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B21 and B22 Discussion/Speculation Thread (B22 Release on 10/01/20!)


AllStarKnight
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2 hours ago, Interlude37 said:

I dunno if this info is somewhere else and I just missed it, but do we have any idea of what the spread is gonna be vis-a-vis rarity? I know the only comparable booster set is B17, and that set had 16 SRs. I see that as of today, we've seen 15 SRs. I'm sort of hoping they chuck convention out the window, with this being the last set lol.

Great question, been wondering the same! All we have confirmed is that B22 is the same as B17 in card count (115) and SR+ count (8). Apparently we also know from the sample image that there will be no Hero Rares or R+ cards this time around.

Personally I'm hopeful that they will chuck the convention out the window despite the similarities, because they've revealed a lot of foil cards already with 5 more weeks of reveals still left to go. Week 1 had a foil reveal per day and Week 2 was close, with only one day that didn't have one. With B17 numbers, that would leave us only 1 new SR and 7 new Rs to reveal, plus the 7 art-only SRs we don't know the effects of yet. They could definitely make it work, but I still would've expected them to spread things out a bit more, maybe save either Robin (f) or Guinivere for later and show less Rs.

Since they didn't, and it wouldn't make as much sense to slow down on foil reveals rather than hype us up closer to set release, I figure we're likely getting a different spread than B17. But since there's no official word on it yet, guess we'll have to wait and see!

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Well this is a little embarrassing since I was just talking foil count, but it appears that Kagero, Kaze, and Saizo are not truly Rs after all but N/HNs, based on their borders. Something similar happened with B21 where I (along with FEcipherENG) mistook the Balthus HN as an R at first, due to the card art covering most of the border. Here with the trio the border was even less apparent, but now that Oscar's pointed it out, it's very clearly at the top of Kaze's.

So yeah, apologies for the misinformation, everyone!

Also, now that this frees up 3 R slots, I'm starting to think we'll have the same spread as B17 after all. 3 more Rs means that by B17 standards we'd still have 8 more new R reveals, 1 new SR reveal, and 5 art-only SRs with ~4 weeks to go. 14 foil reveals spread across the 18 weekdays prior to set release sounds a lot more reasonable to keep with their current fast pace of revealing foils.

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Oh you're right, it's pretty confusing with their art and the borders aren't the first thing you notice when you look at the card. 

So with the Leo revealed, I can't wait to see the Takumi! He probably will be a rare I think!

I quickly tried to deduce how much card we could have for this set actually. We actually have 91 cards revealed if I'm not wrong. By seein the recap you have made page 1, there's a lot of game who actually have 11 cards revealed. So, I guess it will be the max amount of cards for games (at least general games). I think they will add a bit less for spin offs (except for Cipher characters, I think they will add one of each). So with those thoughts, I think the amount of the cards would be :

-99 cards for the principal games (FE1/2/3/4/5/6/7/8/9/10/11/12/13/14/15/16)

-At least 8 for Cipher (maybe 10, if they add Class Change)

-Maybe 5 for Heroes, they could add Bruno, I don't think they will put an other Sharena as she have a rare in B21.

-2 or more for Hasha no Tsurugi (I think they will maybe add one more, like Tiena as she is Al's wife apparently)

-8 maybe for Tokyo Mirage 

-5 for Warriors (I think they will add Lianna maybe a a SR+ variant of Rowan?, Darios, why not Velezark, Yelena but I don't think so as she is not fighting)

Whiwh would do 127 cards, but I think, if that would be approx the case, we could more have like 130 cards. Which is 15 more than B17. 

Also, I'm quite hesitating on which game the Tiki card is. I see you have put her on FE1 and the remakes, but as she have skills that work with TMS, so I don't know from which game we have to consider she is from. 

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20 minutes ago, FireFenrir said:

Whiwh would do 127 cards, but I think, if that would be approx the case, we could more have like 130 cards. Which is 15 more than B17. 

Also, I'm quite hesitating on which game the Tiki card is. I see you have put her on FE1 and the remakes, but as she have skills that work with TMS, so I don't know from which game we have to consider she is from. 

Actually, as stated at the top of this page, we already know from the official page that there will also only be 115 cards in B22.

On the front page, I originally chose to group by game because I didn't want to group by color before knowing which of the many cards would later be revealed as Colorless. However, I'm thinking it might be better to group by color now that most of the art-only cards have been revealed, then leave an "unknown color" section for the rest. That would probably be less confusing!

You're correct that it's TMS Tiki, I only didn't put her there because she looks nearly identical to FE1/remake Tiki, unlike how Draug looks too radically different to put him anywhere but Mirage. Still, I think I'll go ahead with re-organizing by color, so she'll be grouped with Itsuki as RedBlue now.

