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FEH Revenue Drop!!!


XRay
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1 hour ago, XRay said:

I can just as easily make a claim and say that not all 1,800 people worked full time on GTA V, since they were making Max Payne around the same time too.

Over time also is not cheap. At least for the United States, overtime costs more, and if you are not paying the extra rate on overtime, you are paying it in the form of higher turnover rates and extra training time trying to get new employees acclimated to their job or a decline in work performance.

Fortunately feh doesn't require much overtime - 13 anniversary maps cannot be that hard to produce, lol - same goes for the bhb rerun quest 🙂

In the end I think we will have to agree to disagree. What does it matter anyway? Right?

 

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37 minutes ago, Endriu said:

Fortunately feh doesn't require much overtime - 13 anniversary maps cannot be that hard to produce, lol - same goes for the bhb rerun quest 🙂

Did you not read all the stuff about why not to use that stuff as the examples?

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1 hour ago, Endriu said:

What does it matter anyway? Right?

Because calling other people's hard work, time, and effort as cheap and unworthy is quite frankly inconsiderate and insulting. It will be no different going to a restaurant and telling them that you can cook something similar at home for a fraction of the cost and their food is overpriced and not worth it.

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4 minutes ago, XRay said:

Because calling other people's hard work, time, and effort as cheap and unworthy is quite frankly inconsiderate and insulting. It will be no different going to a restaurant and telling them that you can cook something similar at home for a fraction of the cost and their food is overpriced and not worth it.

Well, I think this one takes the cake. Show me where I said that.

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6 minutes ago, Endriu said:

Well, I think this one takes the cake. Show me where I said that.

 

1 hour ago, Endriu said:

Fortunately feh doesn't require much overtime - 13 anniversary maps cannot be that hard to produce, lol - same goes for the bhb rerun quest 🙂

In the end I think we will have to agree to disagree. What does it matter anyway? Right?

Unless you know what goes into map programming, I wouldn't discount it entirely.

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5 hours ago, XRay said:

Because calling other people's hard work, time, and effort as cheap and unworthy is quite frankly inconsiderate and insulting. It will be no different going to a restaurant and telling them that you can cook something similar at home for a fraction of the cost and their food is overpriced and not worth it.

if it really is that pricy why not waste those resources on actual games instead. if we are looking at the content of feh heroes it doesnt seem like to much. but if it's the same cost or surpassing an actual game in terms of development costs than damm doesnt seem that hot.

Fairly sure the actual game is cheap as chips to make. the majority of the costs of a gacha game are in maintenance and mainly advertising. those last 2 things are the only things that could make the game more pricy than an actual FE game since the game is being kept up and updated for years. also advertisment can be pricy.

Speaking of anniversairy maps. I'm pretty sure at this point in time they already have a map creator. to just easily make maps. sorta like mario maker 2. 

Ever played them advance wars game from inteligent systems? all games had a map designer in wich you could create your own maps terrains enemy placements etc etc. at the very beginning when they created the game sure it had to be done from scratch but at this point they probable have some map creator just like in say advance wars.

Literally some of their older games had map creators aswell for the players to use. why start from scratch all the time when you can just add some extra skins and terrains and use a map creator to print maps out in no time. they already made all kinds of terrains and units in the beginning. it's just enemy placement and map design at this point

Edited by SwordsDude
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6 hours ago, SwordsDude said:

if it really is that pricy why not waste those resources on actual games instead. if we are looking at the content of feh heroes it doesnt seem like to much. but if it's the same cost or surpassing an actual game in terms of development costs than damm doesnt seem that hot.

Fairly sure the actual game is cheap as chips to make. the majority of the costs of a gacha game are in maintenance and mainly advertising. those last 2 things are the only things that could make the game more pricy than an actual FE game since the game is being kept up and updated for years. also advertisment can be pricy.

Speaking of anniversairy maps. I'm pretty sure at this point in time they already have a map creator. to just easily make maps. sorta like mario maker 2. 

Ever played them advance wars game from inteligent systems? all games had a map designer in wich you could create your own maps terrains enemy placements etc etc. at the very beginning when they created the game sure it had to be done from scratch but at this point they probable have some map creator just like in say advance wars.

