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Holy god, this game needed a magic using axe class. I know they were trying to mainly stick to the classes from Three Houses, but I can not tell you how frustrating it is that Annette can either take advantage of the Crest of Dominic which boosts offensive magic spells or wield Crusher, but not both. Unlike in Three Houses, every class is locked to a single type of weapon, so you can't just hand Crusher to Annette in a mage class and let her smash fools. She either gets to use her relic or her crest, but not both.

Edelgard suffers from this too, to a lesser extent. She's got a great magic stat, and can learn some pretty badass spells, but can't actually use any of them without putting down Amyr.

And while we're at it, I'm glad Trickster is in this game, and it's one of my favorite classes now, but where are the other Ashen Wolves DLC classes? Dark Flier, War Monk/Cleric, Valkyrie... All of those would be really nice to have in this game. A magic using flying class, a magic using fist class, and a tome using mounted class would be awesome. I'm hoping they add more classes as part of eventual DLC, because the current ones, while awesome, feel kinda restrictive for some characters.

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Yeah, I get why War Master was a Gauntlet Class, since Axes at least have other Master Classes, while War Master was pretty much the only Gauntlet Master Class, but it is annoying to not have an infantry Master Class for Axes (unless your name is Edelgard).

Edited by ZanaLyrander
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53 minutes ago, Fabulously Olivier said:

Well, gauntlets stole Warriors' master class, so maybe they can do it right back and take War Monk/Cleric as a magic axe. I agree though. It is the single most needed class to give the axe users an infantry master class and a magic user.

Actually, given how class evolutions work in this game, what I'm expecting is that War Monk would be a magic using Gauntlet Master Class that evolves from Grappler and is exclusive to male units, while War Cleric would be a magic using Axe Master Class that evolves from Warrior and is exclusive to female units. Mainly because it'd be weird for girls to have no gauntlet classes until suddenly they do at master rank. Frankly it annoys me that female units are completely cut off from an entire weapon type, but I'm not a huge fan of Gauntlets in Three Hopes anyway, so whatever. And frankly, pretty much all of the characters I'd want a magic using Axe class for are female anyway, so it'd work out just fine.

Edited by ZanaLyrander
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13 minutes ago, ZanaLyrander said:

Actually, given how class evolutions work in this game, what I'm expecting is that War Monk would be a magic using Gauntlet Master Class that evolves from Grappler and is exclusive to male units, while War Cleric would be a magic using Axe Master Class that evolves from Warrior and is exclusive to female units. Mainly because it'd be weird for girls to have no gauntlet classes until suddenly they do at master rank. Frankly it annoys me that female units are completely cut off from an entire weapon type, but I'm not a huge fan of Gauntlets in Three Hopes anyway, so whatever. And frankly, pretty much all of the characters I'd want a magic using Axe class for are female anyway, so it'd work out just fine.

I don't agree with that assessment at all. Because it would be two different movesets, and therefore twice as much work. And if the male War Monk is just a grappler with magic, why the Hell would you use the War Master over the more versatile class.

 

Also, you're forgetting that there is a Gloucester axe for Lorenz (if it's in the game?) so he would also be a strong beneficiary for the class.

 

And no. It wouldn't be fine. Dedue and Caspar deserve a master class with their unique outfits.

Edited by Fabulously Olivier
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Right, I was forgetting about the Gloucester axe (it is definitely in the game, I have it). I suppose War Monk would just be War Master but better, so maybe just having them both as Magic Axe classes would make more sense. I would like to have a magic Gauntlet class, if only to actually convince me to use Gauntlets in this game, but I admit if I had to pick between magic Gauntlet wielder and magic Axe wielder, I'd pick axes without hesitation.

Edited by ZanaLyrander
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Thanks for the heads-up on the axe. Makes me seriously consider using Lorenz as a Great Knight since his outfit should actually carry over (my experience with other mounted characters is that they also do). I've only done CB, and partly through AG. I've put in 120 hours but I am playing WAY more slowly than most others.