 

I'd also like to point out for the remaining cards that B17 had a uniform pattern in distributing cards: 13 for each color except Brown (which at the time was a new color) and Colorless.

I think we're extremely likely to get 13 per color (that's not colorless or new like RedBlue) this time too, only with 13 for WhiteBlack/White/Black combined rather than individually to make room for 10 additional Brown slots. And just like when Brown was new in B17, chances are high we'll be getting 3 cards for RedBlue.

So I don't think we can know what to expect per game (Heroes only had 1 card last time and now they have 4 confirmed already, etc.), especially since games can get more representation through Colorless cards (like Fates getting a Colorless Takumi and Camilla this set). But this does give us what to expect per color!

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20 minutes ago, AllStarKnight said:

Actually, as stated at the top of this page, we already know from the official page that there will also only be 115 cards in B22.

Oh yes you're right, I've forgot, sorry for that.

20 minutes ago, AllStarKnight said:

I'd also like to point out for the remaining cards that B17 had a uniform pattern in distributing cards: 13 for each color except Brown (which at the time was a new color) and Colorless.

I think we're extremely likely to get 13 per color (that's not colorless or new like RedBlue) this time too, only with 13 for WhiteBlack/White/Black combined rather than individually to make room for 10 additional Brown slots. And just like when Brown was new in B17, chances are high we'll be getting 3 cards for RedBlue.

So I don't think we can know what to expect per game (Heroes only had 1 card last time and now they have 4 confirmed already, etc.), especially since games can get more representation through Colorless cards (like Fates getting a Colorless Takumi and Camilla this set). But this does give us what to expect per color!

That's nteresting to expect what we could have based on colours! I'm very excited to see which card will be revealed tommorow and then maybe have some thoughts about who could be the next. 

For 3H I really hope they will put more Manuela and Hanneman. But it's pretty hard to say because their actual cost 3(2) show them in their regular outfits, so that's cool thinking about a class change of them! I think each actual 3(2) will at least get or a cost 1, or a class changed version.

I like thinking that they maybe will make Forsyth and Python as cost 1 in their Gaiden version, pretty much as how they do for Silque, difference is that she already have a cost 1 on B09 and Forsyt/Python doesn't in set 11. There's a lot of characters in that case, that don't have any class change  it's quite sad. 

Edited by FireFenrir
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No worries it's easy to forget! And I always enjoy hearing someone else share my enthusiasm for speculating about Cipher possibilites.

On 8/28/2020 at 6:14 PM, AllStarKnight said:

Oh and while Sacred Stones may already have Fomortiis, he's the only one confirmed besides the lords, so I'd like if we could also get Knoll and maybe a new Lyon to wrap up with a theme with those three.

Very happy that with today's reveal, we did get Knoll after all! With the count now up to 12 Known Purple cards and Narcian as a very likely 13th, I think whatever remains of our Elibe/Magvel rep will likely be Colorless. I'm plenty satisfied with just Knoll, but if they do add Lyon for a theme, Colorless could suit him well.

Speaking of Colorless, I think I'm doubling down on my Colorless Caeda prediction, and not just because Red is looking full right now. My reasoning is that the really cool take on Cain and Abel's cards may not be limited to them but instead another mini theme for this set. Just like the two brothers, Caeda has characters of her archetype from across the series in her art, so she fits right in. We could even get a few other cards like these, bonus Archanea rep through more Colorless archetypal cards.

Maybe only one or two, like a Jagen (featuring Marcus, Gunter, etc.) and/or a Camus (featuring Eldigan, etc). Or Medeus with other final bosses would be extremely cool. This theme would be great to celebrate common threads through the series and give Archanea some love, so if we do get more like these, I'll be all for it!

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Today we have lots of reveals with Miranda, Deirdre, Azura and Hinoka!

With the Azura being Black/White, I guess the other Azura will be the same colour. Though, they could decide to make her a colorless version. But I think they would have better do it for a Cost 2 verison,the revealed one today.

I would also like seeing a Narcian colorless. After all he is one of the first Heroes that have been included with Grand Hero Battle on FEH, that could be possible. 

 

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2 minutes ago, FireFenrir said:

Today we have lots of reveals with Miranda, Deirdre, Azura and Hinoka!

With the Azura being Black/White, I guess the other Azura will be the same colour. Though, they could decide to make her a colorless version. But I think they would have better do it for a Cost 2 verison,the revealed one today.

