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DefyingFates
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2 hours ago, Mercakete said:

Even Gullveig specifically singled out Kiran (maybe she's actually Kiran's kid? While also being the "little sister" of Seidr?

Gullveig even says she's tied to Kiran, so Kiran being her parent (and her being Heidr first) would make sense. The soul child thing though... well, I didn't expect IS (or Seidr for that matter) to ever be so brazen about such a thing. Fjorm should take notes!

Seriously though, weird joke aside, the concept of a pseudo-child like that could be interesting, I guess? Maybe? I'm curious what'll happen now that Kiran is stuck with Gullveig though. Maybe she wants to create a spirit baby instead?

Okay, saying it so many times makes it really awkward.

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47 minutes ago, vikingsfan92 said:

Watch this baby be somehow specifically only the Brave version of Gullveig so somehow IS can make it our fault.

I did wonder about that actually, but that would have required from very quick rewriting.

But I suppose it has been a month since CYL, and as long as Brave Gullveig isn't too important going forward...

Also, Brave Gullveig would be the playerbase's fault, so...

 

Edited by DefyingFates
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4 hours ago, DefyingFates said:

Gullveig even says she's tied to Kiran, so Kiran being her parent (and her being Heidr first) would make sense. The soul child thing though... well, I didn't expect IS (or Seidr for that matter) to ever be so brazen about such a thing. Fjorm should take notes!

Seriously though, weird joke aside, the concept of a pseudo-child like that could be interesting, I guess? Maybe? I'm curious what'll happen now that Kiran is stuck with Gullveig though. Maybe she wants to create a spirit baby instead?

Okay, saying it so many times makes it really awkward.

Personally, I think this is partially because IS realized that they had to explain how the dragon founders made kids with the people they "gave their power/blood" to (the royals of Askr, Embla, Nifl, and Muspell, at the very least. Maybe life land, too, since I think Eir had Ymir's power, hence the multiple lives) since traditional babymaking wouldn't work in certain cases. (Askr+Lif, Nifl+whatsherface, etc. Not sure who the human was for Embla or (mistake corrected) Muspell, after all.) It's specifically genetic, after all. (Thinking about it like that, I guess Ash is Alfonse and Sharena's great great great great great great great great (etc.) aunt.)

Though, a thing that bothers me is how Seidr was basically all "the mortal just has to give a bit of his/her soul and then doesn't have to have anything to do with the kid afterwards. Not even pay child support!" No one likes being left high and dry by a parent. If we're making a kid, we should take responsibility for it and try to raise it with love and care (which seems to be what most of the mortal parents of the royal families did since, well, the royal families are a thing and trace their lineage back to their mortal ancestors more than to their deity ancestors.) Anyway, this plot line falls onto some sensitive topics and it probably should have been avoided.

As an aside, of course the kid would be a girl. Even if it's not snake lady, I bet it's a girl. X chromosomes seem to have a very high chance of being selected in this universe. Seems like not such a great thing for the continuation of the species but okay.

2 hours ago, vikingsfan92 said:

Watch this baby be somehow specifically only the Brave version of Gullveig so somehow IS can make it our fault.

1 hour ago, DefyingFates said:

I did wonder about that actually, but that would have required from very quick rewriting.

But I suppose it has been a month since CYL, and as long as Brave Gullveig isn't too important going forward...

Also, Brave Gullveig would be the playerbase's fault, so...

 

I forgot to mention it, but I considered this possibility too. And IS, leave me out of it; I didn't give votes to anyone but Elena. I did not consent to this.

 

Edit: I derp'd; Embla needs this to explain things too, since the founder of the country of the same name was Thrasir.

Edit again: I wonder if the "strangeness" Eitri was talking about at the end of Book 5 was actually in reference to all this, 'cause Book 6 wasn't actually that weird. It wouldn't surprise me if they have 2 teams of writers for Heroes and alternate books. Except that this feels like it's from the same people who gave us Book 4.