Literally some of their older games had map creators aswell for the players to use. why start from scratch all the time when you can just add some extra skins and terrains and use a map creator to print maps out in no time. they already made all kinds of terrains and units in the beginning. it's just enemy placement and map design at this point

Exactly on point. Map creators make things easy. They will also have a unit creator. It's not like they write code from scratch for every new unit.

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11 hours ago, SwordsDude said:

Fairly sure the actual game is cheap as chips to make. the majority of the costs of a gacha game are in maintenance and mainly advertising. those last 2 things are the only things that could make the game more pricy than an actual FE game since the game is being kept up and updated for years. also advertisment can be pricy.

5 hours ago, Endriu said:

Exactly on point. Map creators make things easy. They will also have a unit creator. It's not like they write code from scratch for every new unit.

Please enlighten me with an educated analysis of how you can make the math work out, and, at bare minimum, with real world facts. Blow me away with your wonderful business idea on how I can make such a cheap and profitable game. I am pretty sure Nintendo will immediately hire you and give you a millionaire salary.

But I know neither of you can do that. Not by tomorrow. Not by next week. Not by next month. Maybe, just maybe, within a year if you two work really damned hard. You know how I know that you two cannot do it? It is because I have been in school for years earning my accounting degree and have been in the workforce for about 3 years now. I am still a total noob and I cannot really tell you the difference between cowpie and bullcrap, but my professors have definitely taught me well enough that I can always tell you when I do smell complete and utter opinionated doodoo.

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Nothing wrong with liking and supporting the game but your really overselling the product that is feh heroes. 

I find it hilarious that you think that they don't have a map creator and start from scratch for every update especially considering that all their advance wars games had one. literally game cardridges wich where on the market for vs battles against others or cpu. dark conflict probably had the best map editor in the series.

You make it seem like that the game is actually better than the mainline games. that the content is on equal grounds.

your telling me that relying on whales for hundreds of$ per person per update is a fair business strategy?

It's a bit rich for my blood. and don't give me the argument that your to poor to afford it. Pretty much everyone can afford it with a decent job. a couple hundred$ or more per month is nothing for most people.

Each person has their own opinion on wich they spend their money on, so yea as long as people are willing to pay 100 $- 300$ per update than so be it. it kinda seems like  Sunk cost fallacy to me

it works though. the average spending per download on FE heroes is 40$. Maybe they'll reach the greatness of grand fate order in wich the average download rakes in at 500$ per person 😂

Edited by SwordsDude
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19 minutes ago, XRay said:

Please enlighten me with an educated analysis of how you can make the math work out, and, at bare minimum, with real world facts. Blow me away with your wonderful business idea on how I can make such a cheap and profitable game. I am pretty sure Nintendo will immediately hire you and give you a millionaire salary.

But I know neither of you can do that. Not by tomorrow. Not by next week. Not by next month. Maybe, just maybe, within a year if you two work really damned hard. You know how I know that you two cannot do it? It is because I have been in school for years earning my accounting degree and have been in the workforce for about 3 years now. I am still a total noob and I cannot really tell you the difference between cowpie and bullcrap, but my professors have definitely taught me well enough that I can always tell you when I do smell complete and utter opinionated doodoo.

That's just fanboy talk. Deep within you know perfectly well how mobile gacha games work. But you wanna defend those practices because you are a fan and chances are you have spent quite a dime on it. I never said the game isn't worth our time or even money to some people. Its just blatantly obvious the game is relatively cheap COMPARED to what they earn. Easy to maintain and not even trying to go the extra miles (see anniv. maps and quests). 

And why would they if people spend on it regardless. Hell, people are even buying a dickpass. If I was Nintendo I would keep it that way and make some more millions.

Edited by Endriu
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1 hour ago, SwordsDude said:

Nothing wrong with liking and supporting the game but your really overselling the product that is feh heroes. 

This tells me you have not worked a damned job in your life because you have no idea how to appreciate, let alone value, what other people's works' worth are.

1 hour ago, SwordsDude said:

I find it hilarious that you think that they don't have a map creator and start from scratch especially considering that all their advance wars games had one. literally game cardridges wich where on the market for vs battles against others or cpu. dark conflict probably had the best map editor in the series.

