Shaping My Very First ROM

[Xylaugheon Daily]

Wow, ok. I'm doing it. I'm going to tackle hacking. As a dive into the endless sources for learning the ins and outs, I want to be working on the plot. I am, first and foremost, a storyteller. Honestly, it's silly how little I know about any of this considering I was that kid in the mid 90s who was learning to dapple with C++ and MSDos. Right, so! I've got two very different ideas I'm going to outline before asking which I should go with, as well as asking for advice on what you'd personally like to see.

Idea 1

Gorlan, a powerful nation, has spent many years battling the might of Miv. But for the last few years, things have calmed, and agreements reaching, leading to the king of Gorlan to invite the king and queen of Miv to sign a treaty and celebrate this new era for both nations. But this is a ploy, and Gorlan murders the royalty of Miv before launching a campaign to take control of the territory. A group known as Atlas takes this chance of a thinned Gorlan authoritative presence to start a coup to overthrow the Gorlan power.

You will begin this tale as the sole heir to Gorlan. Being a descendant of Etyl of the Madness, you want to be a good and empathetic ruler, unlike the many before you, However, you have dreams and urges to commit unspeakable horrors. You wrestle with these demon's throughout the story. You will be working with Samuel, an elder dragon, who is looking to liberate the enslaved dragons that are used as the power source for all the greatest nations. A rival group you both splintered from, is run by Mother, another elder dragon who wants to also free the dragons, but then enslave humanity afterward, You will have an uneasy and difficult relationship with this group, but ultimately Mother still see's you as her child and Samuel as a brother.

I would like to incorporate a system where you select two part members before a battle for recon. Depending on who you send and what level the are will give you different results. You could be disadvantaged, with an example of having those characters undeployable and jailed in the map, advantaged, which would work similarly to Hannah the Fortune Teller in Blazing Blade, or blessed, which would have a significant change in the map, such as less enemies for some kind of gimmick to exploit. I'm assuming this would be very hard to script, so I'm not holding my breath, but I still like the idea.

I've also considered kind of a FFIV mechanic, where you use units until a certain point where they're store kind of ends, and then the protagonist gets a new batch of characters for this next plot. I haven't given it much thought beyond that, so opinions on this particular mechanic would be quite helpful.

I would love it if you all could help me come up with one more, big global conflict. Also, do you think the plot with the factions and dragons is rather bad? I originally liked the idea, but after toying with it for as long as I have, it feels campy to me. However, if it sees enough praise, I'll push forward with it. Yes, please, anything you'd personally like to see, any suggestions at all, share!

Idea 2

This one is, so far, much more of a character study. I currently have no idea for what type of world or plot I want this to have, but I am currently toying around with the idea of doing something vaguely resembling Made in Abyss. The big idea is to keep the stakes rather small in an effort to tell deeper, more personal stories of each character. The two I've mapped out thus far are as follows.

Ark is the main protagonist. While he is a powerful man, he is plagued by lots of mental issues, with hallucinations being particularly hard for him to deal with. This shows up in gameplay as, on certain maps, Ark will start to see enemies. They will only target Ark. Allies cannot interact with them, but can also pass through them. This sounds like a fun gimmick to keep maps fresh. I may look into applying each characters weaknesses into different maps, even.

Dahlia is a woman who suffers PTSD from her to as a slave dancer. This has made er chase away her woes with booze, being deflective and jovial when pressed to confront her past. I was kind of thinking of taking Silvia (Genealogy,) Syrenne (Last Story,) and Primrose (Octopath.) I'm not exactly sure how I plan on fleshing out her past with gameplsy, if I do at all, but I do know that at one point she will promote to the dancer class.

Again, any thoughts and suggestions are not just welcomed, but appreciated! I look forward to getting deep into learning what I need to know.

Edited March 13, 2020 by Xylaugheon Daily

[Crimson Mors]

Hey~ I can relate to dabbling in programming -- I've actually decided to pursue a career in it. I'll be getting my Game Dev degree next year. Not that I know what I'm talking about or anything. I have no practical experience so don't take me seriously just yet XD I'd always wanted to hack and decided to actually try doing it seriously pretty recently.

