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sinfonic18

I'm not enjoying FE4 very much. Should I just give up on it?

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Alright (or all right for formal grammarist) so I've been playing Genealogy of the Holy War since a couple of users and some other members recommended it to me and I can say for certain it's been a roller-coaster, mostly a negative one. While I like some aspects of the game, the negatives outweigh the pros by a lot and the only reason I keep trying to trudge through it is because I love Fire Emblem and hate to just throw down a game of its and never touch it again but this game is making it hard to do that. I list some things about it that frustrate me beyond oblivion and I want to know if these are valid criticisms or am I just tired of FE? I'm not sure.

For one, I thought this would be no where near as clunky as FE1, but I was wrong, its some how even worse. I spent probably and hour and half today selling weapons and rings that my units got who didn't need it/couldn't use it and then trying to buy them only to have NO money to purchase it for that said unit. So I then head to the arena to perhaps fix that issue and more than HALF my units can't even get past the first round before being obliterated by a 15% WTD armor knight. That brings me onto another issue which is probably the most frustrating thing in FE4, but I will finish this first.

Never did I think doing simple things like trading weapons/items in a strategy game could be such a pain in the ***. I thought FE1 was bad with it's uncongenial interface but this blows it out of the water.

Like I wanted to give my Quan a silver lance that an enemy dropped. Simple enough right? Warp/return the unit that received it back to the castle, end turn so they can move, use that unit and sell the item to the pawnshop, warp/return/walk Quan to the nearest castle, have Ethlyn give him funds if he needs it, go the pawnshop, BUY IT, and then wait another turn so you can move, and then trudge all the way back to the army. And all that took like, 15 minutes. INSANE!!! WHAT WERE THEY THINKING MAKING THIS SO AWKWARD? I apologize for the caps, but I can't convey the frustration any other way lol.

Now on to the second gripe I have with the game...

The RNG system. Does FE4 have different RNG mechanics than the games after it or what? I know my luck is terrible with games but, how does a 5 hit axe user hit a Swordmaster with 30 Spd every single time???! My lvl 22 promoted Ayra should have never died wielding the lowest weight weapon ( a slim sword) against a couple of pirates with 3-5 hit! But she did, shamefully did, all because I had the worst luck in the world. Now I know people might think "Well this isn't the games fault, you're just unlucky" which may very well be true but I can't help but feel the game is screwy with it's RNG because it's happened before to other units but on a lesser scale. In the arena, I can't count how many times I've had the upper hand by a long shot with RNG, only for it to go against me and I die. 

Third... Villages. And perhaps this is a topic about mounted units in this game, or both. I swear, sometimes this game just puts you at the most unfair disadvantage at the very start of the map. Wanna get those villages? You have to use your horses. Oh wait, most of your horses SUCK in combat and when you hit that wall, and I mean WALL, of enemies they are going to obliterate your Calvary, and your infantry units are miles behind them missing all the action. So perhaps it's best to slow it down and not go on the offense and let some of the enemies come towards you so they're easier to deal with? Oh, there goes the village! Hope Grandma's family treasures weren't burnt to a crisp! Well let's go save the village so that doesn't happen! Congrats, half your units are dead because they are terrible to begin with and almost never get better. Maybe this isn't a legitimate criticism of the game, but in other FEs there is a fair playing field when trying to save villages, most of the brigand units spawn a couple turns later or don't move until certain turns pass but this game? They start walking their *** towards that place as soon as it starts and by the time you get there in one piece with the least amount of injuries possible it's already been destroyed. 

Unit balance is horrid. I thought the mechanic of having to have a skill to double enemies was stupid before I even picked up the game, and I was right about my suspicion unfortunately. Witnessing it myself makes it even worse, it basically just throws units down the drain from the start. Like, I didn't even use noish at all because he lacked Pursuit and hardly did any damage. Lex is another offender of this, because he uses axes which are atrocious in the game and lacks pursuit. Regardless of how his defense is, he is garbage without it. 😕 

Marriage system? What's the point? It was bad in Awakening but at least it was easier to comprehend. Here? Wait two units beside each other until 50 turns??? 50? FIFTY? I could have 2 FE6 maps done in that many turns. And who thought it was a good idea in this game with such clunky trading mechanics to make it even more CLUNKY by having to have units marry each other just in order to trade gold between spouses? Just... WHY? 


60% of my army died on Chapter 3 today and I just stopped caring and didn't reset. I wouldn't have even gotten that far without Sigurd and Ayra because the rest of the army can't whip their way out of a wet paper bag. My final straw for me was when they put Brigid, Claude and Talitu ACROSS THE ENTIRE MAP and expect me to go rescue them when I have an entire battalion of pirates and warriors heading towards me and destroying my castles. All of them died, and I gave in. I couldn't do it anymore. 

Is this valid criticism of the game or am I just salty? I would really like to finish the game and see the story because I do like that part of it, and the fact that I'd like to play every title in the series available to me but it truly feels like a darn chore to do that. A 3-4 hour chore that waste time just to see the story blips. 

Heck, I did a challenge on Binding Blade using on the crappy armors and ward on Hard mode and that was even more fun than this (and that was god awfully frustrating trying to use only Bors and Wendy to beat the game) 

Sorry about the wall of text! Grazie!

 


 

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33 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

Does FE4 have different RNG mechanics than the games after it or what?

Yes. FEs 6-13 have 2rn, meaning that the hitrate show to the player isn't what the actual chance is; FEs 1-5 have 1rn, meaning that displayed hit is what you get.

https://serenesforest.net/general/true-hit/

(This is a really old article, by the way. It is also in 13)

Anyways, if you're upset enough to write a few paragraphs about why you don't enjoy the game, it's almost certainly for the best that you stop playing. FE4 is unique in the franchise, and it won't vibe with everyone because of it.

That said, if you do actually want to finish the game, I have some advice as someone else who isn't a fan of FE4.

33 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

Oh wait, most of your horses SUCK in combat and when you hit that wall, and I mean WALL, of enemies they are going to obliterate your Calvary, and your infantry units are miles behind them missing all the action.

This should not be a huge problem between rings, Sigurd, Quan, Finn* and Lex; anybody who has promoted into having a horse should also be fine. You don't have to bait a whole platoon at once; getting one or two is probably a good idea. As for more potent attacking, giving Midir the Killer Bow can make him fairly potent. He'll still be not good, but certainly decent enough. Basically, don't discard a unit from their face value or because they're worse than Sigurd. Plus, if you get Lachesis to promote, she can delete everything.

Furthermore, most units should be quite viable if you use the arena a lot.

*Especially once he gets the brave lance in chapter 2.

Plus, the villages are incentive to not turtle, not a death threat. If it bothers you so much to not reach all of the villages, you'll probably have to have a plan right out of the gate to save them-It is meant to be a big challenge to save them all. If you don't, then just take what you can.

33 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

WHAT WERE THEY THINKING MAKING THIS SO AWKWARD?

A few solutions for this:

  1. Use Dew. He can give gold freely and receives it very easily.
  2. Manage who gets what when you can; if you want Lex to have the defence ring, for example, then make sure he defeats the enemy who has it.
  3. Funds shouldn't be a huge problem for anyone you're using due to the arena, so use that to your benefit.
33 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

I can't count how many times I've had the upper hand by a long shot with RNG, only for it to go against me and I die. 

The game gives you saves at the start of every turn, so you can redo a turn quite easily.

33 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

Lex is another offender of this, because he uses axes which are atrocious in the game and lacks pursuit. Regardless of how his defense is, he is garbage without it. 😕 

Here's the thing-Axes may have huge weight, but since few enemies have pursuit and Lex doesn't have it, he doesn't really care about the weight. Axes boast a high mt, (The steel axe, which IIRC you can buy in ch. 1 or 2, has a huge 18 mt) and Lex's Elite skill makes him grow exceedingly quickly so that he can reach his great promotion.

...And Vantage exists, I guess.

Anyways, yeah. Just because a unit lacks pursuit doesn't make them useless; the ability to tank with mobility is still helpful! He can still deal, say 20-25 damage to every enemy in his way or so, which is makes them easy pickings for everyone else.

33 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

Here? Wait two units beside each other until 50 turns??? 50? FIFTY? I could have 2 FE6 maps done in that many turns. And who thought it was a good idea in this game with such clunky trading mechanics to make it even more CLUNKY by having to have units marry each other just in order to trade gold between spouses? Just... WHY? 

Units don't have to be adjacent to gain love points, so you really shouldn't HAVE to try to get them unless everyone's inside the castle the whole time. Don't worry too much about pairings; the game is designed to be beatable no matter how badly you screw yourself or got your units to screw, so don't sweat it. Plus, you can always kill someone and bring 'em back later to make sure that they die a virgin instead of someone else! 🙃

33 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

My final straw for me was when they put Brigid, Claude and Talitu ACROSS THE ENTIRE MAP and expect me to go rescue them when I have an entire battalion of pirates and warriors heading towards me and destroying my castles. All of them died, and I gave in. I couldn't do it anymore. 

I get how Brigid died, but how did Taltiyu and Claud die? They should be fine.

And I am saying this who detests this map; you can just leave Brigid and use the Valkyrie staff for her. I'd advocate for letting her talk to Edain to get the Yewfelle, but you don't have to. The Valkyrie's pretty cool.

 

From the sounds of it, you're in a bad spot with your army, so personally, I'd suggest either stopping now, or restarting and using more units/using the arena more.