My first love and favorite series! I was too young back then to support my game and it died. I learned that designing a fun and balanced map is not easy from that series. But do you really think hiring a designer to create maps is cheap? Show me real world facts and numbers. Just look it up on Google to see how much it costs to hire designers. Any designer, cheapest one will do; we can always fire and replace them later.

1 hour ago, SwordsDude said:

You make it seem like that the game is actually better than the mainline games. that the content is on equal grounds.

I prefer the main games in general, but I am not sure they are able to fit hundreds of waifus and husbandos on a single cartridge at a reasonable cost. Heroes will sell like hot cakes to Fire Emblem fans if they include every playable character in the series.

1 hour ago, SwordsDude said:

your telling me that relying on whales for hundreds of$ per person per update is a fair business strategy?

And what is wrong with that strategy? People getting addicted or going into debt? Not all adults need to be babied.

1 hour ago, SwordsDude said:

It's a bit rich for my blood. and don't give me the argument that your to poor to afford it. Pretty much everyone can afford it with a decent job. a couple hundred$ or more per month is nothing for most people.

You ARE talking to an ex-cetacean here, although maybe I still qualify.

1 hour ago, SwordsDude said:

Each person has their own opinion on wich they spend their money on, so yea as long as people are willing to pay 100 $- 300$ per update than so be it. it kinda seems like  Sunk cost fallacy to me

That is not what a sunk cost fallacy is.

1 hour ago, SwordsDude said:

it works though. the average spending per download on FE heroes is 40$. Maybe they'll reach the greatness of grand fate order in wich the average download rakes in at 500$ per person 😂

You need to double check your source or math. I was expecting at least a Wikipedia source or something similar at the bare minimum, so you still have not learned how to cite your work. My math works out to be about $125 (32 million downloads; $4 billion gross revenue) per download.

1 hour ago, Endriu said:

That's just fanboy talk. Deep within you know perfectly well how mobile gacha games work. But you wanna defend those practices because you are a fan and chances are you have spent quite a dime on it. I never said the game isn't worth our time or even money to some people.

I am a Fire Emblem fanboy, yes. But Heroes fanboy? At least look through my profile and find all the gripes I have with Heroes. Just a refresher if you do not know me that well:
- Screw Intelligent System's/Nintendo's crap awful PR. They seem to be improving though.
- Scoring modes are bullcrap.
- Voting Gauntlet's multiplier can suck it.
- Relay Defense should stay in hell.
- Most melee pity breakers fuck off.
- Heroes needs to be more generous and helpful to new players.
Those are my primary complaints against Heroes.

And yes, I have spent a pretty penny on this game.

1 hour ago, Endriu said:

Its just blatantly obvious the game is relatively cheap COMPARED to what they earn. Easy to maintain and not even trying to go the extra miles (see anniv. maps and quests). 

Cite your sources, cause I am calling this as utter and complete crap. How would you feel, if I said you are not worthy of your hard earned allowance/salary? It is such a simple task, why should whoever who pays you pay you that amount? And why not finish it faster in half the time? So-and-so coworker can do your job in half the time while covering two other coworkers.

1 hour ago, Endriu said:

not even trying to go the extra miles (see anniv. maps and quests).

You really have no idea why they are designed that way. These are really low bar maps so new players will feel they have earned and achieved something. And for veteran players, they could have forced us through Infernal maps, but considering those maps are only out for a day and not every player is a great strategist, so as to make everyone still feel the celebratory mood, they put it behind Lunatic difficulty. They know we know it is just an excuse to give us free Orbs and to make us play a few minutes longer each day.

1 hour ago, Endriu said:

And why would they if people spend on it regardless. Hell, people are even buying a dickpass. If I was Nintendo I would keep it that way and make some more millions.

If you really want more people to suck on Feh Pass, it needs a lot of work. There is a whole thread about why the right people are not sucking on it as much. Just us whales sucking on it might not be enough to make Fehnix excited again.

Edited by XRay
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26 minutes ago, XRay said:

 

You need to double check your source or math. I was expecting at least a Wikipedia source or something similar at the bare minimum, so you still have not learned how to cite your work. My math works out to be about $125 (32 million downloads; $4 billion gross revenue) per download.

