When you realize that Edelgard is the only female lord not to make the cut.

[Dark Holy Elf]

37 minutes ago, Jotari said:

I doubt Crimson Flower is the most played route, given Black Eagles is the only route with a second route split which is going to divide Crimson Flower with Silver Snow. What online game data are you referring to (and I'm not sure that can even be taken as veritable as it's more than possible to play the game offline)?

Silver Snow appears to be played very little. Two pieces of evidence for this:

• Polls in several forums - the largest one I can recall is one on Reddit which had a sample somewhere in the thousands, but there has been at least one here at Serenes too - consistently have people playing it FAR less than other routes. I seem to recall the Reddit poll had something like ~15% of Eagles players going Silver Snow on their first run. To emphasize: any one poll is likely to be highly untrustworthy (every website has its own demographic), but together they paint a pretty consistent picture. I have never, ever seen a poll where SS comes close to CF. If you're aware of one, let me know - I love data!
• The game data about teatimes (and gifts, but I remember seeing teatimes more) by chapter. Unfortunately I never think to take screenshots, but it's very consistent: in January through April (Chapter 14-17) of post-timeskip, Eagles dominate, with Edelgard appearing consistently, often #1 or near it (despite not having a birthday for the free tea time during any of these chapters). As soon as we hit May-August (Chapters 18-21), which is when the CF timeline ends, there's a sudden shift to Lions domination, and the Eagles fall off a cliff. This suggests CF > AM > VW > SS for how much each route is played, although it's entirely possible that for whatever reason SS players just hate tea on aggregate. I doubt it.

Obviously it's possible to play the game offline, but I don't see much reason to believe that offline players would skew that differently from online players in terms of choices. As far as reliable polls go, the game data is better than most as far as being a representative sample; I'd trust it more than CYL votes (which bias towards FEH players), let alone polls run by individual websites or magazines..

It's a bit surprising how poorly SS seems to do. I was a bit surprised at first, too - I mean, full disclosure, I think Silver Snow is a trashfire, but I know enough people dislike Edelgard that I might have expected a few more people to pick it, especially since some people will end up on it by accident (missing the Chapter 11 explore). But on reflection it makes sense; quite frankly the prologue of the game gives a pretty good sense of the lords, and people inclined to dislike Edelgard are likely put off by her behaviour there, and go another route. Also, the actual in-game choice for going CF vs SS feels very loaded; if you frame the choices as "protect ___" vs "kill ___" then most people are gonna choose protect.

[Jotari]

2 hours ago, Dark Holy Elf said:

Silver Snow appears to be played very little. Two pieces of evidence for this:

• Polls in several forums - the largest one I can recall is one on Reddit which had a sample somewhere in the thousands, but there has been at least one here at Serenes too - consistently have people playing it FAR less than other routes. I seem to recall the Reddit poll had something like ~15% of Eagles players going Silver Snow on their first run. To emphasize: any one poll is likely to be highly untrustworthy (every website has its own demographic), but together they paint a pretty consistent picture. I have never, ever seen a poll where SS comes close to CF. If you're aware of one, let me know - I love data!
• The game data about teatimes (and gifts, but I remember seeing teatimes more) by chapter. Unfortunately I never think to take screenshots, but it's very consistent: in January through April (Chapter 14-17) of post-timeskip, Eagles dominate, with Edelgard appearing consistently, often #1 or near it (despite not having a birthday for the free tea time during any of these chapters). As soon as we hit May-August (Chapters 18-21), which is when the CF timeline ends, there's a sudden shift to Lions domination, and the Eagles fall off a cliff. This suggests CF > AM > VW > SS for how much each route is played, although it's entirely possible that for whatever reason SS players just hate tea on aggregate. I doubt it.

Obviously it's possible to play the game offline, but I don't see much reason to believe that offline players would skew that differently from online players in terms of choices. As far as reliable polls go, the game data is better than most as far as being a representative sample; I'd trust it more than CYL votes (which bias towards FEH players), let alone polls run by individual websites or magazines..

