What is your preferred class system?

[Fabulously Olivier]

An explanation of each choice:

 

Rigid classes

Every unit has a set class progression that cannot be changed. Ie: FE1-FE7, FE9-10

 

Branching Classes

Reclassing isn't a thing, but a unit may have 2 or more choices on promotion. Ie: Sacred Stones

 

Limited Reclassing

Reclassing exists, but each unit has a limited reclassing pool. IE: Awakening and Fates

 

Open Reclassing

What are limitations? Ie: Shadow Dragon

 

Qualified Reclassing

Class changes are open require certain weapon ranks. Ie: Three Houses.

 

 

The second question is a bonus question and really comes down to your preference on game length.

 

I decided to add the third question to split this from Three Houses' qualified reclassing system. There is no reason why other reclassing systems should necessarily have to reset level. 

Edited January 26, 2020 by Etheus

[Alastor15243]

I hate three tier with a passion. It's never added anything to the game but spectacle at the cost of substance. The third tiers are just as cool looking as the second tiers of other games, so really you're just wasting design budget making duplicate classes with no gameplay twists to them. Compare the variety of classes in Echoes and Three Houses with the variety in Awakening and Fates. Fewer tiers in the latter, but waaaaay more classes at the highest tier.

Edited January 26, 2020 by Alastor15243

[NinjaMonkey]

Rigid Classes, Three tiers, Reset upon reclassing.

[Fabulously Olivier]

Mine are:

 

Branching

I feel like it hits a good balance between unit identity and freedom.

 

Three tier

I'd like to see branching paths with three tiers. That's a lot of work, but would result in a ton of replayability.

 

No resets

I don't like infinite grind or the idea of grinding to combine skills from a bunch of different classes. But that's another topic; I think class skills should be class locked and obtained immediately on promotion to that class.

 

Note, the third question is irrelevant to Rigid or Branching class systems. It's stricting for reclassing systems.

Edited January 26, 2020 by Etheus

[Shanty Pete's 1st Mate]

I think my ideal system would be:

Three-tier, but in a 0-1-2 system, like Sacred Stones. Just make it so there are more "trainee" units and classes. Basically corresponding to the Beginner, Intermediate, and Advanced Tiers from Three Houses.

Branched promotions, like Sacred Stones and Awakening, but with three options in some cases. I.e. Soldier (0) going Pegasus/Cavalier/Armor (1). Or Cavalier (1) going Paladin/Great Knight/Mage Knight (2).

Limited, but customizable, reclassing options. I think Fates did this best, with one innate reclass, then another that can be opened through supports (available through B rank support, but only once per game).

No need to reset levels, like Genealogy/Three Houses. Just have Tier 1 open at level 10, and Tier 2 at level 25, with a maximum level of 50.

[Flere210]

FFT system imo is the funniest, but is a "break this game please", so it would not work on Fire Emblem, as we saw with 3H or Awakening.

I thing limited reclassing like fates did whit two tier and branching promotions work best.  But i wouls limit it even more and put a bunch of conditions to unlock extra class. I heard TRS do something like that. 

Three tiers imo only add bloat and is only needed if the game last 40 chapters or something like that. And if we stack branching on we are doubling the bloat. 

I want any class to exist whit a definite purpose and imo using a certain weapon is not enought to establish a niche. Having both mercenery and soldiers imo is already pointless, because they are both infranty units whit balanced stats, and in fact they never coexisted outside of lolrevelation. So a good system to me is one where the classes are chosen elegantly. 

[Alastor15243]

13 minutes ago, Flere210 said:

Three tiers imo only add bloat and is only needed if the game last 40 chapters or something like that. And if we stack branching on we are doubling the bloat.

Yeah, when I hear "three tiered branching classes", all I can think of is that if they have that kind of ludicrous budget to make that many classes, then making it two-tier branching instead would give us exponentially more classes that are actually relevant at the same time. Way more variety.

