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The Game Awards 2019 Hype/Discussion Thread

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3 hours ago, NinjaMonkey said:

2B is even more lewdly designed than Mai Shiranui is, so there's no way she's getting into Smash, unless they redesign her outfit to appease CERO.

Anyway, this is going to be the night when Geoff finally proposes to Kojima.

Or just put Nines in Smash. He's a very good, non lewdy boi and the true main character anyway. 

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I am looking to forward to seeing who FP5 is. Here's hoping for Bayo 3, BOTW2 and MP4. 

3 hours ago, Shrimperor said:

Honestly, i can't see anyone except Dante for Smash. Surprise me, Sakurai.

I see you're a person of culture as well.

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3 hours ago, Shrimperor said:

Honestly, i can't see anyone except Dante for Smash. Surprise me, Sakurai.

I want this more than any other character. 

 

I just think he's going to be Fighter Pass 2. Alongside Crash Bandicoot (taking the Banjo "nostalgia" slot), Lloyd Irving (taking the Hero "obligatory JRPG" slot), and two others.

Edited by Etheus

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49 minutes ago, lightcosmo said:

Could Smash really do Dante's moveset justice, though? He's got so much potential, which they've proved they dont mind wasting.

Some level of potential is always going to be wasted. I mean, Banjo and Kazooie don't have their fire, ice, or remote eggs.

 

With Dante, you really only need his most iconic weapons. I'd pick Rebellion, Ebony & Ivory (B), Cerberus (Side B), Gilgamesh (Down B), and Cavaliere (Up B), just to have a good rounding between games.

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1 hour ago, Etheus said:

Some level of potential is always going to be wasted. I mean, Banjo and Kazooie don't have their fire, ice, or remote eggs.

 

With Dante, you really only need his most iconic weapons. I'd pick Rebellion, Ebony & Ivory (B), Cerberus (Side B), Gilgamesh (Down B), and Cavaliere (Up B), just to have a good rounding between games.

While this is true, they take they extra mile to waste potential with their characters. Still, if Dante is in at all, i'll be happy.

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10 minutes ago, lightcosmo said:

While this is true, they take they extra mile to waste potential with their characters. Still, if Dante is in at all, i'll be happy.

Geez, which character didn’t get implemented the way you wanted?

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23 minutes ago, Florete said:

Geez, which character didn’t get implemented the way you wanted?

The thing you should be asking is, "which ones did?" And that's hardly any of them. They dont any "heart" in their movesets, if you ask me.

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Mostly watching to see if anything interesting actually pops up besides a possible Smash reveal.

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For Nintendo, I'm expecting two out of the big three:

- BOTW2 Trailer
- MP4 Trailer
- Smash FP5 Trailer

40 minutes ago, lightcosmo said:

The thing you should be asking is, "which ones did?" And that's hardly any of them. They dont any "heart" in their movesets, if you ask me.

If there's anything Smash characters don't lack is heart. It's quite telling by simply trying out the characters and listening to Sakurai's opinions on them that there's a lot of passion put into them. Specially with 3rd party characters.

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43 minutes ago, lightcosmo said:

The thing you should be asking is, "which ones did?" And that's hardly any of them. They dont any "heart" in their movesets, if you ask me.

And if you ask me, you are overly pedantic. But that's that, I suppose.

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Oftentimes, a character's on paper potential lends itself to a potentially less fun moveset than you'd think.

 

Joker could be a great many times more complex than Pokemon trainer, but I'm personally glad that we got the moveset we did; he's a lot of fun and completely practical. 

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8 minutes ago, Etheus said:

Oftentimes, a character's on paper potential lends itself to a potentially less fun moveset than you'd think.

 

Joker could be a great many times more complex than Pokemon trainer, but I'm personally glad that we got the moveset we did; he's a lot of fun and completely practical. 

And it might be just me, but is it possible some fans want to cram too much into one moveset? Too many references, too much of a character's great arsenal?

Maybe the answer to that is "no", Mega Man has weapons representing many of his games, and Samus could easily and should get a boatload of stuff added into hers.

But, if you keep throwing in references, is it possible that if you don't think it through, the moveset becomes an incomprehensible mess? That by focusing on referencing, you don't create any cohesion that would form a fighter with a defined profile and balanced for a loosely defined metagame?

Sure Smash is part-fanservice party fiesta, but I'm not of the mind that that should mean you abandon all notions of attempting balance and creating well-formed fighters. 