I would also like seeing a Narcian colorless. After all he is one of the first Heroes that have been included with Grand Hero Battle on FEH, that could be possible. 

 

Miranda was revealed? Where???

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27 minutes ago, Seazas said:

Miranda was revealed? Where???

She has been revealed with this tweet, FE Cipher's twitter don't revealed her today since they use to reveal one card per days, but there's sometimes other magazines/ posters that reveal few other cards on a day. 

Spoiler

Image

 

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Yes, it was wonderful to get surprise reveals today on top of the twitter ones! And in case anyone needs it, here are the links to the other two FireFenrir mentioned in her post: Deirdre and Azura.

As for speculation, yes, I'd been hoping the two Azuras would fill out WhiteBlack and it looks like that's going to be the case. Now for them to hopefully confirm Azura as our WhiteBlack R now that they've confirmed Hinoka as our White R and Leo as our Black R.

Also with Miranda getting a c1, I think there's a good chance that she'll not only get a higher cost card, but our first Yellow R since it's the only other color not to have one confirmed yet.

EDIT: We also have a now-translated Mamori Minamoto c1 from the poster reveals.

Edited by AllStarKnight
Mamori Minamoto c1 reveal
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Okay wow, today's reveals totally took me off guard. Not just because there haven't been reveals the past two days (anyone know what was up with that? I was so lost), but because Azura SR...Like I was certain the 16th SR reveal would be WhiteBlack, and I was pretty certain we'd get an SR+ since it's the only color to not have one confirmed (or implied like Byleth (m). But I thought given Corrin (f)'s popularity and long history of getting SRs in Cipher that they'd double down with one of her.

It would be pretty wild to me if Corrin (f) didn't get a card at all in the final set, but so far, we actually don't have any doubles of the avatars. Only Kris (f), Robin (f), Corrin (m), and Byleth (m). So it might actually be possible. Wonder if that's all we're getting, or if they'll surprise us with cards for the alternate versions of the popular Robin, Corrin, and Byleth.

Also, the final livestream's this Saturday and we still have 17 completely new cards to reveal, plus 8 that are art-only right now. Can't wait to see what other surprises are in store, as I'm sure we'll be in for a good time with those reveals!

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20 minutes ago, AllStarKnight said:

Not just because there haven't been reveals the past two days (anyone know what was up with that?

National holidays in Japan, iirc Monday was "respect your elders day" and Tuesday was "Citizens day" or something like that.

Really curious for what surprise cards might be revealed Saturday, I'm really hoping for more unexpected characters.

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23 hours ago, whase said:

National holidays in Japan, iirc Monday was "respect your elders day" and Tuesday was "Citizens day" or something like that.

Really curious for what surprise cards might be revealed Saturday, I'm really hoping for more unexpected characters.

Oh, gotcha! Part of my confusion was that unlike Cipher, FE Heroes updated in Japan around the same time it normally does, but it's not unusual for official accounts to handle holidays differently. Anyway, thanks for letting me know!

And definitely, I hope so as well! More new additions to Cipher are always welcome.

EDIT: Speaking of character additions, Medeus!! Not the colorless version I briefly theorized, but having him introduced in his game's color is only right. His first effect is a really fun twist to Marth and co's MC swapping, and after how much I enjoyed making my Ashnard boss decks, I'll definitely enjoy trying to make an endgame Medeus deck work too.

Edited by AllStarKnight
Medeus reveal
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And with that, we're officially done with Cipher livestreams. It's taken months for it to fully sink in for me that Cipher's ending, and now that it has, I can't shake how sad I am to see it go. But what a beautiful run Cipher has had these past five years.

The most emotional parts for me were seeing the heartfelt works that the Cipher artists submitted to celebrate the series, as well as how the voice actors and team were tearing up in the final goodbyes. I especially loved Chinatsu's fantastic art of Byleth (f) as Enlightened One (everything I would've wanted for her as an SR this set), and the heartwarming glow in Sachiko Wada's stunning art of Florina, Lyn, Eliwood, and Hector together. The hosts of these livestreams always radiate such joy, and I can't believe this'll be the last time of seeing them like this. I'm just so grateful for those in every department who worked so hard to contribute to this series and made it as special as it is!

The hosts and the celebration of Cipher really were the highlights, so there's not as much to talk about with the other reveals. I did like how they revealed the final cards for the Cipher OCs, as well as showing the full art of the Elibe Legendary spread. Also, Three Houses did get its last playable character after all with Gilbert. Can't say I'm particularly thrilled about the maid/butler paired art, but I do know it's a clear and fair parallel to the ninja paired art, so no complaints there. Though I'll admit I'm not totally over missing the perfect opportunity to have paired art for Chrom and Robin (especially since Robin's two versions can't be an excuse, with how they've favored one version for Byleth in getting to share art with the lords). But both have gotten great solo cards both in the past and this set, so still no complaints.

