Rate the Unit: Day LI

[Shin]

Rules (Borrowed from whomever made them first with modifications)

- Ratings to be assumed from when a unit is first available.

- Votes need some explanation regarding their gameplay performance to be counted - incredibly low scores or high scores without proper justification will not be counted. Don't put in some random text thinking it'd count as justification. Put in at least a little thought and give REAL reasoning.

- Numbers for votes, please - not something like "Turban/10", etc.

- Personality / Appearance may be taken into account, but only +/- 1 point at the most.

- Votes out of 10, or something proportional to it, please!

- Make votes easily visible, please and thank you!

- Every ranking phase will end on the next day at approximately 19:00 BST! Take that, Americans!

-Second Generation Note: Assume that Substitutes are done on a Subs-only run. Any "not ________" will not be accepted.

Units and Ranking (Least to Greatest):

First Generation

Diadora: 1.19

Ardan: 1.39

Tiltyu: 2.00

Briggid: 3.71

Claude: 4.42

Azel: 4.63

Jamka: 5.25

Midir: 5.47

Dew: 5.68

Holyn: 5.90

Lachesis: 6.13

Noish: 6.15

Alec: 6.17

Beowulf: 6.40

Aideen: 6.57

Ayra: 6.79

Levin: 7.87

Fin (First Generation): 7.88

Fury: 8.25

Cuan: 8.41

Lex: 8.83

Ethlin: 9.15

Sylvia: 9.50

Sigurd: 9.96

Second Generation

Roddlevan: 3.33

Radney: 3.44

Daisy: 3.65

Johalva: 3.93

Patty: 4.31

Amid: 4.85

Dimna: 4.89

Mana: 4.98

Tristan: 5.00

Johan: 5.08

Skasaher: 6.00

Janne: 6.29

Lakche: 6.35

Femina: 6.50

Lester: 6.59

Julia: 7.12

Fin: 7.82

Nanna: 8.00

Lana: 8.24

Delmud: 8.45

Shanan: 8.56

Oifaye: 8.58

Arthur: 8.67

Fee: 8.86

Leaf: 9.45

Celice: 9.54

How on Earth did Janne outrank Tristan!

Tinny

Or Teeny/Tony/Whatever. She comes a little underleveled but with a nice father like Lex, Levin or Azel, she's not too bad. High magic and staves upon promotion make her a nice staff-bot. She's a possible Rescue user, if you felt like crippling Arthur. Her main problem is that she has no mount and faces WTD against the dark mages. Still, not too shabby.

6.5/10

[Zak Something]

Hmm... What can I say that won't get me immediately shot...

*clears throat*

I- *shot in the face 200 times*

But yeah, 7/10. Lack of a pony hurts, but great versatility (any magic type (Although you'd really only give her wind and thunder) staffbot, even swords if you wanted to for some reason), great evade (around that of Speed Glitch Sety), and a great skill make up for it.

Also, shouldn't today be Aless, since he's recruited before Teeny/Linda?

[Thor Odinson]

I honestly like Lex over Levin for her father since she's just so underleveled that auto Elite is damn nice and AmbushWrath allows her to level quickly through the arenas. I mean, chances are, Levin is more likely to be her father since Arthur is just so hax and Levin is still a pretty great father for her (let's her have access to Elwind, too, which is a pretty great tome), but considering her alone I prefer Lex. Azel's alright I guess, pursuit and potential stats are nice, but I find Azel!Tinny not as easily trained as Lex or Levin Tinnies due to the lack of access to EliteAmbushWrath or Elwind.

But anyway. She shouldn't have a terribly hard time promoting with the right father, and she can get B staves on promotion. That's pretty good. That's like, Libro and Recover, making her not totally useless even with the mount domination. And she can shell out quite a bit of damage if you don't want to play on turbo. I don't feel like she deserves over a 5 since she joins midway through the game and requires several chapters (unless you /really/ baby her) to do something that Lana can do since Chapter 6, but she's not utterly crap.

4.5/10

[Shin]

Also, shouldn't today be Aless, since he's recruited before Teeny/Linda?

