Jump to content

Three Hopes General Discussion Thread


Recommended Posts

2 hours ago, Dark Holy Elf said:

Not sure if this is common knowledge and/or true in previous musou games, but I figured out recently that you can heal completely for free (time-wise): just pause the game (doable even mid-animation/etc.), and choose the heal command to use a healing item. You'll be healed instantly with no animation time required when you unpause.

This further devalues my respect for self-healing skills/weapons, and further cements in my mind that Lifeforce and Impossible Feat are great skills.

I was thinking about making a dedicated thread about how useless the Sacred Weapons are. Not only do they provide very little benefit in terms of gameplay, but they have next to no presence in the story, popping up randomly out of nowhere, but they also have issues with me for the lore (though this was a bit of an issue in Three Houses too). Why do the crests of the elites have sacred weapons? Were these meant to be weapons some Nabateans made for the dragons killed by the elites? Or was it just some smith (Mascuil?) that played to both sides of the war making special weapons? Or do they just plain not exist as the likes of Axe of Ukonvasara is just never mention in the story (and can't even be used by its intended wielder in a magic class >.> )

And yes, Lifeforce is one of the best skills in the game. Aside from recovery items being far beyond what you actually need and Renewal being very easily available,  the danger of actually dying from HP loss is almost never relevant. HP loss is only ever important for losing the S rank, which is usually far more strict than the five HP gauges recovery items allow you. Which is all a bit of a shame since healing magic is one thing other warriors games don't seem to have and good be something that really makes Fire Emblem stand out (though this game is far better than any other Mushou game I've played so that's not a big deal imo).

Edited by Jotari
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 479
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

7 hours ago, Jotari said:

I was thinking about making a dedicated thread about how useless the Sacred Weapons are. Not only do they provide very little benefit in terms of gameplay, but they have next to no presence in the story, popping up randomly out of nowhere, but they also have issues with me for the lore (though this was a bit of an issue in Three Houses too). Why do the crests of the elites have sacred weapons? Were these meant to be weapons some Nabateans made for the dragons killed by the elites? Or was it just some smith (Mascuil?) that played to both sides of the war making special weapons? Or do they just plain not exist as the likes of Axe of Ukonvasara is just never mention in the story (and can't even be used by its intended wielder in a magic class >.> )

And yes, Lifeforce is one of the best skills in the game. Aside from recovery items being far beyond what you actually need and Renewal being very easily available,  the danger of actually dying from HP loss is almost never relevant. HP loss is only ever important for losing the S rank, which is usually far more strict than the five HP gauges recovery items allow you. Which is all a bit of a shame since healing magic is one thing other warriors games don't seem to have and good be something that really makes Fire Emblem stand out (though this game is far better than any other Mushou game I've played so that's not a big deal imo).

They aren't great late game but have the niche of being crestless weapons with uniquely high Mt and low weapon rank requirement. They are great for units getting into new weapon types.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Spear of Assal, The Inexhaustible, and Axe of Ukonvasara, and Sword of Seiros are all good. The other sacred weapons, not so much.

 

As for why Macuil was potentially playing both sides of the war, the only logical explanation I can think of is that the 10 elites, or the Nabateans whose crests they took, had family with the same crest fighting on the side of the Nabateans.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yeah, when people say the Sacred Weapons are weak, I tend to assume they're referring to specifically the ones that only have healing abilities. The ones that are effective against specific enemy types are very strong. The Sword of Seiros is only good for healing, but it's so good at it that it's worth using, it basically makes you immortal, especially if you have the crest of seiros. And The Inexhaustible is straight up the best bow in the game, and a strong contender for the best weapon in the game.

Edited by ZanaLyrander
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Certainly my issue is specifically with healing. I'm just not sure under what circumstances that you'd use up all your elixir supply and still need more healing. You've absolutely failed your S rank at that point, but maybe some hypothetically very tough, long battle where you don't care about ranks and just want to survive... but does such a thing even exist? Maybe on NG Maddening, but then you don't even have the sacred weapons. Obviously some of the weapons have good properties which make them worth using anyway.

