Book IV Official Speculation & Discussion Thread

[DefyingFates]

1 minute ago, Sentinel07 said:

Part 1:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3QuaKmAh38

Part 2:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3V1Apq8SXc

Part 3:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oyDH_qzVTrw

 

Huh. I...never knew about this, thank you so much! I remember CYL 1 having the live action trailer, did CYL 2 get anything?

[Sentinel07]

1 hour ago, DefyingFates said:

Huh. I...never knew about this, thank you so much! I remember CYL 1 having the live action trailer, did CYL 2 get anything?

Not that I can remember off the top of my head.

[Sentinel07]

Well, that was quite a chapter. Didn't expect that turn at all!

Though, that middle section of the chapter confirmed one thing that I believed before, that children who essentially had nowhere else to go were specifically targeted.

I should probably give the chapter another read though to make sure I understood it all.

Edited August 18, 2020 by Sentinel07

[Mercakete]

Playing through the chapter now and I'm kind of all... "So...Freyja had a funny little mustache birthmark or something she was embarrassed about and teased for and THAT'S how this all started?! Who even was there to make fun of her?! Also, when did Freyr join us?"

But goodness, that made a lot of sense. ... Because I summoned Hel, does this mean I get to keep the ONE male fairy?

[DefyingFates]

2 hours ago, Mercakete said:

"So...Freyja had a funny little mustache birthmark or something she was embarrassed about and teased for

To be fair, kids can be cruel and that sort of thing can mess you up at a young age, so I buy it.

2 hours ago, Mercakete said:

Also, when did Freyr join us?"

Yeah, this part caught me off-guard too though xD

As for the chapter at large...I liked it! The middle conversation was interesting with the "we targeted miserable children" thing as @Sentinel07 said  - though this does make me curious when the fairies will open up about Sharena. And the ending...that was surprisingly rough. I was completely blindsided by the having to kill a defenceless Freyr thing, but it was such a clever way of integrating the story with the chapter. Not to mention Freyja freaking out when he asked the Askrans to kill him and screaming once he died...say what you will about FEH's writing, but that part got to me. It's a much better death than the random bloodbath at the end of Book 2, at least.

In any case, the ending opens the door for some sort of redemption for Freyja, though it's just as likely that she's going to go ballisticd have to be put down. Or suffer a "Redemption Equals Death" fate by trying to undo something she put into motion in her anger. I won't get my hopes up too high, but I am curious as to how this'll all play out.

[Sentinel07]

Just gave the chapter another look and something I had glossed over before.

Freyr mentioning a mortal princess making her way in by mistake and should never have been involved.

[Mercakete]

@DefyingFates

I know that teasing is terrible and stuff (I dealt with it a lot as a child, actually) it's just...kind of a silly detail that takes away from the drama of it. It could have been any birthmark, but it had to be a mustache situation. Also, this reminds me of the old version of Sleeping Beauty. (Maleficent cast the curse on Arora because she wasn't invited to the party. Very petty. And probably why she wasn't invited.) So, I wonder if that's another thing they pulled from, actually, since Maleficent is a dark fairy. But yeah, "I'm going to cast all worlds into a never-ending nightmare" is kind of extreme for "my brother cares for other people besides me" and it gets even sillier with "my brother defended me when I was a kid, so he's the only one I'll ever love and he'd better only love me or I'll torture and kill whoever else he loves." Freyja's kind of extreme and needs to calm down.

Freyr, on the other hand, is very selfless and I love how he came to the conclusion that he needed to act the part of a hero himself instead of trying to get other people to do it for him. Super mature (quite the contrast to Freyja) and man this guy blew me away with that. Also, brought some solemnity to an otherwise kind of over-the-top situation, and resolving the present issue with a solution that makes sense with the canon. Further, yeah, Freyja's response was really good (though Freyr coddling her a bit at the end instead of confronting her with how terrible she's being was kind of annoying.) It was a good twist, and I'm so glad that Freyja (who honestly is kind of a spoiled brat) didn't get her way, and not because she's the baddie. Because it's realistic. You play with power too big for you and use it for selfish reasons and people around you get hurt. Try to hurt others out of vengeance and those you love will get caught in the middle of it. An "I didn't mean for this to happen" moment is guaranteed. However she responds to it, it's a lesson she needed to go through...though I expect she'll respond poorly. Being all "No no no! I want my waaaaay!! I'll take it out on you humans!!"