EDIT: Also, if you do continue, there's a bridge in chapter 4 that requires Dew to lower it. The game tells you this...In a village that you have to save from burning down, so it can be missed.

Edited by Benice

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8 hours ago, sinfonic18 said:

Now on to the second gripe I have with the game...

The RNG system. Does FE4 have different RNG mechanics than the games after it or what? I know my luck is terrible with games but, how does a 5 hit axe user hit a Swordmaster with 30 Spd every single time???! My lvl 22 promoted Ayra should have never died wielding the lowest weight weapon ( a slim sword) against a couple of pirates with 3-5 hit! But she did, shamefully did, all because I had the worst luck in the world. Now I know people might think "Well this isn't the games fault, you're just unlucky" which may very well be true but I can't help but feel the game is screwy with it's RNG because it's happened before to other units but on a lesser scale. In the arena, I can't count how many times I've had the upper hand by a long shot with RNG, only for it to go against me and I die.

Yes. It and FEs 1-5 use what people call 1rn, meaning that it actually rolls the dice that way and calls it a day. Every Fire Emblem after uses what is called 2rn, meaning that it runs those odds twice and used the average of those two numbers instead, which is why they say the game is lying to you. If the hit is above 50, the odds are actually higher than what you see and if it’s below, the chances are lower than what you see.

I think fe4’s RNG is also different in the way that the seed (what is going to happen) is generated in the exact same way every time. If you and I were to boot up a new file if fe4 and do everything in exactly the same way our rng would always be exactly the same. The only way to change it (again, someone correct me if I’m wrong) is to fight in the arena which can be problematic for obvious reasons.

8 hours ago, sinfonic18 said:

Third... Villages. And perhaps this is a topic about mounted units in this game, or both. I swear, sometimes this game just puts you at the most unfair disadvantage at the very start of the map. Wanna get those villages? You have to use your horses. Oh wait, most of your horses SUCK in combat and when you hit that wall, and I mean WALL, of enemies they are going to obliterate your Calvary, and your infantry units are miles behind them missing all the action. So perhaps it's best to slow it down and not go on the offense and let some of the enemies come towards you so they're easier to deal with? Oh, there goes the village! Hope Grandma's family treasures weren't burnt to a crisp! Well let's go save the village so that doesn't happen! Congrats, half your units are dead because they are terrible to begin with and almost never get better. Maybe this isn't a legitimate criticism of the game, but in other FEs there is a fair playing field when trying to save villages, most of the brigand units spawn a couple turns later or don't move until certain turns pass but this game? They start walking their *** towards that place as soon as it starts and by the time you get there in one piece with the least amount of injuries possible it's already been destroyed. 

I don’t remember specific details, but this often isn’t true. What I mean is that, some far away brigands will usually wait until you seize the nearby castle before going to the villages. They’re usually meant as an anti-turtling deterrent, what units are you using? Do they have good weapons? Defeating enemies shouldn’t be that hard.

8 hours ago, sinfonic18 said:

Unit balance is horrid. I thought the mechanic of having to have a skill to double enemies was stupid before I even picked up the game, and I was right about my suspicion unfortunately. Witnessing it myself makes it even worse, it basically just throws units down the drain from the start. Like, I didn't even use noish at all because he lacked Pursuit and hardly did any damage. Lex is another offender of this, because he uses axes which are atrocious in the game and lacks pursuit. Regardless of how his defense is, he is garbage without it. 😕 

Pursuit isn’t really necessary because most units don’t have it, brave weapons are fairly common from events, and units without it can still get enemies low enough that anyone else could take them out.

But I never had to deal with that with Lex, I got the secret event to give him a brave axe. Which is one complaint I do have about the game, since without a guide these are virtually impossible to find but they are quite useful. It would be fine if these just gave you one stat up or something, but these hidden events (which consist of having a specific unit wait in a specific tile, usually) have really good rewards like a brave axe or pursuit ring. Which is frustrating since you basically have to use a guide since there’s no reason to ever have anyone go to the out of the way locations.

8 hours ago, sinfonic18 said:

Marriage system? What's the point? It was bad in Awakening but at least it was easier to comprehend. Here? Wait two units beside each other until 50 turns??? 50? FIFTY? I could have 2 FE6 maps done in that many turns. And who thought it was a good idea in this game with such clunky trading mechanics to make it even more CLUNKY by having to have units marry each other just in order to trade gold between spouses? Just... WHY? 

Characters don’t have to wait next to each other to get married, they will always be building love points on the map together and certain talk events can boost their love by a bit or a lot. Waiting is simply an easier way to control the pairings.

8 hours ago, sinfonic18 said:

60% of my army died on Chapter 3 today and I just stopped caring and didn't reset. I wouldn't have even gotten that far without Sigurd and Ayra because the rest of the army can't whip their way out of a wet paper bag. My final straw for me was when they put Brigid, Claude and Talitu ACROSS THE ENTIRE MAP and expect me to go rescue them when I have an entire battalion of pirates and warriors heading towards me and destroying my castles. All of them died, and I gave in. I couldn't do it anymore.

If you’re unaware, you can go into the settings menu and turn on auto saving every turn, which makes it so you’re offered a prompt to save at every turn. You can also manually save each turn by clicking on an empty tile as long as no units have moved yet. I recommend turning on the auto saving but manually saving in different slots every so often so you don’t lock yourself into a unit death after a bad turn.

8 hours ago, sinfonic18 said:

Is this valid criticism of the game or am I just salty? I would really like to finish the game and see the story because I do like that part of it, and the fact that I'd like to play every title in the series available to me but it truly feels like a darn chore to do that. A 3-4 hour chore that waste time just to see the story blips.

I don’t think it really matters whether or not the criticisms are “valid”, you’re not enjoying it and that’s that.

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If you're not having fun, then don't play.  Video games are meant to be enjoyed, not suffered through.

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38 minutes ago, eclipse said:

If you're not having fun, then don't play.  Video games are meant to be enjoyed, not suffered through.

Seconding this. If you don't like it now, it's not worth enduring it any longer, as it isn't likely you'll find something that makes it worth suffering through.

Edited by Shadow Mir

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17 hours ago, sinfonic18 said:

Is this valid criticism of the game or am I just salty? I would really like to finish the game and see the story because I do like that part of it, and the fact that I'd like to play every title in the series available to me but it truly feels like a darn chore to do that. A 3-4 hour chore that waste time just to see the story blips.

judging by what you wrote, i think you might be playing it the wrong way.

i'm not saying that to sound mean, mind you, but rather because most people tend to approach FE4 in the same manner of playing with GBA or post-GBA games, wich is kind of a mistake because Genealogy, as much as Gaiden under some aspects, was/is a whole different beast, with different gameplay concepts and features.

going by few examples:

Quote

Never did I think doing simple things like trading weapons/items in a strategy game could be such a pain in the ***. I thought FE1 was bad with it's uncongenial interface but this blows it out of the water.

Like I wanted to give my Quan a silver lance that an enemy dropped. Simple enough right? Warp/return the unit that received it back to the castle, end turn so they can move, use that unit and sell the item to the pawnshop, warp/return/walk Quan to the nearest castle, have Ethlyn give him funds if he needs it, go the pawnshop, BUY IT, and then wait another turn so you can move, and then trudge all the way back to the army. And all that took like, 15 minutes. INSANE!!! WHAT WERE THEY THINKING MAKING THIS SO AWKWARD? I apologize for the caps, but I can't convey the frustration any other way lol.

perhaps you could have just waited for the next chapter to start instead, as a valid alternative.

that way everyone would have been in the castle at the beginning, letting yourself manage things way easier, rather than wasting time going back and forth from castles in the middle of a chapter just to buy one item.

Quote

The RNG system. Does FE4 have different RNG mechanics than the games after it or what? I know my luck is terrible with games but, how does a 5 hit axe user hit a Swordmaster with 30 Spd every single time???! My lvl 22 promoted Ayra should have never died wielding the lowest weight weapon ( a slim sword) against a couple of pirates with 3-5 hit! But she did, shamefully did, all because I had the worst luck in the world. Now I know people might think "Well this isn't the games fault, you're just unlucky" which may very well be true but I can't help but feel the game is screwy with it's RNG because it's happened before to other units but on a lesser scale. In the arena, I can't count how many times I've had the upper hand by a long shot with RNG, only for it to go against me and I die.

understandable, as RNG in Genealogy can become quite annoying at times.

however, shooting enemies with ranged units first, and then letting the melees move in to finish the job is always a good strategy. better safe than sorry.

also, the weapon triangle along with terrain bonuses play a huge factor in this game, to the point that you can potentially get destroyed or obliterate an enemy instead in the arena just by switching weapons to exploit weaknesses. weapon weight does have a role as well, but compared to the weapon triangle itself, it's kinda marginal in terms of bonuses.

