Jump to content

How does this look for a Blue Lions NG+ Hard plan?


Recommended Posts

2 hours ago, RainbowMoon said:

Will going the pure black magic route hurt her white magic potential though? I still want her to be able to function as a healer.

Marianne's Faith Rank starts off at Rank D+. It's really easy for her to learn Physic after about 1 or 2 sessions since she learns it Rank C. From there you could focus on Reason and Flying. In the case of Flying she has a boon so she should be able to get to Dark Flier relatively easy. If you're looking for her to play a pure healing role then Bishop is her best option at this point. Silence at Rank B can be useful at times in case you need to approach mages safely without retaliation.

Aura is not a bad spell since it hits hard but you only get 3 uses out of it. 6 if you're a bishop. And Holy Knight being the only class having white tomefaire boosts the damage. But people would say that Holy Knight is not a good pick since white tomefaire boosts only offensive white magic. Lysithea somewhat gets more out of it since she learns Seraphim and Abraxas, but it doesn't justify having her switching to offensive white magic when she can spam her plethora of dark magic instead.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 hours ago, Owns said:

Merc > SM works fine. You could also do Thief > SM without the need of bows. Merc gets you Vantage; not too important if you use Battalion Vantage, but still useful and better than steal. The main advantage of Thief over Merc is better speed and dex growths which I think are worth it but both routes are okay. Oh and thieves can move through forest tiles without movement penalty which is extremely useful.

Ah, perfect! I can always go Thief for the better growths and just not bother with mastering it since Steal is meh. So I'm thinking I'll take the Soldier* / Myrmidon* > Thief > Swordmaster > High Lord* > Great Lord* route and have him use both lances and swords. Then I'll give him Killer weapons, Fraldaruis Soldiers for the crit bonus and the Chalice of Beginnings (maybe swap it out for the Knowledge Gem occasionally just so time's not an issue like @Shadow Mir said.)

12 hours ago, Skarthe said:

Fair warning: this is true, but you do not get all of the rewards if both characters aren't recruited.  As an example: Ingrid's paralogue will not give you Lúin if you haven't recruited Ingrid, and it will not give you the Goddess Ring if you haven't recruited Dorothea.

Oh! So I can get Lúin without Dorothea, it's just the ring that I can buy from Anna anyway that I'll miss? Maybe what I'll do then is scrap the magic Sylvain idea, make him a Cavalier and give him Lúin so Ingrid can keep the Lance of Ruin.

And then I'll just take the Monk > Mage* > Warlock* > Dark Flier path with Marianne and give her a Healing Staff since I don't wanna leave the support role entirely to Flayn.

I think I'm all set now! Thanks everybody for your help! 🙂

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 hours ago, RainbowMoon said:

Damn... so a magic Sylvain really isn't worth it then? I'd hoped to make him into something different since Ingrid and Hilda pretty much do everything he does as a Paladin but with the added bonus of flight.

Hilda could potentially do the same as Sylvain since she has high enough speed and str but I wouldn't say the same for Ingrid. Her str is just too low unless you really favor her with stat boosters. But I see Ingrid as a specialized mage killer since she has one of the best resist stats in the game. She gets enough speed and dex to be able to ORKO mages and takes very little damage from them. So even she too uses lances, she won't really manage to do what Sylvain can do with swift strikes. Giving her his relic is fine for the most part. He might want it back towards the end if Silver Lance isn't giving him enough damage but feel it out.

If you want to use all 3, one suggestion is Sylvain > Paladin. Ingrid Falcon Knight evade tank which goes well with Wyvern Rider's Seal Defense, using lances/swords focusing on killing mages and using strong gambits. Hillda can be another evade tank but with higher damage focusing on Axes going Pegasus Knight > Wyvern Rider > Wyvern Lord. Hilda's budding talent in Heavy Armor gets her seal speed, which combined with seal def is probably the most broken evade tank combo. Not sure how important this is on Hard difficulty but makes Maddening much easier. Do whatever you like in the end, this is just an idea.

3 hours ago, RainbowMoon said:

And then I'll just take the Monk > Mage* > Warlock* > Dark Flier path with Marianne and give her a Healing Staff since I don't wanna leave the support role entirely to Flayn.

Just a note about Marianne, she learns Recover which is a (much) stronger version of heal and won't need a healing staff as a result. If anything, she'll do better with a magic staff or caduceus staff to help her attack better. If you will be relying on her excellent rally abilities though, I found giving her a march ring very fruitful until she gets the movement of either a flying or riding class since using rally can sometimes mean a unit lags behind a bit too far in the battle field. And you can always do stuff like switching to the march ring at the start of the turn, move, then switch to a magic/caduceus staff before attacking. Edit: was totally thinking Annette the whole time for some reason.

3 hours ago, RainbowMoon said:

I think I'm all set now! Thanks everybody for your help! 🙂

Yes, you're most definitely all set with or without my final thoughts. There's always a little bit here and there that one can optimize or consider but in the end it's best to just start and feel things out. Good luck and enjoy the run!

Edited by Owns
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Owns said:

Just a note about Marianne, she learns Recover which is a (much) stronger version of heal and won't need a healing staff as a result. If anything, she'll do better with a magic staff or caduceus staff to help her attack better. If you will be relying on her excellent rally abilities though, I found giving her a march ring very fruitful until she gets the movement of either a flying or riding class since using rally can sometimes mean a unit lags behind a bit too far in the battle field. And you can always do stuff like switching to the march ring at the start of the turn, move, then switch to a magic/caduceus staff before attacking.

