Rate the Unit - Felix

[Pie Burritos]

Claude

Spoiler

Availability - A

Stats - A

He's got high Dex and solid Str, and his other stats are generally pretty decent.

Skills - S

Arts - S

Wind God is hilariously broken. You just click it and the enemy dies.

Assist - F

Preferred Class - S

Barbarossa is probably the best unique class in the game, except maybe Asura. The fireballs are so ridiculously strong if you can trap an enemy inside them. It's not quite Wind God levels of damage but it gets close enough and the fact that you can alternate this and Wind God while the other is on cooldown means that everything dies super fast.

Alternative Class - ?

I dunno.

Crest - B

Additional healing to offset skills that drain HP is always nice.

Unique Action - A

Unique Support - D

Anything that has to do with Awakening is kinda bad imo, since Awakening locks you out of switching characters. Sure, you can use it as another Warrior Special, but like, that's just a Warrior Special that takes way too long to charge up. That being said, having Awakening on a mobile unit who is incredibly strong and can take down just about anything makes for a pretty good Awakening, so maybe I'm underrating this. 

Unique Tactical - D

At least it raises damage dealt rather than reducing taken?

Bias - A

I like Claude.

Overall Ranking - S

Barbarossa, Wind God, and his damage boosting skills make him S tier for certain. He doesn't need to play fair at all, he can simply use his easily recovered resources to nuke everything to oblivion from a safe distance.

 

[ZanaLyrander]

People really underestimate the value of Awakening I find. It lets you shred enemy stun gauges with incredible ease, it's basically a "I'd like to win this fight now" button, regardless of how many enemies you're currently fighting. But then, people tend to underestimate stun gauges damage in general and focus on pure hp damage instead. It's probably why so many characters like Petra and Lindhardt get labeled as weak despite excelling at stun gauge damage and critical rushes.

That said, I still don't place too much value on Claude's unique support ability, because while Claude has everything he needs to be a powerful stun gauge build (the fireballs from the Barbarossa class action can eat through stun gauges real quick too), he doesn't usually need to do so, his damage output is high enough to just kill things outright without worrying about critical rushes.

Edited August 4, 2022 by ZanaLyrander

[Pie Burritos]

Ideally you have your character set up so either they do enough raw hp damage that everything dies or you have a combat art + combo that will shred a stun gauge for you (the latter of which is the First Playthrough staple, so I'm definitely familiar). I agree that Awakening can help out a lot with that since the stun gauge goes down faster but I see of it more as a crutch rather than something to rely on if you really need it to get consistent stun gauge breaks. That being said, I guess if you're not getting WTA all the time it would end up mattering a lot. But that's the other thing, if you're switching characters constantly and issuing orders, you will probably have WTA. And of course, Awakening locks you out of switching. I dunno, I'm probably undervaluing it but it just feels terrible not being able to switch because then you aren't being efficient since you need to spend time manually moving to places. But ending Awakening early also feels incredibly wasteful. It just feels bad. Which is why I hate it. But it's probably just as good as you say and I'm being biased.

[ZanaLyrander]

7 minutes ago, Pie Burritos said:

Ideally you have your character set up so either they do enough raw hp damage that everything dies or you have a combat art + combo that will shred a stun gauge for you (the latter of which is the First Playthrough staple, so I'm definitely familiar). I agree that Awakening can help out a lot with that since the stun gauge goes down faster but I see of it more as a crutch rather than something to rely on if you really need it to get consistent stun gauge breaks. That being said, I guess if you're not getting WTA all the time it would end up mattering a lot. But that's the other thing, if you're switching characters constantly and issuing orders, you will probably have WTA. And of course, Awakening locks you out of switching. I dunno, I'm probably undervaluing it but it just feels terrible not being able to switch because then you aren't being efficient since you need to spend time manually moving to places. But ending Awakening early also feels incredibly wasteful. It just feels bad. Which is why I hate it. But it's probably just as good as you say and I'm being biased.