In the end, this week's most hype reveal for me was prior to the livestream, with the Byleth (m) SR+ art. I may have known he was getting one, and part of me was even expecting the house leaders to be in it (though I was torn about the idea, since I knew it could make me want yet another expensive card, haha). But to actually see it. Wow. I won't even mind if I never get it, it turned out incredibly beautiful for all four of them, and I'm just so happy it exists! Though of course, I do hope I can luck out one more time to pull one in my boxes.

 

At this point we've now seen 111 cards total, only 2 of which are art-only now (Kyza and Narcian). Leaving 4 cards to be entirely new reveals! One of the remaining should be an R, since we only have 17 Rs compared to B17's 18 R count, and we already match B17 in having a 16 SR count. And for other B17 standards, I previously noted how it had 13 be the rule for the non-colorless/new color cards, but for B22, it looks like they may have used 13 as the minimum instead. Red is already confirmed to have 15 and White/Black/WhiteBlack combined have 16. Assuming Kyza is indeed Green, this leaves only Blue and Yellow just shy of 13. Meaning we only need 1 more Blue and 1 more Yellow for every color to at least have the 13 they had in B17, with some colors getting more cards beyond that.

Edited by AllStarKnight
clarity
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This is just when I was watching the Livestream that I really realized that it was the very last. And this makes me feel so sad.... At the point that seeing Cipher things makes me being sad and think that watching my cards will never make me feel the same than before. Really, I only watched few livestreams, I started with B18 (and don't watch B19) but this is really really sad. I was at the point to cry at the end of the stream with seeing everybody tearing. 

I have to be grateful to Cipher, because it makes me have so much joy discussing with people, making friends and even so much, with the few times I've played and spend good time with playing (I'm back to the game since some weeks, playing with Lackey and learn how to use it!)

About reveals, this is pretty much what I was waiting for. Some of the rarity reveal of the few art-only cards we had before, and new cards, such as the maid/butler, I like the arts, but there's a lot of Black/White characters that  should have updates of their skills. But I'm so happy with the beautiful Byleth SR+ reveal, amazing card I wish to have really!! 

Gilbert has surprised me, I would rather think they would have put Rodrigue of someone other but since Rodrigue isn't in every routes as Gilbert is, it sounds right to put Gilbert instead of putting a character that doesn't appears in every routes. 

We still have to wait for some more reveals, I can't wait to see them, then there's just 4 days left before the set's release. And Cipher will stop.

Really I was sad with this stream, realizing that it was the last one, and then all the flashbacks of previous events. Thinking again of this makes me tearing really.

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We now have our final card reveals: Colorless Wrys, Claude (Jugdral), a 2nd Miranda, and the previously art-only Kyza.

Once again Cipher catches me completely off guard, and sad to say for the last time. I never would've seen Wrys or Claude (Jugdral) coming at all, and while I certainly would've preferred new characters in those slots, I still think it's neat that we get to have Claude (Jugdral) and Claude (Fodlan) in the same set.

With Kyza as Green and with these two new Yellow cards, we did end up getting 14+ of every color when you combine White/Black/WhiteBlack (which I did account for) and count RedBlue as Blue rep (which I honestly forgot to do). Cool that it's one more than the 13 from last time, really feels like they spread the rep well between the colors. I love how it's all organized in the set by game too, with the spin-offs being placed after the mainline games.

 

I really am going to miss all of the hype and speculation and new card reveals. It's been a great run, and thanks to everyone who took part in it too. For those of you getting B22 boxes, I wish you all the best of luck in your pulls! Hopefully we can all get the cards we're looking for 😄 Oh and feel free to post your pulls on here like last time if you'd like, that was a lot of fun!

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Pretty surprised with those new reveals, I didn't expect that!

I'm sad now, those were the very last reveals... This will miss me so much, waiting everyday for new reveal, livestreams.

But that's not a reason for stop loving Cipher and end the community!! 

That's also sad to say, but after we've put our pulls here, will the thread still be here? That was so nice to discuss about Cipher releases and except what new could be released. 

Also, yeah I was wishing for more new characters, like Rudolf will not have at least one card, and lots of characters also, not only him. 

7 hours ago, AllStarKnight said:

It's been a great run, and thanks to everyone who took part in it too. For those of you getting B22 boxes, I wish you all the best of luck in your pulls! Hopefully we can all get the cards we're looking for 😄 Oh and feel free to post your pulls on here like last time if you'd like, that was a lot of fun!

