JimmyBeans Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 Fire Emblem has changed... And whether for better or for worse (or those who don't care either way) will be a discussion until the end of time. FE13, 14, and 16 have a massive amount of support convos as well as fe16 having tons of activities for characters showcasing one of the bigger changes, which has been the emphasis on supports and interactions unlike previous entries. This means that if a character catches your eye, you have a ton of content to dive into in regards to their personality and such things, and that sheer amount of content is why a lot of people love characters from those games. Now lets talk about older FE's, or to be more specific, characters that have very few lines and few/no supports convos. Some have a few quotes, join your army and then never speak again, and some (in the unfortunate case of my favorite game) even only have a death quote. So what is the appeal of some of these characters? Why do so many of us here at SF like characters from older games just as much, if not more than the more recent ones? There are quite a few reasons but 2 I want to give is..... 1. That character makes really good use out of the few lines they are given. Like Shadow Dragon Cain when he speaks to Marth about Cornelius in the prologue, and how his death quote tragically ties in with that. Spoiler “Prince Marth... Tell them... I did not run...” This is basically all of Cain's content throughout the whole game, besides the fact that Marth has a flashback if you are playing normal mode to that convo with Cain in the final chapter. It is of my opinion that with loads of more line and voice acting Cain's really good lines would have been muddied. Imagine if he had all these crit/victory quotes where he repeatedly reminded us of his desire to never back down, I don't think these lines would have the same effect that they do if that were the case, instead whenever I think of Cain, I think of this scene and his death quote. 2. Said character told a story through gameplay, I am sure we all have experiences like this. Cain is my pick for the reasons stated above, I have plenty more I could share but I am more curious to see what SF has to say on this subject. So who do you like that doesn't have a lot of content and why? Just a reminder that this isn't supposed to be a huge critique of newer games, instead mainly highlighting the appeal that previous entries still hold in their characters today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dandy Druid Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 Lene/Laylea! Has some of the least amount of lines in Gen 2 but none of them are wasted or filler. Each time she's in a dialogue, it either sets the story or characterizes herself. Her Ch 10 conversation with Lewyn really explains her motivations and shows her maturity a little bit. She had learned to grow despite not having what she wanted, which is familial stability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benice Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 Aran, mostly because he hard carried the DB. I got a bias for him, and I kinda feel that his lack of dialogue is part of the charm! I wouldn't say no to more characterization, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interdimensional Observer Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 8 minutes ago, Benice said: Aran, mostly because he hard carried the DB. I got a bias for him, and I kinda feel that his lack of dialogue is part of the charm! He does get one sorta snappy line.: Numida: "Aargh! Where are my guards? Why do I have to be the one to fight?!" Aran: "That’s right, I remember who you are. You let others do your dirty work while you run for safety. Looks like you’re running out of places to run, Senator." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etrurian emperor Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 Azelle's the big one. Such an interesting character with his deep personal relation with the main villain, his friendship with Rex, status and status as a bastard. But Genealogy has no supports. Azelle does get some chances to talk and give his view on Arvis but its always hindered by SNES limitations to some extend. I guess Arvis himself counts too. For such an important character he appears only very briefly, but that might have been the point. And then there's Hardin of course. In Shadow Dragon he stands out as being one of the few characters that has a substantial conversation with Marth....but that's also his only conversation. After that he's a mute for the entirety of the game. This makes the attempt to paint him as a close friend to Marth a bit weak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasori Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 Many of the gen 1 cast of fe4 are pretty efficient with their limited lines. They don't have many conversations, but you can tell really quickly what a character like Azelle, Lex, Dew, Sylvia and Tailtyu are like. For what little they give they're pretty interested or entertaining. Its something gen 2 does a lot worse. But there is also that boss in fe9 who captures the priests. He only has a few lines, but uses all of them that shows he has a blast being the more terrible person that he can be. I won't say they have very few lines, but I also want to say Shura and to a lesser extent Reina. Some characters have the entire cast to work with, but these two have to cram all their backstory in two support conversations. And both of those characters pain a very interesting picture of themselves. The game did't feel interested in exploring them further.