 

You want articles as proof since you think I'm talking BS consider it done.

grand fate order 

291 to 487 per download. with japan obviously raking that spending limit to the skies

https://sensortower.com/blog/fate-grand-order-revenue-4-billion

feh

39.90$ per single download

https://www.pocketgamer.biz/asia/news/72153/mario-kart-tour-revenue-reason-for-optimism/

no calculations needed if multiple sources mention it.

all other nintendo games except for dragalia lost at 35$ are 5$ per download or way less. so yea 

 

Also i don't think revenue per download will go down anytime soon rather go up since spendings will still happen but less new players will download the app . These apps have raked in the main crowd already grand fate order for sure if i had to guess. a substantial amount of new players is the only way for revenue per download to go down. 

 

Edited by SwordsDude
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1. If this gets any more out of hand, I'm going to start issuing warnings.  Those who think FEH is cheap, please cite sources.
2. Speaking of, a quick nip into the world of hacking will tell you just how EASY it is to make a competent map.  I mean, just LOOK at the glut of fully-custom, fanmade FE hacks we have available!  And in case this wasn't obvious, it's sarcasm.
3. Did anyone notice a theme on the anniversary maps?  No?  Didn't think so.

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1 hour ago, SwordsDude said:

291 to 487 per download. with japan obviously raking that spending limit to the skies

https://sensortower.com/blog/fate-grand-order-revenue-4-billion

Good, I like those numbers. I will concede on that point.

— — — — — — —

I am quoting from the other thread since our discussion is more relevant here in my opinion as it is beyond the scope of just Feh Pass.

3 hours ago, SwordsDude said:

I have a well paying job don't give me that crap,

Then I expect you to know better than to devalue other people's work. Do you know how much it costs to hire professionals to do their work? Have you ever written a business plan? Did you ever do any market research to see how much people are willing to pay? Or checked out the prices of electrical components and raw materials?

3 hours ago, SwordsDude said:

I don't see any console sales in those sheets only handheld. 

Those figures are the total revenue for the entire Nintendo company; handheld, consoles, games, royalty fees, everything. I divided the eras up by when the handhelds were released since they are ones that lead their generation. You can copy my Google Sheets to do your own analysis if you wish to counter my points, and maybe dividing it up via console eras might make a difference. If you need help finding info, you can look through the annual reports that I linked (you will have to make do with the 2002 annual report if you are trying to look for info older than that, since that is the oldest annual report I can dig up on Nintendo's website) and just do a page search of whatever the name of the number you are trying to find ("Wii" for numbers regarding Wii sales, costs, etc; or "expense" if you are trying to find a specific type of cost). If you cannot find something, let me know so I can see if I can find it or figure out a reasonable estimate if possible.

3 hours ago, SwordsDude said:

Also they didnt do to bad with the recession they had excellent results. multiple articles actually.

Have you double checked the time stamps of the articles? I would search for something like "Nintendo losses" or "Nintendo financials" and limit the date range to be after 2012, and pick something like this article. Keep in mind that Japan's Great Recession came in waves, the third wave did not finish until 2012, and Nintendo borrowed heavily right before the recession. When recession struck, they either could not keep up with the debt load or do not wish to carry it, so they spent a few years paying it off and reducing it in stages, sacrificing the Wii U and profits if they have to.

3 hours ago, SwordsDude said:

Pusing wii sales you say more like developing the next generation. if they would only push wii sales those costs would not be a problem that means more profit. developing an entire new console with games for the new gimmick now that's only a loss for those years until you can put it up for sale.

it takes years to develop a console it doesnt happen overnight after all.

Considering that the wii u came out in 2012 they where already investing allot to make the next console generation or what do you think about the 3ds coming out in 2011. and 2012 and up where horrible times for Nintendo the wii u was a flop people though it was just a wii. parents buying wii u games wich did not work on the original wii in wich even store employees had to explain that the wii u is a brand new console to parents.

Developing  a brand new console costs money. allot of it until a console is out on the market the money invested in it is a loss.

