New Heroes: Dawning Reality & Nifl

[Sayyyaka]

I don't know or care about any of these characters despite having played Fates but seeing that red cav GHB is annoying.  Azelle should've been a red cav.

[Mercakete]

Oh man all girls. That's unpleasant. And poor Benny, being thrown to the side like that... It's also just kind of a "wut" moment for Nifl being thrown on a regular banner. I don't think we've seen that since Surtr, but the thing that makes it the most shocking is that mythic heroes were supposed to be gods or godlike beings or beings with godlike powers (so, ones who are being directly powered by a deity, like with Al...tena? Tina? Uh, anyway...) And here we have someone who CERTAINLY fits the criteria (and is even native to Heroes) and she's...a regular unit? Or did I miss her Mythic status? Did IS panic when they saw people being annoyed at her being (likely to be) this month's mythic?

The only one on the banner I'm interested in is Nifl. Though, Charlotte's B skill looks like it'd be fun on some speedsters. And Charlotte is finally in her regular form, so I guess good for her. Glad she managed to pull Benny along. Also, I guess I never noticed monkey lady's "armor" before. What even is that supposed to protect against? It's not even tight, so all the energy would just transfer through it... Anyway, it surprised me, is the point.

All that said, the most interesting thing to me in this trailer is the red tome cav in the lower left corner. Looks like we're getting a new character reveal in the next chapter. (Aaaand it's another female, looks like. Joy.) Looks like she's with Nidvalir (or however you spell the Dwarf Kingdom name) judging by her outfit. Maybe a subordinate of Otr's? Anyway, I'm curious about her. I guess she's someone from Fates I don't remember.

Edit: Not a new Heroes character.

Edited July 18, 2021 by Mercakete

[Naoshi]

2 hours ago, Othin said:

Do we have an orb schedule for the rest of this banner's timeframe? I'm running a bit low and still don't have Ogma yet, so I'm trying to figure out how much leeway I have.

 

First post.

[Othin]

27 minutes ago, Naoshi said:

 

First post.

Thanks! Missed that. Looks like there's plenty. 

[Naoshi]

2 minutes ago, Othin said:

Thanks! Missed that. Looks like there's plenty. 

No problem. I had been posting the estimate orbs since I started posting calendars threads.

 

Hopefully it will help people and I hope they notice I have been doing it :p

[Ice Dragon]

4 hours ago, FailWood said:

They'd never do that.  They wouldn't throw a bone to those who like larger women, even if the diversity would be appreciated.

Probably because not enough people actually care, and Candace being an optional minor capturable boss with very little characterization doesn't help. Characters that aren't conventionally attractive (either male or female) can make up for it in marketability by having good characterization and/or good stats, and Candace basically only has the latter choice available to her.

Or be relegated to being a Grail unit and not need to be marketable, I suppose, which would at least make sense as she's a capturable boss.

Candace was

• 561/827 in CYL 5 (32nd percentile)
• 636/774 in CYL 4 (18th percentile)
• 471/692 in CYL 3 (32nd percentile)
• 532/818 in CYL 2 (35th percentile)
• 383/791 in CYL 1 (52nd percentile)

In terms of not-conventionally-attractive female characters, both Niime and Dorothy have a way better shot at getting in before her, and that's not just my Elibe bias talking.

[DefyingFates]

4 hours ago, Othin said:

Do we have an orb schedule for the rest of this banner's timeframe? I'm running a bit low and still don't have Ogma yet, so I'm trying to figure out how much leeway I have.

Given we just got a new banner announced (and the calendar a while back), there'll likely be a new schedule uploaded to Reddit tomorrow or so.

6 hours ago, Othin said:

...Vantage?

I wondered about that myself, it could lead to some... interesting builds, that's for sure.

I'm also curious how Frenzy will compare to Spurn going forward: how will Desperation 2 be seen compared to the +5 damage from the latter? If it were the full 10 I can see the latter holding out, but to my (casual) eyes, Desperation seems a bit better?

