Should enemy effective weaponry be more common?

[Jotari]

Effective damage is something that's been around since the start. However throughout the entire history of Fire Emblem it's always something in the player hands and rarely something the enemy uses. There might be just one poleaxe or ridersbane enemy in the entire game. The obvious exception to this being bows which are frequent and vortually always effective against fliers. Which in itself proves effective damage can work in enemy hands if its consistent and predictable (see also Laguz, I guess? Though even then I never really remember fearing enemy mages). I think they neglect to give enemies effective weaponry  because it'd kind of suck to get killed by an unexpected ridersbane. But the same goes for crits and killing weapons are more common than effective weaponry it feels. We also have UI now that can auto highlight that. And just in general more ridersbanes will nerf cavalry which is commonly thought of as just plain better than infantry (for inverse reasons I'm not really looking for  ore hammers on enemies since armours in player hands already have an uphill battle). What do you think?

[Metal Flash]

I think it would be cool to see more enemies use effective weaponry. Many hacks have done it to great effect. Not sure how many enemies or how often though. Too many and they stop being unique weapons, too few and we go back to square one.

[Imuabicus der Fertige]

More than TH, less than CQ would be an ok compromise for most I imagine.

Or well, not have an enemy have 3 different types of effective weaponry, like some of the Master of Arms in CQ and maybe 1 normal weapon.

[lenticular]

Partly, it depends on the balance of different unit types. As you say, armour units are generally not very strong, so there's no need to have more hammers around to counter them. On the other hand, fliers typically are very strong, which is part of the reason that it's OK that bows are so common. Having both a big benefit (being able to fly) and a pretty glaring weakness (vulnerability to a very common weapon type) goes someway towards keeping fliers somewhat balanced. Relatedly, this is why I hope that Three Houses style dismounting never comes back, because having a "get out of weaknesses free" button is one of the reasons why fliers are kinda broken in that game.

Cavalry tends to have more variability from game to game, being great in some games but mediocre in others. Throwing in poleaxes and ridersbanes would make sense in games where cavalry is otherwise great, but less sense in games that have pretty mediocre cavalry.

One of the problems that I have with effective weaponry is that too often it doesn't make for interesting or compelling gameplay. If a map is filled mostly with enemies with regular weapons but then there's one guy with a ridersbane, then I'll just make sure I attack that one guy with someone who isn't on a horse. Provided that you actually notice that the weapon is there, it's a trivially easy problem to solve. Maybe for people who have literally never played a turn-based tactics game before, it might take them a moment to figure out how to deal with it, but this is tutorial level stuff. The bigger challenge is in actually noticing that the weapon is there to begin with.

It's only really interesting if the effective weaponry is smartly positioned. So as a fairly simple example, there's a secondary objective that is easy to get to with a flier but much more difficult to get to on foot, except that it's guarded by a couple of enemy archers. That's potentially interesting, since it gives you an actual decision to make. Can I manage to kill the archers before they kill my fliers, or do I need to go the long way around? If I can do it with fliers, how many of my fliers do I need to send? And so on.

The same sort of thing could potentially be done with effective damage against cavalry and armour units, except it's generally harder to make it work because, unlike fliers, there often isn't so clear a distinction between cavalry, infantry, and armour. In most games, they do pretty much the same sort of thing, except that some of them are better at it than others. The existence of Canto -- especially the version that can be used after attacking -- can sometimes give cavalry something of a niche, admitedly. But at the other end of the scale, you get something like Shadows of Valentia where Gold Knight really don't have anything to offer that Dread Fighters don't.

Basically, I want for all different unit types to have their inherent strengths, weaknesses and well-defined roles, and then think that the existence andf prevalence of effective weaponry should then naturally derive from that.

[Florete]

4 hours ago, Jotari said:

(for inverse reasons I'm not really looking for  ore hammers on enemies since armours in player hands already have an uphill battle)

Looking at it another way, I think armored units should be made much better to the point where effective damage is the only reliable way to kill them.

Yeah, I'd like to see more effective weaponry.

[Jotari]

45 minutes ago, Florete said:

Looking at it another way, I think armored units should be made much better to the point where effective damage is the only reliable way to kill them.

Yeah, I'd like to see more effective weaponry.