It's a bit surprising how poorly SS seems to do. I was a bit surprised at first, too - I mean, full disclosure, I think Silver Snow is a trashfire, but I know enough people dislike Edelgard that I might have expected a few more people to pick it, especially since some people will end up on it by accident (missing the Chapter 11 explore). But on reflection it makes sense; quite frankly the prologue of the game gives a pretty good sense of the lords, and people inclined to dislike Edelgard are likely put off by her behaviour there, and go another route. Also, the actual in-game choice for going CF vs SS feels very loaded; if you frame the choices as "protect ___" vs "kill ___" then most people are gonna choose protect.

Well Silver Snow is definitely the route that people will advise against playing the most. As it is almost identical to Verdant Wind only without Claude. So I certainly think amoung the people who research the game online Silver Snow will tank in number of plays since people will say "There is really no reason to do it other than the final boss" (which is basically true). But I don't think that would necessarily hold for the silent majority, especially since you can be locked into it if you just don't bother looking at the map on a certain month.

[AnonymousSpeed]

On 9/19/2022 at 10:30 PM, Hrothgar777 said:

I've read enough scholarly and polemic literature to understand just how much worse life was for the average before the Industrial Revolution. By every single metric the quality of life has improved dramatically. Even North Korea is arguably better off than the average country from 400 years ago.

Today the world looks at North Korea and wishes that the people would just rise up against Kim Jong Un and end the local dystopian experiment. And it has lasted about 75-80 years. Rhea, in contrast, has kept Fodlan in its even more crude state for almost 1,200 years.

In the context of that reality, Edelgard is liberalism and modernity embodied in a person. She is "this world-soul, astride a horse, who reaches out over the world and masters it", or so the philosopher Hegel once said of Napoleon on horseback in the streets of Jena.

Yeah, but liberalism and modernity are actually bad (nor do they really mean the same things they did hundreds of years ago). Standard of living improved after the Industrial Revolution because of the Industrial Revolution. As much as I protest the Catholic Church, I think it would be childish to say that it was holding Europe back that much.

I could be wrong, though. You know what they say. The Industrial Revolution and it's consequences-

[Jotari]

1 hour ago, AnonymousSpeed said:

Yeah, but liberalism and modernity are actually bad (nor do they really mean the same things they did hundreds of years ago). Standard of living improved after the Industrial Revolution because of the Industrial Revolution. As much as I protest the Catholic Church, I think it would be childish to say that it was holding Europe back that much.

I could be wrong, though. You know what they say. The Industrial Revolution and it's consequences-

And that's why the Agarthans should have won.

[AnonymousSpeed]

1 minute ago, Jotari said:

And that's why the Agarthans should have won.

Nah man. Too much industrial revolution and its consequences that way.

[Hrothgar777]

1 hour ago, AnonymousSpeed said:

Yeah, but liberalism and modernity are actually bad (nor do they really mean the same things they did hundreds of years ago). Standard of living improved after the Industrial Revolution because of the Industrial Revolution. As much as I protest the Catholic Church, I think it would be childish to say that it was holding Europe back that much.

I could be wrong, though. You know what they say. The Industrial Revolution and it's consequences-

I mean, sure. I wasn't trying to make any statement or inference about the real-world Roman Catholic Church. Medieval Europe existed in a time when most of modern science was simply undiscovered. I personally think that long-term structure is the most important factor in determining whether civilizations get around to discovering stuff, and I personally think that the church provided that exactly that structure in a number of ways.

But Rhea, in contrast, was deliberately preventing Fodlan from modernizing. Technologies that had already existed in the past were not redeveloped because Rhea presumably forbade it from happening. In a video game setting it's easy to see how this is value-neutral. But in reality, it means half your infants dying only a couple of weeks or months after they were born. It means mass malnutrition, infection by parasites that stunt growth and even the proper development of the brain, half of the local village dying from a random plague every 15 years, widespread illiteracy, extremely few life prospects for girls and women, and so on.

And the closest thing we get to an explanation for Rhea's behavior is "The Agarthans had technology and they were bad so technology must therefore be bad." 

[AnonymousSpeed]

35 minutes ago, Hrothgar777 said:

In a video game setting it's easy to see how this is value-neutral.

I mean, the mole-people built giant robots and nukes, not penicillin.

[Jotari]

3 hours ago, Hrothgar777 said:

I mean, sure. I wasn't trying to make any statement or inference about the real-world Roman Catholic Church. Medieval Europe existed in a time when most of modern science was simply undiscovered. I personally think that long-term structure is the most important factor in determining whether civilizations get around to discovering stuff, and I personally think that the church provided that exactly that structure in a number of ways.