1 hour ago, Naoshi said:

 

First post.

Ah, thank you very much!

[Tybrosion]

Just for the people complaining about Nohr bias and/or female bias, these were the highest placing Fates characters in CYL5 that were still absent at that point:

1. Charlotte: 72nd
2. Nyx: 88th
3. Dwyer: 110th
4. Orochi: 143rd
5. Scarlet: 146th
6. Mozu: 148th
7. Anankos: 177th
8. Mitama: 179th
9. Shura: 203rd
10. Benny: 221st

So don't get mad at IS, they were just (mostly) following what the people wanted. And even if Dwyer was in, he'd still contribute to the Nohr bias by virtue of being Nohrian by birth (though not always Nohrian in affiliation of course).

[Sunwoo]

9 minutes ago, Tybrosion said:

Just for the people complaining about Nohr bias and/or female bias, these were the highest placing Fates characters in CYL5 that were still absent at that point:

1. Charlotte: 72nd
2. Nyx: 88th
3. Dwyer: 110th
4. Orochi: 143rd
5. Scarlet: 146th
6. Mozu: 148th
7. Anankos: 177th
8. Mitama: 179th
9. Shura: 203rd
10. Benny: 221st

So don't get mad at IS, they were just (mostly) following what the people wanted. And even if Dwyer was in, he'd still contribute to the Nohr bias by virtue of being Nohrian by birth (though not always Nohrian in affiliation of course).

Yeah, but Nohr bias existed since year 1, even during the days of FATESWAKENING SPAM. Hoshido has NEVER had any banner -- seasonal or regular -- to itself. Nohrians have had entire banners to themselves whereas Hoshidans have always had to share with either Nohrians or non-Fates characters. The first Christmas banner should've been an all-Hoshido and male Corrin banner since Nohrians and female Corrin got the entire second summer to themselves. It's not like Hoshidan royals were so unpopular in year 1 they couldn't carry a banner, after all.

[Magenta Fantasies]

1 hour ago, Ice Dragon said:

Probably because not enough people actually care, and Candace being an optional minor capturable boss with very little characterization doesn't help. Characters that aren't conventionally attractive (either male or female) can make up for it in marketability by having good characterization and/or good stats, and Candace basically only has the latter choice available to her.

Agreed. I like Candace—she’s one of the more memorable minor bosses—but I don’t ever see her being added to Heroes. That’s the problem with being an unpopular character in a popular game with a very large cast. I’ll be pleasantly shocked if we get Percy and Yukimura on a future banner.

 

I have never been this ambivalent about a New Heroes banner before. 😕

I’m thrilled to see Nyx and Charlotte, my second and third most-wanted characters! I would’ve been surprised if they weren’t on this banner. I didn’t expect Orochi to be with them, and I didn’t expect Benny to be added over Dwyer or Kiragi, but they both are pleasant surprises. 

I’m very bitter about the GHB. Shura had a good shot since there aren’t many GHB archers (no pun intended.) There were other good choices for Fates GHB characters, and they had to pick a bit-part character who I had to look up who she was.

As some other people have pointed out, there is something of a Nohr bias in Heroes. To be fair, I greatly prefer the Nohrian cast to the Hoshidan cast. 

Maybe next year’s Fates banner will be a neutral banner with infantry lance Mozu, cavalry sword Sophie, colorless tome Izana and staff demote Dwyer (Dwyer is one of my least favorite characters, but he does well in CYL and he’s the most likely choice for this theme) with red/blue/green archer Shura as the GHB.

[Roflolxp54]

In my eyes, I see Frenzy as the Fury+Desperation combo but premium and likely exclusive to sword/lance/axe infantry units. Damage reduction is pretty overrated IMHO as it's only really good on units who have the stats to back it up or units who are actively stacking damage reduction effects (like using Flayn or the soon-to-be-released Nifl). Not helping matters is that there are units who reduce the effectiveness of or actually remove damage reduction effects during combat, units with guaranteed follow-ups, and newer units having generally higher power ceilings (looking at you, Duo Lif). 