Uh... That's not important!

[Biabarr]

YOU SKIPPED ALESS

Tinny

Well she comes underlevelled, but at least she isn't half as underlevelled as her mother is. Her main problem is the lack of a horse. She gets staffs upon promotion which is always nice. All magic types is pretty cool too. Pity she has a low move.

6/10

[BBM]

You skipped Aless, Leen, and Laylea.

[Guy Starwind]

Normally I don't care if people have horses but her lack of movement can get annoying. I would say have Lex or Azel be the father. Um, she can use staffs which is nice. Yeah I'm not sure what else. I like hooking her up with Celice.

7/10

[BrightBow]

Does are some scary high votes. I mean her mother got a 2 average and Tinny gets 7+ ?

I'm kinda afraid to vote since I would have voted even Titlyu quite a bit above her. Lex kills her magic growth, whose base at the start is lower then her mothers and unlike her mother she can't substitute for it by using Thoron.

She dies easily and can't canto away from danger. Lack of Thoron means, she isn't a good glass cannon either. Training her as always been a self-serving purpose for me.

What does she accomplish that makes her deserve an above average score?

Edited April 30, 2012 by BrightBow

[Integrity]

Does are some scary high votes. I mean her mother got a 2 average and Tinny gets 7+ ?

I'm kinda afraid to vote since I would have voted even Titlyu quite a bit above her. Lex kills her magic growth, whose base at the start is lower then her mothers and unlike her mother she can't substitute for it by using Thoron.

Several things wrong with this:

1: Tiltyu's MAG growth is 20%. Even Lex(/noish/fin/whatever)!Tinny's MAG growth is 22%. Tinny can get pushed to 55% (over twice tiltyu's) with Azel. Tiltyu's base is 10, Tinny's is ~8 at its worst.

2: Tiltyu's skillset: Wrath. Continue, later, if you promote her. Tinny's skillset: Wrath (/continue later) putting her automatically = Tiltyu. Then, Tinny's skillset can include any of (on top of tiltyu's base): Continue/Critical, Ambush/Elite, Pursuit, etc. etc. etc.

3: Tiltyu's availability consists of some fighting in one chapter, then two chapters (EDIT: two chapters, it must be said, of being glued to some guy to get on his dick /EDIT) and the game is over. Tinny's consists of some fighting in one chapter, then four chapters and the game is over. That's roughly twice.

So, in short, you're wrong if you think Tiltyu > Tinny.

NOW THAT SAID Tinny isn't actually particularly great. She's an okay fighter, never gonna be an amazing frontliner, can easily clear most arenas, promotes to B Staves (which is a big big thing to me), and is foot-locked. I think the Staves thing helps her case a lot, personally.

6/10 and I still think Jeanne's score was too low.

EDIT2: dropped to a 6 in preparation for linda shenanigans

Edited April 30, 2012 by Integrity

[frat_tastic]

It's probably too late to suggest this now, but maybe we could split the list into a 2nd Generation Kids list and a 2nd Generation Subs list. I feel people aren't really considering the subs-only playthrough rule when they rate most sub characters.

Also 3/10 for Tinny. It's not that she's particualrly horrible or anything, its just that everyone else is so much better than she is. Most people who join before her are just flat out better, and I really think its the same for people after her also. Staves is nice though.

[Thor Odinson]

wrt durability

There is one thing I like to do and it's totally not efficient but who the fuck cares

Promote Lex!Tinny in chapter 9. Get her to half health on something. Equip Thoron. Solo at least half of those brave weapon fucks Hannibal brings.

AmbushWrath is pretty funny sometimes.

Not factoring this in at all (I mean hell park Holsety anyone there and they'll do it better) but hey, she can do some pretty cool things at times. Not utterly unsalvagable at any rate even combat-wise.

Edited April 30, 2012 by Luminescent Blade

[BBM]

I think the problem was that people rated Nanna too low, and then had to rate Janne at least two points below that.

[BrightBow]

So, in short, you're wrong if you think Tiltyu > Tinny.