8 hours ago, Jotari said:

Which is all a bit of a shame since healing magic is one thing other warriors games don't seem to have and good be something that really makes Fire Emblem stand out

Yeah I liked how useful staves felt in FEW1. In this game they're... still occasionally useful for protecting green units (such as in Hour of Vengeance, and certain paralogues, though not necessary even then, of course, you can get by with offence), but overall, not great.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Fabulously Olivier said:

Spear of Assal, The Inexhaustible, and Axe of Ukonvasara, and Sword of Seiros are all good. The other sacred weapons, not so much.

 

As for why Macuil was potentially playing both sides of the war, the only logical explanation I can think of is that the 10 elites, or the Nabateans whose crests they took, had family with the same crest fighting on the side of the Nabateans.

 

1 hour ago, ZanaLyrander said:

Yeah, when people say the Sacred Weapons are weak, I tend to assume they're referring to specifically the ones that only have healing abilities. The ones that are effective against specific enemy types are very strong. The Sword of Seiros is only good for healing, but it's so good at it that it's worth using, it basically makes you immortal, especially if you have the crest of seiros. And The Inexhaustible is straight up the best bow in the game, and a strong contender for the best weapon in the game.

It'll depend on what order you play the routes (I expect Spear of Assal is very good if you play Blue Lions first, though given the Kingdom is the cavalry army, do you even face many cavalry in Dimitri's route?), but for the ones with effective damage you're probably just better off upgrading a normal weapon with effective damage as you get it earlier and there are more widely available materials to forge common weapons. The Sword of Seiros also has conceptually great healing properties...but that won't help you get an S rank, and let's face it, like I said before, healing items are strong enough that you are never truly in danger of actually getting a game over from being damaged too much.

The Inexhaustible is pretty damn good though. Reducing the cooldown time of combat arts is a pretty damn broken ability for this game.

48 minutes ago, Dark Holy Elf said:

Certainly my issue is specifically with healing. I'm just not sure under what circumstances that you'd use up all your elixir supply and still need more healing. You've absolutely failed your S rank at that point, but maybe some hypothetically very tough, long battle where you don't care about ranks and just want to survive... but does such a thing even exist? Maybe on NG Maddening, but then you don't even have the sacred weapons. Obviously some of the weapons have good properties which make them worth using anyway.

Yeah I liked how useful staves felt in FEW1. In this game they're... still occasionally useful for protecting green units (such as in Hour of Vengeance, and certain paralogues, though not necessary even then, of course, you can get by with offence), but overall, not great.

Theoretically so, but are you really going to give a unit healing spells on the off chance you suddenly find yourself in a chapter where healing green units is vital? I'm certainly not. If you keep failing at the same chapter several times than maybe, but the only chapter where I found such a thing to really be a problem is when you need to protect Byleth in the hidden route (and even then I just found it simpler to brute force it in a more direct way, knowing where they'd be warped to, than worry about Byleth). Even Byleth's own unique ability to restore the warrior gauge using healing magic doesn't feel worth giving up a combat art for in competition with Aura and Sublime Heaven. It's not even really that healing magic is unnecessary (though it is), but combat arts are just so damn good that they're going to win out when they're both in competition for the same equipment slot.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, Jotari said:

It'll depend on what order you play the routes (I expect Spear of Assal is very good if you play Blue Lions first, though given the Kingdom is the cavalry army, do you even face many cavalry in Dimitri's route?), but for the ones with effective damage you're probably just better off upgrading a normal weapon with effective damage as you get it earlier and there are more widely available materials to forge common weapons. The Sword of Seiros also has conceptually great healing properties...but that won't help you get an S rank, and let's face it, like I said before, healing items are strong enough that you are never truly in danger of actually getting a game over from being damaged too much.