Orochi looks cool as a green mage infantry -- Pulse Smoke could combo nicely with her tome though Lysithea and Duo Lif are still going to be major issues for her.

Based on trailer footage, Benny has Steadfast Lance+, Pavise, Bracing Stance 2, and likely Wary Fighter in his base kit. He's going to be a commonly foddered unit (since he has Steadfast Lance) or beeg Arena stat stick armor (so like a lance version of Flame Emperor but released in 2021).

Arete being a F2P red mage cavalier is cool -- it's a unit type that's even rarer than axe cavaliers at this point, especially for F2P players (there's just Titania (2019) and Eirika (2018) and Eirika is difficult to merge up and doesn't see frequent usage in F2P guides). However, it's been shown that she has the non-seasonal clone (Raudrrabbit) of Summer Lorenz's Conch Bouquet weapon so as per GHB standards, she doesn't come with a unique/interesting weapon.

Edited July 18, 2021 by Roflolxp54

[Tybrosion]

1 hour ago, Sunwoo said:

Yeah, but Nohr bias existed since year 1, even during the days of FATESWAKENING SPAM. Hoshido has NEVER had any banner -- seasonal or regular -- to itself. Nohrians have had entire banners to themselves whereas Hoshidans have always had to share with either Nohrians or non-Fates characters. The first Christmas banner should've been an all-Hoshido and male Corrin banner since Nohrians and female Corrin got the entire second summer to themselves. It's not like Hoshidan royals were so unpopular in year 1 they couldn't carry a banner, after all.

Yeah, and what a lot of good that early bias did for Nohr and Awakening & Fates in general. It might’ve been good for them at the time, but now all it gave them were (barring an exception here and there) units that are now completely outclassed and aren’t worth pulling for (especially the seasonals).

Even if they had gave Hoshido entire banners instead of Nohr back then, they’d still be units that never get used these days and would just to bloat out Fates’s roster. In other words, next to nothing would change.

[Sunwoo]

23 minutes ago, Tybrosion said:

Yeah, and what a lot of good that early bias did for Nohr and Awakening & Fates in general. It might’ve been good for them at the time, but now all it gave them were (barring an exception here and there) units that are now completely outclassed and aren’t worth pulling for (especially the seasonals).

Even if they had gave Hoshido entire banners instead of Nohr back then, they’d still be units that never get used these days and would just to bloat out Fates’s roster. In other words, next to nothing would change.

That's true, but even so I'm sure you could see how people who either like Hoshido as a route in general or have more characters they like on that route could be (rightfully) irritated that even with Fateswakening bias being less of a thing Nohr bias is still very much real.

Edited July 18, 2021 by Sunwoo

[Dandy Druid]

I think this is the most excited I've been for a Fates banner. 

Charlotte finally made it out of Seasonal Hell after 5 years! 5 freaking years. And her art is great. Her neutral art's expression is a little off. They should have given her "bedroom eyes" and made her lips more noticeable but I absolutely love the contrast between her neutral and damaged art versus her special art. I also love the difference of tone between her quotes.

Also lol at Iago, your tome got taken.

I wonder what Arete's art will look like.

[Alexmender]

11 hours ago, DefyingFates said:

I was curious what Element they'd give her since anything other than Water would feel weird, but they added her to the regular pool instead as if to avoid that issue. Interesting! And this way she can get Blessed herself, so it's better for her overall, right?

I was hoping she would be Anima, as Fjorm is Ice yet Gunnthrá and Hríd are wind so it'd make sense Nifl could use two elements at the very least, and I think Anima represents elemental magic (Fates and 3H considers all non healing magic as Black magic, but they are outliers). 