 

3 hours ago, Xylaugheon Daily said:

Idea 1

Gorlan, a powerful nation, has spent many years battling the might of Miv. But for the last few years, things have calmed, and agreements reaching, leading to the king of Gorlan to invite the king and queen of Miv to sign a treaty and celebrate this new era for both nations. But this is a ploy, and Gorlan murders the royalty of Miv before launching a campaign to take control of the territory. A group known as Atlas takes this chance of a thinned Gorlan authoritative presence to start a coup to overthrow the Gorlan power.

You will begin this tale as the sole heir to Gorlan. Being a descendant of Etyl of the Madness, you want to be a good and empathetic ruler, unlike the many before you, However, you have dreams and urges to commit unspeakable horrors. You wrestle with these demon's throughout the story. You will be working with Samuel, an elder dragon, who is looking to liberate the enslaved dragons that are used as the power source for all the greatest nations. A rival group you both splintered from, is run by Mother, another elder dragon who wants to also free the dragons, but then enslave humanity afterward, You will have an uneasy and difficult relationship with this group, but ultimately Mother still see's you as her child and Samuel as a brother.

I like the premise. You're not actually playing a nation so to speak, you're more of a rebellion army. It reminds me of Thracia 776 with Leif's crew. It's pretty similar to how actual revolts work. I could site the rebel forces in France during WWII -- there were many different factions trying to liberate France but they all had different ideas of how to go about it and what the government should be. Your splintered rebel faction is akin to this, perhaps by design? The reason for there being a splinter in the revolt is also solid, it is a moral question. Everyone being equal or replacing the top dog with someone else. 

3 hours ago, Xylaugheon Daily said:

I've also considered kind of a FFIV mechanic, where you use units until a certain point where they're store kind of ends, and then the protagonist gets a new batch of characters for this next plot. I haven't given it much thought beyond that, so opinions on this particular mechanic would be quite helpful.

I do agree that recon would be amazing as a concept but I haven't the slightest idea of how to do something like that in a romhack. This also has Thracia vibes in that it wants to make all units important to the war effort. Leif's units were important because of fatigue. Your units would be important for side objectives like scouting. I like it. Again, no idea how to implement.

3 hours ago, Xylaugheon Daily said:

I would love it if you all could help me come up with one more, big global conflict. Also, do you think the plot with the factions and dragons is rather bad? I originally liked the idea, but after toying with it for as long as I have, it feels campy to me. However, if it sees enough praise, I'll push forward with it. Yes, please, anything you'd personally like to see, any suggestions at all, share!

As stated above, the idea of factionalism in a rebellion is a real world thing. You could use anything as a premise for a revolt so if you don't like your enslaved dragon idea you could try for something else. If your protagonist is literally the sole heir to the throne and he believes his (father, uncle, cousin, etc.) is an evil ruler then that is justification enough for a rebellion. However that is more of a military coup, rather than a civilian coup which is what I'm getting the vibe of with your description. The revolt would most likely be a ragtag group of citizen soldiers rather than a segment of the army loyal to the heir. 

As far as a much larger global conflict, the other faction could gain momentum in a country outside of Gorlan. Dragon enslavement is continent wide afterall; they don't have to operate solely in Gorlan. Image this:

Mother and her faction manage to successfully stage an uprising, free their dragon brethren and seize control of, if not the whole country, a sizeable portion of a country and declare a free dragon state. This state then goes to war with the entire continent because viva la revolution and so waves of dragons sweep across the land liberating camps in a domino effect. Protagonist just won control of his throne at the palace of Gorlan and is recognized as the true king; the old king is either still on war campaign or died somewhere or you fought him; up to you narratively. This puts Samuel in a predicament. He could either stay by the protagonist's side and fight his own people to keep humans free from slavery. Or he could stand down and refuse to fight since his people are now free in Gorlan which was his goal for being with you (I assume). If I am correct in assuming Samuel was the Jagen of your game, the player is now in a very difficult position and the threat feels more significant. Boom Global Conflict.
He can be the very best king he always wanted to be by going to the aid of his neighbors; but also staying true to his word to Samuel by liberating dragons as he goes as well. Some of them may even refuse to fight on Mother's side. Eventually that group of dragons you saved could join you in the final fight with Samuel at the helm having found the resolve to fight his kin. 