The effective weapons like Rapiers, Horseslayers, Armorslayer, etc. fall off extremely hard over time. They only get +4 to might/durability per upgrade at the blacksmith, and that's with a fully upgraded blacksmith, while the Sacred Weapons get +8 per upgrade with a fully upgraded blacksmith. They are way too weak to be useful late game. They may be useful during a NG run, but in NG+ runs, they're simply not worth the investment.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, ZanaLyrander said:

The effective weapons like Rapiers, Horseslayers, Armorslayer, etc. fall off extremely hard over time. They only get +4 to might/durability per upgrade at the blacksmith, and that's with a fully upgraded blacksmith, while the Sacred Weapons get +8 per upgrade with a fully upgraded blacksmith. They are way too weak to be useful late game. They may be useful during a NG run, but in NG+ runs, they're simply not worth the investment.

Yeah, but Sacred Weapons also fall off in New Game+, as by then I'm using relics. But as someone who played Golden Wildfire first, I got far mor out of my horse slaying gauntlets than the Axe of Ukonvasara (course knights are the least necessary weapon effectiveness you need as magic will knock them off very quickly). By the time you get to New Game+, you're really only fielding 4-6 units (and I think 6 units is being generous as per my previous complaints about the difficulty scaling when you're guaranteed to have a maxed level Shez each New Game+) and there's plenty of weapons better than the sacred weapons by then. I personally still use Sacred Weapons as I like using characters with narratively appropriate weapons, but I think they fall short of being the best weapons in the game (with some exceptions, Caduceus is probably great to throw on anyone as well). Course I find the game to be just mindlessly easily over all compared to an actual Fire Emblem game, so basically any conversation about the effectiveness of things is practically moot so long as your using life force and powerful combat arts.

Edited by Jotari
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Jotari said:

Yeah, but Sacred Weapons also fall off in New Game+, as by then I'm using relics. But as someone who played Golden Wildfire first, I got far mor out of my horse slaying gauntlets than the Axe of Ukonvasara (course knights are the least necessary weapon effectiveness you need as magic will knock them off very quickly). By the time you get to New Game+, you're really only fielding 4-6 units (and I think 6 units is being generous as per my previous complaints about the difficulty scaling when you're guaranteed to have a maxed level Shez each New Game+) and there's plenty of weapons better than the sacred weapons by then. I personally still use Sacred Weapons as I like using characters with narratively appropriate weapons, but I think they fall short of being the best weapons in the game (with some exceptions). Course I find the game to be just mindlessly easily over all compared to an actual Fire Emblem game, so basically any conversation about the effectiveness of things is practically moot so long as your using life force and powerful combat arts.

Most Sacred Weapons are indeed weaker than Relics. But Spear of Assal and Axe of Ukonvasara make up for it with effective damage (especially the spear, cavalry are extremely common), and The Inexhaustible is just better than any other bow in the game by a wide margin. The rest, you're probably better off with a regalia weapon or a relic.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 hours ago, Jotari said:

I was thinking about making a dedicated thread about how useless the Sacred Weapons are. Not only do they provide very little benefit in terms of gameplay, but they have next to no presence in the story, popping up randomly out of nowhere, but they also have issues with me for the lore (though this was a bit of an issue in Three Houses too). Why do the crests of the elites have sacred weapons? Were these meant to be weapons some Nabateans made for the dragons killed by the elites? Or was it just some smith (Mascuil?) that played to both sides of the war making special weapons? Or do they just plain not exist as the likes of Axe of Ukonvasara is just never mention in the story (and can't even be used by its intended wielder in a magic class

In terms of the crests of the elites having Sacred weapons story wise, wasn't that also a thing in Three Houses, specifically the sword with Riegans crest you get from Mascuil's paralogue? I'd imagine they weren't made for the elites themselves, but for their families that surrendered to Adrestia.

On a related note, perhaps it pointless to discuss what it's, but I had an idea where Seteth shows up and is killed in Scarlet Blaze Chapter 9 (the assassination chapter), his body disappears, and then in Chapter 13 (Fort Merceus), Duke Aegir is weilding a brand new hero's relic.