That's certainly how armours tend to be treated on the enemy's hands (in addition to magic), but making them so good that the enemy needs effective weapons to take them down would be something of an instant win tactic. You just assassinate the enemies with armour effectiveness and then solo the area with a powerful armour.

[whase]

I feel like most FE games solve the superior movement of cavalier/fliers by giving them slightly lower stats, which sort of is a solution. But, for my self written FE D&D system, I decided on solving it using effective damage. It's been quite a journey and it's still not completely well balanced, but I did notice this way effective damage obviously becomes very important for both players and enemies.

I do find effective damage a more interesting way of handling this that lowered stats though, harder to balance, but it feels more rewarding. So yes, enemy effective weaponry should be more common. (So long as it's not an instant-kill weapon, that's a bit much imo.)

[AnonymousSpeed]

7 minutes ago, whase said:

But, for my self written FE D&D system, I decided on solving it using effective damage.

Does movement matter in D&D?

Personally, I like effective weapons a lot as a game mechanic, but I really do think they work a lot better as a player asset than enemy one. Using effective weapons to balance classes (aside from bows, where it's a constant trait of a common weapon type) is pretty lame- it's highly situational, but even worse is that the conceptual idea sucks. "This thing is too good, so let's occasionally bash it with a hammer instead of actually balancing it in a natural way." Same thing for dismounting.

Honestly, the best mechanic to balance mounted units? Ledges. Good terrain benefits.

[Jotari]

3 minutes ago, AnonymousSpeed said:

Honestly, the best mechanic to balance mounted units? Ledges. Good terrain benefits.

This I can agree with conceptually, but Fire Emblem has never truly done it well. Well Heroes actually kind of does with these terrain tiles that are impassible for mounted units unless they are adjacent to them, but legdes in Radiant Dawn served less to nerf mounted units and just kind of wall off maps from them, and that's when they bothered to use them at all on the, what, three maps that have ledges? It's only indoor ledges, no natural terrain typography. Actually I think dismounting would syngerize well with ledges, as it would allow mounted units to get to parts of the map, but make it too inconvenient to do so. For all that people complain here about dismounting in Three Houses being unfair, I've never once felt it necessary to actually use it in Three Houses. Effective weaponry isn't common enough for non fliers and even for fliers the ability to just move and canto is way too effective to give up. You just stay out of the range of the bow by flying over impassable terrain. The only time I've ever used dismount was to stick someone with the Chalice of Begnnings on a shrub for the evasion bonus and have them dodge tank the entire map, but that's me just dicking around and isn't even required for suck overkill dodge tanks.

[whase]

1 minute ago, AnonymousSpeed said:

Does movement matter in D&D?

In actual D&D? A little bit. In my completely self written system based upon a mixture of D&D and FE? Yes, a lot.

In D&D most characters have a movement of 30 ft, which means as much as 6 squares. In my system I gave most units 3 movement, with mounts granting a +2, which is actually quite substantial.

Effective damage won't one-shot cavaliers, but it keeps you from sprinting ahead and getting ahead of everyone else. Ledges are great and all, but that won't stop fliers. Make your terrain benefits too high and everybody simply sprints for the bushes like in Echoes. Using multiple tools for balancing is better imo.

[AnonymousSpeed]

1 minute ago, Jotari said:

This I can agree with conceptually, but Fire Emblem has never truly done it well.

Neither does it do enemies with effective weapons well, and yet here we are. At least ledges work conceptually. It is strange, though, that the gacha game is the one to make the most successful and active effort to balance mounted units.

1 minute ago, whase said:

Effective damage won't one-shot cavaliers, but it keeps you from sprinting ahead and getting ahead of everyone else.

Right, but if a mounted unit can't sprint ahead of everyone on open terrain, is it truly a mounted unit in spirit?

Ledges might not stop fliers, but no +20 avoid on forts and bows might. Multiple tools, I agree, is best for balance, and I think tools that are more consistently present than "mechanical exceptions" are better.

[Metal Flash]

2 hours ago, AnonymousSpeed said:

Neither does it do enemies with effective weapons well, and yet here we are. At least ledges work conceptually. It is strange, though, that the gacha game is the one to make the most successful and active effort to balance mounted units.

I feel like that comes down the small maps, making terrian matter more since you (usually) can`t just walk around it.  

[Jotari]

3 hours ago, AnonymousSpeed said:

Neither does it do enemies with effective weapons well, and yet here we are. At least ledges work conceptually. It is strange, though, that the gacha game is the one to make the most successful and active effort to balance mounted units.

