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42 minutes ago, MilodicMellodi said:

3) Extra Summoner Supports: Fairly useless. Any teams you had before that did well with only 1 S-Rank Summoner Supported unit don't need 3. And any team compositions that actually need 3 fucking S-Rank Summoner Supports are so niche and full of shit that no one would competitively use them. It downplays the effort people put into making great, powerful team compositions by giving the average P2W junkie a free ride with less powerful builds.

It's definitely far from useless. You don't need to have all 3 S supported units on the same team, and not everyone just uses a single tanking strategy. Like in light season I have a tanking team, a vantage team and a galeforce team with different units, and I use them all regularly. If I had the pass then that lets me S support my tank for the first team, which is what I already do, but also S support my vantage mage for the second team which would be very helpful. Then I can also have both my Eirs rolling with extra stats so they can contribute even more, or S support a galeforce unit to get even more atk/spd to do their job. It could definitely mean the difference between more wins and losses for a lot of people one way or the other.  And you won't necessarily get more defense losses and see people rocking 3 S supports on the teams to make it obvious, but you could also get losses you otherwise may not have because the person's alternate teams were now able to beat your map with the extra help.

And this just about AR, leaving aside the benefit of breezing through arena easier with 3/4 of your team S-boosted and whatnot.

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1 hour ago, MilodicMellodi said:

1) Resplendent Heroes: Better-looking versions of weak-ish Gen 1 Heroes with a small BST boost. Not useless, but certainly bait. Simply getting a free 5* unit without having to work for it is something anyone would fall for.

+2 to all stats is not small though. Cordelia gets 37/37 offensive spread, superior to gen IV lance units and rivaling gen IV sword units. Lyn gets 31/40 around gen II in terms of power, similar in stat distribution to Leif; Lyn also has a free B slot to pad her damage, and her Weapon is basically pseudo Null Follow-Up as her Spd and Brash Assault have little to no problem breaking Wary Fighter.

1 hour ago, MilodicMellodi said:

3) Extra Summoner Supports: Fairly useless. Any teams you had before that did well with only 1 S-Rank Summoner Supported unit don't need 3. And any team compositions that actually need 3 fucking S-Rank Summoner Supports are so niche and full of shit that no one would competitively use them. It downplays the effort people put into making great, powerful team compositions by giving the average P2W junkie a free ride with less powerful builds.

I would argue otherwise. Support units benefits massively from this. They can now better draw Chills as well as inflict Sabotages, and can hold their own in combat even more.

While Player Phase teams are not as dependent on stats, Atk/Spd+2 is still a pretty big boost. That is merge +5 across your 3 nukes if you choose to put it all there.

Having three Summoner Supports also mean you can split it between multiple teams. You can give one to your super tank in your super tank team, give one to your Counter-Vantage unit in the Counter-Vantage team, and give one to a support unit on another team that Sabotages enemy teams.

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10 hours ago, DefyingFates said:

Speaking of Summoning, what does F:GO do that you liked so much, @eclipse?

Two summon pools, with the lower one taking a different currency.  The upper one is where the rarer stuff is (and the one where you could buy currency with RL money).

Now if they'd relegate Craft Essences to their own pool (CEs are equippables, and most of the time I wasn't looking for them), that would make it almost bearable.

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3 hours ago, MilodicMellodi said:

That doesn't really feel like it's worth $10, but like I've said before at least it's not KHUx's $15 a week.

  1. Resplendent Heroes: +2 to all stats, which is a total of +10, is definitely not small. That's effectively 5 merges or 10 Dragonflower levels. Additionally, a 5-star-exclusive character normally costs an average of $60 to snipe from the revival banners.
  2. Quests: Assuming what we see in the video is what we get every half month, there will be a total of 10 orbs given out every month, which is the equivalent of $5.20 if purchased.
  3. Summoner Supports: You're assuming that players are going to put all 3 supported units on the same team, and there are clearly more things you can do with this feature. In particular, most players have multiple teams that they use, many of which likely will not have overlapping units, and this allows multiple teams to have a supported unit in them. For me, I have multiple super tanks that I use depending on the enemy team, and it would get extremely useful for me to have all of them have support bonuses, even if they usually aren't on the same team as each other.
  4. Re-Act: The game mode where it would clearly be most useful, but cannot be used in, is objectively Aether Raids.