If you focus on the weapon triangle, then yeah, Awakening isn't as important. I've been doing a lot of solo runs as part of my process of leveling everyone to 120, so I'm used to thinking in terms of making sure everyone can solo the entire map without difficulty, regardless of the weapon triangle. If you're swapping characters a lot and paying close attention to the weapon triangle, it becomes less necessary. Of course at that point, character tiers don't matter quite so much. With a good enough weapon, just about anyone can win without difficulty if they have WTA.

[Dark Holy Elf]

34 minutes ago, ZanaLyrander said:

If you focus on the weapon triangle, then yeah, Awakening isn't as important. I've been doing a lot of solo runs as part of my process of leveling everyone to 120, so I'm used to thinking in terms of making sure everyone can solo the entire map without difficulty, regardless of the weapon triangle. If you're swapping characters a lot and paying close attention to the weapon triangle, it becomes less necessary. Of course at that point, character tiers don't matter quite so much. With a good enough weapon, just about anyone can win without difficulty if they have WTA.

Obviously you can play without switching, as you're proving, but switching is just mechanically superior in my experience. There's been a couple paralogues I've gotten to where I just see no conceivable way to S rank them without switching, at least at the power level I was at. There are so many advantages: you don't waste time running places, you almost always have WTA, you have a far deeper pool of weapon durability to work with, and you get four characters' worth of instantaneous free damage from their warrior specials (especially once you get to the tier of cooking which literally has everyone start with one).

(I agree that character tiers don't actually matter that much, of course. I also personally generally prefer switching because I like fights feeling like a team effort and because running places is boring... though I will sometimes be indulgent and just see how much a favourite can do by themselves.)

This is also why I have a relatively low opinion of all the unique actions which go away whenever you switch (hi Ferdinand), and yeah I basically agree with @Pie Burritos about Awakening; you really need to line up a particular set of enemies in close proximity (but not so close you can't just hit them all with one spell or special) for it to not just feel like a warrior special which takes way longer to build up (not that this is bad or anything, mind).

[ZanaLyrander]

I certainly switch characters when it's convenient to do so, prior to starting my solo runs to level to 120, that was my usual strategy, divide and conquer. But even during my 'solo runs' running all the way across the map is annoying, it's easier to swap to someone who's close by unless the objective is fairly close. But if I have a bunch of objectives that are relatively close to each other, just plowing through them one by one with a single character can also be a lot of fun. In some sense, I'm very pleased that both of these play styles are viable, it speaks to a well rounded game with more than one approach. It also highlights how some things that are fantastic for one play style may be much less useful for another. And again, I kinda like that, it keeps the game feeling fresh.

For a lot of characters, Awakening takes too long to charge to be reliably useful, it's great for making a fight trivial now and then, but you won't get to use it too often. But for some, who have abilities that dramatically increase the rate at which it fills like Burst of Resolve or Foresight, you don't have to be as conservative with your Awakening. Really, if you're about to start a fight and you have full Awakening, there's no reason not to use it, it might occasionally feel like a waste, but whenever you have full awakening or full warrior special, you're wasting the gauge refill you would be getting during the normal course of battle. I think it's important to fight the urge to save your specials and awakening for moments when you might 'need it'. If you're outfitted properly, you should never need either of them, so wasting them shouldn't be a concern.

[Fabulously Olivier]

One thing I've noticed is that people have dinged Dimitri for being out for one chapter. But that's true of all three lords. Edelgard is an NPC in Chapter 9, and Claude is an NPC in Chapter 10.

 

Anyway, Yuri's up.

 

Availability - C

Yuri is a late joiner in all three routes.

Stats - A

Claude boasts the highest Spd growth in the game, with good Str and Dex too. His other stats are nothing to write home about.

Skills - A

Yuri's high speed naturally synergizes with Mercenary's Wisdom and Absorb Speed. 

Yuri gets the Lifeforce and Impossible Feat combo.

He also has Dual Onslaught.

Sharpshooter and Burst of Resolve work with his Crest and good Dex.

Essence of Wind.

Arts - B

Yuri's got everything he needs with Excalibur, Windsweep, and Cutting Gale. Granted, he's not really teaching anything remarkable.