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murozaki Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 Minerva for me, she is probably my favorite Archanea character, the way she struggles with being in a position that necessitates her to have a hardened heart while being too kind for that is compelling to me. Another Archanean example would be Gharnef for being a surprisingly well-done take on an evil mastermind character. His role in the story is simple: To be comically evil and to manipulate and kickstart the events of both FE11 and FE12, and he does a great job in both of such things. Beyond these two another notable example would be Kotaro from Fates, most of Fates' villains and antagonists are neither interesting nor threatening, so Kotaro for me stands out for getting a decent amount of characterization and presence in his short screentime. Specially in how he actually has a personal connection to a character that isn't Corrin, something Fates otherwise didn't have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAZ_2002 Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 Haha I've got many! Deimne, Sleuf, Ulster, Castor, and especially Robert. My boy has no lines other than his defeat and retreat quotes yet he's my favorite Thracia character. And does Scarlet count? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 I think Tomas literally has the least amount of speech across all of FE11. But that made him the perfect blank page for a certain deranged writer! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabulously Olivier Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 Bastian has a mere 3 support partners and is only available for the last few chapters of both games. But his every word is gold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 1 hour ago, Fabulously Olivier said: Bastian has a mere 3 support partners and is only available for the last few chapters of both games. But his every word is gold. Bastian is a cool case where his actions speak far louder than words. Kinda wish we'd get a bit more of that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabulously Olivier Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 15 minutes ago, eclipse said: Bastian is a cool case where his actions speak far louder than words. Kinda wish we'd get a bit more of that! A bit ironic given how much he loves the sound of his own voice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 5 minutes ago, Fabulously Olivier said: A bit ironic given how much he loves the sound of his own voice. That's why he can enjoy the sound of it off-screen! So the audience doesn't have to suffer through it! Still, gotta love how much he managed to get done, especially in RD. It's pretty telling when his absence helps to trigger a revolution! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmyBeans Posted March 5, 2021 Author Share Posted March 5, 2021 7 hours ago, Murozaki said: Another Archanean example would be Gharnef for being a surprisingly well-done take on an evil mastermind character. His role in the story is simple: To be comically evil and to manipulate and kickstart the events of both FE11 and FE12, and he does a great job in both of such things. Hard agree. I still find him very unique in the series as a whole given that most of the other members of his "archetype" tend to be a lot more like Jedah, in which they are the head servant of some dark god/dragon, whereas Gharnef wants it all just for him. Probably the most successful villain in his archetype as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baron the Shining Blade Posted March 6, 2021 Share Posted March 6, 2021 I know you wanted us to focus on older games here, but I feel the need to mention a certain someone from Echoes who was horribly shafted in the lines department. No, it's not the newcomer Faye. I'm talking about the pink fluffy-haired cleric from Novis, Miss "I'm ready to roll!" Genny (incidentally my favorite female character from SoV). Celica's story events see plenty of screentime from Mae, Boey, Saber, and Conrad. But Genny? Poor girl shows up in only one story event with literally only one line, and it's right at the beginning of Act 2 when the priory bell tolls for the death of Lima IV, right before you gain control of Celica. "Oh dear. I hope she’s dealing with this okay…" Very sweet and all, but......that's it? That's all she gets? Even though you will choose to recruit her (let's be real, only a fool or a challenge seeker passes up Celica's only cleric [Shade notwithstanding]), she doesn't partake in any later story events at all when even the other clerics get a fair share. Sure, there's the village exploration quotes, but all recruitable characters have them so, adorable as hers are, I'm not counting it here. And her one support chain? Is with Sonya, who can be missed (And guess what, I picked Deen my first playthrough -_-). Surely she could've been part of the fun; maybe as the gentle, peaceful one who tries to stop Mae and Boey from bickering so much, or she could comment on Boey's fear of Terrors by reassuring him that she can keep him healed and easily Seraphim the monsters to heck (if she's learned it). And she could easily have benefited from another support; maybe some girl talk with Mae, or being flustered at first then quickly warming up to Saber (since she likes older men, and their endings subtly imply