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1 hour ago, Jave said:

If there's anything Smash characters don't lack is heart. It's quite telling by simply trying out the characters and listening to Sakurai's opinions on them that there's a lot of passion put into them. Specially with 3rd party characters.

I dont agree with this, considering the staggering number of clones and characters that share animations. How much heart is there in adding four Marths? 

 

1 hour ago, Florete said:

And if you ask me, you are overly pedantic. But that's that, I suppose.

How so? It's not a secret that most of the cast is generally pretty uninteresting, as far as potential goes. They could have done something. No excuse why not.

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2 minutes ago, lightcosmo said:

How so? It's not a secret that most of the cast is generally pretty uninteresting, as far as potential goes. They could have done something. No excuse why not.

It's been a secret to me. I don't hear these kinds of complaints from other people.

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35 minutes ago, lightcosmo said:

How so? It's not a secret that most of the cast is generally pretty uninteresting, as far as potential goes. They could have done something. No excuse why not.

Considering you're one of the only people with these complaints in Ultimate, maybe you should reevaluate before you make a bigger idiot out of yourself. Honestly you sound like you don't even enjoy Smash, so keep away from it and stop talking about it so we don't have to put up with you. You've been insanely grating with this from day 1. 

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31 minutes ago, lightcosmo said:

I dont agree with this, considering the staggering number of clones and characters that share animations. How much heart is there in adding four Marths? 

 

How so? It's not a secret that most of the cast is generally pretty uninteresting, as far as potential goes. They could have done something. No excuse why not.

In the particular case of Smash, a lot. Roy was added back in Melee where Sakurai had less than a year to develop the whole thing. In the final months, he could have added one original moveset or six clones. He went with the latter because he felt adding more diversity to the roster was more important. Lucina was added in Smash 4 because she was a favorite and she could easily be added by altering the Marth model. Also, the clones in Ultimate are explicitly labeled as such (Echo Fighters), to heavily note they're bonus characters. They all exist because they were highly requested characters (he specifically pointed this out with Dark Samus and Chrom) but there was not enough time or room to make those characters unique. I don't think anyone out there was legitimately expecting Richter to happen, but I'm sure all of his fans were more than thrilled to see him, even if he barely differs from Simon. Or do you seriously believe that Richter fans would prefer not having him at all?

For your second point I'll have to agree with Florete and Jedi in that I've never seen any discussion of the sort, and I frequent Smashboards, ResetEra and even GameFAQs.

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This whole event is honestly just a mess to me, just looking forward to the very likely new smash rep. (I would love 2B, unsure of how likely it would be.)

And at least hoping we get like... anything of Bayonetta 3 shown.

Otherwise I don't see me paying too much attention to it. Probably will just listen to it in a call on discord or something while I play a game.

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40 minutes ago, Jave said:

In the final months, he could have added one original moveset or six clones. He went with the latter because he felt adding more diversity to the roster was more important.

Side note, but this is actually a common misconception. He couldn't have added another unique newcomer even if he hadn't made the clones in Melee. From here:

Likewise, in response to various fan e-mails about Melee, Sakurai noted that, even if the six clone characters hadn’t been added to the roster, there wouldn’t have been enough time for an entire new character.

“If I could add one or two more characters, then [Wario] could have gotten in. Of all the characters I discarded, [he’s] ranked near the top.

However, even if I didn’t work on several clone characters he wouldn’t have gotten in.

Even if I deleted characters from before (Jigglypuff, Luigi) he wouldn’t have gotten in.

You might think it’s impossible that even if we delete one character in development that it couldn’t be replaced with another character….

I would have needed to get rid of both Marth and Roy or Mewtwo in order for Wario to get in[1]

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4 minutes ago, Florete said:

Side note, but this is actually a common misconception. He couldn't have added another unique newcomer even if he hadn't made the clones in Melee. From here:

Likewise, in response to various fan e-mails about Melee, Sakurai noted that, even if the six clone characters hadn’t been added to the roster, there wouldn’t have been enough time for an entire new character.

“If I could add one or two more characters, then [Wario] could have gotten in. Of all the characters I discarded, [he’s] ranked near the top.

However, even if I didn’t work on several clone characters he wouldn’t have gotten in.

Even if I deleted characters from before (Jigglypuff, Luigi) he wouldn’t have gotten in.

You might think it’s impossible that even if we delete one character in development that it couldn’t be replaced with another character….

I would have needed to get rid of both Marth and Roy or Mewtwo in order for Wario to get in[1]

Ah wow, thanks for that. Guess the whole "Six clones or one character" got so spread back then most people took it for granted.