Quote

Villages. And perhaps this is a topic about mounted units in this game, or both. I swear, sometimes this game just puts you at the most unfair disadvantage at the very start of the map. Wanna get those villages? You have to use your horses. Oh wait, most of your horses SUCK in combat and when you hit that wall, and I mean WALL, of enemies they are going to obliterate your Calvary, and your infantry units are miles behind them missing all the action. So perhaps it's best to slow it down and not go on the offense and let some of the enemies come towards you so they're easier to deal with? Oh, there goes the village! Hope Grandma's family treasures weren't burnt to a crisp! Well let's go save the village so that doesn't happen! Congrats, half your units are dead because they are terrible to begin with and almost never get better. Maybe this isn't a legitimate criticism of the game, but in other FEs there is a fair playing field when trying to save villages, most of the brigand units spawn a couple turns later or don't move until certain turns pass but this game? They start walking their *** towards that place as soon as it starts and by the time you get there in one piece with the least amount of injuries possible it's already been destroyed. 

while some villages might be harder to reach compared to others, they're not mandatory.

besides, on-foot units are supposed to move straight to the main castles, as they're not really meant to move all around the map. flyers and horses are there for that.

in Genealogy, unless you already have a decent unit with stacked stats, and you're confident enough that it will survive on its own, rushing to places with a split army will most likely backfire soon or later.

a compact army that moves in defensive formations will perform overall way better in the long run, and you won't be held back by some weaker unit when you can compensate for its lack of performance with different strategies.

Quote

Unit balance is horrid. I thought the mechanic of having to have a skill to double enemies was stupid before I even picked up the game, and I was right about my suspicion unfortunately. Witnessing it myself makes it even worse, it basically just throws units down the drain from the start. Like, I didn't even use noish at all because he lacked Pursuit and hardly did any damage. Lex is another offender of this, because he uses axes which are atrocious in the game and lacks pursuit. Regardless of how his defense is, he is garbage without it.

there's no denying it, sadly the game is far from being balanced in terms of units.

you can eventually work around the lack of some skills by trading/using specific items, weapons or dedicated builds, but a weaker unit will most likely end up dealing with brigands in order to protect villages from being plundered.

Quote

Marriage system? What's the point? It was bad in Awakening but at least it was easier to comprehend. Here? Wait two units beside each other until 50 turns??? 50? FIFTY? I could have 2 FE6 maps done in that many turns. And who thought it was a good idea in this game with such clunky trading mechanics to make it even more CLUNKY by having to have units marry each other just in order to trade gold between spouses? Just... WHY?

keep in mind that we're talking about a SNES game here, actually the very first that introduced some sort of supports. you even get stats boosts and items via conversations, so i'd say waiting for units to get married is not really that big of a deal when you even get useful stuff in return. that's just me though.

as for money, trading between couples is more like an additional feature.

the main money traders are thiefs. then there's items/weapons that can steal money from enemies. then there's visiting villages. then there's the arenas.

there's plenty of ways to get money, you just need to plan wisely about how and when to do it.

Quote

60% of my army died on Chapter 3 today and I just stopped caring and didn't reset. I wouldn't have even gotten that far without Sigurd and Ayra because the rest of the army can't whip their way out of a wet paper bag. My final straw for me was when they put Brigid, Claude and Talitu ACROSS THE ENTIRE MAP and expect me to go rescue them when I have an entire battalion of pirates and warriors heading towards me and destroying my castles. All of them died, and I gave in. I couldn't do it anymore.

trying to do arenas at the start of a new chapter can become a good routine, since you can get both money and levels with those.

as for the pirates section, you're meant to escape to the tower of Blagi with Brigid. once you reach Claude, tanking pirates shouldn't be a problem when you have a healer and a mage helping you, as long as you send either your melees or your horses to the rescue later. warp/return staves and rings always help to move around faster.

Quote

Is this valid criticism of the game or am I just salty? I would really like to finish the game and see the story because I do like that part of it, and the fact that I'd like to play every title in the series available to me but it truly feels like a darn chore to do that. A 3-4 hour chore that waste time just to see the story blips.

mh...i think it might be salt, with a touch of pepper.

jokes aside, there's really no mid ways about Genealogy: you either like it, or you don't. if the game is that frustrating for you, then you could either drop it or just leave it be for a while. you can always pick it up another time, if you're willing to give it another try.

let's be clear about it: Genealogy is not perfect by any means, and it's far from being forgiving. however, once you understand how it plays, or rather, how it should be played, it can become quite an interesting experience, surely different from the most recent titles.

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23 hours ago, Benice said:

Yes. FEs 6-13 have 2rn, meaning that the hitrate show to the player isn't what the actual chance is; FEs 1-5 have 1rn, meaning that displayed hit is what you get.

https://serenesforest.net/general/true-hit/

(This is a really old article, by the way. It is also in 13)

Anyways, if you're upset enough to write a few paragraphs about why you don't enjoy the game, it's almost certainly for the best that you stop playing. FE4 is unique in the franchise, and it won't vibe with everyone because of it.

That said, if you do actually want to finish the game, I have some advice as someone else who isn't a fan of FE4.

This should not be a huge problem between rings, Sigurd, Quan, Finn* and Lex; anybody who has promoted into having a horse should also be fine. You don't have to bait a whole platoon at once; getting one or two is probably a good idea. As for more potent attacking, giving Midir the Killer Bow can make him fairly potent. He'll still be not good, but certainly decent enough. Basically, don't discard a unit from their face value or because they're worse than Sigurd. Plus, if you get Lachesis to promote, she can delete everything.

Furthermore, most units should be quite viable if you use the arena a lot.

*Especially once he gets the brave lance in chapter 2.

Plus, the villages are incentive to not turtle, not a death threat. If it bothers you so much to not reach all of the villages, you'll probably have to have a plan right out of the gate to save them-It is meant to be a big challenge to save them all. If you don't, then just take what you can.

A few solutions for this:

  1. Use Dew. He can give gold freely and receives it very easily.
  2. Manage who gets what when you can; if you want Lex to have the defence ring, for example, then make sure he defeats the enemy who has it.
  3. Funds shouldn't be a huge problem for anyone you're using due to the arena, so use that to your benefit.

The game gives you saves at the start of every turn, so you can redo a turn quite easily.

Here's the thing-Axes may have huge weight, but since few enemies have pursuit and Lex doesn't have it, he doesn't really care about the weight. Axes boast a high mt, (The steel axe, which IIRC you can buy in ch. 1 or 2, has a huge 18 mt) and Lex's Elite skill makes him grow exceedingly quickly so that he can reach his great promotion.

...And Vantage exists, I guess.

Anyways, yeah. Just because a unit lacks pursuit doesn't make them useless; the ability to tank with mobility is still helpful! He can still deal, say 20-25 damage to every enemy in his way or so, which is makes them easy pickings for everyone else.

Units don't have to be adjacent to gain love points, so you really shouldn't HAVE to try to get them unless everyone's inside the castle the whole time. Don't worry too much about pairings; the game is designed to be beatable no matter how badly you screw yourself or got your units to screw, so don't sweat it. Plus, you can always kill someone and bring 'em back later to make sure that they die a virgin instead of someone else! 🙃

I get how Brigid died, but how did Taltiyu and Claud die? They should be fine.

And I am saying this who detests this map; you can just leave Brigid and use the Valkyrie staff for her. I'd advocate for letting her talk to Edain to get the Yewfelle, but you don't have to. The Valkyrie's pretty cool.

 

From the sounds of it, you're in a bad spot with your army, so personally, I'd suggest either stopping now, or restarting and using more units/using the arena more.

EDIT: Also, if you do continue, there's a bridge in chapter 4 that requires Dew to lower it. The game tells you this...In a village that you have to save from burning down, so it can be missed.

Well that makes a lot more sense now why the odds seem higher in FE4 because it's an actual 5% or so. (The same system is in FE13? I never knew...)

You're most likely right, and I should put it down for the good of it all, but tomorrow I think I will pick it up again and restart the game over, again... for the 4th time... Because I don't know what is good for me and I simply love this franchise too much to really give up on it, regardless of how messed up I think the game was designed. So all your advice will go into use, I guess.

The problem with that though is the entire platoon moves in together from what I've experienced, and that makes it extremely difficult (especially without a dancer) since my units can't one round them outside of Ayra, Sigurd and Jamke (and maybe my Azel). I used Jamke instead of Midir as my bow user and he usually ended up killing enemies instead of weakening them, further leaving my mounts in the dust due to EXP. Raquesis (or Lachesis) died in Chapter 2, which now I really regret letting her die. More incentive to start over, I guess.

That's the thing: The arena is very hard to get EXP from for most of my units because they can barely get past the first round, even with different weapons. IF , and big IF, I'm lucky, I'll get Finn or Lex or some other unit to round 2 or 3 before an enemy that outclasses them comes up or I just get RNG screwed, and no amount of trying over will get me past that hump. That's another thing I've been waiting forever to get is those items like the Brave Axe and Pursuit ring, which have never shown up. Where exactly do you get those?

I need to give up on my OCD stemmed from the GBA games to get every village I can. It's just different in this game. I just wish it was a bit more fair though where it positions the enemies, not right beside the town. I never did save every one of them (especially on Ch 2) but I did get most of them. But it was at the expense of lives lol. My Dew died in Chapter 1 due to the aforementioned platoons of enemies that run towards you. He got unlucky, of course, and I didn't think I would need him but now looking back I regret letting him die. 

The problem with saving after every turn is I eventually save myself into a rut like I am now. Like how I got Claude and Talitu stuck on that island trapped by pirates with not much to kill them with. Yes I could just not save and maybe save after, idk, like every 2 or 3 turns, but in this game resetting after 3 turns spent is like resetting and entire chapter. 

I have observered that about Lex while using him and he isn't the worst cav I have but he misses a lot. He has zero chance against any sword wielding enemy and even with his high defense usually ends up getting overpowered, granted I don't put him in those positions at all during regular play but in the Arena he runs into that quite often. Vantage never really got useful on him because I never let my units get that low on health if I can help it. I bought the Silver Axe for him in chapter 3, how does it fare against Steel? I never really thought about using him to set up kills, I'd always do it vice-versa so he gets levels faster but I am playing it wrong.