the possibility they got together). I know we're talking a character from the remake of FE "Everyone-Gets-One-Line" Gaiden...but still, with Genny being a fave of mine, the lack of lines was really apparent. Poor girl only has her named said once, in her A support with Sonya. At least Duo Alm in Heroes made up for it by actually acknowledging her existence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dandy Druid Posted March 6, 2021 Share Posted March 6, 2021 7 hours ago, eclipse said: That's why he can enjoy the sound of it off-screen! So the audience doesn't have to suffer through it! Still, gotta love how much he managed to get done, especially in RD. It's pretty telling when his absence helps to trigger a revolution! I know why his absence is important, but damn I always want more Bastian. While we're talking obscure Tellius characters, I have to nominate Stefan as well. Pretty interesting character all around: background, recruitment, and personality. I always find him enjoyable and was floored when my 12 year old self accidentally recruited him many years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanty Pete's 1st Mate Posted March 6, 2021 Share Posted March 6, 2021 12 hours ago, Baron the Shining Blade said: Celica's story events see plenty of screentime from Mae, Boey, Saber, and Conrad. But Genny? Poor girl shows up in only one story event with literally only one line, and it's right at the beginning of Act 2 when the priory bell tolls for the death of Lima IV, right before you gain control of Celica. That's because she can die whenever, and isn't a forced recruit. Same with Kliff and Faye on Alm's route. 12 hours ago, Baron the Shining Blade said: Very sweet and all, but......that's it? That's all she gets? Even though you will choose to recruit her (let's be real, only a fool or a challenge seeker passes up Celica's only cleric [Shade notwithstanding]), she doesn't partake in any later story events at all when even the other clerics get a fair share. Sure, there's the village exploration quotes, but all recruitable characters have them so, adorable as hers are, I'm not counting it here. Yo. I wanted to beat Hard Mode with minimal recruitments. Genny gets the same degree of village quotes as all other non-forced units (more, in light of her early join time). 12 hours ago, Baron the Shining Blade said: And her one support chain? Is with Sonya, who can be missed (And guess what, I picked Deen my first playthrough -_-). Surely she could've been part of the fun; maybe as the gentle, peaceful one who tries to stop Mae and Boey from bickering so much, or she could comment on Boey's fear of Terrors by reassuring him that she can keep him healed and easily Seraphim the monsters to heck (if she's learned it). And she could easily have benefited from another support; maybe some girl talk with Mae, or being flustered at first then quickly warming up to Saber (since she likes older men, and their endings subtly imply the possibility they got together). Agreed with this much, Genny should have gotten another support. Saber would be good, and so would Nomah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etrurian emperor Posted March 6, 2021 Share Posted March 6, 2021 While I'm not especially attached to her I think there was a lot that could have been done with Vika. She'd be a nice extension of Tormod's family. She's the only bird Laguz who's a former slave rather than a Bird from one of the two island kingdoms so Vika could have given an interesting perspective on the bird tribe. Her king is on record as not really caring about the abuse of any Raven who leaves Kilvas so that should be an interesting conversation. Vika also nicely rounds out the LEA army. You've got Tormod the idealistic one, Vika the cynical one and Muarim as the mature dad. Maybe Vika and Tormod would have a relation akin to big sister and little brother with her merely humoring Tormod as her ''boss'', or maybe she'd really values Tormod as a leader due to him having saved her. Vika has some mild unique dialogue with the likes of Neasalla, Oliver, Canaighis(who she calls her hero) and Sanaki which could have led to all sorts of interesting supports. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonymousSpeed Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 Illios. Is that how it's spelled now? I unironically like that guy for his personality. In a series of flat and idealistic characters, it's a real breath of fresh air to have someone with actual self interest, yet alone a kind of funny one. I like Volke too, but since his body of dialogue is several dozens of times larger than Illios's, I figure he doesn't count. On 3/5/2021 at 7:35 PM, Baron the Shining Blade said: Genny The sheep will reap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lenticular Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 Shiharam. For a character who mostly exists as backstory for Jill and Haar and as a boss for one chapter he has a surprising amount of depth. It's easy to imagine him as a man trying to escape from corruption but ultimately getting irrevocably caught in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twilit Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 Sigrun is one that comes to mind. She doesn't get an abundance of dialogue, but she was very memorable to me in both her personality and design. One of my favorite character designs in the series, tbh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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