Eh, it's a mixed bag. Being free to be blessed wherever is a boon for Nifl as it makes her more flexible and makes her more sturdy overall, but in Arena she needs a B Duel Cav 4 to score well (and that skill goes better with a ranged cav like Reinhardt). She doesn't fare too well in AR-O because she can't use Galeforce, and her Flash effect might end up being detrimental to her teammates if they need to take a hit to proc a special. She's kinda built for AR-D, but it's hard to fit her into a team as the mode only gives you 5 slots (6 if you like to play high risk-high reward) and those favor a mix of Dancers/Ranged cavs/Far Save armors; and even if you can fit a non L!Sigurd melee cav into your team she's in direct competition with Ingrid for the slot. 

[DefyingFates]

1 hour ago, Alexmender said:

but it's hard to fit her into a team as the mode only gives you 5 slots (6 if you like to play high risk-high reward)

What do you mean, isn't it always better to have as many Def Heroes as possible?

On offence on the other hand, you trade the free space for manouvring against Cav lines, for example.

[Alexmender]

44 minutes ago, DefyingFates said:

What do you mean, isn't it always better to have as many Def Heroes as possible?

On offence on the other hand, you trade the free space for manouvring against Cav lines, for example.

I meant that as in the usual number of slots you have available for blessed units. A normal AR-D team uses 2 Mythics, which reduces your free slots to 4 (5 if you use a Mythic that enables the 7th slot). Most AR-D teams will use at least 1 dancer, and that reduces your free slots to 3 (or 4) unless you got Mirabilis/Triandra to compress roles, and even then many like to bring 2 dancers so your remaining slots are still only a few.

You always want to bring the max number of Def heroes you can into a team, but if you care about AR you'll be thinking about who offers you the most amongst the 600+ cast, and Nifl has pretty hefty competition in the blue cav category from the likes of Reinhardt/Selena/Ingrid because you don't want to have much color overlap for your team. If Nifl was an Anima Mythic her competiton would be Seiros/Mirabilis/Líf/Thrasir/Duma, and of those she only loses to Mirabilis (and maybe Duma on specific maps) because the others offer no utility.

[Othin]

4 minutes ago, Alexmender said:

I meant that as in the usual number of slots you have available for blessed units. A normal AR-D team uses 2 Mythics, which reduces your free slots to 4 (5 if you use a Mythic that enables the 7th slot). Most AR-D teams will use at least 1 dancer, and that reduces your free slots to 3 (or 4) unless you got Mirabilis/Triandra to compress roles, and even then many like to bring 2 dancers so your remaining slots are still only a few.

You always want to bring the max number of Def heroes you can into a team, but if you care about AR you'll be thinking about who offers you the most amongst the 600+ cast, and Nifl has pretty hefty competition in the blue cav category from the likes of Reinhardt/Selena/Ingrid because you don't want to have much color overlap for your team. If Nifl was an Anima Mythic her competiton would be Seiros/Mirabilis/Líf/Thrasir/Duma, and of those she only loses to Mirabilis (and maybe Duma on specific maps) because the others offer no utility.

Whoever the next Anima mythic is, it wouldn't take much for them to be the best Anima-Party option. Would be nice to not have to waste a slot on Seiros.

[NegativeExponents-]

It being an all-girls banner aside, I'm really excited for Charlotte! She looks like a really great unit which I really wasn't expecting her to be. I really love her art too. Glad she gets to be one of the few exceptions to the usual re-use of poses for normal and special attacks because it let's the art capture her character perfectly in a way I wasn't expecting for Heroes to do for her.

I'm so tempted to spark but with Brave Marianne and Leg Hector's remix coming soon-ish I think I'll sadly skip.

[Tybrosion]

Stats and stuff [SPOILERS]:

Spoiler

Nifl
Super Asset(s): Atk, Spd, Def
Super Flaw(s): HP
*cannot show up in PvE maps

Nyx
Super Asset(s): HP, Atk, Spd
Super Flaw(s): Res

Charlotte
Super Asset(s): HP, Atk, Spd
Super Flaw(s): none
*Frenzy is only for infantry swords, lances and axes.

Orochi
Super Asset(s): Atk, Spd
Super Flaw(s): HP
*Atk/Res Link 3 unlocks at 4*.