[Ertrick36]

I think Fates' class system was the best.  It did well to hit a nifty balance between class identity and freedom, as each character had their own class sets garnered towards who they are (e.g. Oboro had apothecary/merchant as a reclass due to her aspiring to be a merchant, Hana could reclass to shrine maiden due to her adoration of Sakura).  But at the same time, it also emphasized supports beyond just mere stat boosts or baby making, as units could essentially "teach" units they love/are very close friends of how to make use of those classes, and I like anything that makes the support system more intriguing than just "here's a bunch of f***ing broken stat boosts, hope you like it!"

And as much as I love Awakening, levels resetting upon reclass was both broken and extremely tedious.  Broken for the obvious reason of enabling a character to get max stats in everything eventually, and tedious because if you want to gain the skills of, say, the Cavalier and War Monk/Cleric classes, you'd have to go through all of those levels.  Fates was better because not only did they keep you from leveling up forever, but because you would retroactively gain skills you missed if you reclass.

No real opinion on number of tiers.  I think it honestly depends on how many levels each tier would have.  If it'd just be a flat 20 for all, then the game better be long as hell.  If it's standard FE length, then either one or more tiers need to be cut down in size.  I do like the idea of there being an uber endgame class for everyone that they aren't playing as for, like, half the game, but I also don't want the game to get bogged down or to have to grind to take on such a class before the game ends.  Still, it doesn't feel quite as special beating the game as a class you were promoted to ever since the mid-game unless it was for a challenge (e.g. something like an "Intermediate Classes Only" run of Three Houses).

[Interdimensional Observer]

I went rigid, two tiers, no resets. Call me old-fashioned if you want for the preference for simplicity, but I am open to the other systems.

 

1 hour ago, Flere210 said:

I thing limited reclassing like fates did whit two tier and branching promotions work best.  But i wouls limit it even more and put a bunch of conditions to unlock extra class. I heard TRS do something like that. 

???

There is no such thing in TRS, not really. There are a couple characters whose fixed promotions differ, but this is no different from Jugdral where Macha promotes to Hero and Mareeta Swordmaster, even though both are Myrmidons. And, Raffin does have his missable promotion from an already promoted class, Bronze Paladin, to Wyvern Rider. But thats it.

[Zapp Branniglenn]

Not sure what I'm answering with the final question. Am I being asked yes/no to level caps, or to the ability to grind levels? Because if your level still resets to 1, I assume there's still a cap. 

Honestly I like most class systems across the series. Branched class promotions, third tier promotions, being able to select a new weapon type for your promotion in FE9, they all captured my imagination despite their poor execution. I remember being attached to limited reclassing when I thought of the idea of units earning more classes by completing certain paralogues or support chains. Like a veteran armor knight who reconnects with his clan of blade masters to unlock the swordmaster class as a totally different build. Three Houses isn't too far from that, as you're being asked to earn your class options via attaining skill ranks which I always complained didn't matter enough in previous games. Then again, I think Three Houses' system was ideal for that game because you're forced to raise a crew of growth units. Having an entire game of time to customize your units justifies free reclassing. But being able to make Jagen a wyvern lord in chapter 4 isn't compelling customization.

[Fabulously Olivier]

Just now, Glennstavos said:

Not sure what I'm answering with the final question. Am I being asked yes/no to level caps, or to the ability to grind levels? Because if your level still resets to 1, I assume there's still a cap. 

Honestly I like most class systems across the series. Branched class promotions, third tier promotions, being able to select a new weapon type for your promotion in FE9, they all captured my imagination despite their poor execution. I remember being attached to limited reclassing when I thought of the idea of units earning more classes by completing certain paralogues or support chains. Like a veteran armor knight who reconnects with his clan of blade masters to unlock the swordmaster class as a totally different build. Three Houses isn't too far from that, as you're being asked to earn your class options via attaining skill ranks which I always complained didn't matter enough in previous games. Then again, I think Three Houses' system was ideal for that game because you're forced to raise a crew of growth units. Having an entire game of time to customize your units justifies free reclassing. But being able to make Jagen a wyvern lord in chapter 4 isn't compelling customization.

