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[FE5] Lil' Manster – Translation and Quality-of-life Patch for Thracia 776


Miacis

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Excuse me, maybe is there, although I haven't noticed it before, but shouldn't there be, after the title screen, the old‐fashioned warning, something like: "This is a Fantasy, the characters, items, places and events aren't a replication of the ones from Real world!".

Among other things, shouldn't be "Tahra" changed to "The Hill of Tara" and "Dakia" to "Dacia"? Probably that, still, wasn't been revealed by “Nintendo of America”…

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On 4/18/2020 at 9:46 PM, WolfTwin said:

Excuse me, maybe is there, although I haven't noticed it before, but shouldn't there be, after the title screen, the old‐fashioned warning, something like: "This is a Fantasy, the characters, items, places and events aren't a replication of the ones from Real world!".

It's not part of the original game, and I'm not sure how i'd even add that, so no, probably not.

On 4/18/2020 at 9:46 PM, WolfTwin said:

Among other things, shouldn't be "Tahra" changed to "The Hill of Tara" and "Dakia" to "Dacia"? Probably that, still, wasn't been revealed by “Nintendo of America”…

The city is described in the JP script as ターラ (Taa-ra, hence the H), as opposed to タラの丘 (the Hill of Tara). While it hasn't been officially localized yet and we could change it to "Tara" if we really wanted, I'd rather we didn't, to avoid overlapping names with the FE8 character.

Dacia Forest is already Dacia since Project Exile though.

8 hours ago, YourBoyRoy said:

Also, kind of a noob question, but can I retain my save from 1.02 going into 1.03? Years of emulating but this is my first time using bps patches. 😅

Yes! Just make sure it's a hard save and not a save state.
(BPS patches are basically IPS 2.0, and actually check if you're patching the correct file.)

------------------------------------
In other news, Lil' Manster v1.03 is OUT! The download link is in the the first post, or you can grab it directly from here if you're a registered user. Here's a quick list of changes (more info in the Changelog, as per usual).

1) Ultimage joins the team as a Programmer, bringing with him a bunch of cool UI changes.
1a) Item description boxes are now 2 lines bigger, allowing for much more detailed weapon descriptions. Sadly, staff and item descriptions can't make use of that extra space until Shop textboxes are expanded.
1b) If you go back and look at Olwen again, you may notice that the FCM and Range stat are now properly aligned. Hurray for my OCD.
1c) There's a more precise Weapon Experience Display, and it's in the Optional folder. Why optional? Because despite how incredibly useful it is, it's still a bit clunky.

2) More small localization changes than usual!
2a) As per Heroes, Manster has become Munster (yes, even on the map), and Friege's Battalions are now Friege's Divisions.
2b) Authority/Leadership stars and Action/Movement stars are now Authority and Vigor. Seal and Manastone terrains are now actual FE terrain, namely Sigils and Altars. Generic boss Eichmann was localized "Eichner" instead of "Arendt." Poor Hannah is now freed from this curse. See the end of the script edits PDF for the reasons of all these changes.

3) Just a whole lot of small polish. Adding missing info from descriptions (did you know Sleep/Berserk Edges don't work on targets standing on Thrones and Gates?), makingch23's objective more accurate, fixing up bad spacing in pop-up boxes, adding missing music cues, fixing typoes... the usual.

4) We've finally fixed the patch's checksum. So if you use the patch without any of the optional IPS stuff, you'll stop getting checksum warnings from your emulator or patcher. And it has our name on it, now!

5) For people playing around with cheats or Nightmare modules, the Naga spell animation has now been restored, even though it's not attached to any spellbook. But hey, you can change that in Nightmare now, and it won't be a broken mess.

6) I made a small patch that doubles all WEXP rates. It's neat, so I put it in the Optional folder, if you like that.

Phew. That one's been a long time coming. Good that we finally got it out. I hope y'all have a great time playing Thracia. :newyears:

EDIT: There was a small, but noticeable mistake in the original release's dialogue, which is now fixed. If you downloaded as soon as I posted this, consider re-downloading.

 

Lil-Manster-1.03.zip

Edited by Miacis
Attached file was weird
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1 hour ago, NovaMCdude said:

Bug on Chapter 1's Ending Convo, Not sure if the Top-Wait patch caused this

Fire Emblem - Thracia 776006.png

Amusingly, this was solved right before you posted about it. Thank you for the swift report, though!

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Thank You, many thanks to "Lil' Manster" for all the great work with the hacking for a mirable result.