The Marriage thing just seems way to much work for what it's worth. What happens if I don't make any of my units boink another? From what I understand I get child units some time but I'd like to make this game as easy as possible with how much trouble I have with it so I'd like to make the most optimal pairings. But it just seems like more worth than what it's worth.

Also I see what you did there LOL

Talitu and Claude died because those pirates just north-east of them in the oceans eventually made their way to the shore and waltzed on over towards them with a dead Bridgid north-east and the rest of the army a 1000 miles away. (not literally but I you get what I mean) No way I could've saved them however I tried. 

Like I mentioned before I'm going to restart and take it step by step, I can't play with efficiency or with the mindset I had with the GBA games. I have to change my entire playstyle and if that doesn't work I'll just drop it completely even though I hate to do it.

(Well if that's the case I would've had to restart anyway. ;( )

 

22 hours ago, Hasechi said:

just wait for the remake. FE4 is a great game. I think high chance that the game would be remade. 

I would support a remake for this. I think modern amenities would benefit it, greatly.

15 hours ago, Sooks said:

Yes. It and FEs 1-5 use what people call 1rn, meaning that it actually rolls the dice that way and calls it a day. Every Fire Emblem after uses what is called 2rn, meaning that it runs those odds twice and used the average of those two numbers instead, which is why they say the game is lying to you. If the hit is above 50, the odds are actually higher than what you see and if it’s below, the chances are lower than what you see.

I think fe4’s RNG is also different in the way that the seed (what is going to happen) is generated in the exact same way every time. If you and I were to boot up a new file if fe4 and do everything in exactly the same way our rng would always be exactly the same. The only way to change it (again, someone correct me if I’m wrong) is to fight in the arena which can be problematic for obvious reasons.

I don’t remember specific details, but this often isn’t true. What I mean is that, some far away brigands will usually wait until you seize the nearby castle before going to the villages. They’re usually meant as an anti-turtling deterrent, what units are you using? Do they have good weapons? Defeating enemies shouldn’t be that hard.

Pursuit isn’t really necessary because most units don’t have it, brave weapons are fairly common from events, and units without it can still get enemies low enough that anyone else could take them out.

But I never had to deal with that with Lex, I got the secret event to give him a brave axe. Which is one complaint I do have about the game, since without a guide these are virtually impossible to find but they are quite useful. It would be fine if these just gave you one stat up or something, but these hidden events (which consist of having a specific unit wait in a specific tile, usually) have really good rewards like a brave axe or pursuit ring. Which is frustrating since you basically have to use a guide since there’s no reason to ever have anyone go to the out of the way locations.

Characters don’t have to wait next to each other to get married, they will always be building love points on the map together and certain talk events can boost their love by a bit or a lot. Waiting is simply an easier way to control the pairings.

If you’re unaware, you can go into the settings menu and turn on auto saving every turn, which makes it so you’re offered a prompt to save at every turn. You can also manually save each turn by clicking on an empty tile as long as no units have moved yet. I recommend turning on the auto saving but manually saving in different slots every so often so you don’t lock yourself into a unit death after a bad turn.

I don’t think it really matters whether or not the criticisms are “valid”, you’re not enjoying it and that’s that.

So if that's the case, if I were to start the game from scratch would I get the same growths as I did on the previous file? 

They have steel weapons or greater. Except my Azel, who only has a Thunder and Fire tome.

Yup I never knew about any of this before I posted this and if I did I might've had an easier time. Mostly the guides I was looking at are for the marriage or unit tiering. 

 

10 hours ago, eclipse said:

If you're not having fun, then don't play.  Video games are meant to be enjoyed, not suffered through.

10 hours ago, Shadow Mir said:

Seconding this. If you don't like it now, it's not worth enduring it any longer, as it isn't likely you'll find something that makes it worth suffering through.

I like some aspects of the game, it's not a total negative crap show. But, yeah... It's probably best to just put it down and I most definitely will if this next run doesn't go very well. This game just hasn't captivated me like the GBA or GC/Wii/Switch games have. 

 

5 hours ago, 𝙵ᴇɴʀᴇɪʀ said:

judging by what you wrote, i think you might be playing it the wrong way.

i'm not saying that to sound mean, mind you, but rather because most people tend to approach FE4 in the same manner of playing with GBA or post-GBA games, wich is kind of a mistake because Genealogy, as much as Gaiden under some aspects, was/is a whole different beast, with different gameplay concepts and features.

going by few examples:

perhaps you could have just waited for the next chapter to start instead, as a valid alternative.

that way everyone would have been in the castle at the beginning, letting yourself manage things way easier, rather than wasting time going back and forth from castles in the middle of a chapter just to buy one item.

understandable, as RNG in Genealogy can become quite annoying at times.

however, shooting enemies with ranged units first, and then letting the melees move in to finish the job is always a good strategy. better safe than sorry.

also, the weapon triangle along with terrain bonuses play a huge factor in this game, to the point that you can potentially get destroyed or obliterate an enemy instead in the arena just by switching weapons to exploit weaknesses. weapon weight does have a role as well, but compared to the weapon triangle itself, it's kinda marginal in terms of bonuses.

while some villages might be harder to reach compared to others, they're not mandatory.

besides, on-foot units are supposed to move straight to the main castles, as they're not really meant to move all around the map. flyers and horses are there for that.

in Genealogy, unless you already have a decent unit with stacked stats, and you're confident enough that it will survive on its own, rushing to places with a split army will most likely backfire soon or later.

a compact army that moves in defensive formations will perform overall way better in the long run, and you won't be held back by some weaker unit when you can compensate for its lack of performance with different strategies.

there's no denying it, sadly the game is far from being balanced in terms of units.

you can eventually work around the lack of some skills by trading/using specific items, weapons or dedicated builds, but a weaker unit will most likely end up dealing with brigands in order to protect villages from being plundered.

keep in mind that we're talking about a SNES game here, actually the very first that introduced some sort of supports. you even get stats boosts and items via conversations, so i'd say waiting for units to get married is not really that big of a deal when you even get useful stuff in return. that's just me though.

as for money, trading between couples is more like an additional feature.

the main money traders are thiefs. then there's items/weapons that can steal money from enemies. then there's visiting villages. then there's the arenas.

there's plenty of ways to get money, you just need to plan wisely about how and when to do it.

trying to do arenas at the start of a new chapter can become a good routine, since you can get both money and levels with those.

as for the pirates section, you're meant to escape to the tower of Blagi with Brigid. once you reach Claude, tanking pirates shouldn't be a problem when you have a healer and a mage helping you, as long as you send either your melees or your horses to the rescue later. warp/return staves and rings always help to move around faster.

mh...i think it might be salt, with a touch of pepper.

jokes aside, there's really no mid ways about Genealogy: you either like it, or you don't. if the game is that frustrating for you, then you could either drop it or just leave it be for a while. you can always pick it up another time, if you're willing to give it another try.

let's be clear about it: Genealogy is not perfect by any means, and it's far from being forgiving. however, once you understand how it plays, or rather, how it should be played, it can become quite an interesting experience, surely different from the most recent titles.

I take no offense to it all. I'm playing it blind mostly and I have this weird style of play with FE so I most likely am playing it wrong. 

It's salt, no denying that. When I wrote the original post I wasn't very happy at all and wasn't thinking too great. I don't want to spew hate for the game, because it's not really a bad title per-say in my opinion, it just has some questionable design flaws that just make it sometimes a chore more than it is fun. But it still has that FE feel to it, I can't explain it but it's the reason why I don't want to give up on it.


 

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3 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

(The same system is in FE13? I never knew...)

Ah, I meant 2rn, not 1rn. Awakening uses 2.

Also, Fates has a really weird mixed rn where hitrates above 50 have something similar to 2rn, (but not quite as extreme) while anything below 50 uses 1rn.

6 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

The problem with that though is the entire platoon moves in together from what I've experienced, and that makes it extremely difficult (especially without a dancer) since my units can't one round them outside of Ayra, Sigurd and Jamke (and maybe my Azel).

My advice is to not overlook Quan; he lacks pursuit, but he's really good. His growths are solid and he's bulky.

7 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

That's the thing: The arena is very hard to get EXP from for most of my units because they can barely get past the first round, even with different weapons.

Really? In my experience, even the weakest units can get past round one; my base level Noish made it into round three in chapter 3.

It's possible that I got lucky, but I used only Finn, Quan, Sigurd and Midir* as mounted units in combat and, as of the end of chapter 2, I have not let a single village get wholly burnt. I think Sigurd had the speed ring, but it may have been Quan. Midir had the skill ring, but he really didn't need it. I also put the defense ring on Dew, because I decided to make him a combat unit for no reason other than the fact that he's bad at it.

You don't have to get rid of every enemy with your cavs-In chapter 1, there's that one village on the opposite side of the map that I sent Sigurd to deal with. There were still tons of enemies elsewhere. Super Canto is also a thing in this game, so your cavs can escape danger if they must.

*Also Lex, but barely. I DID get the Brave Axe, but he saw, like, two rounds of combat in chapter 2.

(In case you're curious, my primary foot units were Arden, Dew, Azelle, Raquesis and Edain.)

9 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

That's another thing I've been waiting forever to get is those items like the Brave Axe and Pursuit ring, which have never shown up. Where exactly do you get those?

