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Robert Stewart

Fire Emblem Gaiden's Unused Dungeons

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Found something interesting when I was doing some work for RetroAchievments for Gaiden: Gaiden has some unused dungeon entrances! I did a quick Google and didn't see any results, and it's  not listed on the site here, so I assume these aren't widely known.

I  thought it was pretty neat, so I made a recording of them:

Most of the info is in the video description, but I'll copypasta some of it here:

Quote

I was able to access them by modifying the value the game writes to the map index before it gets written.

The first is the Desert Temple. This is the most interesting because it doesn't correspond to any other location on the world map, and it actually has unique map data! All that's in there is one fight with a HiKnight and Luck/HP lion heads, but it's more than the other two. Exiting leads you to Mila's Temple.

The second is just labeled "Fort"and appears to correspond to the location also called "Fort" near the end of Alm's Chapter 4. Unfortunately it doesn't  contain any actual new dungeon areas - it just drops the player in the Lost Woods, though it skips the Dolk's Fort entrance area. Perhaps the Fort was originally used for Celica's side of the map and was later moved? Or maybe the Lost Woods was meant to be entered from both sides of the map? Who can say?

One other thing to note is that the Fort location on the world map shares a similar sprite with other locations that have an area that can be explored by the player, but not in this instance. Maybe this leftover entrance is a side effect of that?

The final unused entrance is labelled Doma's Gate, which is shared with a location in Celica's Chapter 4. This location also has the same shared sprite I mentioned with the "Fort" location. This one also leads to the lost woods, though it leads to the northern entrance. Perhaps at an earlier stage, the player was meant to enter from Doma's gate directly?

 

Edited by Robert Stewart

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Very cool. I just completed Gaiden recently and enjoyed it. Looking at cut dungeons is very cool because that was a fun part of the game.

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Funny how they never reused any of these in the remake. They took Guardians and Dagons from unused enemies in Mystery of the Emblem, so they're no doubt aware of all these cut stuff. Thabes is great, but some more bonus dungeons on Valentia proper would have been near for post game. In fact, they should have put all the DLC stuff on the actual map like the Spot Pass Awakening things. Much as I like Gaiden for having a world map, it feels so incredibly linear to the point that it's just boring.

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Very interesting. Looking at weird unused stuff is always fun. For curiosity's sake, which byte of RAM needs to be modified in order to see these unused places for myself? I'd like to document this on The Cutting Room Floor and other places to spread the word. All credit will be given, of course.

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48 minutes ago, Darrman said:

Very interesting. Looking at weird unused stuff is always fun. For curiosity's sake, which byte of RAM needs to be modified in order to see these unused places for myself? I'd like to document this on The Cutting Room Floor and other places to spread the word. All credit will be given, of course.

Sure. After you select the move option on the overworld, you can alter $74B5 or $74B6 to change which tile you'll enter. I think $74B7 as well if the tile has three exits, but I'm not sure.

The values to get to these entrances are:

  • $3E - Desert Temple
  • $49 - Fort
  • $4C - Doma's Gate

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Unused stuff always interests me. More so in 2D games actually because 3D unfinished stuff (and glitches) reminds me too much that video games are thin 2D planes suspended and assembled in various ways in a 3D void and are human constructs.

 

9 hours ago, Jotari said:

Much as I like Gaiden for having a world map, it feels so incredibly linear to the point that it's just boring.

And thats saying something when Gaiden's world map is the "best" in FE. Though making for more optional stuff could mean having to reorient FE away from centralization on the main story.

 

1 minute ago, 𝙵ᴇɴʀᴇɪʀ said:

never thought there could actually be unused content in a NES game as well, especially in a time where the space on cartridges was quite limited. a good find indeed.

FE1 had a slew of things too.:

Dark Dragon and Sword of Light

Characters

Sabre (slightly different name to Savor from Gaiden) is an unused playable character, with Misheil’s portrait, who also has data as an enemy. Wylar is one of the first non-playable characters and doesn’t have a portrait. Basilisk, Salamander and Narga appear towards the end of the character list, along with Gaia; the first three are names of the dragon tribes, so maybe Gaia was going to be the Earth Dragon tribe’s name?

Items

Wyvern, Gargoyle, Salamander, Shenron, Neptune and Dark Dragon can be equipped by Mamkutes, but can’t be used to attack with. The Helarn staff has the unusual ability of making equipped weapons permanently indestructible and the staff itself has 22 uses! No wonder it was removed…

 

The joys of an infinite use Iron Sword

The joys of an infinite use Iron Sword

 

Before it was finally implemented in Thracia 776, it seems Fog of War was initially planned for this game, judging from the Telescope item, which claims to increase Vision by 5 when used. The Dark and Time Orbs (no Life Orb?) can be used 3 times each, but nothing seems to happen when you use them. Finally, we have the Fire Emblem in item form; unlike in Mystery of the Emblem, anyone can hold it—Shh, don’t tell anyone!

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1 minute ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

 

 

And thats saying something when Gaiden's world map is the "best" in FE. Though making for more optional stuff could mean having to reorient FE away from centralization on the main story.

It wouldn't be impossible if you worked the story around the map. Like say while you make progress in one part of the continent, the enemy counter attacks at another part, meaning you need to go back to an earlier section and play a new map there, with some reinforcements battles along the way. Or even just what I said before, but some of these extra maps in as post game stuff. It's great Echoes has a post game, but there's zero to actually do in Valentia itself once you beat the game. They could have utilized that to actually show a post war world for the characters with small single map side plots and stuff.

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16 minutes ago, Jotari said:

It wouldn't be impossible if you worked the story around the map. Like say while you make progress in one part of the continent, the enemy counter attacks at another part, meaning you need to go back to an earlier section and play a new map there, with some reinforcements battles along the way. Or even just what I said before, but some of these extra maps in as post game stuff. It's great Echoes has a post game, but there's zero to actually do in Valentia itself once you beat the game. They could have utilized that to actually show a post war world for the characters with small single map side plots and stuff.

Or, if you preferred preventing the enemy from getting an advantage at Fort CaptureMe, you could split your army in two and leave a force there to defend it. Though this would be somewhat unusual fluidity for FE stories. After Fates and 3H, I want more smaller choices instead of giant route splits.

And yeah, some postgame battles would be nice. Could be more ordinary stuff, or it could be a little grand. Why not have Zeke peacefully escorting Tatiana somewhere when a Duma Faithful remnant attacks and he has to protect her as she tries to escape? -Akin to the BSFE Camus battle again, which would serve as his memory trigger.

Edited by Interdimensional Observer

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Nice now time for a new gaiden remake for it... IT IS AMACING!

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