I'm very grateful, it was disturbing to see (MK404 Let's play) the name of "Arendt" instead of any other for アイヒマン.

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What a great update! I'm looking forward to continuing my playthrough with this version (I'm at the start of Chapter 5 atm). I appreciate all the various changes, especially the UI ones.

17 hours ago, Miacis said:

Yes! Just make sure it's a hard save and not a save state.
(BPS patches are basically IPS 2.0, and actually check if you're patching the correct file.)

I kinda messed up at first after trying it out, since I named the 1.03 patched rom differently than the previous one, so the save file wasn't recognised. Renaming it the same as my new patched rom fixed the issue.

By the way, what do you mean by the WEXP display being clunky? I'm also not sure how it works exactly. Does it go from 0 to 100, going up in rank after reaching 100?

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1 hour ago, YourBoyRoy said:

By the way, what do you mean by the WEXP display being clunky? I'm also not sure how it works exactly. Does it go from 0 to 100, going up in rank after reaching 100?

Well the WEXP display shows even for weapons that character can't use, and big green numbers isn't as smooth as some of the stuff Zane has implemented (but not perfected yet). It''s still perfectly functional though.

Also, the way the numbers go, it shows you how much WEXP you are above the current rank. So, in the example picture with Brighton, he's at D+20 Swords. Since there's 50 WEXP between each rank, that means he's at 120.

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@Miacis

This is a total nitpick, but it would be a good idea to change all instances of the word 'adress' to address in the pdf script notes. Would look even more professional 😉

Loving the patch btw! It's even been picked up by Mekkah in his iron man run of Thracia 776.

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

What is your reason for using some, but not all, content from Heroes/CYL? I would imagine a translation should generally be consistent, so I'm assuming that most of the discrepancies are because it would take a lot of effort to change it from the PE script.

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On 5/1/2020 at 6:58 AM, YourBoyRoy said:

This is a total nitpick, but it would be a good idea to change all instances of the word 'adress' to address in the pdf script notes. Would look even more professional 😉

Never! My translation notes are and will forever be trash.

I'll fix it in the next update. It's coming... sooner than I expected actually. Why does this keep happening?

On 5/1/2020 at 6:58 AM, YourBoyRoy said:

Loving the patch btw! It's even been picked up by Mekkah in his iron man run of Thracia 776.

Thank you! And I heard, yeah. It was a really nice shout-out. Now if only more famous LPers used Lil' Manster? Now that'd be the dream, for getting the word out.

On 5/9/2020 at 9:21 AM, JamesBCrazy said:

What is your reason for using some, but not all, content from Heroes/CYL? I would imagine a translation should generally be consistent, so I'm assuming that most of the discrepancies are because it would take a lot of effort to change it from the PE script.

It is a creative choice, actually. Find-replaces aren't too difficult, with Zane's tools.

First, I do want to specify that Heroes content is not the same as CYL content. Heroes has contradicted CYL names a few times and, always, it was CYL that got updated to Heroes localizations.
We do use all Heroes names, as they are official names, and are material that the fanbase will have access to and get acquainted with. If you find Heroes names that we are not consistent with, do tell, it's likely to be a mistake.

CYL names are a different story. They are official material, but not present in official games, and that's an important distinction to make. Old TGC names were official materials, but were generally poor romanizations. CYL names sometimes suffer from that, and the quality level is a bit all over the place. FE4 names, for instance, show an effort to research mythologic references and write proper Celtic names. This is why you have Annand and Chulainn, not Mahnya and Holyn.
Now, I invite you to compare to the FE5-CYL names and uh... Machyua, Perne, Cain and Deen (again?), etc I think you'll agree are way more basic. It's barely more than just transcribing the kana directly. It just looks too unreliable to be used as a source, the same way that SSBB would have been dismissed for FE6's "Deke" and "Rutoga".

Adding the nail in the coffin of CYL names is that I'm pretty sure there's a lot more people with an Osian and his Vouge in FE Heroes than there are people who remember what Dermott's CYL name is, so it's not like we're clashing with a lot of player's existing knowledge there.
(Oh, speaking of Dermott, we went with this instead of FE4-CYL Diarmuid to be consistent with Project Naga, as it's likely people will know him from there. If he ever gets in Heroes, or gets mentionned in it, we'll switch to that.)

Does that answer your question? 🙂

Edited by Miacis
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IMO some of the names in this do look jarring, but in a lot of cases you're stuck between a rock and a hard place due to consistency with Project Naga. I'm of Irish-Scottish ancestry, so a lot of the CYL names look like actual names to me, when to others they might look like a random combination of characters.