Marianne does not learn recover. Not counting heal and nosferatu, her faith line up is physic, silence and aura

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Barren said:

Marianne does not learn recover. Not counting heal and nosferatu, her faith line up is physic, silence and aura

thanks for this, was thinking of annette the whole time while saying marianne lmao. My bad.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

22 hours ago, RainbowMoon said:

Damn... so a magic Sylvain really isn't worth it then?

@RainbowMoon You're on hard NG+, so you pretty much have free reign to explore "sub-optimal" builds like magic Sylvain. I personally haven't tried it yet, but it looks pretty fun 🙂

My opinion is that it's more enjoyable to explore builds that are sort of out there than using the same old build every playthrough. Go for it!

21 hours ago, Owns said:

For what it's worth, if I had to do it again, I'd skip Dark Mage and just master Mage for Fiendish Blow. While Poison Strike was very good in the mid-game when he still wasn't at full strength, I stopped using it in the late game it just wasn't important on him. Then again it was very useful in the early-mid game allowing him to take a chunk out of an enemy from range then another unit finishing them off. Up to you. Lifetaker from Dark Bishop on the other hand was excellent and made him much more sustainable.

Thanks, my biggest question for magic Sylvain was whether to go for Dark Mage or just master Mage. I was pretty sure I wanted Lifetaker (especially since he'd be the only candidate for Dark Mage/Bishop anyway in my playthrough), but I was wondering if Poison Strike was worth it or not. Thanks for the advice! 

By the way, I'm thinking of just playing on Hard NG+ and exploring random builds that I thought would be fun, by the way, but more damage is never a bad thing.
 

Edit: sorry, just saw second page. Sylvain with Luin also sounds like a great idea, by the way. Both are equally viable, but Paladin Sylvain will probably give you a higher damage output, and giving Sylvain Luin for his main weapon sounds fresh enough to me.

Edited by SirErrant
Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 hours ago, SirErrant said:

@RainbowMoon You're on hard NG+, so you pretty much have free reign to explore "sub-optimal" builds like magic Sylvain. I personally haven't tried it yet, but it looks pretty fun 🙂

My opinion is that it's more enjoyable to explore builds that are sort of out there than using the same old build every playthrough. Go for it!

Thanks, my biggest question for magic Sylvain was whether to go for Dark Mage or just master Mage. I was pretty sure I wanted Lifetaker (especially since he'd be the only candidate for Dark Mage/Bishop anyway in my playthrough), but I was wondering if Poison Strike was worth it or not. Thanks for the advice! 

By the way, I'm thinking of just playing on Hard NG+ and exploring random builds that I thought would be fun, by the way, but more damage is never a bad thing.
 

Edit: sorry, just saw second page. Sylvain with Luin also sounds like a great idea, by the way. Both are equally viable, but Paladin Sylvain will probably give you a higher damage output, and giving Sylvain Luin for his main weapon sounds fresh enough to me.

From my experience with Poison Strike, it's really only useful on bosses/monsters with high HP since chip damage can be a big deal. It's however not really necessary to have on a frequent basis. Lifetaker only really works on player phase and I think it only allows to recover half the damage you inflict. I haven't tried Lifetaker personally but from what I was told, it's generally not worth it using you should have a plethora of healing at your disposal anyways. I am going to try out DK Sylvain with Black Magic Avoid +20 and see how he functions on my Black Eagles/Church of Seiros playthrough 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Barren said:

From my experience with Poison Strike, it's really only useful on bosses/monsters with high HP since chip damage can be a big deal. It's however not really necessary to have on a frequent basis. Lifetaker only really works on player phase and I think it only allows to recover half the damage you inflict. I haven't tried Lifetaker personally but from what I was told, it's generally not worth it using you should have a plethora of healing at your disposal anyways. I am going to try out DK Sylvain with Black Magic Avoid +20 and see how he functions on my Black Eagles/Church of Seiros playthrough 

Indeed, it's like you say about Poison Strike. The thing is, it's very good on units who haven't reached the point of ORKO'ing enemies. So in Sylvain's case basically until he learns Swift Strikes. On the other hand, getting Poison Strike delays how early he will get swift strikes. That's okay though if you just want to have fun with an endgame build with the versatility to ORKO using either physical or ranged magical damage, it was a lot of fun albeit less powerful than I had anticipated. On Hard, it might be perfect though.

Another major advantage I found from Poison Strike that I hadn't expected was that it works following even gambits. This makes it very powerful against bosses with the Commander + Counterattack abilities like Death Knight, Flame Emperor, Edelgard, and AM's final boss. It can safely bring them down to low enough HP's to finish off without retaliation. So I'm a bit on the fence about Poison Strike tbh, on the one hand it can be very useful, less so towards the end game. On the other hand, getting both it and Fiendish Blow is a helluva grind and Fiendish Blow can make getting ORKO's easier for someone like Sylvain (his magic will still only ever be ORKO'ing armored units, but there's boatloads of them on the AM route so that's okay).

As for Lifetaker, you're right it only recovers half damage, but when you're dealing 20-40 x2 damage that's usually enough recovery to negate whatever damage you're dealt on the counterattack freeing up your healers to do something more useful (depending on your setup).  I had Mercie as main healer, with Annette and Flayn as backup but I didn't like to waste their turns on heals since 1) Annette has good magic dps or excellent rallies to use, 2) Flayn was also my dancer which is a much better use of her turn than healing, 3) on large maps Mercie's Fortify won't always reach everyone who needs it. Anyway just some more of my experience with these abilities.

Edited by Owns
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...
On 7/22/2020 at 4:39 PM, RainbowMoon said:

Yeah I've seen people do it but it always felt like "You trained her in all that crap just for some defense?!" to me haha

Considering that advanced classes have 12 defense minimum, qualifying for Fortress Knight will only give you 5 extra defense. Which is not enough to justify heavy investment in two weaknesses.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...