Edited by Aedan7479
Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 minutes ago, Aedan7479 said:

In terms of the crests of the elites having Sacred weapons story wise, wasn't that also a thing in Three Houses, specifically the sword with Riegans crest you get from Mascuil's paralogue? I'd imagine they weren't made for the elites themselves, but for their families that surrendered to Adrestia.

Yes, it is something in Three Houses, as I noted. Though there's really no need for it to be, as the Axe of Ukonvasara and Sword of Begalta/Moralta are integrated into Three Houses only marginally more so than Three Hopes in that you just randomly find them with no explanation (rather than randomly getting them for S ranking chapters). And of the three of them only the Sword of Moralta actually fits its wielder (as Lorenz is probably going mage why Thyrsus and Claude is happy with bows and Failnaught). Course they're not specifically intended to wielded by their crest bearers, and I could see specifically for an axe why they'd want more sacred weapons around, but in that case you don't need to actually make them Elite Crest based, just make them all Crests of Macuil or something. Claude's in particular feels like they just wanted to give you something for beating the Wind Caller, and as it was Claude's paralogue (for some reason) they just made it a Reigann Sword, unlike the Immovable where they actually gave us a relic associated with the boss you just beat.

14 minutes ago, Aedan7479 said:
  Hide contents

On a related note, perhaps it pointless to discuss what it's, but I had an idea where Seteth shows up and is killed in Scarlet Blaze Chapter 9 (the assassination chapter), his body disappears, and then in Chapter 13 (Fort Merceus), Duke Aegir is weilding a brand new hero's relic.

 

I would have liked that. Though given Amyr and the dark versions of the Elite's relics, it seems the Agarthans literally don't need any Nabateans to create relics any more (unless them controlling Garrek Mack for a while is meant to suggest they raided the tomb for spare parts to make all those dark versions).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 8/10/2022 at 7:37 PM, ZanaLyrander said:

Yeah, and it's not a huge difference either, it's like... maybe 10-20 more might/durability? They're pretty much comparable.

The combination of rarer mats, lower drop rates, and negligible difference makes me think Regalia weapons aren't worth pursuing unless you just happen to find one with ideal skills.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Fabulously Olivier said:

The combination of rarer mats, lower drop rates, and negligible difference makes me think Regalia weapons aren't worth pursuing unless you just happen to find one with ideal skills.

Zoltan level weapons are the best in general, agreed.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Not sure if anyone has looked into this or has noticed the following but:

Dark Knight Class Action deals Physical damage, both the blast from the unit and the sigils. This means that the only way to use Mag and target Res as DK without AoI is to actually use Spells. Just throwing this out there in case anyone else wasn't 100% sure.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 minutes ago, Archeleon said:

Not sure if anyone has looked into this or has noticed the following but:

Dark Knight Class Action deals Physical damage, both the blast from the unit and the sigils. This means that the only way to use Mag and target Res as DK without AoI is to actually use Spells. Just throwing this out there in case anyone else wasn't 100% sure.

Aol?  What is aol?  I'm guessing maybe you mean Indra's Arrow in some way maybe that's the skill name for magic damage but I'm not sure, maybe it's something else.

Edited by Jotari
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The game says that you get more renown by finishing the main battle while capturing as few regions as possible, but that is not worth it, is it? Also, is pairing up everyone a bad move? Because I see people doing it on Youtube playthroughs, and I feel it isn't the best move they could be making...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, Shadow Mir said:

The game says that you get more renown by finishing the main battle while capturing as few regions as possible, but that is not worth it, is it? Also, is pairing up everyone a bad move? Because I see people doing it on Youtube playthroughs, and I feel it isn't the best move they could be making...

I'm pretty sure that only exists to facilitate Vanguard Whistle rush playthroughs. If you're playing normally, no, no it isn't worth it. 

