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Let's come up with ideas for Fallen Heroes banners and Redeemed Heroes banners (SPOILERS FOR THE ENTIRE SERIES)

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4 hours ago, Sir Wolfram of Vallora said:

Because he was disappointingly thrown in as a SpotPass afterthought. Some of my favorite characters in concept, like Emmeryn, Walhart, Gangrel, and even Yen'fay, were shafted in terms of story. I really would have liked to have seen supports between more of these characters. Yen'fay not supporting with Say'ri, Emmeryn not supporting with any of her siblings, and Gangrel and Walhart not having supports with Chrom or any related characters is a real missed opurtunity.

Chrom getting supports with them would have been so much better. Who limits the main character so much? 
 

but tbh I think gangrels story is a LOT stronger by being recruited 

 

but Walhart and Chrom’s story are stronger if Walhart dies 

 

emmeryns stort is stronger if she dies 

 

yen Fay is stronger if he dies. 
 

Gangrel improves the story

im neutral to Priam and Aversa

yen, walhart and Emmeryn take away from the main story If they were fully canon 

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Fallen Camilla after she falls into the botomless canyon in an alternate universe.

 

Don't hate me, hate IS for probably making this happen in the future. If we have Adrift Camilla, Fallen Camilla is possible.

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41 minutes ago, IEatLasers said:

Chrom getting supports with them would have been so much better. Who limits the main character so much? 
 

but tbh I think gangrels story is a LOT stronger by being recruited 

 

but Walhart and Chrom’s story are stronger if Walhart dies 

 

emmeryns stort is stronger if she dies 

 

yen Fay is stronger if he dies. 
 

Gangrel improves the story

im neutral to Priam and Aversa

yen, walhart and Emmeryn take away from the main story If they were fully canon 

Aversa joining is completely ridiculous trying to think about things canonically given she's the second last boss you fight in the game as you travel to Grima. For them to suddenly take a wild detour and return with her is pretty unthinkable. The others could conceivably fit in before chapter 25, but not Aversa. Don't know why they even bothered to keep her around after the Deadlords chapter.

Whalhart I think I'd very much improved by him living. Mostly because we only have like two damn scenes with him before he dies in the story so we actually get very little exposure to him. And he is a pretty interesting character with stuff like his vegetarianism that would never be expressed, which is both funny, unexpected and completely sensical for his personality. It also shows him as a more malleable philosophical figure unlike his peers who run the might makes right philosophy. And finally there's the implications that he did in fact die, unlike the others, and is only back because he's a risen. A risen that has maintained his sentience which makes him a massive bad ass.

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16 minutes ago, Jotari said:

Aversa joining is completely ridiculous trying to think about things canonically given she's the second last boss you fight in the game as you travel to Grima. For them to suddenly take a wild detour and return with her is pretty unthinkable. The others could conceivably fit in before chapter 25, but not Aversa. Don't know why they even bothered to keep her around after the Deadlords chapter.

Whalhart I think I'd very much improved by him living. Mostly because we only have like two damn scenes with him before he dies in the story so we actually get very little exposure to him. And he is a pretty interesting character with stuff like his vegetarianism that would never be expressed, which is both funny, unexpected and completely sensical for his personality. It also shows him as a more malleable philosophical figure unlike his peers who run the might makes right philosophy. And finally there's the implications that he did in fact die, unlike the others, and is only back because he's a risen. A risen that has maintained his sentience which makes him a massive bad ass.

That’s fair I have no strong feelings for or against her use. 
 

I just don’t agree about Walhart. As the non canon xenologue it’s great to learn those facts 

 

but in canon the point is he is the same but also the opposite to Chrom. Hero king descendant. Chosen by a god. Wants to unit the world and create peace. 
but he wants the weak to serve the strong. Chrom believes the strong should serve the weak. Because that is an impossible compromise they fight. 
Chrom begging him to lay down his arms in honor of Emmeryn But ultimately being forced to kill him adds a lot to both his and Chrom’s character. Neither could ever back down. 
 

so him living and joining Chrom...I just don’t like it. 
 

I DO think he should have had a descendant. Maybe after you fight him, the conqueror’s child from the future shows up. 
when you beat the game Chrom puts him in charge of the valm region of our timeline (despite Chrom being the leader of a more peaceful world, others work as leaders of regions) something like that. 
Would work for 3 reasons. 
1: we could learn about Walhart and see more about valm as a whole. 

2: we could see the effects of a child learning they won’t be born in the timeline 

3: we could learn about what happens in the original timeline, where Walhart lives much longer due to Chrom being wounded. 
 

idk my opinion. But maybe I should make a new thread to discuss that since it’s off topic. 