It's strange that they only did it once (it was once, right? Did Path of Radiance have ledges?). I blame the 3DS and their decision to make maps that look isometric. though  even then the technology was still there, it was the 3DS, adding depth of ledges would have been completely possible (and indeed there is a lot of depth in some maps like the Mila Tree), but for whatever reason their visual design didn't encourage making ledges part of gameplay. It absolutely could have happened in Three Houses, but by that time Radiant Dawn was already ten years old and, I suppose, they just sort of forgot about them.

[Shanty Pete's 1st Mate]

Spoiler

That's certainly how armours tend to be treated on the enemy's hands (in addition to magic), but making them so good that the enemy needs effective weapons to take them down would be something of an instant win tactic. You just assassinate the enemies with armour effectiveness and then solo the area with a powerful armour.

Yes, but that requires you to actually *shudder* move your armor knight. The player should be rewarded for the tedium it takes to get an Armor Knight to actually face the enemy.

Anyway, I wouldn't go as far as saying "Armors immune to everything but effective weaponry and magic", but I do think something like "Armors take half damage from non-effective weaponry" or "Armors immune to physical crits" could be interesting.

6 hours ago, Jotari said:

This I can agree with conceptually, but Fire Emblem has never truly done it well. Well Heroes actually kind of does with these terrain tiles that are impassible for mounted units unless they are adjacent to them, but legdes in Radiant Dawn served less to nerf mounted units and just kind of wall off maps from them, and that's when they bothered to use them at all on the, what, three maps that have ledges? It's only indoor ledges, no natural terrain typography. Actually I think dismounting would syngerize well with ledges, as it would allow mounted units to get to parts of the map, but make it too inconvenient to do so. For all that people complain here about dismounting in Three Houses being unfair, I've never once felt it necessary to actually use it in Three Houses. Effective weaponry isn't common enough for non fliers and even for fliers the ability to just move and canto is way too effective to give up. You just stay out of the range of the bow by flying over impassable terrain. The only time I've ever used dismount was to stick someone with the Chalice of Begnnings on a shrub for the evasion bonus and have them dodge tank the entire map, but that's me just dicking around and isn't even required for suck overkill dodge tanks.

Radiant Dawn is the one game without dismounting that feels like it should have it. It's still a trade-off: take a turn to dismount, then climb up the ledge, then another turn to re-mount. Oh yeah, and ledges do occur in outdoor maps, like the Part I map where you meet Tauroneo, Zihark, and Jill, or the Part III map where you climb up the mountain with Kyza and Lyre.

As for effective weapons in general, yeah it'd be nice to see more of them. What's the point of working towards a "Horse Effect Null" skill in 3H, when no enemies have anti-cavalry weapons? Two requests, though: rename Horseslayers to the more elegant Ridersbane, and give Fates-style warning markers to denote where the effective weaponry is. Or at least give the player the option to flip the warnings layer on/off.

[Jotari]

5 minutes ago, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said:

  Reveal hidden contents

That's certainly how armours tend to be treated on the enemy's hands (in addition to magic), but making them so good that the enemy needs effective weapons to take them down would be something of an instant win tactic. You just assassinate the enemies with armour effectiveness and then solo the area with a powerful armour.

Yes, but that requires you to actually *shudder* move your armor knight. The player should be rewarded for the tedium it takes to get an Armor Knight to actually face the enemy.

Anyway, I wouldn't go as far as saying "Armors immune to everything but effective weaponry and magic", but I do think something like "Armors take half damage from non-effective weaponry" or "Armors immune to physical crits" could be interesting.

Radiant Dawn is the one game without dismounting that feels like it should have it. It's still a trade-off: take a turn to dismount, then climb up the ledge, then another turn to re-mount. Oh yeah, and ledges do occur in outdoor maps, like the Part I map where you meet Tauroneo, Zihark, and Jill, or the Part III map where you climb up the mountain with Kyza and Lyre.

As for effective weapons in general, yeah it'd be nice to see more of them. What's the point of working towards a "Horse Effect Null" skill in 3H, when no enemies have anti-cavalry weapons? Two requests, though: rename Horseslayers to the more elegant Ridersbane, and give Fates-style warning markers to denote where the effective weaponry is. Or at least give the player the option to flip the warnings layer on/off.