Now, if we assume that Feh Pass, when purchased, will give a full month's duration (rather than ending immediately after the second rotation), the best bang for your buck if you don't care all that much for the quality of life features (because I honestly don't) would be to always overlap your Feh Pass with 3 sets of Resplendent Heroes and bonus quests, i.e. you buy 1 Feh Pass every 1 and a half months.

This would get you all 24 Resplendent Heroes and all 120 orbs from the bonus quests (as well as all of the other resources) each year for the cost of 8 Feh Passes, or $76 per year. For comparison, 120 orbs normally costs $62, meaning all of the other benefits come effectively at the cost of $14 per year.

Edited by Ice Dragon

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I dunno if anyone else was wondering but since I was curious about whether we'd get to keep the costume and stat boost of Resplendent Heroes if our subscription expired so I made an inquiry.
 

Spoiler

0abPmNr.png

In short, the answer is yes! While I agree that it's quite scummy to lock QoL improvements and strengthening old heroes behind a paywall, this is a fairly reasonable price to get particular heroes for the costume (and extra merge). Some characters really need the art "refine". I won't be an active subscriber but I'm considering signing up for a month because I like Lyn and Cordelia. 

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5 hours ago, Ice Dragon said:

Now, if we assume that Feh Pass, when purchased, will give a full month's duration (rather than ending immediately after the second rotation), the best bang for your buck if you don't care all that much for the quality of life features (because I honestly don't) would be to always overlap your Feh Pass with 3 sets of Resplendent Heroes and bonus quests, i.e. you buy 1 Feh Pass every 1 and a half months.

That's a good point. 3 sets of Resplendent Heroes and bonus quests for 1 month paid sounds even better. If I am not wrong, that's how Mario Karty Tour's Golden Pass works, so I don't see why it would be the case for Feh Pass as well.

Since I don't have plans to get the first month, I will wait for people to tell us how it works. If you get the pass, please inform me about if this idea works. I thank you in advance.

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Wow, that's a nice thing to know! I probably will end up getting the Feh Pass once in awhile. This should mean that the additional summoner supports will be kept even when you don't renew it as well!

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I refuse to buy the pass.  It is too scummy to me and even if they give Lloyd the best art redo ever I won't do it.  I sent feedback about this saying as much.  If it was just the quests and the new art I would have no problem with this pass, but the rest of the pass makes me so mad.  I might of bought the pass if they didn't lock QoL changes behind it but that crossed the line with me and I personally hope that this pass flops so hard they remove it from the game.  I know that won't happen but as Lucina would say "hope will never die".  My advice to the people like me who are mad about this is send feedback, we were able to make a difference with feedback about Ayra we can do it again here if we all send negative feedback.

Edited by EricaofRenais

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58 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Wow, that's a nice thing to know! I probably will end up getting the Feh Pass once in awhile. This should mean that the additional summoner supports will be kept even when you don't renew it as well!

I don't think that's the case, or I didn't understand well. Resplendent Heroes and their bonuses will be kept after the subscription has ended. The summoner supports are one of the other bonuses of the pass keeping them afterwards doesn't make sense. 

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6 minutes ago, SuperNova125 said:

I don't think that's the case, or I didn't understand well. Resplendent Heroes and their bonuses will be kept after the subscription has ended. The summoner supports are one of the other bonuses of the pass keeping them afterwards doesn't make sense. 

...Uh, why doesn't it make sense? I personally don't see how it it makes sense for the supports to be removed.

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It makes perfect financial sense that IS would add the feature they add to monetize to the game first and leave the (hopefully) F2P-friendly one 'til later, but it still aggravates me to no end that they're adding Feh Pass ASAP and leaving the Compile Combat Manual (CCM) feature for next month. Maybe they're still trying to work out how to make it as hard as possible to use without getting more complaints?

Eh, at least this way CCM is in a Schrodinger's position of possibly being either fair and an awesome addition or utterly tedious, I suppose...