Assist - F

One Heart One Mind and Warrior Assist aren't much.

Preferred Class - B

Yuri's preferred class does put him in direct competition with the required deployment of Shez. And he really doesn't lean into Dancer as a flex class. With his stat spread, you want to be a Mortal Savant to nuke with the class action, end of story. He is very good at it though. 

Alternative Class - F

I don't think Yuri has any reason to go into any alternative weapon line. His accessory makes all mounted classes redundant. He doesn't particularly excel as a mage. There's little reason to make him a Warmaster. 

Crest - C

Crest of Aubin's a good crest for its effects (but nowhere near, say, Fraldarius or Charon). But it has no unique weapon, and the powerful accessory only gains random damage taken reduction, which is nowhere near as beneficial as healing. 

Unique Action - D

The vacuum and damage isn't useless, but it's largely redundant on a character who is already going to be using Excalibur and maybe Windsweep too.

Unique Support - F

Honestly, Yuri has Petra's Unique Support and she has his. They should trade. (And he definitely got the worse end of the deal).

Unique Tactical - F

Probably the second worst tactical skill to have, only just above Defend defense.

Bias - S

Yuri was my favorite house leader in Three Houses. Claude only edges him out in Hopes because he's so well written now.

Overall Ranking - B

Yuri's got high enough marks in the most important category (Skills) that I feel like he isn't worthless. But he's also way too lacking in way too many areas to be exceptional.

I was maybe even leaning as low as C tier, but I think he is average by definition. 

Edited August 7, 2022 by Fabulously Olivier

[ZanaLyrander]

I sadly haven't really used Yuri all that much, so I don't feel qualified to contribute to this particular vote.

1 hour ago, Fabulously Olivier said:

One thing I've noticed is that people have dinged Dimitri for being out for one chapter. But that's true of all three lords. Edelgard is an NPC in Chapter 9, and Claude is an NPC in Chapter 10.

It is worth pointing out that Edelgard and Claude are NPCs for a single mission. Dimitri is absent for an entire chapter (though he rejoins halfway through the main mission at the end of said chapter), and he's an NPC for one mission. There is a difference. I don't think it's a huge enough difference to warrant giving him a B in Availability, but I can understand why some people did.

[ZanaLyrander]

Honestly, while normally I don't consider availability a big concern for most units, it really is the kiss of death for Yuri. He joins really late on every route, and frequently joins the same time as Byleth. Which means by the time he joins, your team is pretty set, and if you're gonna make room for any new character, it's probably gonna be Byleth, who uses the same weapon class as Yuri. Meanwhile, Petra is recruited early on every route, and is, in my opinion, basically just a better version of Yuri.

[Fabulously Olivier]

14 minutes ago, ZanaLyrander said:

Honestly, while normally I don't consider availability a big concern for most units, it really is the kiss of death for Yuri. He joins really late on every route, and frequently joins the same time as Byleth. Which means by the time he joins, your team is pretty set, and if you're gonna make room for any new character, it's probably gonna be Byleth, who uses the same weapon class as Yuri. Meanwhile, Petra is recruited early on every route, and is, in my opinion, basically just a better version of Yuri.

I don't feel that Petra is a better Yuri at all. I feel like Yuri is a significantly better, less available Petra.

[ZanaLyrander]

2 hours ago, Fabulously Olivier said:

I don't feel that Petra is a better Yuri at all. I feel like Yuri is a significantly better, less available Petra.

Strongly disagree. Petra has a very different build than Yuri, being more suited to stun gauge damage than pure HP damage, but she's insanely good in that role. They're both high speed, wind using sword units, but Petra has superior personal abilities and lower raw damage, and she's better at stun gauge destruction. That said, Yuri can also be an effective stun gauge build, having access to Heavy Hitter and Death Blow just like Petra, and he has Excalibur without having to learn it from Lindhardt (trivial though that is for Petra), and he has a crest. He doesn't build Awakening quite as fast as Petra does, and he sadly can't get Stalwart Stance or Patience like Petra, so he's not quite as good in a stun gauge build, but he's still quite effective.