She's a toddler with power throwing a temper tantrum.

@Sentinel07

Yeah, that was clearly Sharena. Though it's a bit odd that the changeling is involved with the ruling fairy siblings specifically targetting kids from terrible homes. There's also Peony's Meet the Heroes section, which talks specifically about royal children visiting the dream world as a sort of commonplace thing.

[Sentinel07]

Can only wonder how things will go from here.

I'm still hoping that we actually do get some maps based on our world as shown in the trailer. I really want them to actually make those real. 😄

Hopefully they also really get a move on with these plot revelations. Got 3 chapters left and they're still being ambiguous on Sharena as well as Peony and Triandra's relationship.

[Sunwoo]

As long as Heroes sticks to its formula for main game chapters, we're always going to have a decent start, exciting middle, and disappointing finish.

[Humanoid]

Just like Three Houses.

[Tybrosion]

2 hours ago, Sunwoo said:

As long as Heroes sticks to its formula for main game chapters, we're always going to have a decent start, exciting middle, and disappointing finish.

Yup. If we’re getting the usual thirteen chapters, the remaining chapters will probably just be offing Plumeria, then Triandra, and then Freyja for good until IS brings them back as Mythic waifu bait of course with little else of substance happening in between. 

[Mercakete]

2 hours ago, Sunwoo said:

As long as Heroes sticks to its formula for main game chapters, we're always going to have a decent start, exciting middle, and disappointing finish.

That's subjective opinion. I, personally, really like the Heroes stories on the whole. I didn't care for the beginning of book 4, and it's only just becoming interesting for me. Loved books 2 and 3. Book 1 was necessary, and more of a stage-setter to me, though the parts about Alfonse rekindling his ability to create bonds with heroes was nice.

[Sunwoo]

I hate the entirety of book 4 even now, so.

Doesn't change the fact that the later books have followed the general premise of starting somewhat hit-or-miss, the middle part builds up and starts to get interesting, and then poor pacing kills it in the end.

Edited August 19, 2020 by Sunwoo

[Mercakete]

1 hour ago, Sunwoo said:

I hate the entirety of book 4 even now, so.

Doesn't change the fact that the later books have followed the general premise of starting somewhat hit-or-miss, the middle part builds up and starts to get interesting, and then poor pacing kills it in the end.

Again, that's subjective opinion. To your tastes, sure. But that doesn't mean that it is, as a fact, as you described.

[DefyingFates]

On 8/18/2020 at 5:23 PM, Mercakete said:

I know that teasing is terrible and stuff (I dealt with it a lot as a child, actually) it's just...kind of a silly detail that takes away from the drama of it. It could have been any birthmark, but it had to be a mustache situation. Also, this reminds me of the old version of Sleeping Beauty. (Maleficent cast the curse on Arora because she wasn't invited to the party. Very petty. And probably why she wasn't invited.) So, I wonder if that's another thing they pulled from, actually, since Maleficent is a dark fairy. But yeah, "I'm going to cast all worlds into a never-ending nightmare" is kind of extreme for "my brother cares for other people besides me" and it gets even sillier with "my brother defended me when I was a kid, so he's the only one I'll ever love and he'd better only love me or I'll torture and kill whoever else he loves." Freyja's kind of extreme and needs to calm down.

I'm sorry to hear that. I really hope you're doing better now!

As for Freyja, I think her backstory if she developed an obsessive personality due to her brother being the only one who cared about her or always had obsessive tendencies, if you want to look at it that way. That said, I also like Freyja's reaction to Freyr's death as you said. It was a surprising but welcome dose of reality to the whole situation and I look forward to seeing what happens to her next. Even if she goes onto throw a tantrum, I think it'll be interesting if she just shuts down or starts lashing out at random instead of "rationally seeking revenge" if that makes sense.

As @Sunwoo says, there's a good chance Book 4 will botch the ending, but hopefully they use the time they have left productively and give the story a satisfying ending. Or even extend the Book past the expected 13 chapters if need be; that'd be nice.