As to whether CYL names are trustworthy, there have been more names changed from Awakening>Heroes than from CYL>Heroes. I'd hoped that Heroes would stop our having to remember 3 different names for each character. (Pan/Pahn/Pirn/Perne, Brigid/Briggid/Bridget, Delmud/Dermott/Diarmuid, Edain/Aideen/Adean/Edin, and so on; and yes, I have seen every one of these names in a fan translation or fanfic) but it seems fans are going to stick with the names we've already been using for years, regardless of any attempts to get one concrete set of names.

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On 5/11/2020 at 9:59 AM, Miacis said:

I'll fix it in the next update. It's coming... sooner than I expected actually. Why does this keep happening?

Hmmm, any hints on what's to come in the upcoming update?

EDIT: Oho, I'm seeing some interesting QOL additions and script adjustments... 

Edited by YourBoyRoy
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On 5/13/2020 at 3:00 AM, YourBoyRoy said:

Hmmm, any hints on what's to come in the upcoming update?

No need, 'cause we're releasing today!

Gigtu1b.png

Lil' Manster v1.04 is OUT! The download link is still sitting in the first post, or you can grab it directly from this here post, if you're a registered user. This one has quite a lot of exciting things! Here's our quick list of changes for this version (more info in the Changelog, as per usual).

1) Flasuban joins the team as a Graphic Designer, bringing with him some cool fonts.
* We have a new menu font! It's not a variable-width font yet, so it's still small, but it's less tall and narrow as its predecessor, which should help make it more legible.
* Can you imagine a world where it's possible to tell capital M, N and W apart? 'cause we live in it now. Lack of tile space made it so only the Wi pair got widened for W, but hey, it's a start. (This update is technically from me, but Flasuban helped make it possible, and this is the big paragraph for font talk.)
* There's a new dialogue font. It's inspired by its predecessor, the FE8 menu font, but with less aliasing, more legibility, and more uniqueness. It also looks less out of place when placed next to the menu font.

2) After a bit of a break, script revisions return. The_Elfangor, the new French translator helped me fine some more inconsistencies to root out. We also took our editing scissors to a couple of sections of dialogue that had been expanded beyond all reason. Finally, we made an exception to our "don't touch on style issues" self-imposed rule for localization choices that required extensive textual additions to even work.
You can find the new edits in the Script Revisions file, highlighted in yellow.

3) A ton of quality of life additions. All of these are from Zane Avernathy's public release, and almost all of them are included in the base Lil' Manster patch.
* Equipped items (or staves if no weapons) now display in the info-bubble.
* Units that a character can talk to now have a visual indicator over their head.
* Enemies with an AI set to not move will display as having 0 Mov, when selected on the map.
* Holding the L button at the start of a fight swaps animation modes between Normal and Map.
* Damaged units show HP bars on the map. Since this can cause some sprites to disappear in fairly specific circumstances, it's not part of the base Lil' Manster patch, but can be found in the Optional folder. Circumstances made me develop a colorblind-friendly version, so that version is included too, if you need it.
* "Hold A to speedup movement" was not included, because Lil' Manster already has that option.

4) We now have a delightful official logo/banner, courtesy of Tchu. Check him out!

----------------
You know, I keep expecting these releases to be "the last release for awhile" and then a bunch of cool things happen and all of a sudden, we have a new patch ready to go again. This community is crazy, in a good and perfect way.

Lil-Manster-1.04.zip

Edited by Miacis
idk why the imgur embed was weird, should be fixed now
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As one of the playtesters for the (now complete and released) Spanish patch, it has been a pleasure to be able to contribute to this amazing project. For almost a whole year, this team has done the impossible and has turned Thracia from the most inaccessible game in the franchise into easily one of the most accessible. All of these UI updates, QoL tweaks, and translating this game into other languages (Thracia got a Spanish translation before Genealogy, New Mystery and Binding Blade) will sure encourage lots of people to give this game the chance that it deserves. It's been awesome to see all of this unfold. Thank you so much for this! I can't wait to see what else you're all planning to do for my favorite Fire Emblem game!

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"Murder Hollace"‥
What will happen if we give some credit to Syozo Kaga?
I think that there were combined words from "murder holes", a mantrap, with "hearse" or with "ヘルセー( Ἕρση, Herse), herusē", herse  – a synonym for "portcullis", Kempf's favorite tactic.