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13 hours ago, Ice Dragon said:
  1. Resplendent Heroes: +2 to all stats, which is a total of +10, is definitely not small. That's effectively 5 merges or 10 Dragonflower levels. Additionally, a 5-star-exclusive character normally costs an average of $60 to snipe from the revival banners.
  2. Quests: Assuming what we see in the video is what we get every half month, there will be a total of 10 orbs given out every month, which is the equivalent of $5.20 if purchased.
  3. Summoner Supports: You're assuming that players are going to put all 3 supported units on the same team, and there are clearly more things you can do with this feature. In particular, most players have multiple teams that they use, many of which likely will not have overlapping units, and this allows multiple teams to have a supported unit in them. For me, I have multiple super tanks that I use depending on the enemy team, and it would get extremely useful for me to have all of them have support bonuses, even if they usually aren't on the same team as each other.
  4. Re-Act: The game mode where it would clearly be most useful, but cannot be used in, is objectively Aether Raids.

Now, if we assume that Feh Pass, when purchased, will give a full month's duration (rather than ending immediately after the second rotation), the best bang for your buck if you don't care all that much for the quality of life features (because I honestly don't) would be to always overlap your Feh Pass with 3 sets of Resplendent Heroes and bonus quests, i.e. you buy 1 Feh Pass every 1 and a half months.

This would get you all 24 Resplendent Heroes and all 120 orbs from the bonus quests (as well as all of the other resources) each year for the cost of 8 Feh Passes, or $76 per year. For comparison, 120 orbs normally costs $62, meaning all of the other benefits come effectively at the cost of $14 per year.

Value is relative. In (feh) gacha terms this is a steal.

Albeit I wouldn't necessarily call it great value.

The units thrown into the package are totally outdated. Unless someone is into Lyn I doubt owning her will make a difference in anyones barracks. IS must have realized people don't spend on her anymore and it's time for the final cash-in. Anyone who wanted Cordelia will have her at +10, so it's basically just galeforce. Thats why they added skins and stats, otherwise it would be laughable.

The qol changes are debatable. I can luve without them. Might never use re-act, auto-battle is interesting but I don't grind beyond whats necessary.

Summoner supports are good, although it's a bitch-move. Similar to the 10 extra resplendent stats, only that this obe affects general gameplay and not just a particular unit.

But like I said,  it's a steal compared to nintendo's general offerings.

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1 hour ago, Anacybele said:

...Uh, why doesn't it make sense? I personally don't see how it it makes sense for the supports to be removed.

They could be removed if no longer you have the pass. But it could be like a purchase that you buy the pass once and you get them always. I don't know it was a guess I also didn't pay much attention to that part of the channel so I might have missed something. 

Edited by SuperNova125

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31 minutes ago, Endriu said:

The units thrown into the package are totally outdated. Unless someone is into Lyn I doubt owning her will make a difference in anyones barracks. IS must have realized people don't spend on her anymore and it's time for the final cash-in. Anyone who wanted Cordelia will have her at +10, so it's basically just galeforce. Thats why they added skins and stats, otherwise it would be laughable.

People should really start doing the math before claiming Lyn is outdated. Lyn would not even be that dated anymore once she gets her stats boosted up. All stat+2 and all stat+1 from extra Dragonflowers gives her 31/40 stat spread. 71 offensive stat spread is no joke, and Lull Spd/Def boosts that up to 77. Lyn also has guaranteed follow-up on her Weapon and pseudo Null Follow-Up against Wary Fighter and Swordbreaker.

For comparisons:
Ayra has 33/37 with Spd+3 on Weapon and extra Dragonflowers, totalling 75 offensive stat spread.
Darkness Within Mareeta has 31/41 and if running Lull Spd/Def, totalling 78.
F!Byleth has 34/40, totalling 74.
BE!Alm has 38/35 and Atk+3, totalling 76.
Zofia's Call Catria has 38/36 with Atk+3, totaling 77.
Mareeta has 35/42 with Atk/Spd+4, totaling 85.
Eyval has 33/35, totaling 68.
Larcei has 36/40 with Atk/Spd+4, totaling 84.
Shannon has 38/36 with Spd+3 and Atk/Spd+5, totaling 87.
Líf has has 38/30 with Atk/Spd+4, totalling 76.