It is true that it does take a while and money to develop consoles. But, if it really took that much time and money to develop, we would see the spike of 30% debt financed assets to continue from 2008 to until the Wii U launched in 2012. There is no reason to assume the Wii U has finished developing when 2008 hit and Nintendo just let it sits there doing nothing for 4 years. Their debt clearly dropped off significantly right after the recession came, so I think that high debt level was for the manufacturing and sale of the Wii, and the lowering debt level afterwards was for either for damage control purposes or that the creditors came knocking.

I also agree that the Wii U could have been marketed better. If they just called it something else, that might have helped with reducing the confusion, but I am not sure if the lack of brand recognition would have helped.

27 minutes ago, eclipse said:

1. If this gets any more out of hand, I'm going to start issuing warnings.  Those who think FEH is cheap, please cite sources.

@Endriu @SwordsDude, sorry when I made personal attacks. I get a little heated when people are making claims about business and finance when even I have no idea what is going on inside Nintendo.

Edited by XRay
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@XRay

 

I don't know how reliable these figures are but according to 

https://vgsales.fandom.com/wiki/Fire_Emblem

The total sales of ALL Fire Emblem games is about 16 million.

Let's say each copy will have sold for $60 on average then that's about $960mill total revenue. Might be more with dlc.

If you put that against $656million total revenue for just FEH then you realize they make quite good money here.

Of course I can't say anything about the development costs of games like 3h, radiant games or the 3ds games but I would assume a game like three houses might have cost more to develope. Would that be a fair assumption?

Keeping feh alive,  creating new units, maps, etc. won't be near the costs of developing a new game, that would preposterous.

We also need to bear in mind, the distribution of feh and its products (feh pass, orbs) will be much cheaper than producing, shipping and selling cardridges, cards and discs (albeit thanks to the digital age that has changed over recent years)

All I was ever implying is that a mobile game like feh is relatively low investment with huge income. 

Was I wrong?

 

 

Edited by Endriu
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2 hours ago, Endriu said:

 

Let's say each copy will have sold for $60 on average then that's about $960mill total revenue. Might be more with dlc.

You can't use that as an average when at least seven games in the series retailed at $40 or less (since they were released on handheld systems).

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1 hour ago, Jave said:

You can't use that as an average when at least seven games in the series retailed at $40 or less (since they were released on handheld systems).

True but 3ds onwards all had dlc aswell.

And awakening till valentia had dlc that surpassed the base game costs making the total price over 80 - 90$ for the people that needed everything? Fates had 3 games basicly 100$ for everything. you could also include collectors editions sales wich happened from valentia onwards wich again surpass base game costs. past FE games didnt have that. ok there was one exception on the super famicom but it was actually so rare that those sales could be ignored.

unlike tree houses with just 25$ dlc, the dlc in them 3ds titles was quite a bit more than that.

not to mention that older sales of 40$ also includes inflation, not to mention the especially 5 console games at 60$, raising that  price quite a bit. this series released multiple games on the famicom and super famicom after all.That's 5 games on a console of 60$ before the gba era plus inflation increasing that price.

I'd say 60$ on average is good enough considering inflation of the gba, nes amd snes era + especially dlc and collectors editions wich surpassed the base game costs in pretty much all 3ds titles you don't need exact numbers after all, we get his point and his estimate is pretty alright all things considered, 

Majority of sales is base game only. however added inflation and the smaller portion of people that did buy dlc or the collectors editions would probably make up for the small loss at 40$ handheld prices to make the average around 60$ per game sale in the end I'd say.

 

 

Edited by SwordsDude
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16 minutes ago, SwordsDude said:

true but 3ds onwards all had dlc aswell

and awakening till valentia had dlc that surpassed the base game costs making the total price over 80$ for the people that needed everything? Fates had 3 games basicly 100$ for everything

unlike tree houses with 25$ dlc the dlc in the 3ds titles was far more than that.

I'd say 60$ on average is good enough you don't need exact numbers after all not to mention that older sales of 40$ also includes inflation not to mention the especially 5 console games at 60$, raising that  price quite a bit. this series released multiple games on the famicom and super famicom after all.That's 5 games on a console of 60$ before the gba era  plus inflation increasing that price.

The problem is that you can't use DLC to jack up the average because:

1) Not everyone who bought the game bought the DLC.

