[FE4] Rate the Unit IX

[Caliban of Sycorax]

Rules (Borrowed from whomever made them first with modifications)

- Ratings to be assumed from when a unit is first available.

- Votes need some explanation regarding their gameplay performance to be counted (unless they fall into the general parameters of the average rating, but reasoning is still strongly encouraged on those even if you just wanna quote people) — incredibly low scores or high scores without proper justification will not be counted. Don't put in some random text thinking it'd count as justification. Put in at least a little thought and give REAL reasoning.

- Numbers for votes, please - not something like "Sigurd/10", etc.

- Personality / Appearance may be taken into account, but only +/- 1 point at the most.

- Votes out of 10, or something proportional to it, please!

- Make votes easily visible, please and thank you!

- Every ranking phase will end on the next day at approximately 10:00 PM (or 22:00), EST.

Units and Ranking

Sigurd: 9.96

Noish: 6.15

Alec: 6.17

Ardan: 1.39

Lex: 8.83

Azel: 4.63

Cuan: 8.41

Ethlin: 9.15

DAY 9: FIN (First Generation)

______

We're splitting Fin by generation.

Anyway. Fin has Prayer, Pursuit, and a horse. That alone should be 10 material. But the problem is that he has a lance. He has WTD in his first two chapters, which really hinders him.

Of course, he gets two very good bonuses from Cuan. A stat boost, and the ever-broken Hero Lance, which he can easily claim until he leaves, and then it can go to Fury.

His parenting skills aren't that good. He doesn't pass any weapons down because no one uses Lances at base. But he passes some amazing skills to his kids. He can also give Nanna, Rana, or Lakche +5 in Speed, Magic, or Skill respectively if he's their father. Of course, getting to that point may be a hard one because Fin's on a horse, and none of those mothers is on a horse. Lachesis is after promotion but the odds of her promoting before Fin leaves aren't easy.

In the First Generation, Fin is still pretty awesome. Getting to promotion is doable, because once Chapter 2 hits, he'll be able to catch up to and possibly even surpass Cuan.

7.5/10

[Thor Odinson]

Fin's start isn't all that great, since axeland with lancelock and he doesn't have Cuan's bases to make up for it. He is, however, mounted with pursuit and fairly balanced stats, so once he's out of axeland, he isn't all that hard to train. Hero Lance does speed up the process, and he can at least claim use it in C2 even if you choose to give it to Fury or Cuan or Sigurd.

He's a pretty good father, skillswise. Most units want Pursuit, and Prayer's always nice to have. Lachesis is usually a good pair option if you don't want the faster Beo pair and would like the kids to have Prayer, though since he leaves it could be a bit harder to pair him---but that's okay, he can bring a Silver Lance to Lenster instead~ not like anybody can even inherit that except Altenna anyway, and Altenna comes late and has GaeBolg so who needs other lances.

Overall, solid. 8/10.

Edit: changed to 8 because I forgot to give him biaspoints. So, biaspoint +1.

Edited February 13, 2012 by Luminescent Blade

[Guy Starwind]

9/10

Even with being a lance guy in axeland he still kicks ass. I always keep him in the front. Going off of personal experience I've never had a bad generation 1 Fin. With a stat boost conversation, hero lance, and a skill ring he is unstoppable. I've been able to dodge 100% attacks with prayer too. He's in 9 of the 12 chapters making him the most usable character in the game. So, whocares if he leaves early. Imo he's a good choice for anyone. Especially Aria, Lachesis, and Aideen.

I wish this was both generations because I would list off more stuff.

I have two favorite characters in this game and he's one of them. So, I guess I could be a little bias towards him.

[Caliban of Sycorax]

I wish this was both generations because I would list off more stuff.

If I did both Fins now most people would go "HURR DE DURR HE'S AVAILABEL THE WHOLE GAME" and not take anything else into account so I'd rather rate his usefulness separately. Hell, Mekkah in his top 30 split the generations into separate games. I think that's a good idea when discussing Fin because he's such an interesting case. Although talking about his parenting is still important.

[Refa]

Fin is amazing enough to be worth a 9/10 what with his Hero Lance, mounted self, pursuit, and being way better than Lex for the first 2 chapters (Prologue, and Chapter 1, I mean) and you all rated him so damn high. Oh, and the Javelin is better than the HandAxe as he can possibly double the slow ass enemies (maybe I'm overestimating him) and the Hero Lance is awesome as always. So I'd say that puts him at a ....