But Rhea, in contrast, was deliberately preventing Fodlan from modernizing. Technologies that had already existed in the past were not redeveloped because Rhea presumably forbade it from happening. In a video game setting it's easy to see how this is value-neutral. But in reality, it means half your infants dying only a couple of weeks or months after they were born. It means mass malnutrition, infection by parasites that stunt growth and even the proper development of the brain, half of the local village dying from a random plague every 15 years, widespread illiteracy,

Sure would have been nice if that was an extant part of Rhea's character instead of shoved in a book somewhere.

Quote

extremely few life prospects for girls and women, and so on.

Actually Fodlan, like most Fire Emblem societies is quite egalitarian when it comes to gender roles. Only think I can thing I can think of is Ingrid's arranged marriage, which historically was also something men had little choice in too.

Quote

And the closest thing we get to an explanation for Rhea's behavior is "The Agarthans had technology and they were bad so technology must therefore be bad." 

What really should be biting Rhea in the ass here is the rest of the world that she doesn't control developing technology that outstrips Fodlan, and indeed the Almyrians do have cannons on their ships. Not that the game seems aware of that.

3 hours ago, AnonymousSpeed said:

I mean, the mole-people built giant robots and nukes, not penicillin.

Didn't have to.  Restore staves exist. What they probably have very little knowledge of is agricultural practices. Which we know is a horrible thing for some arrogant rulers of a large society to have a blindspot in. Unless Shambala is hiding some hmsuper high quality hydroponics labs to feed their mole people society. 

Edited September 22, 2022 by Jotari

[Seazas]

All I'm gonna say is, I don't really care how Edelgard is this super important central character. Dimitri and Claude are the other two lords and earned their keep with genuine popularity to the point Intsys had no choice but to acknowledge them. Edelgard is always by Claude and Dimitri, so have all three of them or none. Byleth is optimal and deserves to be prioritized over Edelgard too.

Edited September 22, 2022 by Seazas

[SSbardock84]

Do we know she won’t be? I’d assume she would be, alongside Dimitri and Claude.

[Metal Flash]

7 hours ago, SSbardock84 said:

Do we know she won’t be? I’d assume she would be, alongside Dimitri and Claude.

Not confirmed yet, but none of them appear on the mural, which lowers their chances of being playable.

[Lut-ang]

12 hours ago, SSbardock84 said:

Do we know she won’t be? I’d assume she would be, alongside Dimitri and Claude.

She's perfect as a villain ring in Hegemon form along with Grima(Robin) and Lyon. Nergal for FE7. Zephiel for FE6. 

Edited October 10, 2022 by Lut-ang

[Rose482]

Honestly? I'm starting to feel like we won't get more than the 16 rings we have. I feel like making too many rings to the point everyone on your team can have one will be broken, and I can see them not wanting that? Maybe I'm wrong, but for now I'm going off on the prediction that Edelgard and the other lords won't be in this. 

[Jotari]

12 hours ago, Rose482 said:

Honestly? I'm starting to feel like we won't get more than the 16 rings we have. I feel like making too many rings to the point everyone on your team can have one will be broken, and I can see them not wanting that? Maybe I'm wrong, but for now I'm going off on the prediction that Edelgard and the other lords won't be in this. 

Go the DLC route and it doesn't matter if things are broken.

[Florete]

On 10/10/2022 at 6:57 AM, Rose482 said:

Honestly? I'm starting to feel like we won't get more than the 16 rings we have. I feel like making too many rings to the point everyone on your team can have one will be broken, and I can see them not wanting that? Maybe I'm wrong, but for now I'm going off on the prediction that Edelgard and the other lords won't be in this. 

If that's their only worry, I really doubt it would get in their way. There are plenty of things you can do to balance things around it. Maybe only certain characters can use rings, maybe multiple characters are part of the same ring, maybe ring powers can only be used once per map, etc.

[kratoscar2008]

On 9/19/2022 at 12:01 PM, Dark Holy Elf said:

I'd be interested to see your source for the S support thing. It wouldn't completely stun me, but I would have guessed that Edelgard would have an advantage due to being S supportable by either gender, and also due to the fact that CF appears to be the most-played route based on available online game data ("who gets deployed most" / "taken to tea most" / "given gifts most" / etc. all favours Eagles characters).