Edited by Mercakete
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If Gullveig is a creation between Kiran and Seidr Conception(the game)style it wouldn’t surprise me now since Kiran was single out of the existence erasing plus Heidr was hard pushing them together. Oh how fitting Gullveig winning CYL it’s literally fate now I’m CURIOUS what they’ll do(no Heidr clothes I hope). Plus RIP Gullveig lovers I guess.

This is honestly messed up if theory is true because it doesn’t feel like true love at all and feels forced upon me. It’s like you poof something outta nowhere which imo is pretty eh…not a fan it’s just logically wrong but I ain’t going deep on a game.

        Another is that Kiran isn’t a FE avatar but moreso the players playing the game so it doesn’t make sense to have something crazy like this. I hope IS knows what they’re doing here since I like the book so far hopefully this won’t make me change my thoughts close to mid point.

I guess there was Ash and Elm creations of their respective gods but I guess it’s more to do with it being a non-FE Avatar which otherwise would be ok.

Edited by Ivy Wife Supremacy
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My first reaction to this chapter was to laugh so much it hurt.

My second reaction was "nah, I don't buy it. It will be a red herring to confuse us. They wouldn't just randomly give us a kid".

But then I stopped to consider it for a second. It sure has been an awful long time since an Avatar had a kid and both Morgna and Kana were pretty popular, with so many players loving the build-a-family mechanics of the 3DS' games. So even if it's crazy they might just do it.

But there are some things to consider. If it's really Gullveig or something it would be kind of shitty since they showed the character to us months before revealing that she is our kid, which is really messed up when some people might already be attached to her as a waifu and would hate the Surprise Incest (like when they revealed that Azura is your biological cousin at the last possible second after you might have already made babies with her).

I honestly would prefer it if the kid isn't anyone we know at all, and possibly a character we meet at the very end of the book with a different design depending on our choice of Avatar in game (like they have purple hair if we play as purple haired Kiran). That I could accept and I would actually really love it, but it isn't a perfect solution either.

The first problem with this is that it would be a kid forced by the story like Lucina, and not like the Avatar Kids which you can just not have if you want to play as an Aro-Ace Robin or something.

The second problem is that it would force us to be either a single parent based on how they worded it, or married to Seithr if they backpedal on that detail. Both options aren't great. Many people feel a deep affection towards Kana and Morgan, but they feel an even deeper affection towards their chosen spouse. Forcing us to pick Seithr is not ideal.

The third problem is that Kiran, unlike every other Avatar (even the FE 7 one), is literally supposed to be us! And I can see people having problems with that, even people who loved having children in Awakening and Fates.

 

So yeah, no matter what this wasn't a great choice. There only three options:

  1. It's a red herring, and if so why would they intentionally waste our time with something that is honestly in poor taste.
  2. Our kid is Gullveig (or some other character we already know) which is yikes for the Surprise Incest effect.
  3. Our kid is a brand new character (maybe with customization like Kiran, maybe not). Which has its own set of problems

 

Of the three options I prefer the third one for entirely selfish reasons (I missed having a Morgan/Kana in 3H and Engage), but I recognize that it's better for everyone if it's the first one.

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“The child” could possibly be a new character(maybe customizable feature like My Summoner that can actually be used in non MS modes) we haven’t seen yet and all of this overreaction could be for absolutely nothing but still an issue in of itself still. Something’s gonna come out of that whether you like it or not. FEH was missing a child like mechanic they have everything else so I should’ve saw something like this coming for a long time.

Edited by Ivy Wife Supremacy
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I still think Gullvieg is more likely Heior and really don't want Gullveig to be the summoner kid. I also hope the way they introduce Brave Gullveig is good but it honestly is a bit scary how I could see IS going similarly wild with Brave Gullveig story. So while I don't like it I can see them going the meme route I mentioned. 

Also I am not sure they are committed down this road just yet will have to wait for the next part of the story. Maybe we will find another way to solve the problem but they just didn't want to use the whole sacrificial ritual set up again.

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I wasn't in a good mood this morning so I refrained from posting in here until I'd slept on it a bit. Now, all I really have to say is ...

Fuck this story.

Why can't I play as a summoner the characters DON'T fap over?

