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I really don’t like the term “Mary Sue”


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On 12/19/2020 at 2:49 PM, OutcastsofRelix said:

I like the term because it really lets authors know their characters are too overpowered.(Bloom from Winx but it just gets worse with her so idk)

Sarcasm incoming: The often hailed modern archetype of all Mary Sues, Bella Swan from Twilight, is clearly way too overpowered. The author should've wrote even more scenes in which the talentless Bella was helpless, useless, and needed to be saved by her much powerful/useful lover Edward, instead of all the times in which the talentless Bella was always helpless, useless, and needed to be saved by her much more powerful/useful lover Edward.

If only that term clearly only meant one thing, a thread like this and in similar threads in the past would've never existed in the first place. But factually, no, it isn't actually helpful in figuring out whatever the criticism is supposed to be (assuming it's not just being tossed out as to be nothing but a derogatory term, because it is quiet often, particular towards female characters while completely ignoring male characters who would fit the definition with ease but then they would attempt to justify why the male doesn't fit the trope because X reason, all while not giving the female character the same leeway they are giving to the male character, so they can keep on claiming because 'she's too perfect and powerful').

The term is worthless as a term for critiquing (a.k.a, constructive criticism).

The term isn't useful, because many people defines the term on only superficial (a.k.a, surface level) aspects of the specific character, while others view the term closer to the original definition in which it's more about the extremely massively large dissonance between the character's treatment by the creator(s) compared to the treatment that seems 'reasonable' within the established in-universe setting, other characters' traits/personalities, and the story's plot & tone that the creator(s) makes outside of the character. NOTE: There are other definitions but I just don't want to write them all. 

I'm not here arguing what the term actually means. I'm just stating that it's useless because there is a wide array of what its definition could be that doesn't really correlate with one another. The fact that one person can say, Mary Sue and think it means 'the character is too overpowered and too perfect', while another person can look at the word Mary Sue and disagree because they think the term is saying "that story is giving the character way too much importance when the character isn't showing a reason to be this important in this specific storyline"

Lastly, Micaiah and how it was misused and labelled on her. She was not the first, and she will not be the last fictional female character to have this term be used to 'criticize' her while not actually providing anything useful on why she's a poorly written character.

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  • 1 month later...
On 12/19/2020 at 9:49 PM, OutcastsofRelix said:

I like the term because it really lets authors know their characters are too overpowered.(Bloom from Winx but it just gets worse with her so idk)

that's not really how it's going to play out, most of the time. Especially with writers of any greater franchise; they're not going to give a damn about it, simply because they don't have to. It's usually just a term for people discussing writing, detached from the author

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  • 8 months later...

agreed.  while some characters are definitely "mary sues" I think the term has lost a lot of its original meaning due to overuse.  there are some characters who are often labeled as such despite not being one in the slightest (anyone who thinks tohru honda from fruits basket is a "mary sue" (which seems to be quite a popular opinion) probably hasn't watched more than the first 2 episodes)

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