Lyn does not have the busted stats of hyper offensive gen IV sword infantry, but she does have the stats to rival everyone else in her class, including all gen III infantry.

Cordelia is still a powerhouse with her 35/35 offensive spread. All stat+2 allows her to rival hyper offensive gen IV infantry: 37/37 with Atk/Spd+4 on her Weapon gives her 82 total on a Brave unit.

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3 hours ago, Anacybele said:

...Uh, why doesn't it make sense? I personally don't see how it it makes sense for the supports to be removed.

The Resplendent Heroes are different because each one is essentially a one-time gift for current owners. If your pass expires, you keep your current ones, but you won't keep getting new ones. That's different from keeping the bonus summoner supports. If you were to keep the bonus summoner supports, they might as well let you keep the rewind and auto battle as well and then you'd just be able to get these features forever for the price of one FEH pass. They are constant features that are always there, unlike Resplendent heroes which are different every month.

This is speculation of course, I don't know for sure that it will actually work this way, but I find it most likely.

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19 minutes ago, XRay said:

People should really start doing the math before claiming Lyn is outdated. Lyn would not even be that dated anymore once she gets her stats boosted up. All stat+2 and all stat+1 from extra Dragonflowers gives her 31/40 stat spread. 71 offensive stat spread is no joke, and Lull Spd/Def boosts that up to 77. Lyn also has guaranteed follow-up on her Weapon and pseudo Null Follow-Up against Wary Fighter and Swordbreaker.

For comparisons:
Ayra has 33/37 with Spd+3 on Weapon and extra Dragonflowers, totalling 75 offensive stat spread.
Darkness Within Mareeta has 31/41 and if running Lull Spd/Def, totalling 78.
F!Byleth has 34/40, totalling 74.
BE!Alm has 38/35 and Atk+3, totalling 76.
Zofia's Call Catria has 38/36 with Atk+3, totaling 77.
Mareeta has 35/42 with Atk/Spd+4, totaling 85.
Eyval has 33/35, totaling 68.
Larcei has 36/40 with Atk/Spd+4, totaling 84.
Shannon has 38/36 with Spd+3 and Atk/Spd+5, totaling 87.
Líf has has 38/30 with Atk/Spd+4, totalling 76.

Lyn does not have the busted stats of hyper offensive gen IV sword infantry, but she does have the stats to rival everyone else in her class, including all gen III infantry.

Cordelia is still a powerhouse with her 35/35 offensive spread. All stat+2 allows her to rival hyper offensive gen IV infantry: 37/37 with Atk/Spd+4 on her Weapon gives her 82 total on a Brave unit.

Matter of fact its 72. She gets +2 from dragonflowers if Im not mistaken

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2 minutes ago, Florete said:

The Resplendent Heroes are different because each one is essentially a one-time gift for current owners. If your pass expires, you keep your current ones, but you won't keep getting new ones. That's different from keeping the bonus summoner supports. If you were to keep the bonus summoner supports, they might as well let you keep the rewind and auto battle as well and then you'd just be able to get these features forever for the price of one FEH pass. They are constant features that are always there, unlike Resplendent heroes which are different every month.

This is speculation of course, I don't know for sure that it will actually work this way, but I find it most likely.

The thing is, those supports take a while to build and they're something you're adding to your units. The other stuff you mentioned don't affect your units stats or anything.

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Just now, Endriu said:

Matter of fact its 72. She gets +2 from dragonflowers if Im not mistaken

I am only counting the extra +5 Flowers, since every unit in the game has access to the first 5 Flowers.