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If the villainess that half the fanbase shamelessly horny-voted into winning CYL ends up being our future daughter, my sides are going to leave the solar system and possibly pass through the next galaxy over.

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The more I think about it the less I think Seidr will actually end up having a child. The whole thing is Njordr's idea and Seidr going to Kiran about it is her trying to make the best of an uncomfortable situation. Not to mention, Seidr is in the past and Kiran is currently being held hostage by Gullveig, so it's not like they can make the vow at the moment unless they did so offscreen. Or maybe I'm just overthinking things.

Of course, there's also the question of why Njordr wants Seidr to have a child in the first place. I'd think that he wants the child to absorb the golden curse and "become" Gullveig so they could kill her, but I'm not sure if FEH would go there.

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8 hours ago, Some Jerk said:

If the villainess that half the fanbase shamelessly horny-voted into winning CYL ends up being our future daughter, my sides are going to leave the solar system and possibly pass through the next galaxy over.

Oh, I'd forgotten about that somehow, but you're right, the fan fallout to that would be incredible xD

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I think I've calmed down after reading.... THAT. So we're going to the past for four chapters; it would be cool if we got a heroes children banner this year. I'm in the camp that think Heidr is our child and Gullveig, so I think Heidr will be born in the past, Gullveig will curse her past self, and we leave her behind, which probably leads to some grudge. A random thought occurred to me: imagine, since we've been kidnapped again, if Seidr asks Alfonse instead? if we could see Veronica's reaction, it'd be worth it.

Also, I'm kinda disappointed how they're using the 'out of order' story format, because this just feels like they mixed around the Chapter numbers without mixing up the story itself; after the 3rd chapter, I figured it would be in groups of four, but I though we'd at least die at the end of the first and second groups of four, rather than just a typical 'travel to the past to learn the truth' story.

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11 hours ago, Aedan7479 said:

Also, I'm kinda disappointed how they're using the 'out of order' story format, because this just feels like they mixed around the Chapter numbers without mixing up the story itself; after the 3rd chapter, I figured it would be in groups of four, but I though we'd at least die at the end of the first and second groups of four, rather than just a typical 'travel to the past to learn the truth' story.

The problem with that is legacy. In the future, players (and especially new players) will probably play the story in order since all the chapters will be available. They need a story that works both in the mixed order and in the linear order because of that. Also, it's not like their choice here is bad. It's just in a "loop style" time travel arc. Think of it like a roller coaster. Sure, there are loops, but at the end of said loops, you move forward again, and the journey from start to end never branches even if you can tell that there was a loop. (In this case, there are signs of time being altered "already" while still "needing to be altered." For example, Freyr/Freyja's aunt giving Sharena a hint about how to persuade her in the past. For her, the past has already been altered, but for the Askr trio, it hasn't. And she seems to be aware of that, hence giving the hint. So, it's like you have 2 camps of perception coexisting at the same time: those who know what's been altered and are in "the second loop" and those who haven't altered it yet as being in "the first loop." Since this is all more because of precognition (goat aunt had the Ar and once Njordr gave the Ar's power to Seidr, she could time travel, so we can assume goat aunt could see the past as it would later be altered. Also, Kiran was given a vision of the future, so it hadn't happened yet, but the summoner knew what would happen if the future wasn't changed, so again, knowledge, not experience) than very much actual time traveling, this multi-layered-loop system actually works in a rational way, and I actually think IS is handling THAT aspect really well. You of course also have Seidr remembering Kiran in the past from when she was young, so there's obviously time travel/cognition things going on there, too.) It's the same thing here since the books are just arcs instead of their own stories. Ultimately, this is just one segment of the journey, which will continue on to the next book. I think they chose a style of time travel that works well for the format they have.

If you think about it, the only actual time travel we've seen... Actually, let me just break this down this way.

Instances of pre/postcognition:

- Seidr giving Kiran a vision of the future.

- Goat Aunt knowing about the past being altered in the (perception-based) future (as in, it hasn't happened yet according to the Askrans' personal histories as individuals, but has according to Goat Aunt's perceived personal history, if that makes sense), probably with the power of Njordr's Ar that she stole.

