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Choose Your Legends Round 6 Discussion Thread!


DefyingFates
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I am going all in on Plumeria for now. I might switch to Azura or another Dancer/Singer later.

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3 hours ago, Jotari said:

*Heroes is placed between Fates and Three Houses in the listing while TMS. Bit of bias there but Heroes is kind of calling itself a main series title and TMS not.

TMS is specifically listed as its Encore release, which was released after Three Houses, and not its original release.

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1 minute ago, Ice Dragon said:

TMS is specifically listed as its Encore release, which was released after Three Houses, and not its original release.

Good catch. Though if that is taken as a standard one would expect the same logic to follow with Shadows of Valentia which was released after Heroes too. Though Gaiden was always on the list while the original TMS wasn't.

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1 minute ago, Jotari said:

Good catch. Though if that is taken as a standard one would expect the same logic to follow with Shadows of Valentia which was released after Heroes too. Though Gaiden was always on the list while the original TMS wasn't.

The difference is that both Gaiden and Echoes are listed (under the same heading) whereas TMS♯FE is not listed at all for whatever reason, so Gaiden/Echoes is listed chronologically in Gaiden's position, whereas TMS♯FE Encore is listed chronologically in Encore's position. The logic is sound given the givens, but the givens don't make sense, so... yeah.

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I used my second vote on Elena from Path of Radiance but woooah...

Revealing the top 8 early? I'm not sure if I like it. Now I feel really conflicted if I should continue to vote for characters I want added in the game or just try with al my might to make Bernadetta win. 

Anyway I wouldn't exactly call this list surprising if not for Azura making it and Soren whose popularity I clearly underestimated.

1 minute ago, Ice Dragon said:

The difference is that both Gaiden and Echoes are listed (under the same heading) whereas TMS♯FE is not listed at all for whatever reason, so Gaiden/Echoes is listed chronologically in Gaiden's position, whereas TMS♯FE Encore is listed chronologically in Encore's position. The logic is sound given the givens, but the givens don't make sense, so... yeah.

It's also notable that the original order of games in CYL was unchanged in every new version. The Heroes version was added in CYL 2 placed after all the others, and in CYL 4 they added Three Houses and TMS placed after all the previously votable games.

As weird at it sounds couldn't it be that they simply didn't want to place TMS between Fates and Heroes simply because in CYL 2 and 3 there was nothing between the two games and they want to remain consistent?

Like they for some reason consider changing the existing order of games different from simply adding to the existing order of games at the tail end?

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2 minutes ago, GrandeRampel said:

It's also notable that the original order of games in CYL was unchanged in every new version. The Heroes version was added in CYL 2 placed after all the others, and in CYL 4 they added Three Houses and TMS placed after all the previously votable games.

As weird at it sounds couldn't it be that they simply didn't want to place TMS between Fates and Heroes simply because in CYL 2 and 3 there was nothing between the two games and they want to remain consistent?

Like they for some reason consider changing the existing order of games different from simply adding to the existing order of games at the tail end?

I guess we'll have to wait to see if they ever decide to add Warriors to see if they're just tacking things to the end, as if they go in chronological order, it'd end up between Heroes and Three Houses.

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5 hours ago, Jotari said:

*Whom we called Barth, the armoured knight guy, has the real name of Barthe. That E doesn't look like it'd make much of a difference, but he's alphabetically placed right beside Bartre which makes them look like they have almost identical names as it's only a single character difference. Great job there guys. Was just calling him Bart really off the table?

They didn't want to give Barthe the same name as Barth. That's the purpose of the "e", as stupid as it may be.

5 hours ago, Jotari said:

Like does Ladislava even appear in the academy arc?

Yes, but only in Ch. 12 (where she's either an enemy Wyvern Rider or, in Crimson Flower, an ally NPC that is inexplicably a Cavalier instead of a Wyvern Rider). She's the enemy on Maddening that always yeets Hanneman or his stand-in.

Also, when you're in the bunker or whatever in Crimson Flower (before the map), she's one of the NPCs that you can talk to.

Edited by Tybrosion
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14 hours ago, Alexmender said:

Anyways, today RNG chose Elena. She's Ike's dead mom, right? Can't remember

Even if it was random and not by choice, this makes me so happy! Thank you! ^_^ (And yes, she is Ike and Mist's mom!)

12 hours ago, Fire Emblem Fan said:

Huh, very interesting that they'd release the Top 8 for both sides already. I wonder how much this will change things. A lot of people seem to be missing the "listed in alphabetical order" part.

For me, personally, still just...voting for Brom. Alternating between Path of Radiance and Radiant Dawn. I just want to see him hopefully get enough votes to get into the game on a future Tellius and/or seasonal banner.