I wish I'd played with Yuri more so that I had a better feeling for his strength, the more I look at him, he seems like a character I'd enjoy for many of the same reasons I enjoy Petra, a character whom I consider to be criminally underrated in Three Hopes. All told, from everything I've seen of him, he seems A tier to me, or at least high B tier. The only thing I really dislike about him are his personal abilities, none of which impress me.

As an aside, as we leave the realms of characters with unique combat arts, I'm likely to start paying closer attention to supports. Because for any character with whom you can form an A rank support, learning their teachable combat arts/spells is trivial, there's roughly an 8% chance every time they use said combat art/spell while the two are paired up, if it takes more than one mission, you are very unlucky. If a combat art/spell is teachable by a unit's A rank supports, I consider that to be essentially a part of the unit's learnset, learning it is easy. This is another reason I prefer Petra over Yuri: Petra has A rank support with Lindhardt and Dorothea, allowing her to easily acquire the stupidly overpowered Excalibur + Agnea's Arrow combo, while Yuri starts with Excalibur already in his learnset, but teaching him Agnea's Arrow would be a pain in the ass.

Edited August 8, 2022 by ZanaLyrander

[Fabulously Olivier]

So there's nothing really to say for Yuri. Regardless of how or even if I interpret the only ratings he's got, he's currently B tier.

 

Anyway, Seteth up.

 

Availability - B

Seteth has majority availability in one route.

Stats - A, maybe even S

Seteth is rocking good Hp, Str, Spd, and Dex.

Skills - C, maybe B

Notable skills - Wild Abandon, Armsthrift, Big Game Hunter, Range Master, Absorb Dex, Essence of Wind

Arts - B

Nothing exceptional. He can rock a good mage with Excalibur. Everyone gets War Strike. He'll need to be taught the other lance wind art.

Assist - F

Trust, Awakening Assist, Safeguard

It should be noted that men in general make inferior adjutants.

Preferred Class - A

Axe characters rock 4 decent to good movesets in general, and none of them particularly stand out due to War Strike being so universally good. 

Alternative Class - A

Spear of Assal is a great justification to change to DK/HK, and lance users rock two wind arts, or Excalibur. He also has a pair of Sacred Gauntlets, albeit he is nowhere near as good at utilizing them as Ferdinand.

Crest - S

Cichol is awesome. Crits on combat arts, two sacred weapons, and a strong sacred shield. He doesn't use it nearly as well as Ferdinand due to lack of LF/IF, but the crest is strong in its own right.

Unique Action - B

Wind finishers and a decent long cd active. Pretty good honestly.

Unique Support - F

Yeah, there's few situations where this will even remotely help.

Unique Tactical - D

Guard skills are only marginally better than defense.

Bias - A

Seteth is a brilliantly written character, IMO.

Overall Ranking - B

I think above average, but unremarkable, is a great summary.

[ZanaLyrander]

Not going to do a full analysis for Seteth, because I frankly don't care that much about him. He's only available in one route, and there are so many other route exclusive characters in AG that I hardly ever use him. Still, he's not bad. Nothing terribly exciting, but not bad. I agree with your rating, I'd rate him as B as well. Nothing exceptional, but very viable.

[Pie Burritos]

Darn, missed out on Yuri. I don't think I'll do a long analysis either on Seteth, and I'll just put him as B as well.

I do want to note that I think his unique action is quite good because it will completely ignore an enemy's guard and lift them up into the air for combos, which is nice. You just have to clip them once with a strong attack or combat art or whatnot. Though it will never top unique actions that increase attack range or mobility. Other than that, he's definitely solid, nothing worth complaining about but nothing particularly amazing either.

[Fabulously Olivier]

On 8/11/2022 at 1:15 PM, Pie Burritos said:

Darn, missed out on Yuri. I don't think I'll do a long analysis either on Seteth, and I'll just put him as B as well.