Anyway~ On to Idea 2

3 hours ago, Xylaugheon Daily said:

Idea 2

This one is, so far, much more of a character study. I currently have no idea for what type of world or plot I want this to have, but I am currently toying around with the idea of doing something vaguely resembling Made in Abyss. The big idea is to keep the stakes rather small in an effort to tell deeper, more personal stories of each character. The two I've mapped out thus far are as follows.

Ark is the main protagonist. While he is a powerful man, he is plagued by lots of mental issues, with hallucinations being particularly hard for him to deal with. This shows up in gameplay as, on certain maps, Ark will start to see enemies. They will only target Ark. Allies cannot interact with them, but can also pass through them. This sounds like a fun gimmick to keep maps fresh. I may look into applying each characters weaknesses into different maps, even.

Dahlia is a woman who suffers PTSD from her to as a slave dancer. This has made er chase away her woes with booze, being deflective and jovial when pressed to confront her past. I was kind of thinking of taking Silvia (Genealogy,) Syrenne (Last Story,) and Primrose (Octopath.) I'm not exactly sure how I plan on fleshing out her past with gameplsy, if I do at all, but I do know that at one point she will promote to the dancer class.

Again, any thoughts and suggestions are not just welcomed, but appreciated! I look forward to getting deep into learning what I need to know.

I see a theme of protagonists struggling with mental conditions; first a demonic curse and now hallucinations and PTSD. I think that is pretty cool actually. We have way too many heroes that are pristine mentally even after everything is said and done. The hallucinations gimmick feels difficult to implement in FE systems but could be interesting. I assume they would do damage to Ark otherwise they're more annoying than a hazard. Or you could have a mental gauge for him to see how close to breaking he is. Defeating the apparitions could reduce the gauge but each time he's attacked by one it goes up. Again, similar to Fatigue, but not.

Perhaps Dahlia was a dancer prior to her enslavement, but after such treatment she lost any taste for it. PTSD and all that. To have her overcome it would require a storyarc, but you seem very keen on those so dive right into it. Maybe it includes family or an old instructor she thought was killed. It depends on the manner of her enslavement. Was she doing a dancing gig for a venue and some sleeze ball kidnapped her? Was her whole town raided and the woman all taken? 
If I were to assume that an entire town was raided then it seems plausible that some family or a mentor were also taken and enslaved. Dahlia might assume not everyone survived and in addition to how she herself was treated but also the belief she is alone in the world -- it would definitely lead to the drinking problem you're describing. Finding leads on these missing people of importance and having them help her get over the drinking little by little and eventually her old instructor is found/rescued and she finds the will to dance again if it means putting and end to evil people? 

[Xylaugheon Daily]

5 hours ago, Crimson Mors said:

Hey~ I can relate to dabbling in programming -- I've actually decided to pursue a career in it. I'll be getting my Game Dev degree next year. Not that I know what I'm talking about or anything. I have no practical experience so don't take me seriously just yet XD I'd always wanted to hack and decided to actually try doing it seriously pretty recently.

 

I like the premise. You're not actually playing a nation so to speak, you're more of a rebellion army. It reminds me of Thracia 776 with Leif's crew. It's pretty similar to how actual revolts work. I could site the rebel forces in France during WWII -- there were many different factions trying to liberate France but they all had different ideas of how to go about it and what the government should be. Your splintered rebel faction is akin to this, perhaps by design? The reason for there being a splinter in the revolt is also solid, it is a moral question. Everyone being equal or replacing the top dog with someone else. 

I do agree that recon would be amazing as a concept but I haven't the slightest idea of how to do something like that in a romhack. This also has Thracia vibes in that it wants to make all units important to the war effort. Leif's units were important because of fatigue. Your units would be important for side objectives like scouting. I like it. Again, no idea how to implement.