Instances of actual time travel:

- Gullveig jumping around the timeline. Ironically, though she is referred to as a "seer," her power is actual time travel. So, she may not even be a "seer" at all (unless she's using both powers; this is unconfirmed at this time, but would make sense since she always seems to know when to time travel to.)

- Seidr using the power of Njordr's Ar to travel back in time.

- POSSIBLY Njordr turning the development of the golden serpent curse back in time within Heidr's body (so only the curse's development went back in time and nothing else, since evidently, Njordr has time power enhanced by his Ar.) This is just a theory on how his control over this could work and why he's the only one who seems to be able to keep the golden curse at bay. If he could turn back its time, he could achieve this, but not totally remove it, as we've seen so far.

All that said, I'm not sure how IS is going to handle this book without including chapters of AT LEAST the changed future. Like, "Ch10X" or something. Or, maybe Gullveig gets defeated in the past chapters and the books' timelines continue into book 8 from the "present" of book 7? Anyway, time travel always makes for more complication in writing since all elements, in the end, need to be controlled (by the writer.) Otherwise, you get so flippin' many plot holes it's not funny. IS is doing an okay job of this, since they seem to have a very firm grip on major plot points (at least) and have them firmly stapled into place, to the point where characters with pre/postcognition even reference them, indicating, as mentioned, a stable time loop.

 

Now that all that's out of the way, anyone want to hear an uncomfortable alternate theory? What if Heidr is Gullveig, and Gullveig kidnapped Kiran to prevent Kiran from making a kid with Seidr because Seidr is actually the kid of Gullveig and Kiran, which is why Seidr remembers Kiran from her childhood and values Kiran so much without quite knowing why? And all this happens because Gullveig kidnaps Kiran, takes a bit of soul, and makes Seidr because Gullveig wants to make darn sure her big sister gets born (not because she actually cares about Kiran him/herself)? Have fun with the twisted love story, my dudes. Feels like a deity puppy mill (which may be why Njorder told Seidr to have a kid, given that all the deities keep dying lately) except that the deities are more motivated by one another than by the mortal whose soul they want to take a sample of.

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  • 4 weeks later...

So the new oc is named Ksavir and remember all those memes about Gullveig or someone else being our daughter? Well throw them out the window because this new character is literally born out of the saliva of Vanir (Seidr) and an Aesnir (Kiran, who many theorize is FEH's equivalent to Baldur).

Though actually she may not because considering the original Ksavir died and thier blood was used to make the Mead of Poetry (that Odin is often associated with btw) she might be high on character-to-die-for-this-book list.

Other facts relating to Ksavir that may or may not come up:

  • Ksavir was born a mortal who was wise and traveled far and wide
  • He was killed by dwarf brothers Fjalar and Galar and his blood was mixed with honey to create the Mead of Poetry
  • The Mead of Poetry, or Mead of Suttungr as it is sometimes called, grants both skinship and wisdom
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3 hours ago, Deathcon said:

Well throw them out the window because this new character is literally born out of the saliva of Vanir (Seidr) and an Aesnir (Kiran, who many theorize is FEH's equivalent to Baldur).

I did think she looked similar to Morgan, so I can buy this! Kiran really became a parent, huh?

3 hours ago, Deathcon said:

Though actually she may not because considering the original Ksavir died and thier blood was used to make the Mead of Poetry (that Odin is often associated with btw) she might be high on character-to-die-for-this-book list.

Other facts relating to Ksavir that may or may not come up:

  • Ksavir was born a mortal who was wise and traveled far and wide
  • He was killed by dwarf brothers Fjalar and Galar and his blood was mixed with honey to create the Mead of Poetry

As weird as the spirit baby thing is, and as much as I think it's daft that only men die in FEH, I... kinda hope this Book doesn't write Ksavir to be your adorable kid and then kill her at the end. I doubt IS has the guts to do something like that, but still.

