To patch or not to patch? (Rebalance)

[Fraven Pooth]

So I'll need to play in English, of course, but the first time I tried to play FE6, I got annoyed with the shit accuracy on Hard Mode around chapter 7-8. So I'm wondering, for my first playthrough, would it be so heretic to apply a patch to rebalance hit rates a little?

If a patch exists that is pretty faithful to the original as far as gameplay with less frustrating hit rates that would be ideal. But if not, I suppose I can try to tough it out. I would rather not play on Normal Mode unless it's closer to Radiant Dawn's standard, since I'm pretty familiar with the series and I think I would lose interest even more easily.

TL;DR: I'm looking for a true first FE6 experience with nominally less frustration. Patch recommendations welcome.

[Benice]

I mean, changing the hit rates would be easy if you have Fe builder. You could just go into the items and change the hit rates up a bit. It is a bit of a pain to start using FEbuilder, but really, changing the hit rates is SUPER easy.

Other than that, I don't know of any patches. Sorry.

[Fraven Pooth]

26 minutes ago, Benice said:

I mean, changing the hit rates would be easy if you have Fe builder. You could just go into the items and change the hit rates up a bit. It is a bit of a pain to start using FEbuilder, but really, changing the hit rates is SUPER easy.

Other than that, I don't know of any patches. Sorry.

Maybe on principle, I'd rather not make a game easier on my own.. at least if someone else made the patch I feel like there was at least an attempt to balance things ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.

I know there are more than a few patches for FE6 (under Rebalances), I just didn't know if any were more recommended/faithful to the original.

[Benice]

If you want me to make one, feel free PM me about specifics and I can change it for you. Of course, I'm sure someone can recommend an already existing patch for you.

[Fraven Pooth]

1 minute ago, Benice said:

If you want me to make one, feel free PM me about specifics and I can change it for you. Of course, I'm sure someone can recommend an already existing patch for you.

Don't trouble yourself, there are plenty out there. I'm reading into the "Not Thracia" one now, since it seems like they were light on the changes. Thanks.

[Benice]

4 minutes ago, AyraXLex said:

Don't trouble yourself, there are plenty out there. I'm reading into the "Not Thracia" one now, since it seems like they were light on the changes. Thanks.

Well, I hope you find what you're looking for! Good luck, and I hope you hit gold.

Edited March 1, 2020 by Benice

[Saint Rubenio]

I think something pretty close to what you're looking for is the numbers patch. It was made by the same dude who translated the game (read, it's compatible with the good translation), and the main thing it does is change all the weapon stats to be like FE7's (in other words, FE6's oh-so-awful axes are fixed, in exchange for dark magic becoming horrible). It also adds a bunch of minor tweaks to character growths and bases that in most cases don't really make much of a difference, and some other, miscellaneous changes.

Unrelated, but I just stumbled into a post on that thread made by me, and... whoa, I was suggesting that Perceval, of all people, needed to have his growths improved. What even were you thinking, me from 2015?!

[eclipse]

Those of us that didn't patch dealt with the hit rate by learning how the RNG worked - or rather, how to make the RNG work for us.

[Saint Rubenio]

2 hours ago, eclipse said:

Those of us that didn't patch dealt with the hit rate by learning how the RNG worked - or rather, how to make the RNG work for us.

Really? What I learned was that the RNG hates me with a passion, and no matter what I do, it'll find a way to kill thirty characters. And that, despite this, I can still manage to love the game.

[eclipse]

1 minute ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Really? What I learned was that the RNG hates me with a passion, and no matter what I do, it'll find a way to kill thirty characters. And that, despite this, I can still manage to love the game.

I learned that if the RNG was going to be uncooperative, I was going to beat that thing into submission.  Thanks to emulation and save states, it's a lot less frustration (snapshot the point before all hell breaks loose, make your decision, and memorize what happens).  I fully blame the FE6 throne bonuses for this, as I can usually work around everything else.

[Saint Rubenio]

1 hour ago, eclipse said:

I learned that if the RNG was going to be uncooperative, I was going to beat that thing into submission. Thanks to emulation and save states, it's a lot less frustration (snapshot the point before all hell breaks loose, make your decision, and memorize what happens).

Ahhhh, I get it now... yeah, well you see, that's not how a badass like me plays. Badasses like me play normally and scream at the monitor if when everything goes awry. Because that's just more fun. And more badass.

...

...though I will admit, when an emulator has rewind, I cannot stop myself from using it to undo misclicks. I'll take failure most of the time, but failure because my finger twitched on the X key is just... no, thanks.

1 hour ago, eclipse said:

 I fully blame the FE6 throne bonuses for this, as I can usually work around everything else.

Hahahah... ah, yes, FE6's thrones. Never forget, just when you thought it was finally over, Legance was dead after a hundred turns, BOOM motherfriggin' Henning and his thousand avoid. I love FE6, but that is one thing I simply cannot defend.