Ah yes, two maps where you'll definitely be bringing cavalry. Because you have a grand total of 0 with the Dawn Brigade at that time and, what, is it just Oscar for the Greil Mercs? I think it is literally just Oscar as the only cavalry in early Part 3. They really just shoved all the cavalry units into the Crimean Knights.  Well I guess there's Mist too if you can promote her that early (funny thing with Mist is that you can actually get her stuck in some areas by promoting her to cavalry mid map).

This is all making me think that Radiant Dawn with class changing could be very interesting. Because for as big as the cast is, massive even, the class distribution can get kind of weird due to the army hopping.

Edited December 14, 2021 by Jotari

[Interdimensional Observer]

6 hours ago, Jotari said:

what, three maps that have ledges?

More than that:

• 1-5 -Though you have no mounties yet. Still important though, given they're in the center of the map will a bunch of enemies are and shall try approaching T'neo's group from. The map is outdoors, but you're kinda right in that the ledges are on a ruined structure.
• 1-7 -This is indoors as you say.
• 1-F -Indoors again.
• 2-1 -The Brom & Nephenee chapter. Outdoors.
• 2-3 -Geoffrey's Charge. Outdoors.
• 2-F -Outdoors, but it is a castle.
• 3-4 -This is the first case where the ledges are entirely natural in origin, being part of a mountainous landscape.
• 3-5 -The outdoor fortifications of a manor.
• 3-9 -Outdoors in a village.
• 3-12 -Natural and outdoors far to the west, where T'neo and a friend are located and can painlessly pick off a few Crimean-Apostolic soldiers. 
• 3-13 -Outdoors castle fortifications.
• 4-4 Indoors in a mansion.

So twelve chapters actually.

[Vicious Sal]

11 minutes ago, Jotari said:

Ah yes, two maps where you'll definitely be bringing cavalry. Because you have a grand total of 0 with the Dawn Brigade at that time and, what, is it just Oscar for the Greil Mercs? I think it is literally just Oscar as the only cavalry in early Part 3. They really just shoved all the cavalry units into the Crimean Knights.  Well I guess there's Mist too if you can promote her that early (funny thing with Mist is that you can actually get her stuck in some areas by promoting her to cavalry mid map).

This is all making me think that Radiant Dawn with class changing could be very interesting. Because for as big as the cast is, massive even, the class distribution can get kind of weird due to the army hopping.

1-5 Has no cavalry. But outdoor ledges

2-1 is there as well, but no cavalry.

2-3 Has ledges, is outdoor and is literally the entier CRK

 I'm discounting 2-E since technically it has them as well, but the CRk's arrive late and from the corridoor without ledges.

3-4 Is outdoors and you have Titania and Oscar, not just Oscar

3-5 is outdoors with oncer again Titania and Oscar

3-9 Is outdoors, with ledges, and the CRK's

Also discounting 3-12 since Fiona is not near the ledge but you could argue based on the criteria you outlined.

Lastly 3-13 is counted as indoor even though it is open air.

 

So that's 5 extra maps, two of which have the literal cavalry army.

 

EDIT: The post above also notes indoor maps, but yeah, Ledges are prominent and you're just not checking the data before posting.

Edited December 14, 2021 by Vicious Sal

[Shanty Pete's 1st Mate]

9 minutes ago, Jotari said:

Ah yes, two maps where you'll definitely be bringing cavalry. Because you have a grand total of 0 with the Dawn Brigade at that time and, what, is it just Oscar for the Greil Mercs? I think it is literally just Oscar as the only cavalry in early Part 3. They really just shoved all the cavalry units into the Crimean Knights.  Well I guess there's Mist too if you can promote her that early (funny thing with Mist is that you can actually get her stuck in some areas by promoting her to cavalry mid map).

Titania: "Am I a joke to you?"

Anyway, ledges also appear in 2-3 (the Crimean Knights and yellow units aplenty chapter) and 3-12 (where you technically have Fiona). Save for Renning, I think every horseback unit can potentially be fielded in at least one outdoor map with ledges.

9 minutes ago, Jotari said:

This is all making me think that Radiant Dawn with class changing could be very interesting. Because for as big as the cast is, massive even, the class distribution can get kind of weird due to the army hopping.