Brave axe is in a chapter 1 secret event with Lex, Pursuit ring is in a secret event in chapter 2 for Arden.

If you're looking for the brave lance, it's in from a Quan/Finn talk convo in chapter 2. The brave sword is a Holyn/Ayra one...I wanna say in chapter 3, but I can't remember for sure.

17 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

My Dew died in Chapter 1 due to the aforementioned platoons of enemies that run towards you. He got unlucky, of course, and I didn't think I would need him but now looking back I regret letting him die. 

Leaving Dew there is usually a bad idea. I did it, but only 'cause I wanted to make him promote. It is a good way to rack up cash, though.

By the way, don't miss the thief's sword. It's kinda bad, but it gives the user the Steal skill, which can be pretty danged nifty; it's from a talk event in chapter 2 after you recruit Raquesis.

20 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

but in the Arena he runs into that quite often.

Arena myrmidons are indeed generally the wall for most units.

21 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

I bought the Silver Axe for him in chapter 3, how does it fare against Steel? I never really thought about using him to set up kills, I'd always do it vice-versa so he gets levels faster but I am playing it wrong.

It's just a straight up better version of the steel axe-the only problem with it is that you get it later. As for exp sharing, I wouldn't worry about it TOO much-especially for Lex.

23 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

The Marriage thing just seems way to much work for what it's worth. What happens if I don't make any of my units boink another? From what I understand I get child units some time but I'd like to make this game as easy as possible with how much trouble I have with it so I'd like to make the most optimal pairings. But it just seems like more worth than what it's worth.

You get substitute characters for the females who don't marry-Children are tied to the mother, not the father. As for optimal, there are options, but the best units in the game are the ones the game gives you for free-Shannan, Oifey, Seliph, Finn, etc., as well as whoever you used in gen 1.

26 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

Like I mentioned before I'm going to restart and take it step by step, I can't play with efficiency or with the mindset I had with the GBA games. I have to change my entire playstyle and if that doesn't work I'll just drop it completely even though I hate to do it.

I don't really know what we're doing all that differently, but in chapter 2, I presently have this team and setup: (Note that I decided offhand to use Alec after benching him in chapter 1, hence why he has the paragon band; ordinarily it'd go on Raquesis if you're trying to use her, or anyone else you favor.)

Spoiler

cdCRuF8.pngk6xs8Yk.pngFNvew2P.pngaYZHnsT.pngW5xyLTN.pngxCQ2GhQ.pngfp0oCbZ.pngrhU8bhL.pngLAhYLmV.png4X6xTci.pngOv67jEU.pngDRsM0go.pngYFJrUua.pngkM1df5X.pngiQDMBQ7.pnglnNKYzJ.png

 

33 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

Well if that's the case I would've had to restart anyway. ;( )

Well, there's always the Valkyrie staff. Or you can go around the river, it's just incredibly annoying to do so.

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3 hours ago, sinfonic18 said:

That's the thing: The arena is very hard to get EXP from for most of my units because they can barely get past the first round, even with different weapons. IF , and big IF, I'm lucky, I'll get Finn or Lex or some other unit to round 2 or 3 before an enemy that outclasses them comes up or I just get RNG screwed, and no amount of trying over will get me past that hump. That's another thing I've been waiting forever to get is those items like the Brave Axe and Pursuit ring, which have never shown up. Where exactly do you get those?

Are you playing on emulator? Arena battles reset other arena battles, so what I do is once a unit faces a round where they cannot win but the rng can be in their favor (when it’s reasonable, not when there’s like a 1% chance for them to hit) I rewind/load a prior save state and fight up to that battle but then have them leave beforehand, then go back to that unit and try again after doing the same thing with a successful one. Other arena battles will change your RNG. That would take forever without save states or rewind though.

3 hours ago, sinfonic18 said:

I need to give up on my OCD stemmed from the GBA games to get every village I can. It's just different in this game. I just wish it was a bit more fair though where it positions the enemies, not right beside the town. I never did save every one of them (especially on Ch 2) but I did get most of them. But it was at the expense of lives lol.

Are you using any mounted units other than Sigurd? Getting them was never that difficult for me.

3 hours ago, sinfonic18 said:

My Dew died in Chapter 1 due to the aforementioned platoons of enemies that run towards you. He got unlucky, of course, and I didn't think I would need him but now looking back I regret letting him die.

Yeah, don’t let this happen again. You’ll want Dew for chapter 4, because without him you’ll have to spend fifty turns crossing a mountain.

3 hours ago, sinfonic18 said:

The Marriage thing just seems way to much work for what it's worth. What happens if I don't make any of my units boink another? From what I understand I get child units some time but I'd like to make this game as easy as possible with how much trouble I have with it so I'd like to make the most optimal pairings. But it just seems like more worth than what it's worth.

Certain children resulting from a specific pairing can literally solo the game.

3 hours ago, sinfonic18 said:

So if that's the case, if I were to start the game from scratch would I get the same growths as I did on the previous file? 

Only if you did everything exactly the same, which you almost certainly won’t.

3 hours ago, sinfonic18 said:

They have steel weapons or greater. Except my Azel, who only has a Thunder and Fire tome.

I recommend using this guide https://serenesforest.net/genealogy-of-the-holy-war/miscellaneous/secret-events/ to get goodies like Lex’s brave axe in chapter one.

3 hours ago, sinfonic18 said:



Yup I never knew about any of this before I posted this and if I did I might've had an easier time. Mostly the guides I was looking at are for the marriage or unit tiering.

 

The best pairings are generally seen as Aideen x Jamke, Lex x Ayra, Azel x Taillte, Claude x Sylvia, Lewyn x Erin, Beowulf x Raquesis, and Dew x Brigid, if that helps.

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43 minutes ago, Sooks said:

The best pairings are generally seen as Aideen x Jamke, Lex x Ayra, Azel x Taillte, Claude x Sylvia, Lewyn x Erin, Beowulf x Raquesis, and Dew x Brigid, if that helps.

Regarding pairings, I will post this:

Spoiler

 

It's exceedingly in-depth and shows a lot of options.

Also, I can confirm that Lex/Erinys is glorious. Have you ever wanted a pegasus knight with 70% defense growth and 105% HP growth?! Now you can have one!

Edited by Benice

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23 hours ago, Sooks said:

If you and I were to boot up a new file if fe4 and do everything in exactly the same way our rng would always be exactly the same.

I believe this is actually a thing in the GBA FE games as well.

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If you hate it, you should probably give it up for your own sanity. FE4 is polarizing- no one is neutral on it. You either like it, or don't. 

FE4 for the first time is not a fun ride. It's more fun when you know what to do and understand the game's mechanics. 2nd runs are more fun.

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On 3/5/2021 at 12:04 AM, sinfonic18 said:

Never did I think doing simple things like trading weapons/items in a strategy game could be such a pain in the ***.

I absolutely agree that the trading system in FE4 is pretty bad, but part of the strategy of the game is gold management and which enemy units you defeat with your allied units so they get the right weapons, as well as so you can lessen the need to trade. It's hard to "defend" the mechanic since a lot of people (myself included) agree with your sentiments. As it stands, all I can really say is that it's just a part of the game. : (

On 3/5/2021 at 12:04 AM, sinfonic18 said:

The RNG system. Does FE4 have different RNG mechanics than the games after it or what?

On 3/5/2021 at 8:58 AM, Sooks said:

I think fe4’s RNG is also different in the way that the seed (what is going to happen) is generated in the exact same way every time. If you and I were to boot up a new file if fe4 and do everything in exactly the same way our rng would always be exactly the same. The only way to change it (again, someone correct me if I’m wrong) is to fight in the arena which can be problematic for obvious reasons.

Like Sooks said, FE4 differs from the rest of the franchise in that it's RNG isn't as random as you think it would be. 

This video actually gives a great (and brief) explanation of how it works (I've linked it at the timestamp where he talks about the RNG). The "Hard RNG" (as I like to call it) is why Sigurd can defeat the first enemy unit in the Prologue the same way every time.

It should also be noted that you can change the outcomes of RNG simply by doing things in a different order. It's as simple as that, so it makes it a hell of a lot easier to solve problems you may be having by just reloading a save and doing things a tad differently. It's sort of like a choose-your-own adventure in a way, but with RNG.

On 3/5/2021 at 12:04 AM, sinfonic18 said:

Marriage system? What's the point? It was bad in Awakening but at least it was easier to comprehend. Here? Wait two units beside each other until 50 turns??? 50? FIFTY? I could have 2 FE6 maps done in that many turns. And who thought it was a good idea in this game with such clunky trading mechanics to make it even more CLUNKY by having to have units marry each other just in order to trade gold between spouses? Just... WHY? 

The Marriage system pays off in the second generation. Depending on who you've paired in the first generation, some of the child units can become absolutely busted, not to mention that the Marriage system isn't required at all in the second gen (but it's still available for the player to do in order to trade gold and get occasional in-combat bonuses). Trust me, you'd want to pair your units in the first generation. The substitute characters, while not necessarily bad, will typically pale in comparison (except for maybe Laylea). 

I like to use this site here to see how units would turn out with certain parents (or just check stats, skills, and growth rates). I'd recommend checking it out to see for yourself.

On 3/5/2021 at 12:04 AM, sinfonic18 said:

Is this valid criticism of the game or am I just salty? I would really like to finish the game and see the story because I do like that part of it, and the fact that I'd like to play every title in the series available to me but it truly feels like a darn chore to do that. A 3-4 hour chore that waste time just to see the story blips. 