As stated above, the idea of factionalism in a rebellion is a real world thing. You could use anything as a premise for a revolt so if you don't like your enslaved dragon idea you could try for something else. If your protagonist is literally the sole heir to the throne and he believes his (father, uncle, cousin, etc.) is an evil ruler then that is justification enough for a rebellion. However that is more of a military coup, rather than a civilian coup which is what I'm getting the vibe of with your description. The revolt would most likely be a ragtag group of citizen soldiers rather than a segment of the army loyal to the heir.

Big oof. First, let me apologize for the improper grammar. I had been fighting off sleep while enjoying some wine. I am not a fan of how I worded most of what I said, but it's out there now, so I'm not going to worry about it. Honestly, there is a lot I didn't properly convey for spoilers sake, but considering this is still such an early development, I likely shouldn't worry too much on that front. So, you'd only play the prince for the first two chapters. I would start to develop this character, a prince from a tyrannical lineage, wanting to be a great ruler but afraid of what he might become, only to have him die at the end of the second map. His killer is actually the real protagonist. He kills the prince and frames Miv (fyi totally not the names of these locations, I just random hit the keyboard rather than using Nation X and Nation Y.) This real protag does this to start the war between the two nations, to weaken Gorlan so that his rebels can launch the coup. That said, he did this all on his own, without any other members knowing about the assassination, something they'd all be against, as the plan was to eventually put the prince on the throne. But this group, he is not their leader, and he is not on their side necessarily. Gorlan is a very rough place to live, with lots of inequality. That what Atlas is trying to fight against. It is not common knowledge that dragons power the nation. And this protagonist, we'll call him Joey (because why not) is working with Samuel (totally keeping Samuel) to free the dragons.

The backstory for Joey isn't fully fleshed out yet, but I've currently working with the idea that he was abused as a child. Like, so really messed up stuff. Gotta give him a reason to side with dragons, right? But he's on borrowed time. He's connect to Samuel (btw, not a Jagen, isn't even playable) sharing his life force, killing them both slowly. Joey joined up with Mother and her lot before the games start, but after they were attacked, killing the bulk of their forces, Mother decided that humans were to be enslaved, much how they're treating dragons now, where Samuel wants peaceful resolve, just separating the races. There's going to be a lot of at odds between the two groups, but they aren't really friend or foe. I guess, family you've grown distant from due to political differences (something I can definitely relate to.)

The thought behind adding another conflict is to add more depth to the idea of connecting all these events together in order to achieve the goal of freeing the dragons. It would allow for another opportunity to have another party switch, so it would serve gameplay as well. Which, I'm not sure I conveyed that part properly. I was thinking it would be like, while doing the coup, you've got this cast of characters, but after Chapter X you are now working with brand new characters for a different reason, and so you no longer will have previously used characters, with the Joey being the only reoccurring. I also thought that maybe reaching a certain support level before a particular moment means that you could bring that one character with you for the rest of the game.

I've not yet decided on a climax. Because you'll be on a different side than Mother, I could use her as a finale, or maybe the dragons they free? I'm not sure where I want to take this, ya know? With this additional information, what do you think?

6 hours ago, Crimson Mors said:

Anyway~ On to Idea 2

I see a theme of protagonists struggling with mental conditions; first a demonic curse and now hallucinations and PTSD. I think that is pretty cool actually. We have way too many heroes that are pristine mentally even after everything is said and done. The hallucinations gimmick feels difficult to implement in FE systems but could be interesting. I assume they would do damage to Ark otherwise they're more annoying than a hazard. Or you could have a mental gauge for him to see how close to breaking he is. Defeating the apparitions could reduce the gauge but each time he's attacked by one it goes up. Again, similar to Fatigue, but not.