I do want to note that I think his unique action is quite good because it will completely ignore an enemy's guard and lift them up into the air for combos, which is nice. You just have to clip them once with a strong attack or combat art or whatnot. Though it will never top unique actions that increase attack range or mobility. Other than that, he's definitely solid, nothing worth complaining about but nothing particularly amazing either.

Feel free to include ratings for anyone you missed. Partipation is not so great that it would be much work to adjust as needed.

 

Edit:

Hubert

 

Availability - A

Hubert has nearly full availability in one route, only absent for one mission.

Stats - B, maybe A

Hubert's durability leaves much to be desired, but his core stats (Mag, Dex, Spd) are all good, albeit not as good as some other mages.

Skills - B, maybe A

Notable skills - Essence of Darkness, Range Master, Armsthrift, Wild Abandon, Offensive Tactics, Absorb Magic, Specials Master, Dexterity Catalyst, Aggression, Burst of Valor, Big Game Hunter

Hubert's notably very good at charging Warrior Gauge. I recommend a build centered around Specials Master as such. Give him an adjutant with Harmonious Specials.

Arts - C, maybe B

Dark Spikes is the best dark spell. But lacking innate Hades or Luna is pretty bad for a dark mage. He'll want Lysithea or Hapi to teach him.

Assist - F

Trust, Awakening Assist. Ironically for a right-hand man, he's really bad at support.

It should be noted that men in general make inferior adjutants.

Preferred Class - B

Dark Bishop is considered a mediocre moveset, but IMO, it's nowhere near as bad as Gremory. And Hubert is perfectly designed for it, unlike Linhardt (who I would rank at C for Preferred Class).

Alternative Class - A, maybe even S

Hubert makes a phenomenal Trickster, Mortal Savant, or Dark Knight. Arguably, he might be even better as a Trickster with how fast it can proc his unique action.

Crest - F

Hubert has no crest.

Unique Action - S

Hubert's unique action is a powerhouse. Tons of damage, crowd clear, break bar reveal and break bar damage. It's a real swiss army knife.

Also, it's badass as Hell. He's like a Hot Topic Roy Mustang.

Unique Support - B

Extra stun gauge duration is pretty helpful.

Unique Tactical - D

Guard skills are only marginally better than defense.

Bias - B

I do like Hubert a lot in this game. And I like playing him. He's not necessarily a favorite though.

Overall Ranking - A

I think Hubert's a contender for the best tome wielder in the game, though it takes a lot of investment to get him there. He's also mad versatile.

Edited August 14, 2022 by Fabulously Olivier

[Archeleon]

I'd agree he is an A minimum, could border on S the more you iterate on his builds. I think people sleep a bit on Dark Bishop in general as they technically keep advantage over Bows at high levels (since Bow Knight) but also just start shredding 2/3rds of Lance units and 1/2 of the Axe units. But that is not exclusive to Hubert, though he is one of the better ones. His Spd also compliments Dark Magic Mastery very well. Not only that but if you can get a Tome with Res Factor and CA/Spell boost you can still make use of the DB moveset and do as much damage, if not more than DK since it all taps into his high Mag. Only thing DK has over DB is movement, imo.

Edited August 15, 2022 by Archeleon

[ZanaLyrander]

Oh boy, Hubert

Spoiler

Availability - A

Hubert is available for an entire route, with the exception of a single mission.

Stats - A

Hubert has some pretty damn good stats. High magic, good speed and dexterity, decent resistance. A bit fragile, but that's not too much of a problem.

Skills - S

Armsthrift, Underdog, Essence of Darkness, Rejuvenation, Offensive Tactics, Absorb Magic, Big Game Hunter, Range Master... Hubert is stacked.

Arts - S

Hubert has access to extremely overpowered Essence of Dark boosted dark magic like Death and Dark Spikes, and thanks to his A rank support with Lysithea, getting access to Luna and Hades is trivial for him. He has everything he needs to annihilate his foes.

Assist - D

Trust, Awakening Assist, and that's about it. Still, his Unique Support Ability is basically a free Death Blow, useful for Stun Gauge builds I suppose. 