Every remake thus far has had some shade of reclassing, so I wouldn't be surprised to see this in a potential Tellius remake. That said, would it make the laguz even less interesting, for them to remain class-locked while their beorc brethren can class-change? Or should laguz get a class change option as well?

[vanguard333]

It would be interesting to see more enemies use effective weaponry. I could see a number of ways in which this would be interesting. For instance, if ledges from Radiant Dawn are ever brought back, then putting units with ridersbane on ledgeless paths could be an interesting obstacle.

 

21 minutes ago, Jotari said:

This is all making me think that Radiant Dawn with class changing could be very interesting. Because for as big as the cast is, massive even, the class distribution can get kind of weird due to the army hopping.

I don't think reclassing would really work for the Tellius games, as those games are very much balanced around fixed classes. Unique classes are abundant, as are story-driven promotions, and Laguz would be at even more of a disadvantage if reclassing was implemented.

[Jotari]

30 minutes ago, Vicious Sal said:

1-5 Has no cavalry. But outdoor ledges

2-1 is there as well, but no cavalry.

2-3 Has ledges, is outdoor and is literally the entier CRK

 I'm discounting 2-E since technically it has them as well, but the CRk's arrive late and from the corridoor without ledges.

3-4 Is outdoors and you have Titania and Oscar, not just Oscar

3-5 is outdoors with oncer again Titania and Oscar

3-9 Is outdoors, with ledges, and the CRK's

Also discounting 3-12 since Fiona is not near the ledge but you could argue based on the criteria you outlined.

Lastly 3-13 is counted as indoor even though it is open air.

 

So that's 5 extra maps, two of which have the literal cavalry army.

 

EDIT: The post above also notes indoor maps, but yeah, Ledges are prominent and you're just not checking the data before posting.

 

32 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

More than that:

• 1-5 -Though you have no mounties yet. Still important though, given they're in the center of the map will a bunch of enemies are and shall try approaching T'neo's group from. The map is outdoors, but you're kinda right in that the ledges are on a ruined structure.
• 1-7 -This is indoors as you say.
• 1-F -Indoors again.
• 2-1 -The Brom & Nephenee chapter. Outdoors.
• 2-3 -Geoffrey's Charge. Outdoors.
• 2-F -Outdoors, but it is a castle.
• 3-4 -This is the first case where the ledges are entirely natural in origin, being part of a mountainous landscape.
• 3-5 -The outdoor fortifications of a manor.
• 3-9 -Outdoors in a village.
• 3-12 -Natural and outdoors far to the west, where T'neo and a friend are located and can painlessly pick off a few Crimean-Apostolic soldiers. 
• 3-13 -Outdoors castle fortifications.
• 4-4 Indoors in a mansion.

So twelve chapters actually.

Well, yes I could have checked the data, but I was going a tad for exaggeration. Off the top of my head without giving it serious thought I was able to recall the early Monastary chapter, 2-E, Oliver's chapter and the defense chapters (so basically the ones with artificial ledges). The mountain is a pretty big one that slipped my mind though. I wasn't intending to give an accurate number, that's what the "what" was for. It was more about the impression that ledges make, and I suppose I could have been clearer but it wasn't that they don't provide a good element to Radiant Dawn's combat, but more that the element they do provide doesn't feel like it's particularly designed to block cavalry specifically.

My, eh, apologies to Titania T.T

30 minutes ago, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said:

Titania: "Am I a joke to you?"

Anyway, ledges also appear in 2-3 (the Crimean Knights and yellow units aplenty chapter) and 3-12 (where you technically have Fiona). Save for Renning, I think every horseback unit can potentially be fielded in at least one outdoor map with ledges.

Every remake thus far has had some shade of reclassing, so I wouldn't be surprised to see this in a potential Tellius remake. That said, would it make the laguz even less interesting, for them to remain class-locked while their beorc brethren can class-change? Or should laguz get a class change option as well?

More varied Laguz classes is an option. I think such discussion came up in Alastor's play log at some point. Or at some other point. I do recall talking about potentially varied Laguz class ideas at least somewhere.

Edited December 14, 2021 by Jotari

[Florete]

7 hours ago, AnonymousSpeed said:

Neither does it do enemies with effective weapons well, and yet here we are. At least ledges work conceptually. It is strange, though, that the gacha game is the one to make the most successful and active effort to balance mounted units.