Perhaps Dahlia was a dancer prior to her enslavement, but after such treatment she lost any taste for it. PTSD and all that. To have her overcome it would require a storyarc, but you seem very keen on those so dive right into it. Maybe it includes family or an old instructor she thought was killed. It depends on the manner of her enslavement. Was she doing a dancing gig for a venue and some sleeze ball kidnapped her? Was her whole town raided and the woman all taken? 
If I were to assume that an entire town was raided then it seems plausible that some family or a mentor were also taken and enslaved. Dahlia might assume not everyone survived and in addition to how she herself was treated but also the belief she is alone in the world -- it would definitely lead to the drinking problem you're describing. Finding leads on these missing people of importance and having them help her get over the drinking little by little and eventually her old instructor is found/rescued and she finds the will to dance again if it means putting and end to evil people? 

Yes, I'm not really a fan of the typical lords we see in the series. I want my characters to have depth stemming from their hardships and imperfections. Because I know nothing about the scripting necessary, I can't begin to say how obtainable the idea is. That said, my think, I believe, was that you could mark these illusions as friendly units for all members save for Ark, who they are labeled as being an enemy. And yes, they would be able to harm him. The idea of having him being the only one who can attack them is to add more strategic positioning on maps. Do you wall him in with other units, or do you have him kite them as obstacles for the enemy (albeit, they'd only serve as occupied tiles, but still.)

I actually really enjoy your take on Dahlia's arc. I wasn't exactly sure how I wanted to approach it and was focusing far too hard on making a compelling narrative, that I had forgotten even the simplest of stories can be compelling when told properly. If I choose to pursue this story instead of the first one, I'll go this route with her. That said, I feel like the first idea is just so much more fleshed out that it is far more appealing. What do you think, between the two?

[Crimson Mors]

7 hours ago, Xylaugheon Daily said:

Big oof. First, let me apologize for the improper grammar. I had been fighting off sleep while enjoying some wine. I am not a fan of how I worded most of what I said, but it's out there now, so I'm not going to worry about it. Honestly, there is a lot I didn't properly convey for spoilers sake, but considering this is still such an early development, I likely shouldn't worry too much on that front. So, you'd only play the prince for the first two chapters. I would start to develop this character, a prince from a tyrannical lineage, wanting to be a great ruler but afraid of what he might become, only to have him die at the end of the second map. His killer is actually the real protagonist. He kills the prince and frames Miv (fyi totally not the names of these locations, I just random hit the keyboard rather than using Nation X and Nation Y.) This real protag does this to start the war between the two nations, to weaken Gorlan so that his rebels can launch the coup. That said, he did this all on his own, without any other members knowing about the assassination, something they'd all be against, as the plan was to eventually put the prince on the throne. But this group, he is not their leader, and he is not on their side necessarily. Gorlan is a very rough place to live, with lots of inequality. That what Atlas is trying to fight against. It is not common knowledge that dragons power the nation. And this protagonist, we'll call him Joey (because why not) is working with Samuel (totally keeping Samuel) to free the dragons.

The backstory for Joey isn't fully fleshed out yet, but I've currently working with the idea that he was abused as a child. Like, so really messed up stuff. Gotta give him a reason to side with dragons, right? But he's on borrowed time. He's connect to Samuel (btw, not a Jagen, isn't even playable) sharing his life force, killing them both slowly. Joey joined up with Mother and her lot before the games start, but after they were attacked, killing the bulk of their forces, Mother decided that humans were to be enslaved, much how they're treating dragons now, where Samuel wants peaceful resolve, just separating the races. There's going to be a lot of at odds between the two groups, but they aren't really friend or foe. I guess, family you've grown distant from due to political differences (something I can definitely relate to.)

The thought behind adding another conflict is to add more depth to the idea of connecting all these events together in order to achieve the goal of freeing the dragons. It would allow for another opportunity to have another party switch, so it would serve gameplay as well. Which, I'm not sure I conveyed that part properly. I was thinking it would be like, while doing the coup, you've got this cast of characters, but after Chapter X you are now working with brand new characters for a different reason, and so you no longer will have previously used characters, with the Joey being the only reoccurring. I also thought that maybe reaching a certain support level before a particular moment means that you could bring that one character with you for the rest of the game.