In Fates and Awakening, using a second seal/partner seal to reclass will reset your level to 1, allowing you to grind stats to the level cap far in excess of what the level 20/20 cap would normally allow.

[Zapp Branniglenn]

Just now, Etheus said:

In Fates and Awakening, using a second seal/partner seal to reclass will reset your level to 1, allowing you to grind stats to the level cap far in excess of what the level 20/20 cap would normally allow.

That's not what I remember. In Awakening your level resets to 1. But in Fates your level only reset when going from first tier to second tier, like in previous Fire Emblem games. It kept increasing as you made sideways class changes since there was no going back to first tier. And you could increase your level cap for infinite grinding using another seal which gave you another 5 levels. Even if you hit 99.

[Shanty Pete's 1st Mate]

3 minutes ago, Glennstavos said:

That's not what I remember. In Awakening your level resets to 1. But in Fates your level only reset when going from first tier to second tier, like in previous Fire Emblem games. It kept increasing as you made sideways class changes since there was no going back to first tier. And you could increase your level cap for infinite grinding using another seal which gave you another 5 levels. Even if you hit 99.

Yeah, Awakening Second Seals reset level, whereas Fates Second Seals do not. But I'm pretty sure Fates' Eternal Seals still have their own limits. You can't go past level 80 (or 60 promoted). That's what I remember seeing, but I never used them myself.

[Flere210]

51 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

I went rigid, two tiers, no resets. Call me old-fashioned if you want for the preference for simplicity, but I am open to the other systems.

 

???

There is no such thing in TRS, not really. There are a couple characters whose fixed promotions differ, but this is no different from Jugdral where Macha promotes to Hero and Mareeta Swordmaster, even though both are Myrmidons. And, Raffin does have his missable promotion from an already promoted class, Bronze Paladin, to Wyvern Rider. But thats it.

I was reffering to the way to obtain a dancer, not having played the games, i don't know how may times those things happened.

[Slumber]

Limited reclassing. A unit's identity is tied to their class, and just being able to freely switch classes removes this entirely.

Two tier. This is the least contentious one for me, since I'm also fine with three tier. However, I don't like the three tier where you start out as a class that branches. I like the RD way of doing it where there's one linear path, maybe with some unique promotions along the way.

No. Awakening has no game balance because of this. 

[whase]

I voted other because I would love to see a no class system (I really believe there are ways to make it work). That said, I do enjoy every class system so far in some way or another.

[starburst]

1 hour ago, Slumber said:

Limited reclassing. A unit's identity is tied to their class, and just being able to freely switch classes removes this entirely.

Two tier. This is the least contentious one for me, since I'm also fine with three tier. However, I don't like the three tier where you start out as a class that branches. I like the RD way of doing it where there's one linear path, maybe with some unique promotions along the way.

No. Awakening has no game balance because of this. 

You summed it up for me, mate. 😉
I too believe that the initial class of a unit is tied to its identity, and that is why re-classing should be limited. No skill-grabbing through class-hopping.
I do prefer two-trier classes and believe that it is enough for a game that takes place in 25-30 chapters. The more the tiers, the less relevant they are for the unit's development.

[X-Naut]

Reclassing should not reset your level and I am not a fan of the current skill acquisition system. I'd rather have characters get personalized skill sets through levels (and see some of the bit skills cut - looking at you +2 Stat skills).

Promotion tiers depends on the length of the game; you can have three tiers but what's the point of them if you only get to use them for the last 3-5 chapters? The only other way I see it working is like the Radiance duology where it lets the cast have a sense of power continuity. (I'll not speak on the execution, we know how flawed it is.) That said, you could easily redefine the power curve of a two-tier system by raising the stat scales and level cap; and if you're not careful the promotions will feel like they give either too much or too little. Overall, two tiers is the safer bet.

