WHY you shouldn't recruit Ingrid until Chapter 6: Explained.

[Fraven Pooth]

I couldn't find a comprehensive explanation for why this was recommended, so I'll share here what was explained to me.

Quote

When you get to chapter 6, students you haven't recruited reach level 11 and are auto promoted into their intermediate class. They actually use enemy-unit growths, and those are applied retroactively for every level they gained.

Enemy-Pegasus' growths are way better than Soldier's, or any player classes', so Ingrid's raw stats get better than usual the longer that you hold off on recruiting her, the same goes for most physical units.

The major downside is that they are stuck with their default skill goals, and you can't tutor them (or obviously use them, outside of mission assistance). Magic users don't get significantly better growths, and most have sub-optimal goals, which is why you might as well recruit them ASAP.

You can find out what class each character will promote into here: https://serenesforest.net/three-houses/characters/other-data/

 

Edited August 14, 2020 by Fraven Pooth
removed horizontal scrolling

[haarhaarhaar]

In Ingrid's specific case, since enemy Peg Knight growths are better, then should you wait as long as possible to recruit her (especially if you were gonna raise her as a Peg Knight anyway)? She'd lose out on Riding and Authority ranks over time, but the stat increase would be significant (compared to average Lv20 PK Ingrid, +2 Def/Res and +1.5HP/Str)? 

I tend to recruit everyone I can ASAP, because I hate not having lots of time to (micro)manage their builds. It also means you have more room to pivot if your build isn't their default intermediate class, or they get stat-screwed once they join you.

[Shanty Pete's 1st Mate]

It depends on the unit, and the build you're going for. For example, if I want to make Ignatz a Brigand (for Death Blow), I should pick him up as a Fighter (wherein he joins with D Axes) rather than an Archer (E Axes). Plus, an earlier recruitment means an earlier start on building Authority rank.

[Hanes]

How did you make the horizontal scrolling text effect?

And yeah I see, that sounds good.

[Fraven Pooth]

13 hours ago, haarhaarhaar said:

In Ingrid's specific case, since enemy Peg Knight growths are better, then should you wait as long as possible to recruit her (especially if you were gonna raise her as a Peg Knight anyway)? She'd lose out on Riding and Authority ranks over time, but the stat increase would be significant (compared to average Lv20 PK Ingrid, +2 Def/Res and +1.5HP/Str)? 

I tend to recruit everyone I can ASAP, because I hate not having lots of time to (micro)manage their builds. It also means you have more room to pivot if your build isn't their default intermediate class, or they get stat-screwed once they join you.

I agree, i usually recruit during chapter 6 for anyone I've waited for. I do think their auto-levels use fixed growths rather than probability though.

12 hours ago, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said:

It depends on the unit, and the build you're going for. For example, if I want to make Ignatz a Brigand (for Death Blow), I should pick him up as a Fighter (wherein he joins with D Axes) rather than an Archer (E Axes). Plus, an earlier recruitment means an earlier start on building Authority rank.

Agreed, i definitely don't do this for everyone, especially for units where Fortress Knight certification makes some of the higher growths unnecessary. I just wanted to share how this actually works and why it is recommended by some.

9 hours ago, This boi uses Nino said:

How did you make the horizontal scrolling text effect?

And yeah I see, that sounds good.

I just used code tags, i didnt actually intend for it to do that lol.

[Barren]

Question about recruiting Ingrid at chapter 6. I know that you mentioned that she'll be auto leveled to be similar or equal to the enemy's stats so she'll be easier to level up. But with having E in authority and in axes, would you still be able to get her to learn Death Blow and get her authority to at least rank D in a reasonable amount of time? Because I know that from there she'll easily be able to pick up Falcon Knight and have her go on her marry way. The thing however is that fliers are only limited to flying battalions.

Based on the idea of waiting until chapter 6 to recruit her, the most logical path without stretching her development too thin would probably be keep tutoring her in authority and have her suggested goals be lances/authority and swords for a good while since her first flying battalion is at Rank D. So in other words it would somehow look like Pegasus Knight > Swordmaster > Falcon Knight since it will keep her speed growth high and swordmaster should help her strength growth issues. Plus you can keep tutoring her in authority/lance and flying along the way. So she should able to get something like lance prowess, swordbreaker/authority level 5 (since she has lady knight as her personal ability), alert stance, defiant avoid and maybe something like sword prowess in case of cursed ashiya sword+ for extra high crit chances.