I've not yet decided on a climax. Because you'll be on a different side than Mother, I could use her as a finale, or maybe the dragons they free? I'm not sure where I want to take this, ya know? With this additional information, what do you think?

Okay I think I get the idea you were going for now a bit better. Just to confirm before I start throwing nonsense around again:
The heir to Gorlan exists for the purposes of prologue and narrative essentially. He is slew by the real protagonist Joey. Am I correct in assuming they are both a part of the same rebel organization, or did I misread that? No one knows who killed the heir, and Joey uses the death as justification for war between Gorlan and Miv -- a tactical ploy to lure Gorlan's armies away and weaken them internally. So my take on Joey is that he's devious and will attempt to attain his goal by any means necessary. I am unclear on what he hopes to achieve through the rebellion if it wasn't to put the heir on the throne like everyone else. War for war's sake? Knowledge of a greater threat leading to the global conflict? 

Split story as per Geneology is a cool concept. What timescale are you looking at? A full generation like Geneology, or a few years as per Three Houses. Maybe even a couple weeks. It is likely that given a smaller time scale that the protagonist will run into old allies along the way, potentially as enemies, if their goals don't align. I like the idea of bringing units along based on their support rating -- I do believe there is a way to code for that in FEBuilderGBA but I can't say for sure. 

The question then becomes, do you want the rebel factions to be in full swing when you flip to a new theater of storytelling, or do you want them to have resolved. I personally like the idea of having them left on a cliff hanger -- since Joey isn't invested per say in what the others are fighting for. Those story threads can wrap up as the second arc progresses and have a larger impact on that arc. I will think of a potential global conflict going forward, but I just wanted to confirm I understood your vision here.

7 hours ago, Xylaugheon Daily said:

Yes, I'm not really a fan of the typical lords we see in the series. I want my characters to have depth stemming from their hardships and imperfections. Because I know nothing about the scripting necessary, I can't begin to say how obtainable the idea is. That said, my think, I believe, was that you could mark these illusions as friendly units for all members save for Ark, who they are labeled as being an enemy. And yes, they would be able to harm him. The idea of having him being the only one who can attack them is to add more strategic positioning on maps. Do you wall him in with other units, or do you have him kite them as obstacles for the enemy (albeit, they'd only serve as occupied tiles, but still.)

I actually really enjoy your take on Dahlia's arc. I wasn't exactly sure how I wanted to approach it and was focusing far too hard on making a compelling narrative, that I had forgotten even the simplest of stories can be compelling when told properly. If I choose to pursue this story instead of the first one, I'll go this route with her. That said, I feel like the first idea is just so much more fleshed out that it is far more appealing. What do you think, between the two?

 You could just use both characters. Dahlia could be a secret promotion path within the game dependent on visiting villages or something. SImilar to how certain characters visiting villages in Geneology would net certain bonuses. You did say you would base her somewhat on Silvia, who has the lady sword locked behind a village visit if I'm not mistaken. If you want Ark's story to be front and center, Dahlia's could be hidden in the background of the world, not unlike her mysterious past she hides behind a bottle of booze. Ark is the bottle of booze in this analogy I guess, but you know what I'm saying. 

I think it should be *possible* to do what you want for Ark's hallucinations. I just don't know how difficult. If you make them Green Units I don't think you can program them for just a single blue unit to do damage to them -- or for red units to not do damage to them. It is difficult for me to give an opinion on this, as you said it is more of a character study. I'd like to know more about the world and motivations if you come up with them as we're talking.

[Xylaugheon Daily]

56 minutes ago, Crimson Mors said:

Okay I think I get the idea you were going for now a bit better. Just to confirm before I start throwing nonsense around again:
The heir to Gorlan exists for the purposes of prologue and narrative essentially. He is slew by the real protagonist Joey. Am I correct in assuming they are both a part of the same rebel organization, or did I misread that? No one knows who killed the heir, and Joey uses the death as justification for war between Gorlan and Miv -- a tactical ploy to lure Gorlan's armies away and weaken them internally. So my take on Joey is that he's devious and will attempt to attain his goal by any means necessary. I am unclear on what he hopes to achieve through the rebellion if it wasn't to put the heir on the throne like everyone else. War for war's sake? Knowledge of a greater threat leading to the global conflict? 