Edelgard got more votes in CYL than Dimitri, which is probably the biggest sample size poll we have, but all polls are innately imperfect, because they tend to have self-selecting samples (e.g. is the type of person who votes in CYL broadly representative of all players? Probably not! And polls from individual magazines/websites are even worse). They're both very popular by the standards of Fire Emblem characters, certainly (significantly moreso than Byleth, which proves that popularity isn't the only thing they considered). And they're probably both fairly close overall.

"One of the most popular Nintendo characters"? I guess that depends how you define it. I don't think I'd go that far, for any FE character - that's a label I'd prefer to save for the likes of Mario / Link / Samus / Kirby / Pikachu.

This is a bit of a nothing statement, since this was only the case very early in development; it changed long before the game was released, and then was doubled down on in Hopes.

Pikachu wasn't originally intended as the most important Pokemon either, and in his case, this change didn't even come about until after the original game's release. Not that I consider Edelgard as relevant as Pikachu by any measure, of course; just illustrating how silly it is to use early intentions as a guidepost.

Uff sorry for the late response. I usually just post when I get banned from 4chan which I am right now.

I honestly couldn't finf the most popular nintendo character for the life of me so I will rescind that statement.

As for most popular I did find 2 sources of data from Famitsu (First image and link) which is by far the one that IS cares the  most (Heroes is hard to say like they are different, like Brady was relatively popular in Awakening but Heroes has him as the bottom of the barrel popularity wise) given as they care the most about when it comes to desicions.

This one is a gender breakdown and Dimitri is clearly the moat popular for the 2 genders.

https://www.frontlinejp.net/2019/10/18/fire-emblem-three-houses-player-survey-results/

By far Dimitri is the most popular of them while Claude is hard to say as most of his popularity lives in the other side of the shore.

Another kicker is Engage itself as so far we have an expy of Dimitri (Alfred) and Claude (The brown guy with the rose in the DE poster) but none of Edelgard. 

I dont think she being the antagonist of 80% of the game does her any favors and Hopes is developed by another branch of Tecmo not related to Houses I believe. There is also the fact that Hopes isnt particularly well received in Japan (Probably why DLC isnt likely happening) and barely sold a million. 

There is also the fact that due to Houses nature, adding her as a "Hero" would be an statement on her representation in Houses so that would be a no.

So Byleth is the best as their desicion of who to side with is labeled as the correct one so they are the best to represent Houses.

Like it or not of the 3, Edelgard has the least fans (Most arguments stem from whether she is right or wrong after all, other Lords dont have that baggage) so it makes sense why she wouldnt be a good fit for Houses repping.

Edited November 12, 2022 by kratoscar2008

[Dark Holy Elf]

3 hours ago, kratoscar2008 said:

As for most popular I did find 2 sources of data from Famitsu (First image and link) which is by far the one that IS cares the  most (Heroes is hard to say like they are different, like Brady was relatively popular in Awakening but Heroes has him as the bottom of the barrel popularity wise) given as they care the most about when it comes to desicions.

Brady isn't popular, which is why he took a long time to get into Heroes and still only has one form. Not sure what poll you're thinking of that suggests otherwise - there may well be one! - but this is if anything proving my point to not put too much stock in any one poll.

Famitsu is one source, and notably, a Japan-only one. If your argument is that Dimitri is the most popular one in Japan, I think there's reason to believe that, although even then I'd urge caution, because Famitsu isn't indicative of the entire Japanese fanbase - it's a single magazine. Do you really think Hilda or Bernadetta is more popular than Edelgard, as that poll suggests? Anyone who has spent significant time in this fandom knows that this isn't the case.

3 hours ago, kratoscar2008 said:

I dont think she being the antagonist of 80% of the game does her any favors and Hopes is developed by another branch of Tecmo not related to Houses I believe.

She's extremely popular. Would she be more popular if she weren't an antagonist on some routes? Unknowable, but I rather doubt it! These characaters are popular in large part because they are morally complicated. The most popular character from Three Houses is very likely either Edelgard or Dimitri, both of whom are very far from paragons in the tradition of Marth or Roy.