殺人孔、さつじんあな, satsujin ana, murder hole

We have マーダーホレス, mādā horesu, a Japanese Fantasy name…

———

I was "blinded" by Kempf's tactic, "ポートカリス, Portcullis", mentioned in Ch. 11. Apparently, I had given too much credit to "Kaga, S." and to myself because now I found "ホレス, horesu" in…
⋯this will require a stretchy, unsatisfactory explanation, hopefully not too ridiculous:
ホレス・ロバートソン, horesu robātoson, Horace Robertson [nicknamed "Red Robbie"]

In the final days of the 2nd World War the remnants of Japanese 18th Army were encircled (through MacArthur's strategy), additionally dying from starvation and illness, they were forced to surrender to Lieutenant General Sir Horace Clement Hugh Robertson of the Australian 6th Division. I'm aware that those events took place in jungle, on hills or mountains, but the previous chapter had (in dialogues) the "Portcullis", which, so much I know, isn't a feature of "Fire Emblem". Probably this chapter could had shown an alternate Japanese history for Lt Gen Hatazō Adachi.

In the end it's only a theory, it could also be a coincidence, but it doesn't matter, the chapter got already a name.
Sorry to bother!

Edited by WolfTwin
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1 hour ago, WolfTwin said:

"Murder Hollace"
What will happen if we give some credit to Syozo Kaga?
[...]

An interesting theory, though I do have two major objections:

- Do you have any corroborating evidence about ホレス being a romanization of hearse or hearse? Because I can't find any. Seems pretty far from it, really.

- Just like there's no murder holes in this level, there aren't any hearses or herses either.
 

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On 5/16/2020 at 3:49 AM, Miacis said:

An interesting theory, though I do have two major objections:

- Do you have any corroborating evidence about ホレス being a romanization of hearse or hearse? Because I can't find any. Seems pretty far from it, really.

- Just like there's no murder holes in this level, there aren't any hearses or herses either.
 

⋯sorry, you are right, it is a THEORY… Probably, not even Kaga could remember, after 20 years, the origin of the names he had invented.

Thanks to the translations from "FireLizard", "Shaya", "Cirosan" and "Lil’ Manster" (with some "brain fever"…) I've acquired the impression that the whole level is like a alive confinement in a funeral pyre.
I've thought that it could be similar to ヘズル, Hezul – mixed ヘズ, hezu and ホズル, hozuru (Japanese renderings of Hǫðr) then anglicized, in theory it could be done also with English terms. I don't think that Kaga was unaware of English, but for a fantasy and for originality many things were renamed. It's named creator's liberty?

Right, there are no "damage zones" in Fire Emblem like the ones which are in Majin/Megami Tensei and no height differences.

———

Please, excuse a smart aleck who had come with some antique idea about a chapter title's name which had just got localized. Evidently the post should have been about quality, bugs and something useful or praiseful for Lil' Manster

 

Not that it matters…
A Japanese rendition for Njörun, the official localization for ノヴァ, can be found through Tacitus' ネルトゥス(Nerthus)…

& 谷口幸男訳、『広島大学』(1983年12月), taniguchi yukio-yaku,“hiroshima daigaku”
Alvíssmál
ドラウムニョル, doraumunyoru (the dwarfish name here is for Nótt/night)
夢の織手, The Weaver of Dreams (Henry Adam Bellows' translation for draumnjörun)

elsewhere: ドラウムニョルン, doraumunyorun (draumnjörun)

in the advertisement: クレッタルムーセン ニョルン 2.0 フーディ, kurettarumūsen nyorun 2.0 fūdi; Klättermusen Njorun Hoodie

Edited by WolfTwin
grammatical, additions & corrections
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Maybe they meant 'murder holes' in an entirely literal sense rather than the specific definition of holes in a fortification that defenders fire through. I haven't reached that chapter yet though.

Anyway, great work on the update! Kudos to Zane especially for the nice QOL stuff, seems to work pretty well when I tried it out. I'm very happy about the script changes too, particularly Saias' new dialogue and Raydrick fiend status. 😀 

Edited by YourBoyRoy
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Gigtu1b.png

Lil' Manster v1.05 is OUT! The download link is sitting in the first post, or you can grab it directly from this here post, if you're a registered user. This is a fairly small release, but it does include a fix for a rare, but very troublesome gameplay bug, which is why this was pushed faster out the door.