9/10

BUT WAIT

FIN IS AWEMOSE

THAT'S WOTH LIKE...1 POINT

10/10.

[Shin]

He's a step above Alec and Noish, Prayer saves his hide on a regular basis and the Hero Lance greatly improves his offense. His start's pretty shaky, but once we're out of axeland, he's good. Admittedly, he's not easy to pair on an efficient run, and he can't pass down anything - and he doesn't stick around for long.

7/10

[The_Purple_Knight]

7/10his an okay combat unit and he saves leafs butt in chapter 8 and he makes a great dad minus 1 because I dislike him greatly .

Edited February 13, 2012 by The_Purple_Knight

[Renall]

I like Fin, he pokes stuff, and he's an okay father. Having said that, while his pokes are nice and Pursuit and/or the Hero Lance are reliable, he's not altogether special in Gen 1. Also, it's better generally not to pair him, as he doesn't have swords or bows to pass down (which Delmud and Lester would like), and if you don't pair him, he can rock a Silver Lance in Gen 2 instead of accidentally dropping it into a volcano. So on paper he sounds average I guess. However, his Prayer can be used for some pretty boss strategies like tanking the Cross Knights, and it's relatively easy to set him up for a You Guys Can't Hit Shit moment when you need it.

So 7/10 seems fair. He's an above-average unit on a horse with a great weapon who kinda loses out on availability. If we were rating him whole-game that'd be a bigger plus, but we aren't, so sucks for you Gen 1 Fin.

[Refa]

I think it's disingenuous that other units get bonus points for being good parents but Fin doesn't for being in gameplay terms, his own parent. He inherants his own stuff for fucks sake, how goddamn awesome is that? I get that you're not rating him based on his 2nd gen performance, but I feel this aspect ALONE warrants extra points that no other Gen 1 user can lay claim to.

[Renall]

I think it's disingenuous that other units get bonus points for being good parents but Fin doesn't for being in gameplay terms, his own parent. He inherants his own stuff for fucks sake, how goddamn awesome is that? I get that you're not rating him based on his 2nd gen performance, but I feel this aspect ALONE warrants extra points that no other Gen 1 user can lay claim to.

At the same time, not pairing Fin has no investment whatsoever. To not pair Fin, you just use him normally. He doesn't have to talk to any women about their problems, he doesn't have to stand next to some slow-ass healer, he just has to ride along with Sigurd and Cuan killing stuff. And then he ceases to exist and re-exists later with all his stuff just as it was when he left.

I suppose you can argue it's great to have a no-work Second Gen unit who "inherits" good lances, but considering you don't do anything to get that, I don't get what a big deal it would be to scoring him. And since Gen 1 Fin is basically the only topic for discussion here, his fathering options could simply be considered as "can father x y and z to pass on his good skills, OR can 'father' himself to keep a Silver Lance for Chapter 7." Those are decent options, but they're not the best genes in the game either.

[Refa]

At the same time, not pairing Fin has no investment whatsoever.

That's even better. Don't you get that your argument is as silly as me saying "Marcus in FE7 has no investment whatsoever".

Fin inherents everything Fin needs to inherent, and if you're, he's the best user of the Hero Lance.

Edited February 13, 2012 by Refa

[Renall]

That's even better. Don't you get that your argument is as silly as me saying "Marcus in FE7 has no investment whatsoever".

Fin inherents everything Fin needs to inherent, and if you're, he's the best user of the Hero Lance.

It's a silly argument if the Fins are rated together. They're not. Saying "viewed in the context of Gen 1, Fin should be getting massive props for being able to keep the stuff that he's already got when he becomes a character we're not even rating right now!" is pretty pointless.

The fact that Fin returns with everything he had unless paired in Gen 1 is no more shocking and amazing than Ephraim still having Reginlief after 5x. Wow, he still has the items he had before? Top tier! If you give Gen 1 Fin a weapon and don't pair him, Gen 2 Fin will still have it. ...And?

[Duff Ostrich]

He has a better claim to the hero lance than most (by starting with it), but he's thoroughly unimpressive without it and he's gone way too soon. Also, while having wtd is less severe in this game than in several others (like Thracia or Sword of Seals), it still sucks and he has a lot of it for two of his four chapters. If I gave Cuan an 8, then what can I give Fin?