Split story as per Geneology is a cool concept. What timescale are you looking at? A full generation like Geneology, or a few years as per Three Houses. Maybe even a couple weeks. It is likely that given a smaller time scale that the protagonist will run into old allies along the way, potentially as enemies, if their goals don't align. I like the idea of bringing units along based on their support rating -- I do believe there is a way to code for that in FEBuilderGBA but I can't say for sure. 

The question then becomes, do you want the rebel factions to be in full swing when you flip to a new theater of storytelling, or do you want them to have resolved. I personally like the idea of having them left on a cliff hanger -- since Joey isn't invested per say in what the others are fighting for. Those story threads can wrap up as the second arc progresses and have a larger impact on that arc. I will think of a potential global conflict going forward, but I just wanted to confirm I understood your vision here.

You've got most of that correct. The heir was not part of the rebellion. His purpose is to serve the tutorial, and as a piece of Joey's characterization, which you nailed. I also like subverting expectations, so if I really sell him, no one will expect his death, or that the killer is the main protagonist.

In killing the prince, he also frames Miv, which prompts the war, weakening their defenses. The current idea is that Gorlan is the nation secretly using enslaved dragons to fuel their technology and lifestyle, which is why he'd want the war. On the skip, it would be rather immediate, so it's more like just a change of perspective before meeting the new characters. My vague idea atm is to say he's a spy for Nation Z, just so he has some ties from the get go and a footing for plot.

I actually intended the rebellion to resolve with them losing, some bloody battle, but I'd want it to occur some time into the second campaign, after you've left. Maybe there's a reason to go in, and he comes across Atlas members being slain, so you can have the option to save them or not. Still really don't know.

56 minutes ago, Crimson Mors said:

You could just use both characters. Dahlia could be a secret promotion path within the game dependent on visiting villages or something. SImilar to how certain characters visiting villages in Geneology would net certain bonuses. You did say you would base her somewhat on Silvia, who has the lady sword locked behind a village visit if I'm not mistaken. If you want Ark's story to be front and center, Dahlia's could be hidden in the background of the world, not unlike her mysterious past she hides behind a bottle of booze. Ark is the bottle of booze in this analogy I guess, but you know what I'm saying. 

I think it should be *possible* to do what you want for Ark's hallucinations. I just don't know how difficult. If you make them Green Units I don't think you can program them for just a single blue unit to do damage to them -- or for red units to not do damage to them. It is difficult for me to give an opinion on this, as you said it is more of a character study. I'd like to know more about the world and motivations if you come up with them as we're talking.

So, i wanted to use my world for an old D&D campaign I never ran. It is largely based on Made in Abyss, an anime that definitely should have been a video game. Anyway, you'd essentially just have this massive hole in the center of this world. And the motivations would be as decided further in development, but the big thing is getting to the bottom. Looking at an image from Made in Abyss would do wonders for better explaining this, but I'm currently too busy to grab one. So sorry!

The reason I like this approach is it allows each character to be developed as part of the 'main scenario.' It'd allow for a very different feel, which is a big part of my motivation for writing it. On that front, it's likely that I end up hiring individuals to do the really complex scripting I need.

What waits at the bottom, you ask? That's a secret!

Edited March 14, 2020 by Xylaugheon Daily

[Crimson Mors]

6 minutes ago, Xylaugheon Daily said:

You've got most of that correct. The heir was not part of the rebellion. His purpose is to serve the tutorial, and as a piece of Joey's characterization, which you nailed. I also like subverting expectations, so if I really sell him, no one will expect his death, or that the killer is the main protagonist.