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34 minutes ago, IEatLasers said:

That’s fair I have no strong feelings for or against her use. 
 

I just don’t agree about Walhart. As the non canon xenologue it’s great to learn those facts 

 

but in canon the point is he is the same but also the opposite to Chrom. Hero king descendant. Chosen by a god. Wants to unit the world and create peace. 
but he wants the weak to serve the strong. Chrom believes the strong should serve the weak. Because that is an impossible compromise they fight. 
Chrom begging him to lay down his arms in honor of Emmeryn But ultimately being forced to kill him adds a lot to both his and Chrom’s character. Neither could ever back down. 
 

so him living and joining Chrom...I just don’t like it. 
 

I DO think he should have had a descendant. Maybe after you fight him, the conqueror’s child from the future shows up. 
when you beat the game Chrom puts him in charge of the valm region of our timeline (despite Chrom being the leader of a more peaceful world, others work as leaders of regions) something like that. 
Would work for 3 reasons. 
1: we could learn about Walhart and see more about valm as a whole. 

2: we could see the effects of a child learning they won’t be born in the timeline 

3: we could learn about what happens in the original timeline, where Walhart lives much longer due to Chrom being wounded. 
 

idk my opinion. But maybe I should make a new thread to discuss that since it’s off topic. 

To add to this, Walhart’s ideals and actions are also basically a complete antithesis to that of Emmeryn’s. Emmeryn’s sacrifice was able to prove that peace is what unifies people and that ultimately more conflict will only breed more needless conflict. As shown when the plegians all defect after her sacrifice and refuse to fight. Walhart though is able to unify people through fear and war which is the very thing Emmeryn said would only divide people. Emmeryn’s ideals are ultimately proven to be true when the shepherds are able to shake Walhart’s iron grip of fear on the dynasts by defeating Yen’fey thus proving they have nothing to fear. Unity through fear and conquest is a fragile one indeed. In the end the two are opposites. Two sides of the same coin. Both Walhart and Chrom are unwavering in their ideals and too stubborn to compromise on them which is why the conflict ends up the way it does.

Edited by Ottservia

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So interesting and well put. 
 

Is It okay if I make a spin off thread about this convo and also my idea of a Walhart child! 

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46 minutes ago, IEatLasers said:

So interesting and well put. 
 

Is It okay if I make a spin off thread about this convo and also my idea of a Walhart child! 

Go right on ahead. I may eventually try my hand at a Gangrel Emmeryn support, but feel free to use any of these ideas. PM me when you post it. I'd be interested in reading it.

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4 hours ago, IEatLasers said:

That’s fair I have no strong feelings for or against her use. 
 

I just don’t agree about Walhart. As the non canon xenologue it’s great to learn those facts 

 

but in canon the point is he is the same but also the opposite to Chrom. Hero king descendant. Chosen by a god. Wants to unit the world and create peace. 
but he wants the weak to serve the strong. Chrom believes the strong should serve the weak. Because that is an impossible compromise they fight. 
Chrom begging him to lay down his arms in honor of Emmeryn But ultimately being forced to kill him adds a lot to both his and Chrom’s character. Neither could ever back down. 
 

so him living and joining Chrom...I just don’t like it. 
 

I DO think he should have had a descendant. Maybe after you fight him, the conqueror’s child from the future shows up. 
when you beat the game Chrom puts him in charge of the valm region of our timeline (despite Chrom being the leader of a more peaceful world, others work as leaders of regions) something like that. 
Would work for 3 reasons. 
1: we could learn about Walhart and see more about valm as a whole. 

2: we could see the effects of a child learning they won’t be born in the timeline 

3: we could learn about what happens in the original timeline, where Walhart lives much longer due to Chrom being wounded. 
 

idk my opinion. But maybe I should make a new thread to discuss that since it’s off topic. 

I'd be up for a specific topic, but I point out that Chron actually killing him isn't necessary for either of their arcs. Only that Chrom soundly defeats him. Defeating him also allows Whalhart to re-evaluate his views. Playable Whalhart and enemy Whalhart are actually pretty different as playable Whalhart has been greatly humbled by his defeat and is trying to maintain his beliefs without being hypocritical about them.

And again even if you want Chrom to outright kill him there's the whole he's probably part Risen aspect.

Edited by Jotari

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11 hours ago, IEatLasers said:

So interesting and well put. 
 

Is It okay if I make a spin off thread about this convo and also my idea of a Walhart child! 

I don’t see why not. Go I ahead, I ain’t gonna stop you. If you were talking to me anyway

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