6.0

Incidentally this is what I would have given both Alec and Noishe had I voted on them.

Edited February 13, 2012 by Duff Ostrich

[Shin]

He has a better claim to the hero lance than most (by starting with it), but he's thoroughly unimpressive without it and he's gone way too soon. Also, while having wtd is less severe in this game than in several others (like Thracia or Sword of Seals), it still sucks and he has a lot of it for two of his four chapters. If I gave Cuan an 8, then what can I give Fin?

6.0

Incidentally this is what I would have given both Alec and Noishe had I voted on them.

FE5's weapon triangle really doesn't matter at all, 5% hit is less than FE4's 20%.

[Ϲharlie]

Genealogy actually has one of the strongest triangles in the game. The 20 hit bonus/penalty is four times higher than Thracia's 5 hit and double FE6's 10 hit (though, FE6 also affects might).

[Duff Ostrich]

I stand corrected. That's what I get for commenting on a game I haven't played in two years.

I've actually been operating under the assumption of FE4 having a weak triangle for so long that I can't believe I didn't notice it sooner.

Edited February 13, 2012 by Duff Ostrich

[Non-Existent Member]

Another mounted Lance-user who is unpromoted at a low level. Just like Cuan, he gets a WTD for two chapters. He does have good skills Prayer and Pursuit. and He gets some stat boost and a Hero Lance in Chapter 1 and 2, respectively.

8.5/10

[Integrity]

Eh. He's good in G2 (because he shows up mecha) but in G1 he's not particularly GODMAZING, especially with the whole leaving-early business.

Growth unit + leaves your team = :(

He does come back, but I'm TOTALLY NOT RANKING THAT AT ALL because rules lol

I think a 7.5/10 is fair because +1 bias because len*.

[General Horace]

FIIIIIIIINNNNNNNN

Honestly, his start isn't that solid, but in chapter 1 he can yoink Cuan's steel lance, and ORKO bandits, something that a lot of units have issues doing. He's still at WTD though, and might have to rely on prayer if you want him to have an enemy phase.

I'll give him a 7 + 1 = 8/10

[Balcerzak]

I would much rather have 2 Finns (gen 1) than 2 Lex's. Prayer is absolutely invaluable on enemy phase, especially combined with the fact that he should have no problem with ORKOs (Steel Lance in Ch1, Hero Lance in Ch2, your choices in Ch3). This makes him a machine. Sure, lances are heavy, and he can't double everything naturally, but he doubles way more than Lex. Not to mention, he's a good storage for transferring lances between generations, and should take every lance that Fee isn't taking. (In all likelyhood this probably is limited to 1 Javelin, 1 Steel Lance, and 1 Silver Lance, but still.) Not to mention, if you can be bothered to try to pair him, he has very nice skills to pass down.

Finn should not need help in the Arena, but even if he did, he comes with the biggest I Win button of them all.

Conclusion: Rocking field work, Amazing Arena skills, PGP (pretty good parentage). And Lenster.

9/10

[Integrity]

Finn should not need help in the Arena, but even if he did, he comes with the biggest I Win button of them all.

...Wrath?

yes i know what you meant

[MacLovin]

Fin's start isn't all that great, since axeland with lancelock and he doesn't have Cuan's bases to make up for it. He is, however, mounted with pursuit and fairly balanced stats, so once he's out of axeland, he isn't all that hard to train. Hero Lance does speed up the process, and he can at least claim use it in C2 even if you choose to give it to Fury or Cuan or Sigurd.

He's a pretty good father, skillswise. Most units want Pursuit, and Prayer's always nice to have. Lachesis is usually a good pair option if you don't want the faster Beo pair and would like the kids to have Prayer, though since he leaves it could be a bit harder to pair him---but that's okay, he can bring a Silver Lance to Lenster instead~ not like anybody can even inherit that except Altenna anyway, and Altenna comes late and has GaeBolg so who needs other lances.

Overall, solid. 8/10.

Edit: changed to 8 because I forgot to give him biaspoints. So, biaspoint +1.

Just what I wanted to say.

[Caliban of Sycorax]

And another round's over. Next round up shortly!

7.88 for Fin in the First Generation... I wonder what his Second Generation score will be.

Edited February 14, 2012 by Octavian