3 hours ago, Deathcon said:

The Mead of Poetry, or Mead of Suttungr as it is sometimes called, grants both skinship and wisdom

Uh... you mean kinship, I hope? xD

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Well, I try to avoid looking at story-related stuff in the trailers but the new character is just so obviously Kiran and Seidr's kid. She got her mom's iridescent bits and her dad's (because Kiran is the dad in this case for simplicity's sake whether he's a he or a she) hood (but silver instead of gold detailing.) This will clearly go well. /s

About the "skinship" comment... Nah. This lady clearly just inspired all of Nhor and Hoshido. So, granting skinship.

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18 hours ago, Deathcon said:

So the new oc is named Ksavir and remember all those memes about Gullveig or someone else being our daughter? Well throw them out the window because this new character is literally born out of the saliva of Vanir (Seidr) and an Aesnir (Kiran, who many theorize is FEH's equivalent to Baldur).

And the story has proceeded to throw those memes back in the window with shining Christmas lights attached. Kvasir turns out be Gullveig as a child. If anything, this makes it more likely, though it does leave the trouble with Heiðr up in the air.

Also, this is Chapter 2 instead of Chapter 1. We're not done going back in time yet.

Edited by Some Jerk
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So at some point we'll probably go back in time again and Ksavir will be born, and then left alone. So is Heidr a red herring, or does Kvasir lose her memories and get taken in by Njordr? If it's the latter, it'll be funny to think that half of this book's characters are the same person.

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1 hour ago, Aedan7479 said:

So at some point we'll probably go back in time again and Ksavir will be born, and then left alone. So is Heidr a red herring, or does Kvasir lose her memories and get taken in by Njordr? If it's the latter, it'll be funny to think that half of this book's characters are the same person.

Alfonse makes a comment wondering about Gullveig's presence in the present as well, so I think it's a safe bet that the answer to that question is Heidr.

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Spoiler

So it has been confirmed that Ksavir is the younger form of Gullveig. It is also explained Gullveig's fascination with the Summoner as they were her only friend before they were seperated when the Summoner returned to the Order of Heroes.

Spoilers for Book VII Chapter 2

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3 hours ago, Othin said:

Alfonse makes a comment wondering about Gullveig's presence in the present as well, so I think it's a safe bet that the answer to that question is Heidr.

Yep! I think it's because of the mention of Kvasir being Kiran's kid but I didn't see the Gullveig reveal coming. I do wonder what leads to her becoming Heidr though: is Heidr faking being an ingenue and is actually really calculating? The "time = light" thing was cool though, from a scientific perspective.

1 hour ago, Deathcon said:

Spoilers for Book VII Chapter 2

I hadn't thought about that! Yeah, that would explain some of her angst.

Also, Kiran was put out of commission for a bit over three months, right? I wonder if they'll do something with that; maybe Kvasir accidentally revealed a weakness of hers (maybe the second Breidablik)?

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Okay, going into this without reading other comments, so I can be as blind as I can (as usual.) Let's go!

We're in the past now (by a few hundred years) yay!

Okay, so Alfonse being a worried mother friend as per usual. Such a nice guy.

Ah, daughter (Kvasir) is here now. ... Actually, though, elements of her dress under the transparent shawl thing reminds me of Emblian attire. Also, parts of her clothes have blue and red parts to them (the color of Askr's power and the color of Embla's power, respectively.) I may be reading too much into this, but maybe Briedablik isn't just an Askr-powered summon gun, but is made partially from Embla's power, too?

Ah, okay, so Kiran only got bumped about 100 days further into the past than the others did. Good thing, too, if those injuries are as bad as they seem. Time for recovery. Still, leaving your kid to live in a ravine isn't very good parenting. And, as we all figured, I'm sure, Kvasir is a time goddess. And light and time are the same thing here I guess.

And she being alone and sad because of it is no surprise. This is why I said we should be responsible about bringing new people into the world and take care of them properly if we're going to do that.

Pff. "This one shines with a golden light... while the other does not. Which one is yours?" Reminds me of that story about the woodcutter and the pond. HA! "Remember...to lie to a goddess is to ask for punishment." Yep, really reminding me of that legend. Honestly, ol' Bried's been through so many divine rites by now that I'm not sure. ... Also, threatening your parent is to ask for punishment, too, young lady. Don't sass me.