I think that your criticisms of the game are very much valid. It can be a very daunting game with how much you need to pay attention to and manage. If you would really like to experience the story of the game without having to deal with much of the hassle of the gameplay, I would suggest using cheat codes if you're playing on emulator. I'm sure a lot of people may disagree with me about doing that, but it would be for your own personal experience with the game to get the most enjoyment out of it, and you really wouldn't be harming anyone by doing so (expect for the feelings of purists). It's completely up to you, though. (I'd also recommend restarting the game from the beginning if that's the route that you decide to go down).

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People say that FE5 is the game that you gotta play with a guide, and honestly, i only agree to a certain extent.

For FE4 though? That is the game i feel new players should absolutely read about before starting, sure, it's a far less difficult game than FE5, but unlike FE5, which, despite all the nutty stuff, still follows a standard FE game formula, only with a bunch of extra mechanics that change it up like Capture or Stamina, FE4 is from the outset a completely different beast that can be hard to adjust to.

The biggest pieces of general advice that i can give are:

  • Money matters only as much as one unit needs it, and the only money a unit will ever need is how much money they need to get a ring they need, or, if they're a Staff unit, fixing a broken non-healing Staff, anything else, from buying weapons on the armory, passing weapons through the Pawn Shop or fixing weapons, can all be handled by sending the unit to the Arena for a bit;
  • To make dealing with the above issue more easy, whenever you face a boss with a proper portrait and dialogue, specially if they're guarding a castle, make sure to check if they drop an item or weapon, if they do, make sure to have a proper plan on who to get the killing blow to make inventory management easier;
  • As far as weapons go, typically you will want each unit to carry around one strong weapon, one weak weapon, one 1-2 range option (If they have access to one) and maybe one situational weapon (e.g. Armorslayers, Horseslayers, Wingslayers, etc.), anything more will be superfluous, there's no reason to give Ayra a Silver Sword since if she needs a strong weapon to one-round an enemy she can just use the Brave Sword for example; 
  • Don't do Arena before starting the chapter proper, if you wanna grind, do it mid-chapter during moments of respite between castle seizes, or at the very end before seizing the final castle in a chapter;
  • Mounted combatants are decent at worst though how they're good can often be unintuitive or have caveats to it in Gen 1 at least, this could honestly be its own list with how it goes:
  1. Sigurd is Sigurd;
  2. Alec and Noish can contribute a lot but only if you give them lots of favoritism, Noish needs a Pursuit Ring and Alec needs a very strong offensive boost such as the Power Ring and/or a stronger weapon;
  3. Quan has excellent bases, if you get him the early Silver Lance from Chapter 2, he will be perfect for setting up kills for other characters as his lack of Pursuit and reliance on Adept means he's unlikely to 1-round most enemies but he'll still leave them with very little HP to help your other units get the kill, kills he himself won't need because his bases are already great;
  4. Finn is just okay until he gets the Brave Lance (And even then you might need to pawn off the Speed Ring to him to make him more consistent); 
  5. Lex needs the secret event to get the Brave Axe to be great;
  6. Midir can contribute a lot... if you pawn off the early Killer Bow to him, trust me, Jamke won't need it, Iron Bow Midir is okay and Killer Bow Jamke is good, but Killer Bow Midir is great and Iron/Steel Bow Jamke is still good, giving Midir the Killer Bow means having an excellent high move chipper (Which trust me, is far more useful than it sounds) and Jamke's own performance as a "1-round 1 Enemy" button for Player Phase will only be slightly hurt at worst;
  7. Beowulf is straightforward, already starts off with Pursuit, has much better bases than Alec and Sword access means it's not hard for him to double, all he needs is a good weapon, preferably a 1-2 range sword like the Bolt Sword from Chapter 3;

As you can see, mounted combatants can and will contribute a lot, but in order to do so you kind of have to either give them some kind of preferential treatment (Alec and Noish mostly) or you have to do some kind of "How was i supposed to think of that?" decision of investment like the Midir one, it's all rather unintuitive i'll admit, but if you do stuff like this you'll get way more out of them than just using them at base with their starting inventory without putting much thought into more. The only action here in this list i wouldn't take is the favoritism for Alec and Noish and even then only if you really want to focus on Inheritance and training up your footies a lot.

Edited by Murozaki

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On 3/6/2021 at 4:03 AM, Benice said:

Ah, I meant 2rn, not 1rn. Awakening uses 2.

Also, Fates has a really weird mixed rn where hitrates above 50 have something similar to 2rn, (but not quite as extreme) while anything below 50 uses 1rn.

My advice is to not overlook Quan; he lacks pursuit, but he's really good. His growths are solid and he's bulky.

Really? In my experience, even the weakest units can get past round one; my base level Noish made it into round three in chapter 3.

It's possible that I got lucky, but I used only Finn, Quan, Sigurd and Midir* as mounted units in combat and, as of the end of chapter 2, I have not let a single village get wholly burnt. I think Sigurd had the speed ring, but it may have been Quan. Midir had the skill ring, but he really didn't need it. I also put the defense ring on Dew, because I decided to make him a combat unit for no reason other than the fact that he's bad at it.

You don't have to get rid of every enemy with your cavs-In chapter 1, there's that one village on the opposite side of the map that I sent Sigurd to deal with. There were still tons of enemies elsewhere. Super Canto is also a thing in this game, so your cavs can escape danger if they must.

*Also Lex, but barely. I DID get the Brave Axe, but he saw, like, two rounds of combat in chapter 2.

(In case you're curious, my primary foot units were Arden, Dew, Azelle, Raquesis and Edain.)

Brave axe is in a chapter 1 secret event with Lex, Pursuit ring is in a secret event in chapter 2 for Arden.

If you're looking for the brave lance, it's in from a Quan/Finn talk convo in chapter 2. The brave sword is a Holyn/Ayra one...I wanna say in chapter 3, but I can't remember for sure.

Leaving Dew there is usually a bad idea. I did it, but only 'cause I wanted to make him promote. It is a good way to rack up cash, though.

By the way, don't miss the thief's sword. It's kinda bad, but it gives the user the Steal skill, which can be pretty danged nifty; it's from a talk event in chapter 2 after you recruit Raquesis.

Arena myrmidons are indeed generally the wall for most units.

It's just a straight up better version of the steel axe-the only problem with it is that you get it later. As for exp sharing, I wouldn't worry about it TOO much-especially for Lex.

You get substitute characters for the females who don't marry-Children are tied to the mother, not the father. As for optimal, there are options, but the best units in the game are the ones the game gives you for free-Shannan, Oifey, Seliph, Finn, etc., as well as whoever you used in gen 1.

I don't really know what we're doing all that differently, but in chapter 2, I presently have this team and setup: (Note that I decided offhand to use Alec after benching him in chapter 1, hence why he has the paragon band; ordinarily it'd go on Raquesis if you're trying to use her, or anyone else you favor.)

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Well, there's always the Valkyrie staff. Or you can go around the river, it's just incredibly annoying to do so.

Hmm, interesting. I wonder if they changed the RNG in Fates for balance reasons.

Quan is my sole enemy-weakener (Bad term for it but whatever) in this new run I started. He gets them just in the right range for just about anyone to finish off and collect all the EXP. He's also 1 of 3 that can actually finish the arena without getting blocked by annoying myrmidons. The first time through he died and I didn't think much of it because he was a pre-promote but then when Ethlyn left with him it blew my mind. 

My Noish, Alec, Lex, Finn and even Azel sometimes could never get past the first or second round in my last two runs, but I seem to be having better luck with it this time because my Lex got to the myrmidon before being defeated and Finn almost cleared the entire thing while getting stuck at the last round. For that matter, I seem to be having better luck period this run. Growths, hit rates, all that I seem to be getting the better end of the stick. (KNOCK ON WOOD, DON'T JYNX IT MYSELF😫). This could just be me creating my luck though, since I've been using almost everyone available to me and just taking it a lot slower than I was. Helps to know what I'm getting into, though.

I also got the brave axe for Lex this time and he has come around to be very viable. It helps to know that though!

Although, looking at your roster I can't help but be curious as to why you are using Arden? As a person who believes that armored characters are treated unfairly by FE fans and how I personally adore them that piques my interest. I try to use them every game but I skipped the armor this time because I thought and read that being a knight in FE4 is a death sentence, so I skipped out on him and he has been relegated to castle-guard duty. What uses did you find for him and get him to level 12? 

I did get the brave sword last time but it was with Lex/Ayra instead of Holyn and then they married. 

Thanks for that. The secrets are kind of a pain but it makes the game a lot easier with what you get. 

Does Alec ever get better? I've found Noish to be a lot better than him even though he lacks Pursuit because Alecs stat-growths and damage are terrible for me. I've been using them mainly for just weakening enemies.

I also did just today what you suggested and gave Lachesis the Paragon Band and used the Return staff to abuse her up to level 20 and promoted her and holy, she's become a completely different unit. Not only can she use almost every A rank weapon but her stat gains were insane and she was able to clear the arena completely with her Miracle Sword with ease. If I gave her the skill ring to boost her accuracy a bit she will definitely surpass Sigurd for my best unit, bar none. And to be believe I let her die on my last run *sigh* I'm now doing the same thing with Ethlyn, hopefully she turns into a beast too.