[Sunwoo]

11 hours ago, Mercakete said:

Again, that's subjective opinion. To your tastes, sure. But that doesn't mean that it is, as a fact, as you described.

And considering I never said you weren't allowed to have your own thoughts or disagree with me on the quality of the story I don't see what the point of your post is. Because sure, my use of the word "fact" in my second post was a poor choice and not one I should've used. But my original post that you replied to stated only my own opinion. It did not, in fact, pretend that what I posted was anything more than my own subjective opinion.

Methinks your first reply just comes off as being salty that someone doesn't enjoy the story and dare to express to in a way you don't like.

[Mercakete]

2 minutes ago, Sunwoo said:

And considering I never said you weren't allowed to have your own thoughts or disagree with me on the quality of the story I don't see what the point of your post is. Because sure, my use of the word "fact" in my second post was a poor choice and not one I should've used. But my original post that you replied to stated only my own opinion. It did not, in fact, pretend that what I posted was anything more than my own subjective opinion.

Methinks your first reply just comes off as being salty that someone doesn't enjoy the story and dare to express to in a way you don't like.

Your assessment is incorrect, but I can see how you came to it. I was just somewhat put off by how strongly you came off. It was the sort of wording you'd give to matters of fact, and can come off to some kinds of people as "this is truth and you're wrong if you believe otherwise." It's clear that you didn't mean it this way, so I'm just advising you to be a bit more gentle with negative opinions. Of course, as this is just advice, you're free to ignore it. For my part, I'm sorry I wasn't clearer. Try as I might to be specific and to the point, my speech can be kind of indirect or winding. I never mean to cause confusion by it; other wording just doesn't come to mind without prompts to bounce off of and sort of "hone in on" more direct speech.

[Sunwoo]

It is not my problem if people prescribe motivations to the things I say without directly asking me if that is what I mean to say, especially over things as trivial as a video game, and especially when we don't even know each other on any level. Negative opinions and harsh criticism exist, and people should not be required to be "gentle" about it as long as it's not outright flaming or unfounded personal attacks.

Put simply, I am too old to put up with or care about people telling me that they don't like how blunt I am.

[Ottservia]

6 minutes ago, Sunwoo said:

It is not my problem if people prescribe motivations to the things I say without directly asking me if that is what I mean to say, especially over things as trivial as a video game, and especially when we don't even know each other on any level. Negative opinions and harsh criticism exist, and people should not be required to be "gentle" about it as long as it's not outright flaming or unfounded personal attacks.

Put simply, I am too old to put up with or care about people telling me that they don't like how blunt I am.

Nothing wrong with being blunt but if you want to make it clear that you’re simply stating an opinion then try not to use such objectivist language. Nothing wrong with having an opinion but claiming something is bad is different from saying you don’t like something. Also if you’re going to make criticism have those criticism actually make sense otherwise it just makes you look dumb

[Sentinel07]

For me, I've just accepted that there are certain flaws they're not going to correct, so I might as well just roll with it.

As long as the plot at least intrigues me, I'll be fine 

[SirErrant]

On 8/19/2020 at 7:09 PM, Sentinel07 said:

For me, I've just accepted that there are certain flaws they're not going to correct, so I might as well just roll with it.

As long as the plot at least intrigues me, I'll be fine 

Pretty much me. Yeah, I like FEH's story, but for me it's more like a penny dreadful than the 500+ page sagas that I prefer to read. And that's not just because FEH's a mobile game. Like @Mercakete said before, IS might not have the resources or time to make the most gripping story ever, but there are still things they could do to make the story better. There are just obvious flaws that IS isn't going to fix (namely the pacing and the fact that characters beyond OC's never interact with each other in the main story), and we pretty much just have to go with it. I don't remember exactly who, but I think someone compared FEH to Dragalia Lost, where people who aren't main characters actually... talk with one another and have real character arcs, which we really don't see in FEH. Sure, we got a character arc for Alfonse, Fjorm (sort of), and Eir, and I think IS is setting something up for Sharena, but what about non-OC's learning something new from their stay in Askr? Forging Bonds are great, but I feel like they take place in a whole other dimension and have literally no impact on anything outside of that mode, which makes sense. I think I've said this earlier, but IS really should take more advantage of paralogues as an opportunity to flesh out some more characters and give us some more free orbs.