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7 hours ago, Florete said:

Side note, but this is actually a common misconception. He couldn't have added another unique newcomer even if he hadn't made the clones in Melee. From here:

Likewise, in response to various fan e-mails about Melee, Sakurai noted that, even if the six clone characters hadn’t been added to the roster, there wouldn’t have been enough time for an entire new character.

“If I could add one or two more characters, then [Wario] could have gotten in. Of all the characters I discarded, [he’s] ranked near the top.

However, even if I didn’t work on several clone characters he wouldn’t have gotten in.

Even if I deleted characters from before (Jigglypuff, Luigi) he wouldn’t have gotten in.

You might think it’s impossible that even if we delete one character in development that it couldn’t be replaced with another character….

I would have needed to get rid of both Marth and Roy or Mewtwo in order for Wario to get in[1]

Interesting. Could this have some relation to why he picked the Smash U new additions so early into its creation IIRC? A sudden shift in gears must be very time-consuming. 

And thank goodness Wario wasn't chosen for Melee, otherwise we wouldn't be here on this lovely board together.

Edited by Interdimensional Observer

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9 hours ago, Jedi said:

Considering you're one of the only people with these complaints in Ultimate, maybe you should reevaluate before you make a bigger idiot out of yourself. Honestly you sound like you don't even enjoy Smash, so keep away from it and stop talking about it so we don't have to put up with you. You've been insanely grating with this from day 1. 

Spoken like someone who doesn't like to admit their favorite game has flaws. It's alright, I understand, but what i'm saying isn't wrong, and no I'm pretty sure i'm not the only one that feels that way. Tell me where the heart in Lucina's moveset is, then. How does it feel special? There are plenty of things they could do, launch angles, bigger KBG/BKB differences like Marth/Roy in melee, move speed, where they actually felt different, mind you. In fact Lucina has so much heart into her character she has a giant gap in her sprite while doing aerial attacks, talk about having heart right there. Maybe they should check into that. As for what I mean, example, Luigi, he feels great to play as, with all the differences, and I can respect that about him, the same can't be said about most of the cast. They should be striving to make their characters feel special, much like Luigi here. If they can at least attempt to do that, rather than play favorites. That's my take on the whole thing, anyways.

 

8 hours ago, Jave said:

In the particular case of Smash, a lot. Roy was added back in Melee where Sakurai had less than a year to develop the whole thing. In the final months, he could have added one original moveset or six clones. He went with the latter because he felt adding more diversity to the roster was more important. Lucina was added in Smash 4 because she was a favorite and she could easily be added by altering the Marth model. Also, the clones in Ultimate are explicitly labeled as such (Echo Fighters), to heavily note they're bonus characters. They all exist because they were highly requested characters (he specifically pointed this out with Dark Samus and Chrom) but there was not enough time or room to make those characters unique. I don't think anyone out there was legitimately expecting Richter to happen, but I'm sure all of his fans were more than thrilled to see him, even if he barely differs from Simon. Or do you seriously believe that Richter fans would prefer not having him at all?

For your second point I'll have to agree with Florete and Jedi in that I've never seen any discussion of the sort, and I frequent Smashboards, ResetEra and even GameFAQs.

The whole "clone" thing just sounds like an excuse to say we don't want to put any effort into this character. And even characters like Bayonetta, who clearly shares a lot of ZSS's animations, and shes DLC! Now isn't that sad? And the worst part? Is that they copy/pasted most of their attacks stats from Smash 4. Come on, Smash is a game with endless possibilities and the best you can do is copy what Smash 4 had? The more broken characters probably should have had some changes there, and they still could, but will choose not to. And don't get me started on their "story" mode. Brawl's had something called "heart"? Which made it actually fun to play, not some gimmicked matches I could just as easily do on the spirit board, which are the exact same, by the way.

Also I think there's a reason so many people make threads about, "what moves this character should actually have", but that could be just me. Maybe they also realize that some characters just didn't get the TLC some others got, and want to see them flourish as well. And I don't think there is anything wrong with that.

Edited by lightcosmo

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There aren't all that many instances of "this character is not living up to its potential," IMO.

 

The biggest example of one that absolutely needs a full rework is Ganondorf. He deserves better than to be a Captain Falcon clone with a few sword smash attacks. 

 

Aside from that, I'm generally happy with the character movesets. 

 

And the issue with the FE swordies isn't cloned movesets. It's picking these clones over more interesting FE characters that can bring more to the table. Or, you know, not just making them costumes for Marth like they could have and should have been.

Edited by Etheus

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