Also, for what it's worth, all the writers from Houses returned for Hopes (you can check the credits yourself). There are certainly some different names in the credits otherwise, but that makes sense given that the style of gameplay is completely different.

3 hours ago, kratoscar2008 said:

Like it or not of the 3, Edelgard has the least fans

Seems unlikely, given that she won Choose Your Legends, had the largest team in at least one of the voting gauntlets that feature her and the other lords, and wins various in-game metrics. There's probably a reason she was the first character to get a figma. All of this is weighed against a single Famitsu poll which, again, I'll emphasize, is Japan-only (Japan accounts for less than 20% of FE3H's sales... you really need to include at minimum the English fanbase, which is the largest). But even supposing you're right, all three lords are extremely popular, so it wouldn't say much.

Edited November 12, 2022 by Dark Holy Elf

[kratoscar2008]

22 hours ago, Dark Holy Elf said:

Brady isn't popular, which is why he took a long time to get into Heroes and still only has one form. Not sure what poll you're thinking of that suggests otherwise - there may well be one! - but this is if anything proving my point to not put too much stock in any one poll.

Famitsu is one source, and notably, a Japan-only one. If your argument is that Dimitri is the most popular one in Japan, I think there's reason to believe that, although even then I'd urge caution, because Famitsu isn't indicative of the entire Japanese fanbase - it's a single magazine. Do you really think Hilda or Bernadetta is more popular than Edelgard, as that poll suggests? Anyone who has spent significant time in this fandom knows that this isn't the case.

She's extremely popular. Would she be more popular if she weren't an antagonist on some routes? Unknowable, but I rather doubt it! These characaters are popular in large part because they are morally complicated. The most popular character from Three Houses is very likely either Edelgard or Dimitri, both of whom are very far from paragons in the tradition of Marth or Roy.

Also, for what it's worth, all the writers from Houses returned for Hopes (you can check the credits yourself). There are certainly some different names in the credits otherwise, but that makes sense given that the style of gameplay is completely different.

Seems unlikely, given that she won Choose Your Legends, had the largest team in at least one of the voting gauntlets that feature her and the other lords, and wins various in-game metrics. There's probably a reason she was the first character to get a figma. All of this is weighed against a single Famitsu poll which, again, I'll emphasize, is Japan-only (Japan accounts for less than 20% of FE3H's sales... you really need to include at minimum the English fanbase, which is the largest). But even supposing you're right, all three lords are extremely popular, so it wouldn't say much.

Maybe popular wasnt the right word but being 2 spots away from top 10 male shouldnt translate into last place unless there is barely overlap between Heroes and the Awakening fanbase which there doesnt seem to be much.

They may have more fans in Japan. Like say Dorothea was very popular in the west while not much in Japan which translate to a bigger popularity overall but the Japanese ones are the ones that matter. To the very least those girls dont have as many people who dislike her as Edelgard. Dimitri's faults lie in his trauma which makes him act irrationally,  its not like Edelgard where the game justifies his acts as the Boar. And we know that Famitsu poll matters as Inigo, Owain and Severa are the most popular children (Barring Lucina as she is a main character you cant miss so she cant leave her setting as Robin and Chrom) and that translated into a role in Fates. Which has been the most relevant polling as far as ingame development goes.

How many of the Hopes people are IS? I feel like Koei has a thing against Rhea which is why her and the Church are explored the least. Hevk I bet Koei would have let Rhea die in Houses and IS is the reason the church route/Rhea marriage.

 

https://gameworldobserver.com/2022/02/04/fire-emblem-heroes-generated-over-950-million-globally-being-nintendos-highest-grossing-mobile-game#:~:text=Japan accounts for 47.3% of,title's player spending — %24523 million.

Japan makes most of the revenue for Heroes and paired with IS mostly considering Japan for ingame development (Famitsu poll having a role in the awakening children chosen for Fates, we dont have a dedicated FE twitter because who they care to interact with is their Japanese fanbase, the artist chosen was entirety to appeal to their Japanese fanbase and because the artist is popular on the V-tuber sphere, a mostly Japanese market, etc) so their reception is the most relevant and Dimitri would be the better choice if they were to choose someone.

Chrom and Robin not being the reps show that even when the game is based around particular characters they wouldnt be the top choice.