At least there's a good stretch of gates after Henning... Kaga bless the gates. Gates are the best.

...oh wait, that's right, the one nosferatu druid boss is on a gate...

[AnonymousSpeed]

2 hours ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Ahhhh, I get it now... yeah, well you see, that's not how a badass like me plays. Badasses like me play normally and scream at the monitor if when everything goes awry. Because that's just more fun. And more badass.

...

...though I will admit, when an emulator has rewind, I cannot stop myself from using it to undo misclicks. I'll take failure most of the time, but failure because my finger twitched on the X key is just... no, thanks.

The manner in which a true champion plays. Using rewind for purposes that don't involve maximizing the quality of rescue chains does not, under any definition, count as beating the game.

EDIT: Oh right the question the guy who make the thread asked. I think FE6 is fine without patches, honestly.

Edited March 2, 2020 by AnonymousSpeed

[Zuda]

By changing the hit rate, of course you change the game. The hit rate in fe6 make the sword unit more important, because you need the accuracy, and unit with high skill and luck valuable.

In fe7 and fe8, sword is the worst weapon, because the hit rate is over kill, and axe user are so steong especially the berseker. Sword lock is the worst because the accuracy is not needed, and it 1 range only. In fe6, you really like them, during the early and mid game. And axe user is pretty bad.

Also, less accurate hit rate means more phase where all not go according to the initial plan, and you need to change your strategy because of that. So it require adaptation and you cant just play wth the same strat all the time, unlike other fe, like shadows dragon or fe12 where is really hard to avoid something. But it’s part of the game and the map where design with that in mind.

Of course you can change it withnightmare or gba fe builder, but you can also learn to adapt. FE6 can be beaten in iron man all the time, it’s not rng based.

 

[Fraven Pooth]

20 hours ago, Saint Rubenio said:

I think something pretty close to what you're looking for is the numbers patch. It was made by the same dude who translated the game (read, it's compatible with the good translation), and the main thing it does is change all the weapon stats to be like FE7's (in other words, FE6's oh-so-awful axes are fixed, in exchange for dark magic becoming horrible). It also adds a bunch of minor tweaks to character growths and bases that in most cases don't really make much of a difference, and some other, miscellaneous changes.

Unrelated, but I just stumbled into a post on that thread made by me, and... whoa, I was suggesting that Perceval, of all people, needed to have his growths improved. What even were you thinking, me from 2015?!

So if I do use a patch, that's probably the one that I will use. My question is, should I just play vanilla for the first time (i.e. will it hold my interest)?

 

9 hours ago, eclipse said:

I learned that if the RNG was going to be uncooperative, I was going to beat that thing into submission.  Thanks to emulation and save states, it's a lot less frustration (snapshot the point before all hell breaks loose, make your decision, and memorize what happens).  I fully blame the FE6 throne bonuses for this, as I can usually work around everything else.

That's what I always do in FE4, and have been doing in FE5. I guess I was going for style points when I installed FE6 and 7 as native virtual console software on my 3DS - what I didn't think of was that I can't use save states or fast forward that way . I would rather not feel like I actually had to resort to that regularly just to keep units from dying though, I've just used it to avoid headaches mostly.

 

1 hour ago, Zuda said:

By changing the hit rate, of course you change the game. The hit rate in fe6 make the sword unit more important, because you need the accuracy, and unit with high skill and luck valuable.

In fe7 and fe8, sword is the worst weapon, because the hit rate is over kill, and axe user are so steong especially the berseker. Sword lock is the worst because the accuracy is not needed, and it 1 range only. In fe6, you really like them, during the early and mid game. And axe user is pretty bad.

Also, less accurate hit rate means more phase where all not go according to the initial plan, and you need to change your strategy because of that. So it require adaptation and you cant just play wth the same strat all the time, unlike other fe, like shadows dragon or fe12 where is really hard to avoid something. But it’s part of the game and the map where design with that in mind.

Of course you can change it withnightmare or gba fe builder, but you can also learn to adapt. FE6 can be beaten in iron man all the time, it’s not rng based.

 

Ideally, I would just play the game the way it was meant to be played, but these aspects of FE6 were what killed off my attention span in the first place, and I'd rather not suffer through completing a game that I don't enjoy.

 

I guess I should have phrased it as "Is there any rebalance good enough to be worth playing instead of vanilla?" If it's like a get-over-the-hump situation, I can just play vanilla, but if its a big factor throughout the game, I don't see myself sticking with it. Not counting OG FE1-3, Thracia and Binding Blade are the only FE's I haven't completed. Best for last 🙄.