"We two are destined to be foes, in fact." Oh. Well. Didn't see that coming. "Do you not recognize me?" Ah, yeah, I was surprised she didn't recognize her, especially with her wearing the Aesir symbol front and center. Like, this is obviously someone related to you at least.

Ah, so she's Gullveig in the future. Yep. Gullveig was our daughter after all. Also, she could still grow into Heidr before turning into Gullveig. And she says she has a "mission to see through to the end." That may be getting her parents to make her. See? Told you this was irresponsible and a bad idea. Easy way to beat her: don't make the kid.

"If Kvasir exists in our past and Gullveig exists in our future, there must be..." Yep. Heidr in the present. That's what I think, anyway.

Oh gosh goat aunt. And she thinks the mortals could get in trouble if Njordr finds them first? I wonder what he was like. Again, I wonder if he gave Kvasir (who says she needs to "become Gullveig") the golden serpent curse she has as Heidr, which eventually turns her into Gullveig. Also, it was Njordr who gave Seidr the mission to make a kid (who is Kvasir.) The puzzle pieces fit, anyway.

And there we go! Looks like we'll be entertaining goat aunt next time. Yay...

 

Edit after reading comments and mulling over things for a bit longer:

Oh, good catch about this being ch2 not ch1. Yeah, it seems to follow the timeline of the daughter's life, so ch1 is probably when she's made. ...or rather not made. Here's what I'm thinking: people realize who she is, and just don't make her, winning in ch1. And then there's some text being all "the following is a tale about a girl who did not exist. Here is what would have happened if she had..." or something. It'd be a neat, haunting, and complex way to end the story and would cover over plot holes going into the future. ... We'll see if IS thought this far enough ahead to do that. It could also be that Njordr is the one we fight in ch1 to stop the daughter time loop. I'll explain that below.

As for whether Heidr's lost her memory or is faking her relationships, I think it's kind of both. Like, consenting to her memory being replaced for the sake of fooling Seidr as she grows up as Heidr. She really seems to be Njordr's "dragon" (powerful, loyal subordinate totally dedicated to the master/'s cause.) The more I think about things, the more convinced I am that Njordr is secretly the big bad, having orchestrated Gullveig's rise to power.

Here's the Njordr timeline as I see it for now (with more chapters incoming, we'll get more info) (warning: this is a bit convoluted and may take several readthroughs to get):

- Njordr, having the power of his Ar (which has time powers), foresees the destruction of the gods at the hands of the humans (Ragnarok) and devises a plan to destroy the humans first (Gullveig)

- Kvasir is born

- Njordr gains influence over Kvasir (whether by kidnapping or whatever, but he successfully makes her a pawn)

- Njordr tells Kvasir about her destiny, and maybe even shows her the Ar (time power thing), which also proves his words

- Njordr sends Kvasir to live in the ravine Kiran will fall into in the future and tells her to come back to him once that's happened and Kiran is well (Point A -- you'll see why I'm naming this later)

- Kvasir returns and is given the golden serpent curse by Njordr

- Njordr wipes Kvasir's memory and gives her new memories and the name Heidr so that she can grow up alongside Seidr without risking giving away the plan (Kvasir obviously "disappears")

- Njorder's Ar is stolen by Goat Aunt (and maybe the Order of Heroes)

- As Heidr and Seidr grow up together, they form a bond, hiding Heidr's true identity. Also, the golden serpent curse gets worse and worse, but Njordr "calms it down" and is the only one who can do so (he may be strengthening it, he may be suppressing Heidr's Kvasir memories or something to keep the ruse up)

- When the curse is advanced enough, Njordr tells Seidr to get his Ar back because he needs it to help Heidr with the curse (this is a half-truth. It's really so he can send her into the past to make Kvasir in the proper time, and so that the Ar's powers will pass to Seidr's kid, which would lead to Heidr and the curse coming into being in the first place) and also tasks her to make a kid with Kiran