For people like us who have obscure characters we really want in, it's not good since it makes people gravitate even more toward those listed. That's because people give up early, being all "well, I can't win anyway, so I'll just vote for whoever has a chance" resulting in a self-fulfilling prophesy.

10 hours ago, LoneStar said:

I guess there's a big push for Adult Tiki and Soren.

Huh, kind of nice, I think. Personally, I wouldn't mind Soren winning. It would be especially cool if they based his outfit on Goldoan garb, or Almedha's outfit.

10 hours ago, MagicCanonBalls said:

The fanbase started out as massive and divisive, but now it's just divisive. 

Sadly, this is pretty accurate, I think.

7 hours ago, Diovani Bressan said:

Hmm... I am considering using my remaining votes on Adult Tiki...

I need to show IS that she also needs some attention, and not only the young one.

Unless IS decides to pool Tiki's votes and makes the young one into the brave hero or something.

4 hours ago, Jotari said:

Heroes is placed between Fates and Three Houses in the listing while TMS. Bit of bias there but Heroes is kind of calling itself a main series title and TMS not.

TMS was a collaboration between FE and Shin Megami Tensei, right? So, it's a crossover, but Heroes is purely an FE game. And it has its own self-contained story, characters, and setting, so I could certainly see it as a main-series FE game, even if it is the black sheep. It even got a track in Smash! Just because it's a mobile game doesn't mean it can't be main-series. It just needs to have the same basic components of the other main-series games, which it has (from story to art to music to gameplay.)

1 hour ago, GrandeRampel said:

I used my second vote on Elena from Path of Radiance

Thank you! ^_^ I really hope she rises in the ranks! Who knows? Maybe tomorrow will show her in the top 8 if people keep voting for her like this! She already gained 3 more votes today that I can see, and there may be ones from others I can't see!

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30 minutes ago, Tybrosion said:

They didn't want to give Barthe the same name as Barth. That's the purpose of the "e", as stupid as it may be.

You mean like the Gaiden character? I'm not sure that really would have been their concern, By that point they had localized several characters with the same name, like Selena or Arthur. A minor Gaiden boss seems like it wouldn't even be on the radar (though Shadows of Valentia might have started production or at least preproduction when the first CYL came about). And if  just technically having a different name was the intention, then I think Bart would still work better than either Barth or Barthe.

 

24 minutes ago, Mercakete said:

TMS was a collaboration between FE and Shin Megami Tensei, right? So, it's a crossover, but Heroes is purely an FE game. And it has its own self-contained story, characters, and setting, so I could certainly see it as a main-series FE game, even if it is the black sheep. It even got a track in Smash! Just because it's a mobile game doesn't mean it can't be main-series. It just needs to have the same basic components of the other main-series games, which it has (from story to art to music to gameplay.)

 

The basic components would be the very thing that would make me consider it not a Fire Emblem game, so we probably have quite a different idea as to what that term means.

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so, i wanted to give Soren at least one vote, and i think i'll him some more, since he's the only Tellius character in top 8

but i just might throw a few votes to the other green-haired *spoiler* mommy Almedha, i just want to see her in the game (possibly as a regular, non-limited unit)

Edited by Yexin
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5 minutes ago, Jotari said:

You mean like the Gaiden character? I'm not sure that really would have been their concern, By that point they had localized several characters with the same name, like Selena or Arthur. A minor Gaiden boss seems like it wouldn't even be on the radar (though Shadows of Valentia might have started production or at least preproduction when the first CYL came about). And if  just technically having a different name was the intention, then I think Bart would still work better than either Barth or Barthe.

Yeah, the one goes by Dahha in Japanese. How they even went from Dahha to Barth is a question itself.

As for why they’d they care about having two Barths when they already had other same name pairs, beats me. I just can’t come up with another reason as to why they stuck an “e” at the end of the armor knight’s name.

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Yesterday I gave my obligatory vote to Awakening Anna. Today I decided to vote for Awakening Tiki since it looks like she might actually have a chance at top 2 (and a brave dragon would be neat to see). For my main account I plan to dedicate a vote to Linde, Chrom, Felix, Ingrid and Hilda since I decided to do something different this year. For my two other Nintendo accounts though I plan to spread my votes out for Tiki, Chrom, Felix and Hilda since they are all in the top 8 right now.

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On 1/20/2022 at 6:23 AM, Etrurian emperor said:

I know its in vain but I'm kinda hoping that the lords won't win this time around. The Brave selection always gets more boring due to it being made up almost exclusively of lords who are very rarely the most interesting characters of their respective games. 

I agree. Other than Corrin, none of the main lords are among my favorite characters. I tend to like side characters more than main characters in general. There are only so many main lords to choose from, and most of them have already won, leaving space for other characters. Other than Chrom, Byleth and Corrin (and Robin and Kris, who I count as main lords) the only ones left are from the least popular/least played games. Honestly, I’m surprised Sigurd and Seliph are so perennially popular in CYL given how small of a fandom percentage has played GotHW.