I have to thank you for creating this thread! I had so much fun and happiness discussing here about new cards, and I think it's too early to stop but Cipher's end want that so.... 

Best of luck you too, and everyone for your pulls!

Now I will try to find a second box from any website I can xD

 

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Well in the end among the many wishes I made for the last set the only one that was realized was a Medeus card. Which is fine, if I did have to choose only one card to wish into existence it would have been that one. It still leaves a bad taste in my mouth that we were so close to completing the rosters for Tellius, FE7 and FE4 and it didn't happen but hey at least we got Gilbert.

Even if I joked that I didn't want him because he is a PoS it would have been so weird to not have a complete roster for the most recent game when the other recent games (Awakening, Fates and Echoes) all got complete rosters of their PCs, even the unpopular ones.

Still this last set was absolutely beautiful and they did make a lot of good choices to get more representation like givin all the Thracia not-Leif cards to new characters in Cipher. And if we really count Danved and Lehran as separate from Devdan and Sephiran they did a good job even for new Tellius reps.

Goodbye Cipher, you weren't a good TCG, I'm told you were the best.

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Not too happy with this last set, but at least there's a few cards I'd like to add to my collection.

Well, time to get started on a custom set. 100 cards in 3 months, should be doable right?

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On 9/30/2020 at 3:50 PM, FireFenrir said:

That's also sad to say, but after we've put our pulls here, will the thread still be here? That was so nice to discuss about Cipher releases and except what new could be released.

Hmm, well the thread will still be here for sure, but there's a good chance it'll become inactive without new card reveals for people to talk about. Still, after we all have a chance to put our pulls here, I'd be happy to update the title to make this into a general discussion thread (so more than just B21/B22), just in case people do still want to talk about Cipher here!

On 9/30/2020 at 3:50 PM, FireFenrir said:

I have to thank you for creating this thread! I had so much fun and happiness discussing here about new cards, and I think it's too early to stop but Cipher's end want that so....

It was my pleasure! I've loved being able to update and discuss with everyone, and I'm so glad that this thread was well-received. I'm definitely going to miss it with how soon things have ended.

11 hours ago, whase said:

Well, time to get started on a custom set. 100 cards in 3 months, should be doable right?

If you do make a custom set, I'd be very interested in hearing about it, if you'd be interested in sharing! You have some great ideas as a TCG player. For example, I really enjoyed your earlier idea to make an all-Green cube and tried it myself with the person I play with. It was great learning the different ways of drafting a cube, and we both had so much fun with the resulting decks!

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8 hours ago, AllStarKnight said:

If you do make a custom set, I'd be very interested in hearing about it, if you'd be interested in sharing! You have some great ideas as a TCG player. For example, I really enjoyed your earlier idea to make an all-Green cube and tried it myself with the person I play with. It was great learning the different ways of drafting a cube, and we both had so much fun with the resulting decks!

That is so great to hear! Sadly my cube has been delayed (mostly due to covid I think).

I've been talking with a friend of mine about working on a custom set, I'll discuss with him on whether we plan to share. I believe I've also seen other people discussing a similar idea, perhaps I should see if we can bundle our efforts.

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13 hours ago, whase said:

That is so great to hear! Sadly my cube has been delayed (mostly due to covid I think).

I've been talking with a friend of mine about working on a custom set, I'll discuss with him on whether we plan to share. I believe I've also seen other people discussing a similar idea, perhaps I should see if we can bundle our efforts.

Right, the current situation has definitely made it difficult to play outside of Lackey. Well that sounds like a good plan, and I hope it's not too long before you get the opportunity to try things out!

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3 hours ago, Lance23 said:
Spoiler

 

Got today my B22 Box!!

EjkVme9WoAU2jwH?format=jpg&name=4096x409

I have a lot of luck becouse I pulled the SR+ Ike (he's my favorite character) and R Edelgard, Dimitri and Claude!!

EjkVpS8WkAAE4NS?format=jpg&name=4096x409

  Reveal hidden contents

EjkVoXkWkAAu6D7?format=jpg&name=4096x409

 

EjkVnfWXsAIFzLa?format=jpg&name=4096x409


 

 

Wow you got a SR+ with one box? This is amazing cause the rate for having an SR+ in this set looks very low (it's not in every box you'll have a + card!) Amazing pulls really!

Edited by FireFenrir
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My own boxes came yesterday as well! It was a very emotional day for me.

I'm planning on doing another front page piece with some photos as a sort of final farewell to Cipher, so keep your eyes peeled for that to come later this month.

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