Preferred Class - S

Hubert is the best Dark Bishop in the game, there's really no contest. Admittedly, he doesn't have a ton of competition: the only characters who can take full advantage of the Dark Bishop's Dark Magic Mastery are male units with access to Dark Magic, and preferably Essence of Darkness, which leaves only Hubert, Jeritza, and male Shez, and both of the other options are better off in another class. But even though competition isn't exactly fierce, even in a vacuum, Hubert is a tremendously powerful Dark Bishop.

Alternative Class - A

With no unique tome specific to him, swapping Hubert to a sword or lance class is very viable, as long as he still has access to his insanely powerful dark magic, he will excel. There is certainly an argument to be made that he's a better Dark Knight than Dark Bishop, I honestly go back and forth between the two classes for him.

Crest - F

Unique Action - A

Hubert's Unique Action is very powerful, especially in conjunction with his Unique Support. It is kinda amazing how much damage he can deal to enemy Stun Gauges without having a single ability in his learnset that supports such a build. It's also just extremely cool.

Unique Support - B

On its own, this is just a free Death Blow, useful, but nothing too exciting. Combined with his magic and Unique Action, it's all he needs to annihilate the stun gauges of anything that miraculously survives the damage from his spells.

Unique Tactical - D

Bias - S

Hubert remains one of my favorite characters from Three Houses, and they did a fantastic job with him in Three Hopes.

Overall Ranking - S

Magic in Three Hopes is extremely overpowered, Dark Magic especially so. I can't in good conscience put the best Dark Magic user in the game anywhere other than top tier. There is really no challenge Hubert can't breeze through with ease, and he's incredibly versatile, able to fill any role you need, so long as he still has access to magic. I think he's low S tier, but S tier all the same.

Edit: It is intriguing to me to see the differences in how we are ranking Arts. I can understand the perspective that Hubert does not natively have access to Luna or Hades, which for a Dark Mage is a significant drawback. But with A rank support with Lysithea, acquiring both of those spells is practically effortless for him, if it takes more than one mission together with Lysithea spamming her spells for him to learn them, I consider you quite unlucky.

Personally, I consider any learnable arts/spells taught by units that a given character has A rank support with to be effectively in that character's learnset, because if you want them, you can get them incredibly easily, it just wouldn't make sense to me to dock a character for not having access to an art/spell that they can acquire in five minutes of work.

Edited August 15, 2022 by ZanaLyrander

[Archeleon]

Perhaps we should make a list of these "easily learned" CA/Spells.

Edited August 15, 2022 by Archeleon

[ZanaLyrander]

36 minutes ago, Archeleon said:

Perhaps we should make a list of these "easily leanred" CA/Spells.

Yeah, it really does vary, so that might be valuable. Support level makes a pretty huge difference. Learning an art/spell at support rank A is effortless, if it takes more than one mission together, you got really unlucky. Meanwhile, learning an art/spell at support rank C is miserable, it can take hours and hours of grinding.

[Fabulously Olivier]

6 hours ago, ZanaLyrander said:

Oh boy, Hubert

  Reveal hidden contents

Availability - A

Hubert is available for an entire route, with the exception of a single mission.

Stats - A

Hubert has some pretty damn good stats. High magic, good speed and dexterity, decent resistance. A bit fragile, but that's not too much of a problem.

Skills - S

Armsthrift, Underdog, Essence of Darkness, Rejuvenation, Offensive Tactics, Absorb Magic, Big Game Hunter, Range Master... Hubert is stacked.

Arts - S

Hubert has access to extremely overpowered Essence of Dark boosted dark magic like Death and Dark Spikes, and thanks to his A rank support with Lysithea, getting access to Luna and Hades is trivial for him. He has everything he needs to annihilate his foes.

Assist - D

Trust, Awakening Assist, and that's about it. Still, his Unique Support Ability is basically a free Death Blow, useful for Stun Gauge builds I suppose. 