 

As for pair ups, I think it's the best move for main missions, since you get so many uncontrollable ally slots. For side missions, one pair up is probably a good idea - maybe only pairing everyone on particularly linear/easy stages.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

46 minutes ago, Shadow Mir said:

The game says that you get more renown by finishing the main battle while capturing as few regions as possible, but that is not worth it, is it? Also, is pairing up everyone a bad move? Because I see people doing it on Youtube playthroughs, and I feel it isn't the best move they could be making...

Regarding Pair-Up, it depends.
-- I honestly use it about half of the time now, although when I initially played (Hard Mode, first campaign run) I practically never bothered with it until the finale.
-- I normally Pair-Up to protect lower-level characters who would get slaughtered by enemy forces, and this can be important when facing the final chapter on normal playthroughs as I've had AI allies die from getting hit from a charged/magic attack while everyone was fighting the boss.
-- Alternatively, I'll place one on the main/active character to make them more powerful, while the others run around the map helping with objectives or seizing strongholds.

As for the extra renown for not capturing territories, I am unsure. I'm currently "speedrunning" a campaign using Vanguard Whistles to make use of the Training Grounds and get more Stat Boosters, and capturing everything possible seems like the way to go. "Challenge Missions" can't be auto-completed though, so it may be worth skipping those unless they have a reward worth doing.
-- Honestly, one could probably optimize the Vanguard Whistle runs more if knowing exactly what region gives, as the general idea is to only manually fight the main chapter battle if possible. Some survey rewards, such as stat boosts or free forge uses, may be worth unlocking and doing the battle if they are locked behind a condition.
== As for normal playthroughs, just do everything possible. The 10 renown for clearing the chapter + extra from doing chores is more than enough to get what you want from the Renown Shop.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The way renown works is as follows: Completing the main mission on the map will get you 10 Renown flat. Every territory you leave uncaptured on your way to the main mission will award you 2 extra Renown. So, let's say you are on a Chapter that has 6 territories in addition to the main mission territory. You only capture 2 on the way there. After completing the main mission, you will earn 18 Renown.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Archeleon said:

The way renown works is as follows: Completing the main mission on the map will get you 10 Renown flat. Every territory you leave uncaptured on your way to the main mission will award you 2 extra Renown. So, let's say you are on a Chapter that has 6 territories in addition to the main mission territory. You only capture 2 on the way there. After completing the main mission, you will earn 18 Renown.

...That... doesn't sound worth it. At all. 2 extra renown is exactly what I get by getting Greats or Perfects during volunteering.

3 hours ago, Fabulously Olivier said:

As for pair ups, I think it's the best move for main missions, since you get so many uncontrollable ally slots. For side missions, one pair up is probably a good idea - maybe only pairing everyone on particularly linear/easy stages.

I was wondering since main missions tend to throw a metric ton of crap at you at once in terms of objectives.

EDIT: What are some good abilities to grab? All I can think of is Death Blow and Armsthrift.

Edited by Shadow Mir
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Shadow Mir said:

...That... doesn't sound worth it. At all. 2 extra renown is exactly what I get by getting Greats or Perfects during volunteering.

I was wondering since main missions tend to throw a metric ton of crap at you at once in terms of objectives.

EDIT: What are some good abilities to grab? All I can think of is Death Blow and Armsthrift.

It is a good bonus if you are just rushing through the campaign for other reasons. It saves a lot of time on the earlier maps that tend to have mediocre rewards.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Shadow Mir said:

...That... doesn't sound worth it. At all. 2 extra renown is exactly what I get by getting Greats or Perfects during volunteering.

I was wondering since main missions tend to throw a metric ton of crap at you at once in terms of objectives.

Sure. But in all my time, I can't say I've ever had more than I could handle with 4 units, nor would I really gain that much by having 4 uncontrollable allies.

 

Maybe if you don't intend to swap characters much (like if you intend on sweeping with Sylvain/Ferdinand's passive), having the extra allies with Guard tactical skills to support your other units could be helpful. I know I did a fair bit of that early on.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...