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17 minutes ago, XRay said:

People should really start doing the math before claiming Lyn is outdated. Lyn would not even be that dated anymore once she gets her stats boosted up. All stat+2 and all stat+1 from extra Dragonflowers gives her 31/40 stat spread. 71 offensive stat spread is no joke, and Lull Spd/Def boosts that up to 77. Lyn also has guaranteed follow-up on her Weapon and pseudo Null Follow-Up against Wary Fighter and Swordbreaker.

actually Lyn can get +2 stats from Dragonflowers, because she is a Gen 1 unit. So fully maxed with the pass she would get +4 to all stats with no merges which is basicly a Gen 4 Infantry unit with trainee bonus, with only +1 stats from Dragonflower she is on par with Gen 4 Infantry units that have no Dragonflower "merges"

A fully merged +SPD Lyn would then sit at: 45 HP/ 36 Atk/ 48 Spd/ 34 Def /37 Res.
Add summoner support: 50 Hp/ 38 Atk/ 50 Spd/ 36 Def/ 39 Res
Her Attack is still "ass", but add the fact she has basicly a "freed" B-Slot and can prominently run stuff like Null-Follow up if you want or Close Call 3.
I mean with double Eirs she sit at 49 RES pre buffs and with Close Call 3 and her high Speed she could function as a dual phase unit (due to her weapon) and maybe not even given a rats ass for precharged AoE specials.

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2 minutes ago, XRay said:

I am only counting the extra +5 Flowers, since every unit in the game has access to the first 5 Flowers.

Yeah, but she has access to +10. Anyway, it only further substatiates your point and I must agree with it and sort of backtrack on my opinion.

 

 

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7 minutes ago, Hilda said:

actually Lyn can get +2 stats from Dragonflowers, because she is a Gen 1 unit. So fully maxed with the pass she would get +4 to all stats with no merges which is basicly a Gen 4 Infantry unit with trainee bonus, with only +1 stats from Dragonflower she is on par with Gen 4 Infantry units that have no Dragonflower "merges"

I did not want to count the full 10 since I just want to compare the numerical differences to keep things simple (and I am lazy). A slots, Sacred Seal slots, first 5 Flowers, merges, etc. are the same across the board. The only additional difference would come from their B slot, where I use Lull Spd/Def if they have Desperation on their Weapon.

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31 minutes ago, Florete said:

This is speculation of course, I don't know for sure that it will actually work this way, but I find it most likely.

It's possible that the existing Supports will be locked in instead of being removed altogether, but does anyone change their Summoner Support around enough for that to matter? IS may nullify those Supports for that reason alone as soon as your Pass expires.

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At the very least, it's nice for the Lyn fans, especially those who are struggling to get merges for her since she is, after all, a book 1 5* exclusive red unit (getting a Resplendent Hero does imply that you get an actual 5* copy of that unit so that you can actually use the reskin -- screw RNG given summoning's current state). Realistically though, IS would just keep throwing in more and more powerful sword units anyways in future banners and who knows which older sword units would get the Resplendent Hero treatment (could be Lucina, could be Ryoma, could be Athena, could even be Ayra).

5 minutes ago, DefyingFates said:

It's possible that the existing Supports will be locked in instead of being removed altogether, but does anyone change their Summoner Support around enough for that to matter? IS may nullify those Supports for that reason alone as soon as your Pass expires.

Given how the Summoner Support works, I would assume that the last 2 supports would be reset to "no support". After all, it takes half as many maps to regain an old S-rank summoner support than to get a new S-rank summoner support and the game does remember the highest summoner support rank you got with that unit. It's not a big issue anyways since having extra summoner support slots mainly saves you stamina potions.

Edited by Roflolxp54

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11 minutes ago, Lemmy said:

Aren’t you ignoring that modern infantry gets an extra skill built into their weapons compared to other gens?

I have factored any extra effects that involves numbers. Any effect that does not involve numbers like Null Follow-Up and Null Special from Creator's Sword have been ignored to keep things simple. Lyn's Desperation-Brash Assault is no slouch as an effect, giving her essentially infinite Spd, a weaker version of Null Follow-Up, and it frees up her B slot to pad her stats further with Lull Spd/Def. Comparing non numerical effects is already a pain in the ass for Slaying effect, since they are basically a straight up Atk boost but you also need to factor in average enemy Def and list several Atk numbers for varying Def numbers; comparing things like guaranteed follow-up is even more difficult since it does not really make sense to assign infinite Spd a meaningful value.

Edited by XRay

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