The Game Awards announced Fire Emblem Engage is getting an Expansion Pass

[DefyingFates]

2 minutes ago, Metal Flash said:

Depending on what the other DLC content is, I might buy it. Right now,, I am unsure of if I find the purchase worth it. Only content I am interested in is the "new story" in the final wave. Speaking of, I am so annoyed that they went for the "waves of content" approach, instead of doing what the 3Ds games did and just sell it in separate parts.

Probably so people are forced to buy the whole thing including the weaker Waves instead of cherry-picking the stuff they actually want...

For example, if only one of the DLC Emblems interests you, it would have been nice to be able to just buy that one (or that Wave).

Edited December 10, 2022 by DefyingFates

[Metal Flash]

1 minute ago, DefyingFates said:

Probably so people are forced to buy the whole thing including the weaker Waves instead of cherry-picking the stuff they actually want...

For example, if only one of the DLC Emblems interests you, it would have been nice to be able to just buy that one (or that Wave).

Probably, I just find it irritating.

[B.Leu]

Engage is just the gift that keeps on giving. Three Hopes? no DLCs. Engage, the game that isn't even out, the game that is screaming Fates 2.0? Instantly get DLCs. Nice. Totally not foreboding at all. 😛 

[Taho]

3 hours ago, DefyingFates said:

Probably so people are forced to buy the whole thing including the weaker Waves instead of cherry-picking the stuff they actually want...

For example, if only one of the DLC Emblems interests you, it would have been nice to be able to just buy that one (or that Wave).

Wait, you can't? 😳

Same as a lot of people, all I wanted was Wave 4 (story, classes... actual game material). Does it mean I have to buy the whole pack to get that one wave? That wouldn't be very player-friendly, but then, it wouldn't really surprise me either...

When 3H came out, I purchased it with DLC with my eyes closed, but it was cheaper (€20 in Europe IIRC). This time around, I'm not so sure... 😒

I guess I'll just buy the pack at a discount, when and if we get one (I'm in no rush, the core game should keep me going for a couple hundred hours, I hope)

[link16hit]

1 hour ago, Taho said:

Wait, you can't? 😳

Same as a lot of people, all I wanted was Wave 4 (story, classes... actual game material). Does it mean I have to buy the whole pack to get that one wave? That wouldn't be very player-friendly, but then, it wouldn't really surprise me either...

When 3H came out, I purchased it with DLC with my eyes closed, but it was cheaper (€20 in Europe IIRC). This time around, I'm not so sure... 😒

I guess I'll just buy the pack at a discount, when and if we get one (I'm in no rush, the core game should keep me going for a couple hundred hours, I hope)

Well, there was a discount this year for 3H expansion! So we will get one for it too...at a later date

[Fabulously Olivier]

So what do we think new classes entails? Is it just establishing that the new characters will be new classes, since there doesn't seem to be class swapping, or do we think these will be unique class changing items like we've seen with the Witch, Ballistician, Lodestar, etc.?

[Azz]

1 hour ago, Fabulously Olivier said:

So what do we think new classes entails? Is it just establishing that the new characters will be new classes, since there doesn't seem to be class swapping, or do we think these will be unique class changing items like we've seen with the Witch, Ballistician, Lodestar, etc.?

Based on previous DLCs, I can imagine these new classes will be throwbacks to older FE games and will probably be locked to specific class changing items. Would be pretty cool if each class was a throwback to each Emblem ring's base game class, but I dunno if they would do that and not charge for each class like they did for SoV.

They could also do a SoV and have higher tier classes, but I'm more inclined to believe it will be throwback classes like what we got with Fates and Three Houses.

[DefyingFates]

50 minutes ago, Azz said:

Based on previous DLCs, I can imagine these new classes will be throwbacks to older FE games and will probably be locked to specific class changing items. Would be pretty cool if each class was a throwback to each Emblem ring's base game class, but I dunno if they would do that and not charge for each class like they did for SoV.

They could also do a SoV and have higher tier classes, but I'm more inclined to believe it will be throwback classes like what we got with Fates and Three Houses.

I hope so. At least then it wouldn't feel like the classes were pay-to-win... even if some of the 3H classes were far better than the base game classes for certain units.

My biggest wish is that the DLC classes aren't gender-locked, if that's returning.