[Zuda]

Yeah’ but the main idea is that there’s many thing that take time to growth on you. And something you dislike the first time, you can enjoy it later... or not. When you use to hit things easily, and play according to it, it became a pain to have a lower hit rate. When you are used to doge tank everythink, it’s a pain when you harly have more than 50% chance to dodge. That’s why fe8, fe6 and fe11 are not the same game, with just different maps and character. But different playstyle that you can enjoy for different reason, or prefer one to another. You need to take the time to appreciate it or not. Can’t it shit is frustrating, when it seems for you rng, but good strat neglec this factor. It just that it could turn harderthan expected, but always manageable. And that’s why you ’ve got plenty of character, and good prepromote in this game.

Or you could hate it and want to change it according to your taste. But if you don’t know the game, how can you know that ? And how a guy can now what fit more to your taste ?

Me for example don’t like some aspect of fe6, fe7 and fe8 and planned to change it in some hack to enjoy a lot more. But it s because I know the vanilla game and what I could improve each specific fe gba game. It’s easy to add skill or increase hit rate of the weapon. You canalso remove all avoidance, and have a no rng game and completly change the game. But it would be a better game for you in a context of a fe6 design ? We and you can’t really know, because map designof fe6 have no the same philosophy than other gba fe. That’s why don’t take more time that 7 chapter to decide it seems to me pretty bad.

[CatManThree]

This is why I never play FE6 on hard mode.

A lot of people seam to think the issue lies entirely with the base weapon hit rates when in actuality its more than that. The other factor towards the game's bad hit rate is the ridiculous enemy balancing. From the enemies having a luck stat in a game where every point of luck adds a point to avoid to the really obvious stuff like Henning. Also, the fact you are playing on hard mode, which takes that poor enemy balancing and makes it much worse, explains your pain a bit more. Like, if not for the existence of hard mode bonuses, the difficulty would be unbearable.

[Saint Rubenio]

1 hour ago, AyraXLex said:

I guess I should have phrased it as "Is there any rebalance good enough to be worth playing instead of vanilla?" If it's like a get-over-the-hump situation, I can just play vanilla, but if its a big factor throughout the game, I don't see myself sticking with it. Not counting OG FE1-3, Thracia and Binding Blade are the only FE's I haven't completed. Best for last 🙄.

Personally, I would recommend sticking to vanilla. It has its problems, but it's a good game all the same.

That said, starting with hard mode is a bad idea. FE6 isn't like, say, FE8 or FE9, where "hard mode" just means "slightly less of a cakewalk". FE6's hard mode is, well, hard. Quite hard, in fact. It's one of the few games in the series that I would say you cannot just jump to the highest difficulty. Play normal mode, familiarize yourself with the game, and if you end up liking it enough, give hard mode a shot. But don't start there, you'll only end up hating the game if you do so.

So yeah, in summary, start over in normal mode. That's the best advice I can give you.

Edited March 2, 2020 by Saint Rubenio

[Zuda]

It’s depend of what you want in the game. If you want a cakewalk run, play normal. If you want a game, where you don’t have a overpowert u it who one round 5 ennemies per ennemy phase, play hard mode. Because it’s the specificity of fe6 compared to other gba fe. You fight strong and tough opponent, and need to team up in order to defeat only one guy. That means you need cheap damage, and a guy who have the possibility to crit and so 1 round a opponent sometimes is not useless, compared to fe7 and 8 where one round anennemyis easy, so it’s a full oriented ennemy phase oriented game.

That’s what s like in fe6, so i only play hard mode ironman. What i find pretty boring in fe6 is the difficulty  curve not linear at all, and some very boring map.

[Benice]

Honestly, I would just change the reinfocements to not be ambush spawns. Thus far, it's my only problem with it thus far. I'm sure someone's made a patch that gets rid of ambush spawns. If there's one that rebalances weapons and gets rid of ambushes, it'd be ideal for you, I guess.

[Fraven Pooth]

2 hours ago, Benice said:

Honestly, I would just change the reinfocements to not be ambush spawns. Thus far, it's my only problem with it thus far. I'm sure someone's made a patch that gets rid of ambush spawns. If there's one that rebalances weapons and gets rid of ambushes, it'd be ideal for you, I guess.

Meh, I've dealt with ambush spawns before, if I have save States I can handle them. I'll just stick with normal mode for my first playthrough. Thanks everyone for your help.

[Hello72207]

On 3/2/2020 at 12:48 PM, Benice said:

Honestly, I would just change the reinfocements to not be ambush spawns. Thus far, it's my only problem with it thus far. I'm sure someone's made a patch that gets rid of ambush spawns. If there's one that rebalances weapons and gets rid of ambushes, it'd be ideal for you, I guess.

Ambush spawns are not that bad in this game. You want bad ambush spawns? Go play FE1 my boy.

[Benice]

1 hour ago, Hello72207 said:

Ambush spawns are not that bad in this game. You want bad ambush spawns? Go play FE1 my boy.

The chapter 6 stairs pranked me hard when I covered them with Clarine but they still spawned the enemies and almost killed her. That was my main problem. And the timee when I covered the spot where the armor knight as supposed to spawn, so it clipped through the side wall and killed Clarine.