Plot-Death, and why it doesn't work

[GlitchWarrior]

This game has an unholy amount of plot-death. Kaze bites it in BR15 if you don't have an A-support. Flora bites it in BR17. Elise, in BR26. And all of these units kill themselves in some way- Kaze literally has a way to escape in BR but doesn't recognize it unless he's bonded with Corrin. Flora literally incinerates herself, and Elise practically hugs Siegfried in an unfortunately vain attempt to calm down Xander. So much of this actually doesn't hurt that it's not even funny. CQ has far less death of major characters, but one thing both routes share is Lilith having a stupid death: while in BR, it's somewhat understandable, in CQ she's mauled by a Faceless and it makes no sense. Like, why do they do this? Even Rev isn't safe, as Scarlet gets killed in between C17 and C18 and there's no way to stop it. What I want to know is, why did they do all of this? Why did they apparently feel a need to fill some sort of death quota, where allied characters like Kaze, Lilith, Scarlet and BR!Elise have to die? Honestly, that's one of the few areas CQ did well in, but there's still the aforementioned Lilith Faceless moment...

[FireFenrir]

I only played Birthright but spoiled me CQ and Revelation,and just remember a bit of things about those two games. I remember that Izana died to in Rev, when he make his prediction or something like that. But I don't think that was a useful death for the game. Like, if they just don't make Izana died, what would that change after all? No much things I guess.... But without talking about Izana, Elise is a death to,maybe show how far Nohrian's will to conquest was too strong. She wanted to resonate Xander. But he don't even respect Elise's last will who is that both Nohrians and Hoshidians had to be at peace. Then he died too after, but this isn't that bad. I mean, Nohrians royal's death don't disturb me that much, because that was kind of the only way to stop the conquest. But I remember that Elise death totally make me sad. About Kaze, that add something to the story, but this is too much I think. They would not add this, that would be the same. Proof is that you can make the end of the story without him (as for me I don't knew I could save him so he died on my BR file).  I don't remember we see him But because I don't played Conquest and Revelation actually I couldn't say anything more about those two. But I think some deaths were unuseful in fact. In BR just see Xander and Lilith die would be enough I think. But comparing to the other game, yup there's too much death on it

[Zapp Branniglenn]

I think part of the design philosophy of the three games was to have unique characters in each route, so Scarlet being playable outside birthright was just not allowed to happen. Excuses need to be made in order for them to not join Corrin even when they have the chance. Or they just want more death in cutscenes to illicit reactions from players (See: Mikoto). Although the Kaze business is...I don't know what they were thinking there. Unlike the Shura business, there's no benefit to losing Kaze. As for Elise, the player is going to ask, "hey Elise could totally join our side now" in birthright, so the writers had to murder her in order to cut out that plot contrivance.

[Etrurian emperor]

25 minutes ago, Glennstavos said:

As for Elise, the player is going to ask, "hey Elise could totally join our side now" in birthright, so the writers had to murder her in order to cut out that plot contrivance.

Isn't that also the case with Leo who doesn't end up murdered. He too comes around and ditches Garon at the end of Birthright. 

[Captain Karnage]

I'm going to go ahead and say it

but Fates isn't really known for having Shakespearean writing, however it does have Shakespearean death scenes

other than that, the more you peel back on the story the worse it gets

If we go back to 2016 the one thing I really do remember was there was some drama between IS and the main author, both sides blaming each other for the poor quality.

[vanguard333]

Plot-death isn't inherently bad, but it is very poorly done in this game; mainly because pretty much every facet of the writing: plot, characters and worldbuilding, were poorly done. The only thing that wasn't done poorly was the writing prose (the sentence structure and such). 

[eclipse]

This is a subset of "Fates writing issues", which means your topic title could use some work.  I'd say Sigurd's death in FE4 worked just fine.

[SullyMcGully]

46 minutes ago, eclipse said:

This is a subset of "Fates writing issues", which means your topic title could use some work.  I'd say Sigurd's death in FE4 worked just fine.

SIGURD DIES IN FE4?

WAIT WHAT?

I THOUGHT HE WAS THE MAIN LORD!

[eclipse]

1 minute ago, SullyMcGully said:

SIGURD DIES IN FE4?

WAIT WHAT?

I THOUGHT HE WAS THE MAIN LORD!

Psst, check the subforum first.

[Hawkwing]

Fates tried to have dramatic and tragic character deaths, but fails largely because of how little time is spent with said characters. Mikoto is killed only a chapter or two after meeting her, fighting a character that is a unit on the other route doesn't have the same impact of you haven't played said route, and even then having a battle and death quote doesn't really make them all that separate from another boss. Shura is another sign of the games skewed priorities, given you have a choice to kill someone whose backstory is actually relevant to the war, and Kaze's situation, while it could be an attempt to show how important bonds can be, just resulted in a lot of "use/don't use this unit!" advice. Lilith's death may have had more of an impact if she was actually involved more in the story itself instead of disappearing a short time in, and the demise of the royals is sad more due to the inherit tragedy of the situation than anything else

Other games in the series have done plot deaths much better than Fates did by spending more time with the characters beforehand and/or giving their death the right amount of narrative impact. Killing off the players units for story reasons is the only thing I have an issue with. It needlessly screws over blind players, and on future playthroughs, the unit just becomes the source of "use/don't use!" debates

5 hours ago, vanguard333 said:

The only thing that wasn't done poorly was the writing prose (the sentence structure and such). 

Heck, even there Fates had room for improvement. While there is little issue on the technical side of things, it seemed like every other sentence there was something to edit to make a conversation more engaging and entertaining to go through during my first playthrough of Conquest, and the tone really did not fit in with the "sword and sorcery" setting of Fire Emblem.

[eclipse]

IMO the only "story death" that worked was Shura.  It was solely up to the player, had an impact on the roster, and the game didn't try to screw you over if you said "no".

Even if you had no emotional attachment to the guy.