Edited December 10, 2022 by DefyingFates

[vanguard333]

All I can say is that I'm glad I didn't watch the Game Awards, as seeing this trailer live would have really angered me. I don't normally pay attention to the Game Awards, as it's a complete joke, but I try to watch any game trailers afterward, and, for some reason, I didn't learn about this trailer until today.

This is just sickening; they announce this DLC and show off the gameplay for it almost an entire month before the game's release; this just screams, "This is all stuff that was originally going to be in the main game, but we decided to remove it from the base game so that we can charge extra for it, as we know you will pay for it." I remember when Nintendo started doing DLC, and everyone was apprehensive about it, so they declared that DLC would only be post-release bonus content; never something removed before release to be sold later. Nintendo just keeps getting increasingly anti-consumer, and no one is doing anything about it.

I was genuinely looking forward to this game; however, seeing that what we're going to get as the base game is just a butchered edition, I don't feel like purchasing it as I don't want to support these anti-consumer practices.

[DefyingFates]

32 minutes ago, vanguard333 said:

All I can say is that I'm glad I didn't watch the Game Awards, as seeing this trailer live would have really angered me. I don't normally pay attention to the Game Awards, as it's a complete joke, but I try to watch any game trailers afterward, and, for some reason, I didn't learn about this trailer until today.

This is just sickening; they announce this DLC and show off the gameplay for it almost an entire month before the game's release; this just screams, "This is all stuff that was originally going to be in the main game, but we decided to remove it from the base game so that we can charge extra for it, as we know you will pay for it." I remember when Nintendo started doing DLC, and everyone was apprehensive about it, so they declared that DLC would only be post-release bonus content; never something removed before release to be sold later. Nintendo just keeps getting increasingly anti-consumer, and no one is doing anything about it.

I was genuinely looking forward to this game; however, seeing that what we're going to get as the base game is just a butchered edition, I don't feel like purchasing it as I don't want to support these anti-consumer practices.

To be honest, I'm usually the same with this sort of thing. I've come to be a bit more lax on stuff like this where only the first batch of DLC is revealed ahead of time though. It's still anti-consumer, but I think it's far better than what other companies do like Ubisoft, that market their entire season pass before the game even releases (and even leaves tons of DLC on disk). Maybe I'm subconsciously comparing FE to that and cutting it some slack, or maybe it's because I think Engage is doing a lot of interesting and new stuff (which those other companies don't). That's just me though and you're perfectly in the right to want to boycott the game or buy it second-hand (as I've done with games whose companies I don't like a few times in the past).

P.S. I don't know where this was said, but someone claimed the 3H Season Pass was price cut after a while. Unfortunately I just checked and it's still the same price. So much for hoping for a discount, I guess...

[Azz]

41 minutes ago, vanguard333 said:

All I can say is that I'm glad I didn't watch the Game Awards, as seeing this trailer live would have really angered me. I don't normally pay attention to the Game Awards, as it's a complete joke, but I try to watch any game trailers afterward, and, for some reason, I didn't learn about this trailer until today.

This is just sickening; they announce this DLC and show off the gameplay for it almost an entire month before the game's release; this just screams, "This is all stuff that was originally going to be in the main game, but we decided to remove it from the base game so that we can charge extra for it, as we know you will pay for it." I remember when Nintendo started doing DLC, and everyone was apprehensive about it, so they declared that DLC would only be post-release bonus content; never something removed before release to be sold later. Nintendo just keeps getting increasingly anti-consumer, and no one is doing anything about it.

I was genuinely looking forward to this game; however, seeing that what we're going to get as the base game is just a butchered edition, I don't feel like purchasing it as I don't want to support these anti-consumer practices.

Since Fates, DLC has always been announced a month/on the month pre-launch. This is really nothing new for FE or the modern day gaming market.

Fair enough to be angry at it, but it's nothing new and shouldn't be surprising at this point.

[DefyingFates]

2 minutes ago, Azz said:

Since Fates, DLC has always been announced a month/on the month pre-launch. This is really nothing new for FE or the modern day gaming market.

Fair enough to be angry at it, but it's nothing new and shouldn't be surprising at this point.

Yeah, at least Nintendo hasn't started showing trailers of the final DLC packs or anything yet, so we can still give them the benefit of the doubt that it's all still unmade/ in-progress.