- Seidr gets the power of time from the Ar and goes out with the Order and Heidr to look for Gullveig (disguising Gullveig's being Heidr)

- Gullveig is sent to attack Seidr and to both cause and disrupt her time travel so that Kiran could be sent to the past a bit further than the others Heidr being around confuses Seidr's attempt to find Gullveig, since she finds Heidr instead, who really is the same person as who she's looking for. Also probably one of those things that look like it's not necessary, but time shenanigans dictates that it actually is. Also...eh, I'll get to that in a sec)

- Seidr time-travels but whoops, Kiran fell out

- Kiran falls into the ravine where Kvasir is waiting to take care of him (I'll use "him" for simplicity's sake here) (this, as a result, brings us back to Point A)

- While Seidr, Kiran, and the Askrans are in the past and trying to figure out how to use time travel and working on making Kvasir, Njordr can work in the present on restoring Heidr's memories as Kvasir, completing the curse, and thus making Gullveig: his weapon against mortals

- Njordr gives Gullveig her mission and unleashes her on the world

- Gullveig becomes the weapon, the loyal servant, and the scapegoat all at once in the past, present, and future, though her entire existence was orchestrated by Njordr, who carefully created a time loop and caused the heroes (who killed Freyr and put Freyja in a coma, who are his relatives if not his children, by the way) who would bring about Ragnarok to instead create destruction for mortals, thus saving the gods from the Ragnarok that would come if the mortals had remained

Whew. Hope that explained my theory okay. Dang was that hard to try to write out in a way that makes sense.

So yeah, we're going to be kicking sea serpent butt eventually and either Kvasir/Heidr/Gullveig will have never existed, or she'll get to go her own way instead of being made into a world-ending weapon.

 

Edit after FEH Channel introducing Seer's Snare:

In there, Gullveig says that she's a time paradox which shouldn't exist. If the timeline is broken down like how I explained it above, then she only esist because Njordr told Seidr to make a kid and then planned it so that said kid would be Kvasir/Heidr/Gullveig born in the past (which takes place after the order was given in the present) and inherit time powers from her mom who got it from Njordr's Ar, thus creating a stable time loop in the form of a time paradox. Basically, all the pieces of this theory are fitting even more snugly than ever. Time to keep watching to see if the midpoint of the book reveals Njordr as the actual big bad.

Also, I wonder if we'll get more xenologues. We already got at least 1 after Book 2, and all this time stuff (at least on theme) would really fit them. Timelines which didn't happen, for example. That said, this whole book could be a timeline which didn't happen, so if anything, a xenologue would be for the timeline that did. But then it wouldn't be a xenologue anymore, right?

Anyway, I'm sure this is the direction IS is going in (at least until officially released stuff tells me otherwise.)

Edited by Mercakete
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  • 3 weeks later...

And now it's time to go over the new chapter! Here we go!

As expected, Kvasir is going toward Vanaheimr's castle. That is, probably Njordr.

Goat Aunt is here already and not in my barracks. Hmm she's being a little threatening, but she seems more worried about what Njordr would do to the Askrans. ...Aaaand Anna, the commander of the Order, jumps pretty much right to violence as a solution. ??? How did she get her rank?

... ... ... ... .... Wat. ... Why- ... IS really wanted to use more of those blushing sprites I guess but... Why? Sharena, what the heck made you jump from "creature of the land" to "I should be a catgirl"? Like, specifically a catgirl. She doesn't even have a catgirl alt. They could've just used bunny Sharena for this and have her make hop puns. Well, anyway, Sharena set up her own time loop and kind of doomed herself, I guess. So...there's that. (Why does she have such weird relationships with the goat people?)

*tirescreech* Okay, what? Kvasir came from the future... But wait- How far into the future? If this is still before she was born, then maybe that's the future she's talking about, to rely future Njordr's plan to past Njordr to make sure Kvasir gets born. Hm? Okay, so the message is that Gullveig lives in Kvasir, and Njordr is all shocked and talking about legends... So, he knew about Gullveig before she was born...and the Golden Seer's Curse turns Kvasir into Gullveig, but the curse affecting Heidr is called the Golden Serpent Curse. Hrm. Maybe that was supposed to be a countermeasure or something? This is getting more complex.