I'm fine with rigid or branching promotion, in fact I'm even fine with Jugdral's rigid branching system. If you can't think of two branches for every class it's worth the thought! However, I don't like the idea of branching and three tiers because then you end up with a bloated number of Master classes. If this was a thing I would advise limiting the branching to the first promotion only.

1 hour ago, whase said:

I voted other because I would love to see a no class system (I really believe there are ways to make it work). That said, I do enjoy every class system so far in some way or another.

Three Houses might as well have been this.

[Flere210]

Personally i would make 90% of the skills unlockable based on the Skill stat and maybe a point buy system, whit some of them further locked by weapon level or class.

Edited January 26, 2020 by Flere210

[Silver-Haired Maiden]

I went with branching, just because it's nice to have a canon progression that still maintains some flexibility based on what you like/need. As for tiers, I like longer games so I went with 3 but this is the one I'm most flexible on. Also the reclassing at will can go away, I like units to maintain some uniqueness and identity and the unlimited stacking feels a touch cheap.

[Boomhauer007]

Branching or limited, anything else you start to lose unit identity.

Third tier has always been pointless. RD it was basically second tier since most units came promoted anyway. 

You aren't gonna find a ton of fans of grinding on serenes, definitely not a casual website. 

[Hawkwing]

I chose limited reclassing as I enjoyed the risk-reward elements it provides in Awakening and Fates, but honestly I'm fine with all the options as long as the execution is good. Rigid classes work best when there are enough units in each class that the player can replace the role of a fallen unit, and branching classes add an extra layer of strategy as the player decides what role a certain unit should fulfill after promoting. Limiting reclassing is a mechanic that can be easily ignored by those uninterested it, while it can provide some engaging long-term planning for those that engage in it. Unlimited reclassing is one of the reasons Shadow Dragon handles permadeath so well, as it allows the player to change the role of one unit to replace a fallen one, or to have more units participate in a level where one class works better than another. The only system I can't comment much on is Three Houses, since I'm in the middle of playing it and there are elements I like and dislike about it, but even then it's not a bad idea and could have the kinks worked out in a future game. Every system can work, so it really just depends on the game in question.

If the game is long enough to justify it, third tiers are fine. Otherwise, second tier classes are the wiser choice, given that they reduce worktime and make it easier for second and first tier classes to have distinctions. I love how every class in Echoes is distinct in both visuals and animation, but soldiers, knights, and barons all serve the same role of "tank stuff" and the game still has second tier classes for mages and Pegasus knights.

Don't care too much about whether or not reclassing resets levels, but then again I tend not to bother grinding, both to get a move on and to get a greater challenge out of the game, minimal as it may be.

[Dandy Druid]

Limited Reclassing or Branching Promotions. It adds some replayability and allows me to try different builds with the characters I like.

2 tiers. A 3rd tier isn't really needed imo. I only liked it in RD since most people we're already in the 2nd Tier so you only had to promote them once.

No level resets. The game becomes very grindy when I don't want it to be. One of my least favorite parts about Awakening was this system when I only wanted to get to level 5 for a certain skill.

[ZeManaphy]

1. Branching, specifically the way Fates handled it. The lack of level reset makes it so much easier to grind for skills, which is the #1 reason for reclassing.  While I do enjoy that 3 Houses makes higher tier classes not nesscarily the best action, the fact that class mastery is how you obtain skills makes it harder to obtain them during the run, especially on Hard and Maddening where auxillary battles are limited.

2. Don't really care, but two class is fine enough.

3. If you played with Dynamax with Pokemon, you'll understand that doubling HP essentially halves the damage taken, so it should no surprise that logic applies here. Your HP threshold becomes so high that super effective damage from bows does not matter. There should have been an HP cap for classes in 3 Houses like in Fates. 

[trainer_derp]

Branching classes, three tiers, and level reset if reclassing (which I'm neutral on) is an option.

I'm not a huge fan of there being "right" and "wrong" ways to play a game (especially in lower difficulties) so making your units overpowered should be allowed. Besides, it's not like FE is carefully balanced anyways (see: movement usually being the best stat).