In killing the prince, he also frames Miv, which prompts the war, weakening their defenses. The current idea is that Gorlan is the nation secretly using enslaved dragons to fuel their technology and lifestyle, which is why he'd want the war. On the skip, it would be rather immediate, so it's more like just a change of perspective before meeting the new characters. My vague idea atm is to say he's a spy for Nation Z, just so he has some ties from the get go and a footing for plot.

I actually intended the rebellion to resolve with them losing, some bloody battle, but I'd want it to occur some time into the second campaign, after you've left. Maybe there's a reason to go in, and he comes across Atlas members being slain, so you can have the option to save them or not. Still really don't know.

So, the heir is unaffiliated with the rebellion; the goal of the rebellion is to put him on the throne though. Joey uses the rebel faction to get close enough to assassinate the heir prompting the war between Gorlan and Miv. Is it just Gorlan that has enslaved dragons, then? That would probably create a tech divide with their neighbors and lead to tension so that fits the narrative.

So the narrative threads I'm gathering thus far:

Pertaining to Dragons:
Dragons are an oppressed species in either the world or just Gorlan specifically, and this oppression (the use of dragons as a power source) grants insights in technology to Gorlan.
Mother (a dragon) is the head of a rebel organization that wants to free dragons and put chains on humans instead.
Samuel (also a dragon) splinters the organization over the question of whether enslaving the humans is correct
Both of these factions make up the larger group known as Atlas (or is it just one faction specifically) - the goal of which is to fight against an unequal society

Pertaining to Nations:
Gorlan is a nation that is gaining a technological edge over its neighbors by using dragons
The dynasty of Gorlan is descended by Etyl  of the Madness, which places a madness on its royal family leading to them taking dark actions
Nation Z has a spy named Joey in Gorlan.

Pertaining to Characters:
Joey -- Has had a rough life to the point of wanting to side with dragons over his own kin. He's a spy sent to Gorlan by Nation Z.
Samuel -- Has a life link with Joey which is slowly sapping both of them of their life force. Leads(?) a portion of Atlas which wants to put Gorlan's heir on the throne over the current king in hopes of a better society.
Mother -- Was radicalized by a ruthless attack on Atlas. Leads a portion of Atlas that would see humans enslaved in place of dragons. 

 

My Questions:
Pertaining to Nation Z and Joey:

What was the nature of Joey's orders?
Infiltration? Gather information on a target.
Insurrection? Sow unrest within a target.
Assassination? Remove a powerful target.

The nature of Joey's orders from Nation Z shape why he is in Gorlan. How much freedom he has with interpreting his orders, too, changes the nature of Joey's character. Or if he even intends to fulfill those orders.

What was Joey's target?
Atlas? Was he intended to infiltrate and feed information on Atlas back to Nation Z.
War? Was his intended mission to instigate the war between Gorlan and Miv.
The Heir? Was the removal of the heir his mission.

Is Joey affiliated with Atlas of his own accord or via interpretation of his orders?
Joey's views align with those of the dragons due to personal trauma. Is he with Atlas because of his orders -- or as a means to fulfill his orders -- or as a side objective he's assigned to himself of his own accord? Because of his orders, or in spite of his orders?

If his mission was insurrection or assassination:
Is Nation Z actively trying to help dragons by using Joey thus aligning their nation with the interests of dragonkind and by proxy Joey as well?
Is Nation Z actively trying to weaken Gorlan for a different purpose, thus creating a divide in their interests and Joey's?
Why does Naton Z want Gorlan and Miv to be at war?

There is a lot of flexibility with this topic and could lead to several different kinds of stories. I dont expect answers to all of these, it's really just something to think about as you storyboard. I like the idea of insurrection with war being the goal and Joey interpreting his orders in his own way leading to an assassination. I think that would fit the narrative as you have presented it, but that doesn't mean you have to limit yourself.

You're trying to think of a bigger conflict that would justify the change of perspective, yeah? Well Nation Z's motivations are a pretty good place to start when looking forward. Especially the final question: Why does Nation Z want Gorlan and Miv to be at war (if not for the express purpose of helping dragons). 

I really enjoy storyboarding. I can keep bouncing ideas back and forth with you unless you find it tiresome XD