Of course I could be wrong but that would be something that seems feasible no?

[Rengor1997]

On 8/9/2020 at 1:59 PM, Barren said:

Question about recruiting Ingrid at chapter 6. I know that you mentioned that she'll be auto leveled to be similar or equal to the enemy's stats so she'll be easier to level up. But with having E in authority and in axes, would you still be able to get her to learn Death Blow and get her authority to at least rank D in a reasonable amount of time? Because I know that from there she'll easily be able to pick up Falcon Knight and have her go on her marry way. The thing however is that fliers are only limited to flying battalions.

Based on the idea of waiting until chapter 6 to recruit her, the most logical path without stretching her development too thin would probably be keep tutoring her in authority and have her suggested goals be lances/authority and swords for a good while since her first flying battalion is at Rank D. So in other words it would somehow look like Pegasus Knight > Swordmaster > Falcon Knight since it will keep her speed growth high and swordmaster should help her strength growth issues. Plus you can keep tutoring her in authority/lance and flying along the way. So she should able to get something like lance prowess, swordbreaker/authority level 5 (since she has lady knight as her personal ability), alert stance, defiant avoid and maybe something like sword prowess in case of cursed ashiya sword+ for extra high crit chances.

Of course I could be wrong but that would be something that seems feasible no?

Ingrid recruited on the first sunday of ch 6 that you've set to authority/axes for example can get D authority by the last sunday if she's instructed from full motivation, since 4 goods will give 24 wexp each, so 20 x 3 + 24 x 2 = 104 > 100.

She can initially stay peg to get darting blow but then later on go brigand/archer -> wyv rider -> WL.

Its better to recruit as the stat jump happens in ch 6 because later on the stats are not worth the lost WEXP.

[Fraven Pooth]

On 8/9/2020 at 7:59 AM, Barren said:

Question about recruiting Ingrid at chapter 6. I know that you mentioned that she'll be auto leveled to be similar or equal to the enemy's stats so she'll be easier to level up. But with having E in authority and in axes, would you still be able to get her to learn Death Blow and get her authority to at least rank D in a reasonable amount of time? Because I know that from there she'll easily be able to pick up Falcon Knight and have her go on her marry way. The thing however is that fliers are only limited to flying battalions.

Based on the idea of waiting until chapter 6 to recruit her, the most logical path without stretching her development too thin would probably be keep tutoring her in authority and have her suggested goals be lances/authority and swords for a good while since her first flying battalion is at Rank D. So in other words it would somehow look like Pegasus Knight > Swordmaster > Falcon Knight since it will keep her speed growth high and swordmaster should help her strength growth issues. Plus you can keep tutoring her in authority/lance and flying along the way. So she should able to get something like lance prowess, swordbreaker/authority level 5 (since she has lady knight as her personal ability), alert stance, defiant avoid and maybe something like sword prowess in case of cursed ashiya sword+ for extra high crit chances.

Of course I could be wrong but that would be something that seems feasible no?

She can jump back down to Soldier/Noble if she REALLY needs a battalion for a battle during the month of Chapter 6, and still keep the nice stats that she gets when she's recruited as a Pegasus.

Personally, I don't really pay any attention to class growths in general, although since my first playthrough I've always played on NG+ with the Holy Tomb for stat-boosters. But at least in my experience, I would much rather have the extra 2 move and flying than the extra speed growth, especially for Ingrid since she should have Darting Blow and pretty good speed by the time she's at Advanced classes anyways.

Swordmaster's strength growth is nothing special, it's the same 10% as her other realistic options for Advanced. I generally like to have my fliers focus on lances/axes more than swords as well.

57 minutes ago, Rengor1997 said:

Ingrid recruited on the first sunday of ch 6 that you've set to authority/axes for example can get D authority by the last sunday if she's instructed from full motivation, since 4 goods will give 24 wexp each, so 20 x 3 + 24 x 2 = 104 > 100.

She can initially stay peg to get darting blow but then later on go brigand/archer -> wyv rider -> WL.