[Azz]

1 minute ago, DefyingFates said:

Yeah, at least Nintendo hasn't started showing trailers of the final DLC packs or anything yet, so we can still give them the benefit of the doubt that it's all still unmade/ in-progress.

Yeah pretty much.

But gaming as an industry has been anti-consumer for a long time and will continue to do so because they can get away with it because people will keep buying games. Not saying people shouldn't be mad at it cause it's shitty, however, it shouldn't be surprising when so many game nowadays have day 1 DLC or their whole schitcik is 'look at this cool season pass that you can use to unlock a lot of things for 20 extra quid.'

[Acacia Sgt]

Didn't they stated the game was long ready but release was withheld? It's possible that the first wave DLC got made in the meantime, so both the main game and it were both ready for the final release date, hence coming out with the base game. But well, that's the best case scenario here.

[DefyingFates]

1 minute ago, Azz said:

Yeah pretty much.

But gaming as an industry has been anti-consumer for a long time and will continue to do so because they can get away with it because people will keep buying games. Not saying people shouldn't be mad at it cause it's shitty, however, it shouldn't be surprising when so many game nowadays have day 1 DLC or their whole schitcik is 'look at this cool season pass that you can use to unlock a lot of things for 20 extra quid.'

True. (And I just remembered you were the one who said the 3H Pass got a price cut, sorry about that!)

Now, if the Expansion Pass is worth it - and more importantly if most (ideally all) of it was developed post release - then it's not as bad. If you're not refusing to buy it altogether, I think the best thing to do would be to just wait. Hopefully a low number of early sales will get the message across.

[vanguard333]

5 hours ago, DefyingFates said:

To be honest, I'm usually the same with this sort of thing. I've come to be a bit more lax on stuff like this where only the first batch of DLC is revealed ahead of time though. It's still anti-consumer, but I think it's far better than what other companies do like Ubisoft, that market their entire season pass before the game even releases (and even leaves tons of DLC on disk). Maybe I'm subconsciously comparing FE to that and cutting it some slack, or maybe it's because I think Engage is doing a lot of interesting and new stuff (which those other companies don't). That's just me though and you're perfectly in the right to want to boycott the game or buy it second-hand (as I've done with games whose companies I don't like a few times in the past).

P.S. I don't know where this was said, but someone claimed the 3H Season Pass was price cut after a while. Unfortunately I just checked and it's still the same price. So much for hoping for a discount, I guess...

That's the thing; unlike Ubisoft, Nintendo is still in the business of making good games. But I don't think they should be given slack for that, as that's mainly thanks to the developers, and the developers aren't the ones doing the anti-business practices. I don't blame Koei Tecmo's dev teams for making Hyrule Warriors: Age of Calamity, but I didn't give Nintendo or Koei Tecmo any slack for falsely-advertising it as a prequel to Breath of the Wild.

 

5 hours ago, Azz said:

Since Fates, DLC has always been announced a month/on the month pre-launch. This is really nothing new for FE or the modern day gaming market.

Fair enough to be angry at it, but it's nothing new and shouldn't be surprising at this point.

…I don't think that's correct; I don't remember SoV's DLC or Three Houses' DLC being announced before the release of the game, and, even if they were, I don't remember the DLC releasing within the exact same month as the base games.

 

4 hours ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Didn't they stated the game was long ready but release was withheld? It's possible that the first wave DLC got made in the meantime, so both the main game and it were both ready for the final release date, hence coming out with the base game. But well, that's the best case scenario here.

If that is the case, my question then is: why not put the completed content into the main game? It's clearly already finished.

Edited December 12, 2022 by vanguard333

[Ziegenpeter]

It appears to me that IntSys/Nintendo failed to make people happy with the DLC announcement. Feels like the discourse around this game in general turned even more sour than before. Not that I'm surprised.

It's kinda funny, because it was the opposite with Three Houses. People were very skeptical at first, but then the Thanibomb leaks + the great E3 2019 trailer turned the mood around.

Edited December 11, 2022 by Ziegenpeter

[Acacia Sgt]

2 minutes ago, vanguard333 said:

falsely-advertising it as a prequel to Breath of the Wild.