2) The Fates numbers are the combined sales of Birthright and Conquest, each of which were sold at $40. So you can't put the number at $100 when it's a dual-version scenario and most people bought the game twice. Revelation is a different scenario but we don't know the exact numbers AFAIK.

3) If you're going to bring up inflation, then please provide proper numbers to make your argument, because inflation is nowhere near as simple as "it increases the price". The earlier games were Japan-only so that brings in the problem of Japanese pricing and inflation to account for, and I don't think you've made any compelling arguments in your post.

Finally, the problem in this topic, and the reason this thread was made in the first place, was to show that Nintendo/IntSys is LOSING REVENUE on its FEH sales in a year-after-year basis. The comparison of FEH's 3-year revenue to the series' all-time revenue is a flawed one to begin with, because it's not the same type of good or service being sold.

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15 minutes ago, Jave said:

The problem is that you can't use DLC to jack up the average because:

1) Not everyone who bought the game bought the DLC.

2) The Fates numbers are the combined sales of Birthright and Conquest, each of which were sold at $40. So you can't put the number at $100 when it's a dual-version scenario and most people bought the game twice. Revelation is a different scenario but we don't know the exact numbers AFAIK.

3) If you're going to bring up inflation, then please provide proper numbers to make your argument, because inflation is nowhere near as simple as "it increases the price". The earlier games were Japan-only so that brings in the problem of Japanese pricing and inflation to account for, and I don't think you've made any compelling arguments in your post.

Finally, the problem in this topic, and the reason this thread was made in the first place, was to show that Nintendo/IntSys is LOSING REVENUE on its FEH sales in a year-after-year basis. The comparison of FEH's 3-year revenue to the series' all-time revenue is a flawed one to begin with, because it's not the same type of good or service being sold.

https://www.ign.com/articles/2016/10/04/comparing-the-price-of-every-game-console-with-inflation

Inflation for the nes games would mean 60$ times 2.25 135$ per game sale

snes sale was times 1.75 making it 100$ per game sale for the console games

Gamecube era wich is roughly gba era aswell was only 35% inflation so 55$ for the gba games and 80$ for console games.

wii and ds era is only 20% inflation so 50$ for handheld and 72 $ for console games.

Also I'm pretty sure that at least 10 to 20% of 3ds owners bought some or full dlc. otherwise it would not make any sense to keep that trend going. Same for collectors editions after fates it was a huge succes in wich even spinoffs like fire emblem warriors have a collectors edition wich again inflates the price. 10 to 20% at the very least I'd say.

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5 minutes ago, SwordsDude said:

https://www.ign.com/articles/2016/10/04/comparing-the-price-of-every-game-console-with-inflation

Inflation for the nes games would mean 60$ times 2.5 150$ per game sale

snes sale was times 1.75 making it 100$ per game sale for the console games

Gamecube era wich is roughly gba era aswell was only 35% inflation so 55$ for the gba games and 80$ for console games.

Also I'm pretty sure that at least 10 to 20$ of 3ds owners bought some or full dlc. otherwise it would not make any sense to keep that trend going. Same for collectors editions after fates it was a huge succes in wich even spinoffs like fire emblem warriors have a collectors edition wich again inflates the price. 10 to 20% at the very least I'd say.

This is fine and all, but the problem here is that you can't combine the revenue of a series of games the years (three decades, in this case) precisely because of inflation, as you're not accounting for any of the production costs, interest and taxes, which makes all the numbers unreliable.

And again, this is not the point of this thread. The point is that FEH is losing revenue over the years, and if the trend continues, eventually they'll be at a loss.

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2 hours ago, Endriu said:

Let's say each copy will have sold for $60 on average then that's about $960mill total revenue. Might be more with dlc.

If you put that against $656million total revenue for just FEH then you realize they make quite good money here.

Of course I can't say anything about the development costs of games like 3h, radiant games or the 3ds games but I would assume a game like three houses might have cost more to develope. Would that be a fair assumption?