Edited by Fabulously Olivier
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22 hours ago, ZanaLyrander said:

And while we're at it, I'm glad Trickster is in this game, and it's one of my favorite classes now, but where are the other Ashen Wolves DLC classes? Dark Flier, War Monk/Cleric, Valkyrie... All of those would be really nice to have in this game. A magic using flying class, a magic using fist class, and a tome using mounted class would be awesome. I'm hoping they add more classes as part of eventual DLC, because the current ones, while awesome, feel kinda restrictive for some characters.

Actually, there’s class data found in the internal files for Dark Flier, War Monk/Cleric, and Valkyrie. So there’s some potential that they’ll come back for DLC.

The internal names for the classes aren’t actually “War Monk” but they’re flagged as mage, flier, and cavalry so they’re presumed to be those classes.

Can’t say for sure what their weapons are yet tho, but I’m kind of on the fence for if War Monk/Cleric should be an axe class. I totally understand the Annette situation, but if War Cleric has axes, then it means female units would have 0 access to any gauntlet class at all past Fighter.

My speculation is that if these classes do come back, they’ll just be direct promotions from 1st tier classes rather than being linked to a specific class tree.

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19 minutes ago, LJ_Tenma said:

Actually, there’s class data found in the internal files for Dark Flier, War Monk/Cleric, and Valkyrie. So there’s some potential that they’ll come back for DLC.

The internal names for the classes aren’t actually “War Monk” but they’re flagged as mage, flier, and cavalry so they’re presumed to be those classes.

Can’t say for sure what their weapons are yet tho, but I’m kind of on the fence for if War Monk/Cleric should be an axe class. I totally understand the Annette situation, but if War Cleric has axes, then it means female units would have 0 access to any gauntlet class at all past Fighter.

My speculation is that if these classes do come back, they’ll just be direct promotions from 1st tier classes rather than being linked to a specific class tree.

I'd be all for female units getting access to gauntlets, but given how classes work in this system, introducing a single class that can use gauntlets for female characters wouldn't work well. Unlike in Three Houses, abilities and combat arts are entirely linked to classes, so a single female class with access to gauntlets would leave female units with no levels of Gauntlet Proficiency, and hardly any combat arts for gauntlets. They'd have to remove the gender-lock from Brawler and Grappler for that to be viable (which hey, I'd be all for). But unless they do that, War Cleric as a gauntlet class for female units wouldn't be very useful on its own.

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35 minutes ago, ZanaLyrander said:

I'd be all for female units getting access to gauntlets, but given how classes work in this system, introducing a single class that can use gauntlets for female characters wouldn't work well. Unlike in Three Houses, abilities and combat arts are entirely linked to classes, so a single female class with access to gauntlets would leave female units with no levels of Gauntlet Proficiency, and hardly any combat arts for gauntlets. They'd have to remove the gender-lock from Brawler and Grappler for that to be viable (which hey, I'd be all for). But unless they do that, War Cleric as a gauntlet class for female units wouldn't be very useful on its own.

That's fair, and I can definitely see having a single gauntlet class being less than efficient for female units. My biggest gripe with the lack of female gauntlet classes though is that the game has female-units only missions, and for those missions you won't have a counter for mages. And when I did the 1st Golden Wildfire female unit-only mission, a monster with a gauntlet barrier popped up on the map and my only way to get past that last HP bar was by straight force LOL. So having that gauntlet class for those kinda missions would be really helpful, despite only having a few. This is a very specific situation, so I can see as a whole, if War Cleric is the sole female-gauntlet class, it would be sub-optimal.

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6 minutes ago, LJ_Tenma said:

That's fair, and I can definitely see having a single gauntlet class being less than efficient for female units. My biggest gripe with the lack of female gauntlet classes though is that the game has female-units only missions, and for those missions you won't have a counter for mages. And when I did the 1st Golden Wildfire female unit-only mission, a monster with a gauntlet barrier popped up on the map and my only way to get past that last HP bar was by straight force LOL. So having that gauntlet class for those kinda missions would be really helpful, despite only having a few. This is a very specific situation, so I can see as a whole, if War Cleric is the sole female-gauntlet class, it would be sub-optimal.