I have a feeling that was going to be a lose-lose situation anyway.

Reveal the time travel twist before game was out? Complains of spoilers.

Not reveal the time travel twist before game was out? Complains of misleading.

2 minutes ago, vanguard333 said:

If that is the case, my question then is: why not put the completed content into the main game? It's clearly already finished.

Good question. Perhaps it was already in the contract to be sold separately but the changed release date wasn't cause enough to go against contract. Who knows.

[Azz]

10 minutes ago, vanguard333 said:

…I don't think that's correct; I don't remember SoV's DLC or Three Houses' DLC being announced before the release of the game, and, even if they were, I don't remember the DLC releasing within the exact same month as the base games.

Both SoV and TH had day 1 DLC. SoV's was announced at the start of May, meanwhile TH's was announced was announced in the beginning of July.

SoV is kind of in a different state because it was released in Japan before it was released worldwide, however TH is in the pretty much same situation as Engage with its DLC being announced pre-release and being dropped on day 1. Really the biggest diff is how much time before its release Engage's DLC was announced but its become a pattern with FE now with the only game not having DLC announced pre-release being Three Hopes.

Edited December 11, 2022 by Azz

[vanguard333]

15 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

I have a feeling that was going to be a lose-lose situation anyway. Reveal the time travel twist before game was out? Complains of spoilers. Not reveal the time travel twist before game was out? Complains of misleading.

Good question. Perhaps it was already in the contract to be sold separately but the changed release date wasn't cause enough to go against contract. Who knows.

They could've avoided complaints about spoilers by revealing the time travel without revealing everything it would entail; they could've marketed it as an alternate timeline while leaving out stuff like the future-champions being in the game.

Maybe, but that still seems a bit scummy.

12 minutes ago, Azz said:

Both SoV and TH had day 1 DLC. SoV's was announced at the start of May, meanwhile TH's was announced in the beginning of July.

SoV is kind of in a different state because it was released in Japan before it was released worldwide, however TH is in the pretty much same situation as Engage with its DLC being announced pre-release and being dropped on day 1. Really the biggest diff is how much time before its release Engage's DLC was announced but its become a pattern with FE now with the only game not having DLC announced pre-release being Three Hopes.

I think I'm beginning to remember now, at least with Three Houses. I remember Three Houses' first wave of DLC; it was essentially a day-one patch that was free and added stuff like Maddening difficulty. Then came more free stuff like Jeritza being playable and Rhea being available for the tea party minigame to make it easier to obtain her supports in time. If I remember correctly (so correct me if I'm wrong about this), the stuff that actually costed money didn't arrive until Cindered Shadows: several months after Three Houses' release.

[Acacia Sgt]

Just now, vanguard333 said:

They could've avoided complaints about spoilers by revealing the time travel without revealing everything it would entail; they could've marketed it as an alternate timeline while leaving out stuff like the future-champions being in the game.

Maybe, but that still seems a bit scummy.

I suppose. I guess they thought even saying it's an alternate version of events would've given out too much. More so since it's not we even had a full picture of how things went originally.

Still, I don't know. To me, it gives me the same vibes as hearing Obi-Wan saying in A New Hope: "A young Jedi named Darth Vader... He betrayed and murdered your father." and then complaining after watching The Empire Strikes Back that you were lied to. But well, that's may be just me.

Just now, vanguard333 said:

I think I'm beginning to remember now, at least with Three Houses. I remember Three Houses' first wave of DLC; it was essentially a day-one patch that was free and added stuff like Maddening difficulty. Then came more free stuff like Jeritza being playable and Rhea being available for the tea party minigame to make it easier to obtain her supports in time. If I remember correctly (so correct me if I'm wrong about this), the stuff that actually costed money didn't arrive until Cindered Shadows: several months after Three Houses' release.

Maddening was in Wave 2. Wave 1 were the Officer Academy Outfits for Byleth, which was paid content. All waves had paid content, and all but Wave 1 had free content too.

[Azz]

2 minutes ago, vanguard333 said:

I think I'm beginning to remember now, at least with Three Houses. I remember Three Houses' first wave of DLC; it was essentially a day-one patch that was free and added stuff like Maddening difficulty. Then came more free stuff like Jeritza being playable and Rhea being available for the tea party minigame to make it easier to obtain her supports in time. If I remember correctly (so correct me if I'm wrong about this), the stuff that actually costed money didn't arrive until Cindered Shadows: several months after Three Houses' release.