Ah. So, she changed Njordr's future...but from what and to what? And by what means? Did she give him the Ar?

Oookay, so Gullveig will disappear and become Kvasir who will again become Gullveig... And knowing this never-ending loop is the curse. Okay, I can see that. No wonder everything turns all sandy over time. It's like the last grains in an hourglass are coming out... So, does that mean her Kvasir design is meant to portray an hourglass that isn't using up its sand, and Heidr is kind of in-between?

Well, there are some mysteries here. Hope it keeps getting interesting and doesn't include cop outs. That said, I keep wondering who cursed her to begin with. If she's cursed, the curse had to start somewhere. Njordr makes the most sense, but is this a double loop? Did he, with his future changed, curse her in order to change his future?

Edit:

Decided to listen to Book 7's theme while grinding a bit. Put it on loop. Realized how appropriate that was.

Edit 2:

HOKAY are you guys ready for a crazy alternative theory? Warning: this is WAY more convoluted than my other one. (Or at least, I think so, before writing it out.) Anyway, here we go.

Let's travel back in time to when we meet Seidr in the present after getting that vision about the destroyed future. She talks about feeling like she's met Kiran long ago, when she was young. She also says that everyone in/from Vanaheimr is related to one another (including Freyr and Freyja.) Additionally, she mentions coming into Njordr's service at one point, and I believe she says he raised her. For sure, she sees Heidr as her sister.

Now that we have all that out of the way, let's go backwards in some of the plot points that have appeared. Specifically, these: Njordr gives Seidr the mission to make a kid. Seidr already chose Kiran as the recipient of a vision, so she already has a connection with the summoner and decides to keep that going and choose the summoner to be the one to help her make a kid. Then, we run across Kvasir who looks like a combination of Kiran and Seidr (so, of course, everyone immediately is thinking that this is their kid.) Now, let's go backwards (or kind of backwards) from here. Kvasir (a child) meets Kiran. Seidr meets Kiran and feels like she's met him/her before when she was a child. Gullveig uses up her magic and becomes Kvasir in the future.

If you don't get what I'm getting at yet, let's go over something else Kvasir says: that Gullveig is within her. It's easy to look past because we already have assumed information (Seidr was told to make a kid with Kiran, so we're expecting a Seidr+Kiran kid, Kvasir will "become" Gullveig.)

Okay, time to make it simple: Kvasir is both Heidr and Seidr, Heidr representing inevitability (incurable disease) and Seidr already being overtly a goddess of hope (so a hopeful future.) Kvasir gets split into Heidr and Seidr at some point, and both girls don't remember that they're the same person, instead thinking that they're sisters. The secret is kept from them by Njordr, who takes them in (maybe in the hopes that he can get rid of the curse somehow, so long as they don't remember who they are) and they grow up together. However, the curse advances and advances in Heidr, and she eventually remembers her destiny and who she is, and fully becomes Gullveig. It could also be that when she runs out of power, she not only reverts to her combined form, but gets transported back in time to when she really was in that form. So, it could be that Seidr is free of the time loop curse, but Heidr is still stuck in it.

In short, the kid is a red herring (and explaining how other deities passed on power or whatever -- so a world lore band-aid.) Or, we get a more different kid eventually who can break the time loop. Maybe this is why Njordr told Seidr to make a kid: because it would take someone from her own power to be able to stop her other self's curse. Hard to say.

Anyway, this would explain Seidr mentioning meeting Kiran when she was young and feeling connected to him/her, Kvasir looking just like a young Seidr, the connection between Seidr and Gullveig, where Seidr came from if she was adopted into Njordr's service (partially -- we're still lacking origins) and it would make the duality extremely clear in this book. (Hope vs inevitability, which was hinted at as soon as Seidr was introduced, given her title as a goddess of hope.) It would also explain why Seidr and Heidr look so gosh dang similar.

Edited by Mercakete
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