Its better to recruit as the stat jump happens in ch 6 because later on the stats are not worth the lost WEXP.

Just to clarify, this is assuming non-NG+ (no statues), Maddening, and no sauna. If she has full motivation before she's instructed (twice), and has Authority as one of her goals all month, she will always hit D by mission day. I didn't actually know this was possible, but I wanted to point out that none of this depends on any bonuses or RNG.

Edited August 14, 2020 by Fraven Pooth

[Barren]

4 hours ago, Fraven Pooth said:

She can jump back down to Soldier/Noble if she REALLY needs a battalion for a battle during the month of Chapter 6, and still keep the nice stats that she gets when she's recruited as a Pegasus.

Personally, I don't really pay any attention to class growths in general, although since my first playthrough I've always played on NG+ with the Holy Tomb for stat-boosters. But at least in my experience, I would much rather have the extra 2 move and flying than the extra speed growth, especially for Ingrid since she should have Darting Blow and pretty good speed by the time she's at Advanced classes anyways.

Swordmaster's strength growth is nothing special, it's the same 10% as her other realistic options for Advanced. I generally like to have my fliers focus on lances/axes more than swords as well.

 

5 hours ago, Rengor1997 said:

Ingrid recruited on the first sunday of ch 6 that you've set to authority/axes for example can get D authority by the last sunday if she's instructed from full motivation, since 4 goods will give 24 wexp each, so 20 x 3 + 24 x 2 = 104 > 100.

She can initially stay peg to get darting blow but then later on go brigand/archer -> wyv rider -> WL.

Its better to recruit as the stat jump happens in ch 6 because later on the stats are not worth the lost WEXP.

 

4 hours ago, Fraven Pooth said:

Just to clarify, this is assuming non-NG+ (no statues), Maddening, and no sauna. If she has full motivation before she's instructed (twice), and has Authority as one of her goals all month, she will always hit D by mission day. I didn't actually know this was possible, but I wanted to point out that none of this depends on any bonuses or RNG.

Thank you @Rengor1997 and @Fraven Poothfor the responses. I guess I wasn't sure if it was possible to have her still be able to get her into Wyvern Rider then Falcon Knight/Wyvern Lord because of when she gets recruited. I suppose that assuming maddening mode could mean that as long as you're determined to get her onto that wyvern route leveling up in lances + axes with a bit of authority would be achievable. And I can understand why Wyvern Rider pretty much outshines swordmaster in terms of strength growths and better movement. I was just a little worried about her speed not catching up as fast. Her 60% speed growth though I know won't take a hit regardless, I was just a bit worried about her growths because whether or not she gets blessed or cursed is all due to RNG. Nonetheless I will take that into consideration when I eventually try out maddening mode. Thanks again

[Fraven Pooth]

@Barren, glad i could help. I remember when i first started playing, i paid a lot of attention to class growths, and as i started playing I realized that I didn't really want to sacrifice movement or flying for better growths. Ingrid does have some protection from the RNG with her auto-levels and high bases. Wyvern classes have solid base stats to boot.

If i come across an enemy that i missed a speed benchmark for, i just make a note that I'll have to take it out with combat arts or chip from distance. If i sacrifice performance for class growths, i usually feel like I'm handicapping myself and the payoff isn't worth it.

Just my $.02, this is something i didnt realize until i actually jumped in and started playing.

[Barren]

2 hours ago, Fraven Pooth said:

@Barren, glad i could help. I remember when i first started playing, i paid a lot of attention to class growths, and as i started playing I realized that I didn't really want to sacrifice movement or flying for better growths. Ingrid does have some protection from the RNG with her auto-levels and high bases. Wyvern classes have solid base stats to boot.

If i come across an enemy that i missed a speed benchmark for, i just make a note that I'll have to take it out with combat arts or chip from distance. If i sacrifice performance for class growths, i usually feel like I'm handicapping myself and the payoff isn't worth it.

Just my $.02, this is something i didnt realize until i actually jumped in and started playing.

That makes sense. My very first playthrough I didn't recruit her until chapter 7 on Back Eagles. That was when I as going into it blind for the first time. Nowadays I just recruit her around chapter 3 or 4 since I can spend more time on developing her. This now helps me broaden my horizons on who and when to recruit units from other houses