There is also the fact that Engage is a classic good vs evil story and characters. Meanwhile Edelgard isn't supposed to be a defacto hero. She wouldnt fit in Engage because no other Lord sides with the clear enemies, starts a war (The Lord/Hero always fight the one who starts the war, not starting them), helping the bad guys hurt other people by making monsters, becomes a monster themselves or clearly deceive their party members at the expense of a city destroyed by the bad guys, etc.

Works for the setting of Houses but for the setting of Engage? Dimitri is a better fit as he is the classic blue themed Lord who fights against the Emperor who started a war, is a classic Lord whenever he is having a mental breakdown, is very popular and doesnt particularly have haters other than Edelgard fans (While VW, AM and SS players have defractors in Edelgard).

Not that it matters because my main point was that Byleth is the best choice given the circumstances just like Corrin as their choices are the ones that decide who is right.

[Dark Holy Elf]

1 hour ago, kratoscar2008 said:

They may have more fans in Japan. Like say Dorothea was very popular in the west while not much in Japan which translate to a bigger popularity overall but the Japanese ones are the ones that matter. To [...]. And we know that Famitsu poll matters as Inigo, Owain and Severa are the most popular children (Barring Lucina as she is a main character you cant miss so she cant leave her setting as Robin and Chrom) and that translated into a role in Fates. Which has been the most relevant polling as far as ingame development goes.

And, notably, Dorothea gets alts in FEH, whereas say Flayn and Annette (who have similar numbers in the Famitsu poll you cited) do not. So clearly they put stock in CYL results, more than this one Famitsu poll. Speaking of which, Edelgard has what, six forms in FEH now? I think safe to say she's more popular than Bernie or Hilda.

Famitsu poll mattered more for Awakening because that was the only data they had at the time. Now that they actually have international polling (i.e. CYL), Intsys clearly uses that instead.

1 hour ago, kratoscar2008 said:

How many of the Hopes people are IS? I feel like Koei has a thing against Rhea which is why her and the Church are explored the least. Hevk I bet Koei would have let Rhea die in Houses and IS is the reason the church route/Rhea marriage.

The writers of both games (Yuki Ikeno, Mari Okamoto, and Ryohei Hayashi) are Koei staff members. From what I recall the original draft of the game was written by Toshiyuki Kusakihara, who is Intsys, but the actual game we got is written by Koei.

The writers don't have "a thing against" Rhea. That's largely not how writers think (e.g. do you think Shakespeare had a thing against Hamlet?) She is meant to be a tragic character whether she's an antagonist or an ally, as evidenced by the fact that even if you S support her, she regrets the things she has done. And you never get a route where you truly get to play as her or side with her, in either game.

1 hour ago, kratoscar2008 said:

Japan makes most of the revenue for Heroes and paired with IS mostly considering Japan for ingame development

If so, that supports my contention that Edelgard is popular in Japan too. Last I checked she has the most forms in FEH of any Three Houses character. Why would Intsys do that if Edelgard isn't popular / a money-maker?

1 hour ago, kratoscar2008 said:

Not that it matters because my main point was that Byleth is the best choice

Yeah, on that we agree. Even though s/he's not as popular as any of the lords, s/he's the most neutral choice. Putting any of the three lords there would annoy the fans of the other two.

I do hope the lords also get added (and also that we get both genders of Corrin and Byleth).

[Troykv]

I think is fair to say that Edelgard is overall a more important character for the plot than Dimitri and Claude, because the game was designed with her in mind from the very inceptions, the original questions and wonders that created Three Houses are related precisely to having the kind of character that Edelgard ended up being.

Though, the fact that while she is the most important character in the setting, she isn't a character you're wanted to be playing the whole game, that is Byleth, so picking Byleth above all the lords is a very sensible choice even if a bit boring.

Also, this gives us a Brawler User for the game, which I think is neat considering the other lords (from 3H itself and older games) are unlikely to have that proficiency.

Edited November 18, 2022 by Troykv

[genesis]

Well Edelgard is not there because they can't chose any Three Houses lord: that would be unfair, would make half of the fanbase angry and would low key canonized one route regardless of who they picked, so Byleth is the safer choice plus they are indeed the protagonist of Three Houses.

I'm more surprised that they picked male Byleth instead of the female one who is arguably more popular. 