I love the idea of announcing the top 8 for each day. At first I was thrilled to see Azura on top of the list, until I realized it was in alphabetical order. Still, I’m very pleased she and Corrin are in the top 8! I may send some votes to them if either make it into the top 3 at midterms. However, I’m less than pleased to see Yuri is in the top 8 again even after being added to Heroes last year.

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23 minutes ago, Tybrosion said:

Yeah, the one goes by Dahha in Japanese. How they even went from Dahha to Barth is a question itself.

This is speculation, but I can see the logic, as stupid as it is.

In Japanese, the "vhhv" (v representing a vowel) construction is used to represent a syllable-final /x/ sound. So German "Mach" is written マッハ (mahha), Dutch "Gogh" is written ゴッホ (gohho), and Irish "Fragarach" is written フラガラッハ (furagarahha).

There are two characters in Gaiden/Echoes with a name with this construction, ガッハ (gahha) and ダッハ (dahha). ガッハ (gahha) is most likely Polish "gach", and ダッハ (dahha) is most likely Polish or German "dach". The localization team, being allergic to names that they think Americans cannot pronounce, changed "Gach" to "Garth", which is a regular English word, and probably wanted to follow the same pattern for "Dach", but probably didn't want to change it to "Darth" for obvious reasons and decided to also change the initial consonant, resulting in "Barth".

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3 hours ago, Tybrosion said:

Yeah, the one goes by Dahha in Japanese. How they even went from Dahha to Barth is a question itself.

As for why they’d they care about having two Barths when they already had other same name pairs, beats me. I just can’t come up with another reason as to why they stuck an “e” at the end of the armor knight’s name.

Well if that's the case the notion of avoiding two pairs is completely thrown out, as Barth and Barthe would have been localized at the same time, unless Marthe was mentioned in Awakening. Point being the two characters don't in fact have the same name and the localisation just bizarrely gave them the same one.

2 hours ago, Ice Dragon said:

This is speculation, but I can see the logic, as stupid as it is.

In Japanese, the "vhhv" (v representing a vowel) construction is used to represent a syllable-final /x/ sound. So German "Mach" is written マッハ (mahha), Dutch "Gogh" is written ゴッホ (gohho), and Irish "Fragarach" is written フラガラッハ (furagarahha).

There are two characters in Gaiden/Echoes with a name with this construction, ガッハ (gahha) and ダッハ (dahha). ガッハ (gahha) is most likely Polish "gach", and ダッハ (dahha) is most likely Polish or German "dach". The localization team, being allergic to names that they think Americans cannot pronounce, changed "Gach" to "Garth", which is a regular English word, and probably wanted to follow the same pattern for "Dach", but probably didn't want to change it to "Darth" for obvious reasons and decided to also change the initial consonant, resulting in "Barth".

So can Americans innately pronunce Iuchar and Iuchabra then? I also know for a fact that the voice actors are mispronouncing half the Irish names they've went with. And hell Heroes is really fond of straight up giving us characters (as in letters) I have no idea how I'm meant to pronounce because they're like old Norse or something. You're probably not wrong in your summation, but that they did it to make things easier to pronounce is probably not true. It's more likely they did it just to further mystify their internal logic. Like why in the world did they call the tome Forseti and the character Ced? Surely that was meant to be a very obvious connection between the characters (and Seti is a name, albeit an Egyptian one which is a bit out of left field for Jugdral). Ced is such a weird unname name that when I google it google literally asks me if I meant "Ced Fire Emblem" before displaying a bunch of acronyms. Though googling Ced name does reveal that it is a name, in so far as it's just a shortened form of Cedric.

Another point on Gaiden Barth is that calling him that in particular gives us a weird dichotomy in which a tonne of the bosses have name ending in 'th'. Barth, Dolth, Greith, Garth, there's even a Jarth in the DLC. I don't know what all those characters are called in the Japanese (Barth and Garth at least are probably meant to be similar) but there's so many of them on indistinguishable pirate and bandit characters (plus Dolth which is like an English word for an idiot) that I'm half convinced it's some kind of joke. They could have went with Gart and Dart to make it sound less like Vader, though we already have a Dart in the series so it wouldn't have avoided the duplicate name issue on that front (though as whenever conversation trends towards names, I just have to commend the series for having so many characters with only a handful of repeating names. Had I been heading the series I probably would have given the first three bosses of each game the same name as the first three bosses in Shadow Dragon as soon as Binding Blade established itself as something of a soft reboot ripping off Archanea, though I'm also partially motived there by just finding Hyman to be a hilarious name).

Edited by Jotari
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1 hour ago, Jotari said:

The basic components would be the very thing that would make me consider it not a Fire Emblem game, so we probably have quite a different idea as to what that term means.