I really have no way of telling you whether Heroes is really cheaper to develop than a traditional game, especially not after Nintendo told us that mobile applications cost substantial amounts of money to develop in the same sentence as traditional games. If they simply left that information out, I think it would be reasonable to assume mobile games are indeed in fact cheaper, since information on an annual report should be material, meaning that that information is relevant and big enough to influence whether somebody will make financial decisions based on that information. Basically, if Nintendo said nothing about the cost of mobile games, it would be reasonable to assume that the cost of developing mobile game is immaterial, i.e. cheap, which a lot of us including me have been assuming until now.

From what I feel comfortable assuming, it MIGHT (and this is a huge might, because there is really no way to substantiate any claim) be safe to assume it is cheaper to develop compared to Awakening and Hyrule Warriors, but without more access to Nintendo's financial information, I cannot really say for certain whether Heroes is even cheaper to develop compared to Fates and Shadows of Valentia or even Fire Emblem Warriors and Three Houses. The reason I am somewhat comfortable assuming Heroes MIGHT be cheaper than Awakening is because Awakening is the first game on the system and (here is another huge assumption) they need to build a new engine from scratch which might cost a substantial portion of development, and I assume the same applies for Hyrule Warriors. I have no idea how much Fates and Shadows of Valentia costs because they seem to be sharing the same engine as Awakening, and I cannot really say how substantial the cost is for making new textures and art and writing a new story compared to making a new engine.

For Fire Emblem Warriors and Three Houses, it gets even muddier because I remember reading Three Houses having a huge amount of input from Koei Tecmo (and a Reddit user claims much of the credits was dominated by KT staff), so on top of assuming Warriors and Three Houses is recycling the engine from Warriors (which makes cost assumptions difficult), Koei Tecmo is also a completely different company and we are making further assumptions about how much it costs them to develop a Fire Emblem game compared to Intelligent Systems.

3 hours ago, Endriu said:

If you put that against $656million total revenue for just FEH then you realize they make quite good money here.

Yes, those revenue numbers are huge, but we are missing other crucial numbers: costs. For example it is safe to assume 30% of the revenue already goes straight into Google's pocket and Apple's pocket and not Nintendo's pocket. That alone knocks maximum potential profits down to $460 million. There are also foreign exchange transaction fees, while not huge, it is generally based on a percentage of the transaction; if there are a lot of those costs that are derived from a percentage of sales, then those costs combined could easily add up and take that large revenue number down another peg or two. Heroes was also jointly developed with DeNA, and I have no idea how that would cost Nintendo and Intelligent Systems as it may or may not include license fees for using another companies' code, how profit is shared, how the costs are split, etc., and that may or may not make it more costly to make compared to games that are largely developed inhouse like the 3DS main series games.

14 minutes ago, Jave said:

3) If you're going to bring up inflation, then please provide proper numbers to make your argument, because inflation is nowhere near as simple as "it increases the price". The earlier games were Japan-only so that brings in the problem of Japanese pricing and inflation to account for, and I don't think you've made any compelling arguments in your post.

5 minutes ago, SwordsDude said:

https://www.ign.com/articles/2016/10/04/comparing-the-price-of-every-game-console-with-inflation

Inflation for the nes games would mean 60$ times 2.5 150$ per game sale

snes sale was times 1.75 making it 100$ per game sale for the console games

Gamecube era wich is roughly gba era aswell was only 35% inflation so 55$ for the gba games and 80$ for console games.

You also have to keep in mind that Japan have an issue with deflation for quite a while now, and that each country have varying levels of inflation, so while most countries try to achieve a target of 2% inflation every year, inflation can vary wildly between countries, as some may be stuck with having 3% or 4% and those differences may compound and further complicate the value between different currencies.

Nintendo also noted in their annual reports that fluctuating exchange is one factor that can have a huge impact on financial performance. For example, if the Yen appreciates relative to other currencies, which it often does as many investors see it as a safe place to temporarily park their money, it would mean that Nintendo would be taking a pay cut when they exchange foreign currency back into Yen. For Intelligent System, this can be a huge blow as Fire Emblem Heroes might be their most stable source of income.

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2 hours ago, Jave said:

You can't use that as an average when at least seven games in the series retailed at $40 or less (since they were released on handheld systems).

A lower pricepoint of some games would just further prove my point. 

Edited by Endriu
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