1) The menu font has been tweaked further, once again targeting those pesky capital M, N and W, but also adding lowercase m and w. They look pretty nifty now.
Since the ms are a bit on the chonky side, some of them have been slimmed down a tad, for some specific letter pairs.
Unfortunately, without a variable-width font, that's as good as it's gonna be. Still better than the squished m/w we had before, I suppose.

2) There was a very rare but very troublesome glitch in the Guard AI Display addition that caused units with exactly 769 accumulated EXP to lose all movement until their EXP counter changed. The 769 glitch is now fixed. Thanks, Zane! (also nice).

3) We renamed a couple of Options settings to better fit series conventions. Fascinating stuff, really.

Lil' Manster 1.05.zip

----------------
That's about it for today. Next release should probably have some more script revisions. I got some help on the French patch from a Japanese to French fan translator. His notes should help clarify some of the doubts we still have about the English script.

Also I'll see if I can restore some more unused content. The Master Knight animations have no right to be this broken.

The screenshot gallery won't be updated for this release, as there's a few things I'd like to adjust with the dialogue font for 1.06. So if I have to retake all the pics again, might as well do it all in one go.
 

Edited by Miacis
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Don't know if you've changed it already but the script notes say you removed Raydrick invented title "Twofold Traitor" from your version but it still shows up at least once when Hannibal first shows up. You can see it in action in part 11 of Mangs' LP.

Also, is there a version without the QoL changes? I find many of them to be intrusive, such as the exclamation icon when talk options are available. Even changing back where the 'end turn' option shows up would be nice. Seems like these changes are implemented through Zane's patch. Would it be possible to remove this patch on my end? Personally, I prefer not to have these additions.

Edit: Seems like those additions and changes are in an optional folder. So no problem for me so far.

Edit2: Got the top wait thing working but I'd still prefer a way to remove the exclamation marks and such.

Edited by RJWalker
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17 hours ago, RJWalker said:

Don't know if you've changed it already but the script notes say you removed Raydrick invented title "Twofold Traitor" from your version but it still shows up at least once when Hannibal first shows up. You can see it in action in part 11 of Mangs' LP.

I saw. I'm guessing I accidentally sent a slightly old ROM when he recorded this. It's 100% fixed now though.
 

Quote

Also, is there a version without the QoL changes? I find many of them to be intrusive, such as the exclamation icon when talk options are available. Even changing back where the 'end turn' option shows up would be nice. Seems like these changes are implemented through Zane's patch. Would it be possible to remove this patch on my end? Personally, I prefer not to have these additions.

Edit: Seems like those additions and changes are in an optional folder. So no problem for me so far.

Edit2: Got the top wait thing working but I'd still prefer a way to remove the exclamation marks and such.

There's no version with zero QOL changes, since 99% of people don't have any problem with quality-of-life additions that don't really impact the gameplay.

It'd be more annoying and time consuming to explain how to revert the patch in hex on your end, so... if you'll give me a list of things you don't want in (check the changelog for all the Lil' Manster QOL changes), I'll remove as many of the easily removable ones that I can and send it to you.

Edited by Miacis
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8 hours ago, Miacis said:

I saw. I'm guessing I accidentally sent a slightly old ROM when he recorded this. It's 100% fixed now though.
 

There's no version with zero QOL changes, since 99% of people don't have any problem with quality-of-life additions that don't really impact the gameplay.

It'd be more annoying and time consuming to explain how to revert the patch in hex on your end, so... if you'll give me a list of things you don't want in (check the changelog for all the Lil' Manster QOL changes), I'll remove as many of the easily removable ones that I can and send it to you.

1) Removing the Guard AI display feature

2) Removing the exclamation icons when talk options are available

3) Moving the wait command to where it was (this already has a separate patch to remove it in the original download but I don't know how you taking out some of the other features I requested would affect compatability.

4) L button to swap animation modes.

5) Crit display in battle.

6) Reordering or rearranging units during battle preps (there's a separate patch to implement this but again, I don't know how compatability would work out)

7) Weapon EXP display

Not a whole lot of changes. I'm fine with more descriptions on items and stuff like that but I'd like things that affect gameplay to remain identical to the original.

Thanks in advance for agreeing to make a specific patch just for me. Though I imagine future updates to the main patch would require you to do this again, making this whole attempt futile in the long run.

Edit: If it's easier to do, I'd be fine with removing all the QoL changes that aren't considered essential. Like, I'd be fine with a menu and script translation if it was easier to do than removing several specific changes.

Edited by RJWalker
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