Preferred Class - S

Hubert is the best Dark Bishop in the game, there's really no contest. Admittedly, he doesn't have a ton of competition: the only characters who can take full advantage of the Dark Bishop's Dark Magic Mastery are male units with access to Dark Magic, and preferably Essence of Darkness, which leaves only Hubert, Jeritza, and male Shez, and both of the other options are better off in another class. But even though competition isn't exactly fierce, even in a vacuum, Hubert is a tremendously powerful Dark Bishop.

Alternative Class - A

With no unique tome specific to him, swapping Hubert to a sword or lance class is very viable, as long as he still has access to his insanely powerful dark magic, he will excel. There is certainly an argument to be made that he's a better Dark Knight than Dark Bishop, I honestly go back and forth between the two classes for him.

Crest - F

Unique Action - A

Hubert's Unique Action is very powerful, especially in conjunction with his Unique Support. It is kinda amazing how much damage he can deal to enemy Stun Gauges without having a single ability in his learnset that supports such a build. It's also just extremely cool.

Unique Support - B

On its own, this is just a free Death Blow, useful, but nothing too exciting. Combined with his magic and Unique Action, it's all he needs to annihilate the stun gauges of anything that miraculously survives the damage from his spells.

Unique Tactical - D

Bias - S

Hubert remains one of my favorite characters from Three Houses, and they did a fantastic job with him in Three Hopes.

Overall Ranking - S

Magic in Three Hopes is extremely overpowered, Dark Magic especially so. I can't in good conscience put the best Dark Magic user in the game anywhere other than top tier. There is really no challenge Hubert can't breeze through with ease, and he's incredibly versatile, able to fill any role you need, so long as he still has access to magic. I think he's low S tier, but S tier all the same.

Edit: It is intriguing to me to see the differences in how we are ranking Arts. I can understand the perspective that Hubert does not natively have access to Luna or Hades, which for a Dark Mage is a significant drawback. But with A rank support with Lysithea, acquiring both of those spells is practically effortless for him, if it takes more than one mission together with Lysithea spamming her spells for him to learn them, I consider you quite unlucky.

Personally, I consider any learnable arts/spells taught by units that a given character has A rank support with to be effectively in that character's learnset, because if you want them, you can get them incredibly easily, it just wouldn't make sense to me to dock a character for not having access to an art/spell that they can acquire in five minutes of work.

That sort of thing is also why I say that you decide how to weigh each category for each character. And Arts are very likely to be a low or zero weight category for everyone who isn't named Claude, because Wind God is dumb.

 

Because Arts are a category that can be changed and invested in (like stats are to a much lesser degree). They aren't the unchanging, intrinsic main factors like Skills, unique abilities, and crests (I mean, you can change unique actions and crests, but there's a significant opportunity cost to that).

[Archeleon]

I personally think that having to invest the additional time to earn the spells is a mark down, simply because of time consumption, but others may not mind it.

[Fabulously Olivier]

41 minutes ago, Archeleon said:

I personally think that having to invest the additional time to earn the spells is a mark down, simply because of time consumption, but others may not mind it.

There's a disconnect in attitude between FE fans and Warriors fans. The reason why investment is seen as a negative in FE is that the series is supposed to be designed around proper use of limited resources. For Warriors games, the grind is just a natural part of the experience, much like it is for a Diablo-like or looter.

[Archeleon]

I dont mind grinding, I got 350 hrs logged in the game and I've only completed Scarlet Blaze. Just because there is no time restriction per se in FEW it doesn't mean time investment can be completely overlooked when it comes to unit optimization. It is still something worth mentioning when comparing units. 

Edited August 15, 2022 by Archeleon

[Fabulously Olivier]

Fair enough. Personally, I'd love if a future Warriors game doubled down on the looter/Diablo side of things to make that grind loop feel especially rewarding. Turning one of the games into third person Diablo would be riveting.

 

Maybe give it a setting associated with legendary weapons, like Arthurian legend or Lord of the Rings.

Edited August 15, 2022 by Fabulously Olivier

[Archeleon]

My only peeve right now is that I can't target specific weapons in any way. I have a serious lack of Gauntlets atm.