unit to now survive a hit.

Triangle Attack - in Maddening, your wyverns are most likely dodgetanking somewhere else for chipping units to hit later or soloing small crowds. Not flying together in pack to kill one enemy. You have Smash / Swift Strike for that.

Mighty Blow - A single hit gauntlet attack most likely will do less damage. It is learned on Dedue and Caspar, who can easily do higher damage with a Steel Axe + Smash. It requires an A in brawling.

Mystic Blow - Byleth would use over Felix. A rank. Magic damage can be replaced with Levin. No reason to spec into brawling as Byleth would go EO or WL. 

Sword dance - your dancer should not be fighting. Their role is to allow a combat unit that excels to have a role twice a turn or heal twice. Or some other utility to finish the objective of the chapter quicker. Suboptimal combat after a combat art is not useful. 

 

Edited by Johnzin

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