NOW THAT SAID Tinny isn't actually particularly great. She's an okay fighter, never gonna be an amazing frontliner, can easily clear most arenas, promotes to B Staves (which is a big big thing to me), and is foot-locked. I think the Staves thing helps her case a lot, personally.

6.5/10 and I still think Jeanne's score was too low.

Tinny is better then her okay. Personally she never grew past fifth wheel for me, which comes down to something below average.

But you just gave Tinny a score that's 5 points higher then what you gave Titlyu. That's an awful lot. She definitely isn't that much better. Particular in a game were the units closets to 10 points are really overpowered.

Edited April 30, 2012 by BrightBow

[bottlegnomes]

Tinny is better then her okay. Personally she never grew past fifth wheel for me, which comes down to something below average.

Never did get that saying. Having another wheel just makes things more stable, which is hardly bad.

Anyway

Well she comes underlevelled, but at least she isn't half as underlevelled as her mother is. Her main problem is the lack of a horse. She gets staffs upon promotion which is always nice. All magic types is pretty cool too. Pity she has a low move.

6/10

That's including a bias point for being fucking adorable, not that it matters.

[BrightBow]

Judging by those high rating she comes closer in terms of performance to Shanan then to her mothers.

She still dies in two hits and this is a game where there are a lot of enemies in a closed space which is a problem when you need to get close to attack. And she can't canto away. She isn't that good at killing at player phase to begin with.

I don't see how she can be anything but below average. Personally I think it's way to risky to even have her anywhere near the front line. Unless the whole enemy army gets wiped out in one round in which case her contribution would be minimal in comparison anyway.

Edited April 30, 2012 by BrightBow

[frat_tastic]

I think the problem was that people rated Nanna too low, and then had to rate Janne at least two points below that.

That's kind of the issue I have though, Janne shouldn't be getting an automatic 2 points or so lower than Nanna just because she isn't as good. For one, the two will never exist in the same playthrough. Janne also isn't competing against other children, she's competing against all the subs. All things considered she should probably be getting around the same score as Nanna. Yeah she might not be quite as useful, but when you look at who is on the same team as Janne (subs) her performance seems about on par to me as Nanna's.

[slootwindow]

Only the Azel pairing is fast enough not to cost turns, but you're sacrificing the Azel/Aideen pairing Rescue staff in that case - so, basically, she costs turns. She's a mediocre footie you can easily do without, but she can counterkill wyverns if you want to bother and she'll promote and start using B-staffs around chapter 9. Her recruitment is a minor pain but it doesn't actually cost any more turns done properly. She can use status staffs pretty well and she's self-funding to buy them if you see a reason for them.

2/10

[Integrity]

She's a mediocre footie you can easily do without, but she can counterkill wyverns if you want to bother and she'll promote and start using B-staffs around chapter 9. Her recruitment is a minor pain but it doesn't actually cost any more turns done properly. She can use status staffs pretty well and she's self-funding to buy them if you see a reason for them.

2/10

I'm sorry, but how is this a 2? You didn't say a thing about her that was less than mediocre.

[slootwindow]

I'm sorry, but how is this a 2? You didn't say a thing about her that was less than mediocre.

I ranked borderline worthless but free characters somewhere around 4-5; costing turns you can never make up is an automatic -3 or more depending on how bad it is.

[Renall]

She's not a bad unit for a kid, but she desperately wants Levin or Lex for her father. Levin gives her some oomph, Lex gives her Elite which is badly-needed given her starting position and the Ambush/Wrath combo as icing on the cake. She wants a little help regardless, but at least there's Thoron kicking around and depending on father she may also have access to Elwind (and if Levin's daughter, Tornado later as a no-Holsety consolation prize).

The main problem is that she comes in at a poor time (arguably one that only Elite can make up for) and doesn't promote to anything more than a foot unit. A foot unit with good caps and the ability to use the Berserk Sword bug and staves, to be sure, but still just a foot unit.

6/10 with a +1 bias bump for being able to make Julius kick Ishtar's ass, because that's worth an entire point all by itself.

[Mekkah]

She's not mounted and therefore terrible. It's really that simple.

3/10

[Shin]

Game over! Adding up now!