On 3/6/2021 at 7:01 AM, Sooks said:

Are you playing on emulator? Arena battles reset other arena battles, so what I do is once a unit faces a round where they cannot win but the rng can be in their favor (when it’s reasonable, not when there’s like a 1% chance for them to hit) I rewind/load a prior save state and fight up to that battle but then have them leave beforehand, then go back to that unit and try again after doing the same thing with a successful one. Other arena battles will change your RNG. That would take forever without save states or rewind though.

Are you using any mounted units other than Sigurd? Getting them was never that difficult for me.

Yeah, don’t let this happen again. You’ll want Dew for chapter 4, because without him you’ll have to spend fifty turns crossing a mountain.

Certain children resulting from a specific pairing can literally solo the game.

Only if you did everything exactly the same, which you almost certainly won’t.

I recommend using this guide https://serenesforest.net/genealogy-of-the-holy-war/miscellaneous/secret-events/ to get goodies like Lex’s brave axe in chapter one.

The best pairings are generally seen as Aideen x Jamke, Lex x Ayra, Azel x Taillte, Claude x Sylvia, Lewyn x Erin, Beowulf x Raquesis, and Dew x Brigid, if that helps.

The only way I know to play this game in english is with a ROM and the patch, so yes... I will have to this tactic.

Yes. All of them this time, as of last though, I benched Midir, Alec and Noish because they were mediocre, but you need everyone in this game. There is no tossing units away.

I've had him on village duty going around getting all that money so he can give the gold to everyone that needs it so he doesn't see much combat this time around.

You see, this is why I want to marry my units with the best pairings (thanks for those by the way!) because I want OP characters that can make the game easier, especially with how hard of time I'm having with it. 

Also thanks so much for this guide! This is exactly what I needed for all the secrets since the guide I was looking at just stated the chapter it's in and not the location on the map.

It does help because now I know who to pair and won't have to mess with researching it. 

On 3/6/2021 at 7:42 AM, Benice said:

Regarding pairings, I will post this:

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It's exceedingly in-depth and shows a lot of options.

Also, I can confirm that Lex/Erinys is glorious. Have you ever wanted a pegasus knight with 70% defense growth and 105% HP growth?! Now you can have one!

This is actually the guide I've been looking at, as well as the one you gave me on Reddit for beginners. 

On 3/6/2021 at 4:49 PM, Dandy Druid said:

If you hate it, you should probably give it up for your own sanity. FE4 is polarizing- no one is neutral on it. You either like it, or don't. 

FE4 for the first time is not a fun ride. It's more fun when you know what to do and understand the game's mechanics. 2nd runs are more fun.

I can second this. I delete all my files and restarted the game from scratch yesterday and now that I know what kind of things I missed, what I could do differently, etc. the game is so much more enjoyable. It's definitely not a game you can just pick up and learn.

On 3/6/2021 at 5:52 PM, indigoasis said:

I absolutely agree that the trading system in FE4 is pretty bad, but part of the strategy of the game is gold management and which enemy units you defeat with your allied units so they get the right weapons, as well as so you can lessen the need to trade. It's hard to "defend" the mechanic since a lot of people (myself included) agree with your sentiments. As it stands, all I can really say is that it's just a part of the game. : (

Like Sooks said, FE4 differs from the rest of the franchise in that it's RNG isn't as random as you think it would be. 

This video actually gives a great (and brief) explanation of how it works (I've linked it at the timestamp where he talks about the RNG). The "Hard RNG" (as I like to call it) is why Sigurd can defeat the first enemy unit in the Prologue the same way every time.

It should also be noted that you can change the outcomes of RNG simply by doing things in a different order. It's as simple as that, so it makes it a hell of a lot easier to solve problems you may be having by just reloading a save and doing things a tad differently. It's sort of like a choose-your-own adventure in a way, but with RNG.

The Marriage system pays off in the second generation. Depending on who you've paired in the first generation, some of the child units can become absolutely busted, not to mention that the Marriage system isn't required at all in the second gen (but it's still available for the player to do in order to trade gold and get occasional in-combat bonuses). Trust me, you'd want to pair your units in the first generation. The substitute characters, while not necessarily bad, will typically pale in comparison (except for maybe Laylea). 

I like to use this site here to see how units would turn out with certain parents (or just check stats, skills, and growth rates). I'd recommend checking it out to see for yourself.

I think that your criticisms of the game are very much valid. It can be a very daunting game with how much you need to pay attention to and manage. If you would really like to experience the story of the game without having to deal with much of the hassle of the gameplay, I would suggest using cheat codes if you're playing on emulator. I'm sure a lot of people may disagree with me about doing that, but it would be for your own personal experience with the game to get the most enjoyment out of it, and you really wouldn't be harming anyone by doing so (expect for the feelings of purists). It's completely up to you, though. (I'd also recommend restarting the game from the beginning if that's the route that you decide to go down).

That may be true but too me personally it just feels like a massive inconvenience and has nothing to do with strategy. I agree that is probably what they were going for, but they were completely wrong on it and it's just a slog instead of strategy. That's just me I guess. Doesn't make it a bad game, just a frustrating one. 

Something is definitely "unique" about the RNG in this one. While it's not as random as other FEs it somehow feels more random and completely out of whack. This is the only FE I've played where I could have a Hit of 80 or so and the enemy will have 30 and I will miss, twice, and the enemy will land both hits. It's mind boggling and makes me laugh every time. 

But, as you stated this can be circumvented by doing something different after saving in-game or with a save state. This is also true for other FEs after FE4 because I've done it numerous times to get better growths or get out of a fatal situation. Sometimes though there isn't any way out of trouble and you have to take the blow...

I've noted that site, thanks for that. 

I was thinking of that perhaps, but, I'd rather just not play the game than cheat. I like to play FE for it's gameplay because it's gameplay is addicting as hell and cheating just to witness the story which is my least important FE feature just takes all the fun out of the game for me. Now that I've gone through a couple chapters of the game (several) times I'm having a lot better time with it and am actually enjoying myself to the point of grinding a little. Plus, a lot of things I learned on here has helped me with the game, and it's not as daunting of a game as I thought it was previously. 

21 hours ago, Murozaki said:

People say that FE5 is the game that you gotta play with a guide, and honestly, i only agree to a certain extent.

For FE4 though? That is the game i feel new players should absolutely read about before starting, sure, it's a far less difficult game than FE5, but unlike FE5, which, despite all the nutty stuff, still follows a standard FE game formula, only with a bunch of extra mechanics that change it up like Capture or Stamina, FE4 is from the outset a completely different beast that can be hard to adjust to.

The biggest pieces of general advice that i can give are:

  • Money matters only as much as one unit needs it, and the only money a unit will ever need is how much money they need to get a ring they need, or, if they're a Staff unit, fixing a broken non-healing Staff, anything else, from buying weapons on the armory, passing weapons through the Pawn Shop or fixing weapons, can all be handled by sending the unit to the Arena for a bit;
  • To make dealing with the above issue more easy, whenever you face a boss with a proper portrait and dialogue, specially if they're guarding a castle, make sure to check if they drop an item or weapon, if they do, make sure to have a proper plan on who to get the killing blow to make inventory management easier;
  • As far as weapons go, typically you will want each unit to carry around one strong weapon, one weak weapon, one 1-2 range option (If they have access to one) and maybe one situational weapon (e.g. Armorslayers, Horseslayers, Wingslayers, etc.), anything more will be superfluous, there's no reason to give Ayra a Silver Sword since if she needs a strong weapon to one-round an enemy she can just use the Brave Sword for example; 
  • Don't do Arena before starting the chapter proper, if you wanna grind, do it mid-chapter during moments of respite between castle seizes, or at the very end before seizing the final castle in a chapter;
  • Mounted combatants are decent at worst though how they're good can often be unintuitive or have caveats to it in Gen 1 at least, this could honestly be its own list with how it goes:
  1. Sigurd is Sigurd;
  2. Alec and Noish can contribute a lot but only if you give them lots of favoritism, Noish needs a Pursuit Ring and Alec needs a very strong offensive boost such as the Power Ring and/or a stronger weapon;
  3. Quan has excellent bases, if you get him the early Silver Lance from Chapter 2, he will be perfect for setting up kills for other characters as his lack of Pursuit and reliance on Adept means he's unlikely to 1-round most enemies but he'll still leave them with very little HP to help your other units get the kill, kills he himself won't need because his bases are already great;
  4. Finn is just okay until he gets the Brave Lance (And even then you might need to pawn off the Speed Ring to him to make him more consistent); 
  5. Lex needs the secret event to get the Brave Axe to be great;
  6. Midir can contribute a lot... if you pawn off the early Killer Bow to him, trust me, Jamke won't need it, Iron Bow Midir is okay and Killer Bow Jamke is good, but Killer Bow Midir is great and Iron/Steel Bow Jamke is still good, giving Midir the Killer Bow means having an excellent high move chipper (Which trust me, is far more useful than it sounds) and Jamke's own performance as a "1-round 1 Enemy" button for Player Phase will only be slightly hurt at worst;
  7. Beowulf is straightforward, already starts off with Pursuit, has much better bases than Alec and Sword access means it's not hard for him to double, all he needs is a good weapon, preferably a 1-2 range sword like the Bolt Sword from Chapter 3;

As you can see, mounted combatants can and will contribute a lot, but in order to do so you kind of have to either give them some kind of preferential treatment (Alec and Noish mostly) or you have to do some kind of "How was i supposed to think of that?" decision of investment like the Midir one, it's all rather unintuitive i'll admit, but if you do stuff like this you'll get way more out of them than just using them at base with their starting inventory without putting much thought into more. The only action here in this list i wouldn't take is the favoritism for Alec and Noish and even then only if you really want to focus on Inheritance and training up your footies a lot.