Dancers counter mages. In regards to monsters, it's very rare from my experience that you'll be able to pop all shields (most of them have so few health bars that it is actually impossible), and you've got Hapi in all routes who can break any monster shield with her unique support ability.

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Yeah, these days I frequently brute force all of a monster's health bars. Like, I'll break shields if I can, but if not I just go "Don't care, didn't ask, plus Dark Spikes T" and nuke their health bars directly with magic and combat arts.

Still, I will agree that gender lock classes were annoying in Three Houses, and have only become more annoying now that every class is restricted to a single weapon type and abilities and combat arts are all tied directly to classes.

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...Huh, it literally just occurred to me that Three Hopes quietly removed the Hero class. I mean there was really never any reason to use the Hero class in Three Houses, which is probably why it took me this long to notice. That might be a cool thing to add back in at some point, with an upgraded version of the Mercenary's combos perhaps? 

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Just now, ZanaLyrander said:

...Huh, it literally just occurred to me that Three Hopes quietly removed the Hero class. I mean there was really never any reason to use the Hero class in Three Houses, which is probably why it took me this long to notice. That might be a cool thing to add back in at some point, with an upgraded version of the Mercenary's combos perhaps? 

The Mercenary already has upgraded combos, because they're based on weapon rank. So the full moveset is there. All you need to do, unless you add in a mount, is to add the learned skills and you have a finished class.

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1 minute ago, Fabulously Olivier said:

The Mercenary already has upgraded combos, because they're based on weapon rank. So the full moveset is there. All you need to do, unless you add in a mount, is to add the learned skills and you have a finished class.

Yeah, I heard about that, it's kinda neat that combos are based on weapon rank like that. It'd be nice to have a mounted sword class anyway. Weird to think that this would be the first non magic sword master class. Magic using master classes were handed out in a really lopsided fashion. All the final evolutions of Myrmidon and Monk and all but one of the final evolutions of Soldier are magic users, but none of the final evolutions of Fighter are.

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3 minutes ago, ZanaLyrander said:

Yeah, I heard about that, it's kinda neat that combos are based on weapon rank like that. It'd be nice to have a mounted sword class anyway. Weird to think that this would be the first non magic sword master class. Magic using master classes were handed out in a really lopsided fashion. All the final evolutions of Myrmidon and Monk and all but one of the final evolutions of Soldier are magic users, but none of the final evolutions of Fighter are.

Yeah. I feel that we need some kind of mounted sword, mounted tome, and magical axes/bows. And to be real, an infantry master class for axes and bows feels mandatory because those characters just have no way to retain their outfits.

 

Not necessarily Gauntlets because they stand on their own - a magical class would invalidate War Master unless it's a totally different moveset, and mounted gauntlets don't exist for a reason.

Edited by Fabulously Olivier
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Just now, Fabulously Olivier said:

Yeah. I feel that we need some kind of mounted sword, mounted tome, and magical axes/bows. 

 

Not necessarily Gauntlets because they stand on their own - a magical class would invalidate War Master unless it's a totally different moveset, and mounted gauntlets don't exist for a reason.

I'm of two minds about magic gauntlets. As you say, if it had the same moveset, it'd just be War Master but better. But at the moment, gauntlets kinda get the shaft in Three Hopes. They have minuscule weapon variety compared to most other weapon types, they have only one master class, including unique classes, and are only usable by half the cast. And their moveset and combat arts honestly doesn't even feel all that good to me. I loved gauntlets in Three Houses, but in Three Hopes I feel like they're not powerful or fast enough to compensate for their short reach and limited utility. A magic gauntlet class would at least provide them with some versatility, even if it did make War Master kinda redundant.