I think it makes perfect sense that the game with a heavy emphasis on PvP tries harder to balance powerful elements than the single-player experiences.

[Armchair General]

As much emphasis as Fates put on those guys with the Wyrmslayers in the prologue, I really don't remember encountering people with effective weaponry that wasn't an free drop.

[Imuabicus der Fertige]

4 hours ago, Armchair General said:

As much emphasis as Fates put on those guys with the Wyrmslayers in the prologue, I really don't remember encountering people with effective weaponry that wasn't an free drop.

According to the wiki.org:

Chapter 5: 2x Wyrmslayers

(Cahpter 9: on Lunatic 1x of the reinforcing Spear Fighters wields a Dual Naginata)

Chapter 11: 1x Oni with a Hammer -> in Kazes room of Lunge

Chapter 12: Kagero with the Sting Shurken

Chapter 13: 2x Cav with Beastkiller, Orochi with Calamity Gate

Chapter 14: 1x Oni with Pike-Ruin-Club, 1x Sky Knight with a Swordcatcher

Chapter 15: 1x Villager with a Dual Naginata

Chapter 16: 4 Mercs with 2x Armorslayer 2x Wyrmslayer

Chapter 17: 1x Samurai with Axesplitter, 1x SM with Armorslayer, 1x SM with Dual Katana, 1x reinforcing Samurai with Dual Katana

Chapter 18: 1x Hammer, 2x Beastkiller, 2x Armorslayer

Chapter 19: foxes

Chapter 20: 2x Swordcatcher, 1x Calamity Gate, 2x Dual Naginata

Chapter 22: 2x Calamity Gate, 1x Dual Naginata, 1x Dual Club, 1x Beastkiller, 1x Pike-Ruin-Club, 1x Axe Splitter

Chapter 23: a bunch

Chapter 24: 1x Pike Ruin Club

Chapter 25: Kagero with 1x Sting Shuriken, 1x Axe Splitter, 1x Pike Ruin Club, 1x Swordcatcher, 1x Dual Katana

Chapter 26: 8x Wyrmslayers, 8x Hammer, 8x Beast Killer 

Endgame: 1x Hammer, 1x Beast Killer, 

[Jotari]

3 hours ago, Imuabicus said:

According to the wiki.org:

Chapter 5: 2x Wyrmslayers

(Cahpter 9: on Lunatic 1x of the reinforcing Spear Fighters wields a Dual Naginata)

Chapter 11: 1x Oni with a Hammer -> in Kazes room of Lunge

Chapter 12: Kagero with the Sting Shurken

Chapter 13: 2x Cav with Beastkiller, Orochi with Calamity Gate

Chapter 14: 1x Oni with Pike-Ruin-Club, 1x Sky Knight with a Swordcatcher

Chapter 15: 1x Villager with a Dual Naginata

Chapter 16: 4 Mercs with 2x Armorslayer 2x Wyrmslayer

Chapter 17: 1x Samurai with Axesplitter, 1x SM with Armorslayer, 1x SM with Dual Katana, 1x reinforcing Samurai with Dual Katana

Chapter 18: 1x Hammer, 2x Beastkiller, 2x Armorslayer

Chapter 19: foxes

Chapter 20: 2x Swordcatcher, 1x Calamity Gate, 2x Dual Naginata

Chapter 22: 2x Calamity Gate, 1x Dual Naginata, 1x Dual Club, 1x Beastkiller, 1x Pike-Ruin-Club, 1x Axe Splitter

Chapter 23: a bunch

Chapter 24: 1x Pike Ruin Club

Chapter 25: Kagero with 1x Sting Shuriken, 1x Axe Splitter, 1x Pike Ruin Club, 1x Swordcatcher, 1x Dual Katana

Chapter 26: 8x Wyrmslayers, 8x Hammer, 8x Beast Killer 

Endgame: 1x Hammer, 1x Beast Killer, 

There are only two wyrmslayers in chapter 5? Huh. That really goes to show how important positoning plays a role in making these things feel like they're part if the map.

[Imuabicus der Fertige]

3 hours ago, Jotari said:

There are only two wyrmslayers in chapter 5? Huh. That really goes to show how important positoning plays a role in making these things feel like they're part if the map.

I´m more surprised with the 24 effective weapons in chapter 26 - I´m wondering if that´s the greatest amount in a single chapter in FE. Plus they are concentrated in 2 rooms.