Yeah I wish I would have paid a bit more attention to the guides Benice gave me on here a little more before jumping in like a moron. Like the GBA FEs for instance I barely looked at a guide during all of them (except FE8 since I only played like a chapter of it). This game is a whole 'nother ball game and without a guide you will miss a lot, as I did, twice.

The trouble I'm having with money is everyone needs it for the Paragon band lol. That and the Pursuit band. As far as weapons go though, you're right.

That's something I'm guilty of not doing and I need to break that habit. It'd save a lot of money and time. 

Now about 1-2 range... Is that really that important in this game? I understand why 1-2 range is good but things like Javelins and Hand Axes in this game are so darn heavy that for a while here I thought I was better off not using them. A lot of times I wielded one (like my Quan for instance) I would get doubled easily and my dodge chances were worse than they already were. I've been debating whether to give some of them those weapons as of now they are setting at the pawnshop.

Noted. As of now, I've been doing it before the chapter starts and then departing.

I don't use Alec or Noish in this playthrough for anything but chip damage because they are honestly terrible, and I don't feel as if giving them items just to make them decent would be a great idea when I could give another unit that's actually worth it those.
 

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3 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

Does Alec ever get better? I've found Noish to be a lot better than him even though he lacks Pursuit because Alecs stat-growths and damage are terrible for me. I've been using them mainly for just weakening enemies.

Well, promotion is generally bonkers in this game, (Thracia shares this trait IIRC) so that fixes him. I'm mostly using him because he's bad.

4 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

I can't help but be curious as to why you are using Arden?

For the memes and because he's absolutely awful, and I adore using bad units. It's also why I'm using Dew, although there is actually merit to using him.

5 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

What uses did you find for him and get him to level 12? 

Uh...Playing inefficiently. I wasn't able to do much with him in chapter 2 due to how fast you have to go to get the villages, but he did some good work in chapter 1; he can actually be a decent way to bait out Ayra, (Alec is better if he has gained at least one or defense, though) and useful for covering the castle while Sigurd raced across the map to save the village in the middle of nowhere.

There is literally no reason to use Arden at all other than wanting to.

7 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

Now about 1-2 range... Is that really that important in this game? I understand why 1-2 range is good but things like Javelins and Hand Axes in this game are so darn heavy that for a while here I thought I was better off not using them. A lot of times I wielded one (like my Quan for instance) I would get doubled easily and my dodge chances were worse than they already were. I've been debating whether to give some of them those weapons as of now they are setting at the pawnshop.

They're generally no good in this game, but I like having a javelin on Quan for ranged chip if I need it; his strength tends to be good enough regardless and he lacks pursuit, so unless I'm looking for adept, speed doesn't matter.

Anyways, glad to hear that you're enjoying the game more now!

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I honestly feel like the poor unit balance is overstated.  Like yeah, it exists and there's a huge discrepency in viability, but on the other hand you can field your entire army on any map, leaving your only concern being who deserves the kills for experience.  And FE4 is ridiculously generous with experience I feel.  

Also glad to see OP is enjoying it after another try.  I'm more used to impossible to know secrets in games as someone who's played many older games, but they really could've used some hints.  They could still be cryptic even, just give any hint that these events could happen.  Have the augury mention that a brash young man should park his horse on the edge of a lake.

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8 hours ago, sinfonic18 said:

The trouble I'm having with money is everyone needs it for the Paragon band lol. That and the Pursuit band. As far as weapons go though, you're right.

Trading around the Paragon Band is not worth it. It's better to just pawn it off to one unit you want to give favoritism to than to try to make as much people use it as possible. Most people make that one unit Lachesis since it makes her getting to Master Knight far quicker.

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On 3/8/2021 at 12:29 AM, Benice said:

Well, promotion is generally bonkers in this game, (Thracia shares this trait IIRC) so that fixes him. I'm mostly using him because he's bad.

For the memes and because he's absolutely awful, and I adore using bad units. It's also why I'm using Dew, although there is actually merit to using him.

Uh...Playing inefficiently. I wasn't able to do much with him in chapter 2 due to how fast you have to go to get the villages, but he did some good work in chapter 1; he can actually be a decent way to bait out Ayra, (Alec is better if he has gained at least one or defense, though) and useful for covering the castle while Sigurd raced across the map to save the village in the middle of nowhere.

There is literally no reason to use Arden at all other than wanting to.

They're generally no good in this game, but I like having a javelin on Quan for ranged chip if I need it; his strength tends to be good enough regardless and he lacks pursuit, so unless I'm looking for adept, speed doesn't matter.

Anyways, glad to hear that you're enjoying the game more now!

Yeah but getting him to that promotion is probably hard (Promotion stat gains are OP)
I can't front you for using someone underrated/bad. I did the same thing with Wil in both my FE7 runs! :D 

That sounds like a decent way to get her. What I did this run was keep my entire party right beside that village on the road and then snuck Sigurd around the castle to seize it while Ayra focused on the army. 

I gave one Javelin to Sigurd but I never use it.

Yeah thanks, I wasn't able to play for a couple days due to being out of town but I was back to it today and I've made it all the way to Chapter 4 now without any hiccups. I agree with everyone here, the game isn't as polarizing once you get familiar with it, since it's much different from other entries.

On 3/8/2021 at 8:25 AM, Murozaki said:

Trading around the Paragon Band is not worth it. It's better to just pawn it off to one unit you want to give favoritism to than to try to make as much people use it as possible. Most people make that one unit Lachesis since it makes her getting to Master Knight far quicker.

After about 3-4 trades I decided to just pawn it and leave it there. Even if the EXP gain is nice, it's way too expensive. 

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2 minutes ago, sinfonic18 said:

After about 3-4 trades I decided to just pawn it and leave it there. Even if the EXP gain is nice, it's way too expensive. 

You'll want to buy it back during chapter 5 on someone who has married, just so you know; parents pass down items to children, (Unless the child lacks the ranks to use it; I.E, if Midir marries someone who has no children with bows, he cannot pass on the killer bow.) which makes the beginning of gen. 2 a lot more manageable, given the massive amount of units you have at the start of it. (Basically doubled, except for a few people who are off being absolute Johnnies elsewhere and join later on, such as Brigid and her children) Speaking from experience, dealing with the organization right away isn't great. Heck, you'll want any items you want your units to have free access to on people who are married. Most child units don't have many starting funds, AYRA, YOU'RE THE HECKING PRINCESS OF ISAACH, YOU CAN SURELY AFFORD TO GIVE LARCEI AND WHATSHISFACE A BETTER ALLOWANCE, so it's a good way to start off. 

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23 hours ago, Benice said:

You'll want to buy it back during chapter 5 on someone who has married, just so you know; parents pass down items to children, (Unless the child lacks the ranks to use it; I.E, if Midir marries someone who has no children with bows, he cannot pass on the killer bow.) which makes the beginning of gen. 2 a lot more manageable, given the massive amount of units you have at the start of it. (Basically doubled, except for a few people who are off being absolute Johnnies elsewhere and join later on, such as Brigid and her children) Speaking from experience, dealing with the organization right away isn't great. Heck, you'll want any items you want your units to have free access to on people who are married. Most child units don't have many starting funds, AYRA, YOU'RE THE HECKING PRINCESS OF ISAACH, YOU CAN SURELY AFFORD TO GIVE LARCEI AND WHATSHISFACE A BETTER ALLOWANCE, so it's a good way to start off. 

I've gotten to Chapter 5 today and I've given it to Sigurd, since I figured I'll want Seliph getting as many levels as he can. That's the thing, do the children inherit items from their mother or father? I'd imagine I can't buy items from the pawnshop then since they no funds starting out, so that is a further incentive to inherit items. 

One more question, I got Talitu killed on Chapter 4 but I didn't sweat it too much since I plan on using the Valkyrie staff on her this chapter, she was married to Azel before she died. If I were to resurrect her, would she still be married to him? Would she still have thoron? 

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Just now, sinfonic18 said:

That's the thing, do the children inherit items from their mother or father? I'd imagine I can't buy items from the pawnshop then since they no funds starting out, so that is a further incentive to inherit items. 

The father passes down his items to one child, and the mother to the other.

1 minute ago, sinfonic18 said:

If I were to resurrect her, would she still be married to him? Would she still have thoron? 

I believe that the Valkyrie straight up deletes the death; inventory, love points/lover, stats, level and everything else should stay the same.

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Inheritance is swapped for Ethlyn's and Briggid's kids tho, there the son inherits from the mother and the daughter from the father.

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On 3/12/2021 at 12:47 AM, Benice said:

The father passes down his items to one child, and the mother to the other.

I believe that the Valkyrie straight up deletes the death; inventory, love points/lover, stats, level and everything else should stay the same.

I finally got to the 2 gen this evening and everyone of the children I have, Seliph, Larcei, Edain's daughter (I forget her name) and Ulster all have everything I had on their parents so I think it's determined by gender.

On 3/12/2021 at 3:01 AM, EnjolrasMTAfem said:

Inheritance is swapped for Ethlyn's and Briggid's kids tho, there the son inherits from the mother and the daughter from the father.

Welp, I've done screwed that up. At least my Seliph is decked out. 

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