Benny
Super Asset(s): Def
Super Flaw(s): none
Kit is: Steadfast Lance+, -, Pavise, Bracing Stance 2, Wary Fighter 3 [4* unlock], -

Arete
Super Asset(s): none
Super Flaw(s): HP, Spd
Kit is: Raudrrabbit+, -, Glacies, Atk/Res Push 3 [4* unlock], -, Res Ploy 3

 

Edited July 19, 2021 by Tybrosion

[Roflolxp54]

Datamine-related info in spoilers.

Spoiler

Orochi having base 24 Spd is just oof. I get that she wasn't that fast in her home game but come on. I guess you could try making Orochi be like a green Lilina though Lilina already has a nasty Prf weapon AND has a reskin.

Arete is disappointment across the board -- her stats are pretty much Leo's in 2021 (a unit who is heavily mocked by a lot of players) and she offers pretty much nothing new for skill fodder.
Raudrrabbit is the non-seasonal clone of Summer Lorenz's weapon.
Atk/Res Push 3 is available on Brady.
Res Ploy is available on Forrest and Ilyana.

Benny be "Wary Fighter in 2021 lmao".

 

Edited July 19, 2021 by Roflolxp54

[Tybrosion]

9 minutes ago, Roflolxp54 said:

Datamine-related info in spoilers.

  Reveal hidden contents

Orochi having base 24 Spd is just oof. I get that she wasn't that fast in her home game but come on.

Arete is disappointment across the board -- her stats are pretty much Leo's in 2021 (a unit who is heavily mocked by a lot of players) and she offers pretty much nothing new for skill fodder.
Raudrrabbit is the non-seasonal clone of Summer Lorenz's weapon.
Atk/Res Push 3 is available on Brady.
Res Ploy is available on Forrest and Ilyana.

Benny be "Wary Fighter in 2021 lmao".

 

Spoiler

Arete is basically Iago who traded a Prf for a horse. It's actually kinda ridiculous how similar her stat line is to his.

Iago
42/38/27/23/32

Arete
41/36/27/20/34

And as a general PSA to anyone: if you want Nifl's silhouette to show up in the Catalog, go do a quick Tempest Trials run now that the update dropped.

[Mercakete]

Sooo about the FB... I guess Nifl isn't here.

Charlotte:

Spoiler

And Charlotte's at it again, except that her going after Alfonse doesn't actually make sense. She says that it doesn't matter where the royal is from, but her whole reason she wants to marry into money is to support her parents. How does she plan to ship that cash back home? Seems to me like her best bets are Leo, Xander, and M!Corrin, and I don't see her overlooking this issue since her goal is so important to her. I do, however, find it funny that she claims that no one knows her true personality yet. She apparently hasn't met her Bride self yet.

 

[NegativeExponents-]

7 minutes ago, Mercakete said:

Sooo about the FB... I guess Nifl isn't here.

Charlotte:

  Hide contents

And Charlotte's at it again, except that her going after Alfonse doesn't actually make sense. She says that it doesn't matter where the royal is from, but her whole reason she wants to marry into money is to support her parents. How does she plan to ship that cash back home? Seems to me like her best bets are Leo, Xander, and M!Corrin, and I don't see her overlooking this issue since her goal is so important to her. I do, however, find it funny that she claims that no one knows her true personality yet. She apparently hasn't met her Bride self yet.

 

Spoiler

Besides that, even if she could export the money back home, it'd probably be worthless as I assume Fates and Heroes uses different currencies. Honestly, might be easier to have her parents imported instead.

 

[Mercakete]

5 minutes ago, NegativeExponents- said:

  Reveal hidden contents

Besides that, even if she could export the money back home, it'd probably be worthless as I assume Fates and Heroes uses different currencies. Honestly, might be easier to have her parents imported instead.

 

Agreed.

 

Hmm I haven't seen Benny's FB convoes much yet, but I can't help but think of people he has things in common with. Mordecai comes to mind immediately. I could see them chilling with wild forest creatures. Maybe Marianne, too. Possibly also Shigure, and maybe even Lilith. Animal friends.