[vanguard333]

2 hours ago, genesis said:

Well Edelgard is not there because they can't choose any Three Houses lord: that would be unfair, would make half of the fanbase angry and would low key canonized one route regardless of who they picked, so Byleth is the safer choice plus they are indeed the protagonist of Three Houses.

So... they instead went with the choice that would upset everyone? Seriously, I keep seeing Byleth referred to as the "safe" choice, but IS choosing Byleth isn't a choice that upsets the least amount of people; it's the choice that upsets the most amount of people because it's the "safe" choice; attempting to please everyone pleases no one.

 

In any case, with the most recent trailers showing that the emblems take on red and dark clothing when corrupted by evil magic, I think I figured out the real reason that Byleth was picked over Edelgard: Edelgard already wears red and dark clothing. How would they make an Edelgard Emblem look corrupted by evil magic? Make her look like Hegemon Edelgard?

Edited November 23, 2022 by vanguard333

[Jotari]

4 hours ago, vanguard333 said:

So... they instead went with the choice that would upset everyone? Seriously, I keep seeing Byleth referred to as the "safe" choice, but IS choosing Byleth isn't a choice that upsets the least amount of people; it's the choice that upsets the most amount of people because it's the "safe" choice; attempting to please everyone pleases no one.

 

In any case, with the most recent trailers showing that the emblems take on red and dark clothing when corrupted by evil magic, I think I figured out the real reason that Byleth was picked over Edelgard: Edelgard already wears red and dark clothing. How would they make an Edelgard Emblem look corrupted by evil magic? Make her look like Hegemon Edelgard?

But most people aren't upset by Byleth as a choice.

[Sunwoo]

Byleth is the most objective choice of the 3H options because Byleth is not associated with any of the four routes. Picking any of Edelgard, Dimitri, or Claude but not the other two would have ... uh, caused some issues in the fanbase.

Also, I'd already restated this earlier this thread but I'll say it again because I think it's important. I'm more upset about female Corrin being here because neither of the Corrins were an objective choice. Female Corrin has forever been associated with Nohr and male Corrin with Hoshido. These are all deliberate choices IS made. If I'm annoyed at female Corrin being picked over male Corrin because I interpret it as yet more Nohr bias, that is because IS themselves has chosen to market f!Corrin as Nohr Corrin. She can no longer represent Fates as a whole or Hoshido, because she's so strongly associated with Nohr. If IS wanted a true neutral representative for Fates, they should've picked Azura. Or they could've given players the option to pick their preferred gender for Corrin and Byleth. What's the point of having an avatar for previous games if later spin-offs using that avatar are going to force a choice on me anyway?

It wouldn't be the weirdest decision either. If we actually gave a shit about proper story-appropriate representation we should've gotten Alm not Celica, either of Eliwood or Hector over Lyn, and Chrom (or even Robin) over Lucina. But clearly the ladies were picked due to their lack of a Y chromosome because IS has never given us a solo female lord (or more than one at the same time) and Eirika is the only one who can claim to stand on equal ground with her male co-lord. Can you tell that I want a new FE game with no avatar and a solo female lord?

Like, there are a lot of things we could rightfully complain about regarding the choice of lords, but picking Byleth over Edelgard or any of the three lords is the sensible thing.

EDIT:

On 11/18/2022 at 8:41 AM, Troykv said:

I think is fair to say that Edelgard is overall a more important character for the plot than Dimitri and Claude, because the game was designed with her in mind from the very inceptions, the original questions and wonders that created Three Houses are related precisely to having the kind of character that Edelgard ended up being.

This ... feels like a slippery slope. Regardless of whether any of this is true, the character who is "more important to the plot" won't always be the hero or the best representative for a game of this nature. Like, I could argue that Ninian is a far more important character for the plot than any of the three lords, but I'd never advocate for her to be the sole representative of Engage. Lucina is also plot important and the story literally wouldn't exist in its current state without her, but between her and Chrom he is definitely the main hero who does most of the actual heavy lifting.

I also don't know what you mean by the original questions that created 3H being related to the kind of character Edelgard is, or why she's somehow the only one this applies to.

Edited November 24, 2022 by Sunwoo

[Fabulously Olivier]

I'm of the mind that Byleth was the right 3H choice, but Azura would have been a better Fates choice.