Day 1 DLC for TH was paid and it only contained the academy uniforms for Byleth. Maddening mode and Jeritza didn't come until several months later (September and November precisely) as free updates alongside waves 2 and 3 of the paid DLC. The Rhea update with her being available for tea time and having her lost items being around didn't come until February with the Cindered Shadows DLC. Nothing was free with the first wave of DLC.

Also, hope I don't come off as telling you not to be angry btw. Just want to contextualise that this is a repeated pattern for FE since Fates and that we really shouldn't be surprised at this point imo.

[DefyingFates]

21 minutes ago, Azz said:

Both SoV and TH had day 1 DLC. SoV's was announced at the start of May, meanwhile TH's was announced was announced in the beginning of July.

I'm going to defend 3H here. If I recall correctly, the only Day 1 DLC was a new outfit for the Byleths. And as Vanguard said, 3H also had a ton of free content released alongside the paid stuff. Actually, I think the free updates were announced alongside the Expansion Pass and that hasn't happened this time, so that's concerning.

If Maddening isn't in at launch I imagine that'd be a free update if nothing else, but I hope we get a similar F2P treatment as we did with 3H, if not better. That said, dealing with same turn reinforcements is going to be a pain without a Turnwheel/ Divine Pulse buffer. There's a reason I never bothered with it in FE13 and 14.

[Saint Rubenio]

As far as I'm concerned, same deal as Three Houses's DLC. Not going to be worth the ridiculous price tag until the campaign comes out. Then we'll see.

I'll admit I do find it rather shady that they didn't do the obvious thing and gave growth boosting to Leif because of scrolls, instead putting it on Tiki because... well, then they could lock it behind a paywall. Vandad better have good growths.

17 minutes ago, vanguard333 said:

I think I'm beginning to remember now, at least with Three Houses. I remember Three Houses' first wave of DLC; it was essentially a day-one patch that was free and added stuff like Maddening difficulty. Then came more free stuff like Jeritza being playable and Rhea being available for the tea party minigame to make it easier to obtain her supports in time. If I remember correctly (so correct me if I'm wrong about this), the stuff that actually costed money didn't arrive until Cindered Shadows: several months after Three Houses' release.

Nah, maddening and Jeritza were separate things that were added for free alongside the paid DLC content. The process of Three Houses DLC was actually very similar to this. Pass came out at release date for the modest price of 25 bucks, and the only thing in it initially was the one Byleth outfit with the cap. That's it. One outfit. Then they released some more outfits, grinding battles and suportless Anna. It didn't become debatably worthwhile until Cindered Shadows came out.

If anything, I feel the reason we won't be seeing as much free content here is that the game hasn't been rushed out of the gate, so they won't need to retroactively add the stuff they couldn't implement in time down the line. But that's just speculation.

Edited December 11, 2022 by Saint Rubenio

[Azz]

6 minutes ago, DefyingFates said:

I'm going to defend 3H here. If I recall correctly, the only Day 1 DLC was a new outfit for the Byleths. And as Vanguard said, 3H also had a ton of free content released alongside the paid stuff. Actually, I think the free updates were announced alongside the Expansion Pass and that hasn't happened this time, so that's concerning.

If Maddening isn't in at launch I imagine that'd be a free update if nothing else, but I hope we get a similar F2P treatment as we did with 3H, if not better. That said, dealing with same turn reinforcements is going to be a pain without a Turnwheel/ Divine Pulse buffer. There's a reason I never bothered with it in FE13 and 14.

Oh yeah TH had a lot of free stuff, however sans Cindered Shadows, I would argue most of the paid stuff was pretty shite since it was costumes, stat items, auxiliary battles and Anna a waste of a unit in TH. So tbh, despite the shittiness of pre-release day 1 DLC, I do think Engage is already providing more for its money's worth compared to 3H if we're ignoring free updates (which I'm hoping Engage has plenty of too tho like Saint Rubenio said, considering Engage's mostly complete looking state, I'm somewhat doubtful, outside of maybe a maddening/lunatic mode if there isn't one at launch).

Edited December 11, 2022 by Azz