That's fair, but I should probably list what I consider the "basic components for a FE game" here, then, to clarify them as I define them.

- The (main) game is extremely story-driven, and in fact the events of the game occur along this story path. The game ends once the main story is concluded (even if parts can be revisited.)

- The story/game is broken up into chapters.

- There is a cast of playable characters, each with a unique design, backstory, name, etc.

- The gameplay is turn-based strategy combat on a grid. The player moves his or her units on this map and combat ensues when two (or more, in linked cases) come to blows.

- The game is made by Intelligent Systems (or whoever the holder of the rights is) and is said to be a Fire Emblem game by said rights holder(s.)

These are what I would say the basic components of a Fire Emblem game are, with the last one being the most important, really. These are things that all of the main-series Fire Emblem games have in common, and Heroes actually fits all of them. They also tend to fit into the high fantasy genre, but I don't think that's strictly necessary for a FE game if all the other components are there.

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Voted for Alois yet again. He’s probably getting one or two more votes (I don’t remember, are the midterm results after the third or fourth day? Are we even getting those this year?) and then I’m strongly considering dumping the rest on Dorothea since she’s my favorite character in either top 8. Funny how I would end up voting for 3H characters exclusively, but that’s how it goes.

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2 minutes ago, Mercakete said:

That's fair, but I should probably list what I consider the "basic components for a FE game" here, then, to clarify them as I define them.

- The (main) game is extremely story-driven, and in fact the events of the game occur along this story path. The game ends once the main story is concluded (even if parts can be revisited.)

- The story/game is broken up into chapters.

- There is a cast of playable characters, each with a unique design, backstory, name, etc.

- The gameplay is turn-based strategy combat on a grid. The player moves his or her units on this map and combat ensues when two (or more, in linked cases) come to blows.

- The game is made by Intelligent Systems (or whoever the holder of the rights is) and is said to be a Fire Emblem game by said rights holder(s.)

These are what I would say the basic components of a Fire Emblem game are, with the last one being the most important, really. These are things that all of the main-series Fire Emblem games have in common, and Heroes actually fits all of them. They also tend to fit into the high fantasy genre, but I don't think that's strictly necessary for a FE game if all the other components are there.

I would say that Heroes is very much not a story driven game. THey give one small piece of story once a month while the lions share of the focus is placed on the other modes and the summoning banners. I'd say the story mode is the second least focused aspect of Heroes with only the puzzle tutorial stuff being of less focus by the game.

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I managed to vote Elincia in my first vote today. I didn't know this was been up from 1/19, is there a way that I can fill up the two votes in since I was planning on voting all 7 different characters in for CYL Round 6?

Edited by King Marth 64
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17 minutes ago, Jotari said:

I would say that Heroes is very much not a story driven game. THey give one small piece of story once a month while the lions share of the focus is placed on the other modes and the summoning banners. I'd say the story mode is the second least focused aspect of Heroes with only the puzzle tutorial stuff being of less focus by the game.

There may be where we disagree, probably by how we measure it. The main focus of this game has always been the story, even though these things are also true: you can play the game without even touching the story, you don't need to progress much in the story to summon units, you can play other modes, and there are a lot of other modes. That's still not what the game itself (the entity of FEH, not the gameplay) focuses on. The game itself is organized by what's going on in the story, meeting Alfonse, Sharena, and Anna is unavoidable, banners follow the story (not only do the units on regular banners appear in the main story as enemies, but characters introduced in the story appear in banners as the story progresses, such as the "rule" of "once a character (such as Surtr, Thrasir, or Otr) dies, that character will become summonable"), and all other modes keep pointing back to the main story. Even how you get heroes is tied directly to the contents of the story (that is, the summoner being, well, the summoner.) Plus, all the main advertising we see happens at the beginning and end of the books, and are all about the story.

It could be, by the way, that I'm not explaining this very well, so disclaimer there, but if this game wasn't story-driven, then we'd just have battle maps with no linear progression in the plot at all. However, there is definitely a timespan between books 1 and 6, and characters grow and develop during that time, not to mention the meeting and inclusion of new characters (like how Fjorm and Peony appeared in Book 5.)

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37 minutes ago, King Marth 64 said:

I managed to vote Elincia in my first vote today. I didn't know this was been up from 1/19, is there a way that I can fill up the two votes in since I was planning on voting all 7 different characters in for CYL Round 6?

There's no way to get back a missed vote (other than using an alt account). That said, you only missed one day, not two - voting started about 42 hours ago.

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1 minute ago, Othin said:

There's no way to get back a missed vote (other than using an alt account). That said, you only missed one day, not two - voting started about 42 hours ago.

Oh, good idea, I did manage to create a Japanese and European Account for my Nintendo Switch while back. I'll try to do that way to fill in the rest of the votes in.

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