That being said, I genuinely like Book 3's first half and Book 4 so far, and I feel like IS's writing has been steadily improving, so we'll see. I especially liked this chapter. Safe to say that Freyr's my favorite character in Book 4 now, and I especially liked how they showed us his maturity and level of caring for Freyja. I think Freyr is essentially a more refined version of what they were trying to do with Gunnthra, and his death really hit harder for me, especially because of Freyja's reaction.

Who knows, maybe they'll break the mold and give non-OC's the same treatment. (I have high hopes for Xander.) Even if they don't interact with each other, maybe regular Fire Emblem characters can at least start showing up in the story like Xander used to do and get their own brief character arcs and story importance. 

[Sentinel07]

On 8/26/2020 at 6:55 PM, SirErrant said:

Pretty much me. Yeah, I like FEH's story, but for me it's more like a penny dreadful than the 500+ page sagas that I prefer to read. And that's not just because FEH's a mobile game. Like @Mercakete said before, IS might not have the resources or time to make the most gripping story ever, but there are still things they could do to make the story better. There are just obvious flaws that IS isn't going to fix (namely the pacing and the fact that characters beyond OC's never interact with each other in the main story), and we pretty much just have to go with it. I don't remember exactly who, but I think someone compared FEH to Dragalia Lost, where people who aren't main characters actually... talk with one another and have real character arcs, which we really don't see in FEH. Sure, we got a character arc for Alfonse, Fjorm (sort of), and Eir, and I think IS is setting something up for Sharena, but what about non-OC's learning something new from their stay in Askr? Forging Bonds are great, but I feel like they take place in a whole other dimension and have literally no impact on anything outside of that mode, which makes sense. I think I've said this earlier, but IS really should take more advantage of paralogues as an opportunity to flesh out some more characters and give us some more free orbs.

That being said, I genuinely like Book 3's first half and Book 4 so far, and I feel like IS's writing has been steadily improving, so we'll see. I especially liked this chapter. Safe to say that Freyr's my favorite character in Book 4 now, and I especially liked how they showed us his maturity and level of caring for Freyja. I think Freyr is essentially a more refined version of what they were trying to do with Gunnthra, and his death really hit harder for me, especially because of Freyja's reaction.

Who knows, maybe they'll break the mold and give non-OC's the same treatment. (I have high hopes for Xander.) Even if they don't interact with each other, maybe regular Fire Emblem characters can at least start showing up in the story like Xander used to do and get their own brief character arcs and story importance. 

I think part of the problem is that Heroes tries to be both an original game and a crossover game at the same time, and ends up feeling underdeveloped in both areas.

Dragalia Lost has an advantage in the sense that it's a new series and doesn't have to account for anything else. It's free to develop its world and characters in a deeper and more organic way. In Heroes' case, it also tries to set up its own world, but also tries to involve the literal hundreds of FE characters and worlds from the mainline games.

Honestly, I feel like one way they could have avoided this is by not tying the new chapters and banners together. Dragalia Lost doesn't concern itself with making sure every new character has an appearance. Heroes on the other hand wastes a significant part of each chapter just showing off new banner units.

[SirErrant]

2 hours ago, Sentinel07 said:

Honestly, I feel like one way they could have avoided this is by not tying the new chapters and banners together. Dragalia Lost doesn't concern itself with making sure every new character has an appearance. Heroes on the other hand wastes a significant part of each chapter just showing off new banner units.

Exactly. They could free up the plot so much and create much more interesting themed maps if they did this. Just let them shine in Forging Bonds and stuff, they don't need to have literally just a one-sentence mention in the main story when it could be pretty much anyone else.

I really wish IS did themed battles, by the way, since there's so much potential there. It'd be so much cooler if the Freyr map had characters like Emmeryn and Sigurd on map (since, you know, untimely deaths) just to make everything so much sadder. 

[DefyingFates]

9 hours ago, SirErrant said:

They could free up the plot so much and create much more interesting themed maps if they did this.

To be fair, they haven't made story maps based on the banners since Book 1. Nowadays they only show up for GHBs and TTs, IIRC.

[SirErrant]

Yeah, I guess that ship sailed a while ago. At least you can see they've been trying with the Freyja map last month and the Freyr map this month, so maybe there's still hope for the future?