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1 minute ago, ZanaLyrander said:

I'm of two minds about magic gauntlets. As you say, if it had the same moveset, it'd just be War Master but better. But at the moment, gauntlets kinda get the shaft in Three Hopes. They have minuscule weapon variety compared to most other weapon types, they have only one master class, including unique classes, and are only usable by half the cast. And their moveset and combat arts honestly doesn't even feel all that good to me. I loved gauntlets in Three Houses, but in Three Hopes I feel like they're not powerful or fast enough to compensate for their short reach and limited utility. A magic gauntlet class would at least provide them with some versatility, even if it did make War Master kinda redundant.

I disagree so hard. Balthus is the best power fantasy in the whole game to me right now. Not only is the moveset fun, but it feels like a downright meat grinder to enemies with fast attacks, hard-hitting combat arts, and easy bar breaks.

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Just now, Fabulously Olivier said:

I disagree so hard. Balthus is the best power fantasy in the whole game to me right now. Not only is the moveset fun, but it feels like a downright meat grinder to enemies with fast attacks, hard-hitting combat arts, and easy bar breaks.

I haven't used Balthus much, my exposure to gauntlets has pretty much just been War Master Caspar. I don't hate it, he just feels kinda sluggish compared to my favorite classes. Any tips on your favorite combat arts for gauntlets? I've been trying out a few of them and none of them have really clicked for me so far.

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Just now, ZanaLyrander said:

I haven't used Balthus much, my exposure to gauntlets has pretty much just been War Master Caspar. I don't hate it, he just feels kinda sluggish compared to my favorite classes. Any tips on your favorite combat arts for gauntlets? I've been trying out a few of them and none of them have really clicked for me so far.

Fierce Iron Fist, Eviscerate, Flamewhorl Kick with Essence of Fire, and Dual Devastators are my favorites.

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Just now, Fabulously Olivier said:

Fierce Iron Fist, Eviscerate, Flamewhorl Kick with Essence of Fire, and Dual Devastators are my favorites.

Fierce Iron Fist doesn't seem to hit as hard as I'd like, but I should probably go back to Dual Devastators, Mighty Blow has been kinda underwhelming.

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3 minutes ago, Fabulously Olivier said:

I reset Balthus to level one yesterday as a War Master, and he literally one shot an entire group of level 73 tome users with Eviscerate. One Punch Man!

Shit, maybe Caspar is just weak. Shame he doesn't learn Eviscerate. But I will have to give that Essence of Fire Flamewhorl Kick thing a try, he can do that.

Edited by ZanaLyrander
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1 hour ago, ZanaLyrander said:

Shit, maybe Caspar is just weak. Shame he doesn't learn Eviscerate. But I will have to give that Essence of Fire Flamewhorl Kick thing a try, he can do that.

Caspar can technically, if you get the Chevalier crest stone and give it to Caspar he can use Eviscerate.

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10 hours ago, ZanaLyrander said:

I'd be all for female units getting access to gauntlets, but given how classes work in this system, introducing a single class that can use gauntlets for female characters wouldn't work well. Unlike in Three Houses, abilities and combat arts are entirely linked to classes, so a single female class with access to gauntlets would leave female units with no levels of Gauntlet Proficiency, and hardly any combat arts for gauntlets. They'd have to remove the gender-lock from Brawler and Grappler for that to be viable (which hey, I'd be all for). But unless they do that, War Cleric as a gauntlet class for female units wouldn't be very useful on its own.

While removing gender-locks would be a far more preferable solution (maybe a purchaseable upgrade from the Tactics Instructor?), I just wanna point out that even if War Cleric were the only female Gauntlet class you could still make it work; just make it so that while male units in War Monk only learn a few new abilities and Combat Arts, female units in War Cleric learn a whole bunch of them at each interval, including all three tiers of Gauntlet Proficiency and other things related to the Brawler/Grappler/War Master line.

It would be pretty exaggerated, but class learnsets are personalized for each unit and there is precedent for learning more than one ability/CA at a Class level-up.

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