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Touhou NOCfia - Game Over


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Wait kirsche was scanned non-mafia? Where was this posted? Why did I miss this?

Ok I still don't trust Xinny's claim because ninja doc sounds pretty pointless. Ninja doesn't make his role seem THAT scummy and if you're gonna say mafia don't have any voyeur/follower kind of role I'm really gonna doubt that. And I don't think I've seen him this phase? >_>

I guess I want one of Cam/Shadoweh lynched today, maybe Manix. Shadoweh's... line of thought wrt finding Boron scummy is weird as fuck

I'm pretty sure SSG posted it earlier today. There was an argument about what it meant. I don't understand the comment about Xinny's claim, you say the ninja part is pointless, then say it's likely Mafia have a voyeur/follower which would make it useful for the doc to be untrackable? Clarify what you meant. And my reasoning rolewise seems similar to what you said about Xinny. Regardless, weird isn't scummy. Unless you think I'm being weird in a way that people obviously dislike because I want to have a contest where I get as many votes as possible.

I'm gonna go to sleep, this argument is starting to make me angry and if you already don't like my sarcasm I imagine you'd like me swearing in all caps even less. (I haven't looked at the rules of your board but I assume they say don't do that.)

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Well basically if Xinny is ninja doc then mafia should have a voyeur/follower kinda role. But it just seems more unlikely that he's ninja doc cuz that seemed like an easy claim since he claimed late and because ninja doc would seem pointless if mafia didn't have voyeur/tracker/follower/watcher to figure xinny out.

The reason I disagree with your scumread of Sangyul is you still aren't seeing the connection: The godfather info back in D1 was that a portion of the godfather's role would be their true role and the rest would be fake- implying they'd be a role godfather. Why on earth would scum have rolecop AND rolegodfather?

Are you going to tell me then that the rolegodfather was just for that one-shot cop that you have?

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Your insomniac+numbers claim is just shit and I don't really agree with your votes this phase and think they're kinda scummy. Like, you've been all over the place: Proto;Shadoweh;Me;Shinori? Uh, what?

So I'm being voted on because of rolespec and because Prims made a mistake leading me to believe at least one of you or Cam could be scum (which is still possible but not 100% true) and I'd rather go for a 50/50 vote than a potential vig? 'Jumpy' My arse there's just new info coming out, I believe every time this info gets outed BBM also switches votes why is he so clear? Because he's tunnelling on Cam? Why is BBM's role better than mine? He's just an announcer who gives other people announcements.

Shinori didn't even explain why he voted me at the start of the phase which was also a question I and Boron raised. He didn't even respond to SSG clearing me and just shrugged it off. Manix decided to sheep before even rereading which just takes the piss.

Oh man you definitely missed me being cleared by SSG when I and others have mentioned it many times.

By the way this my last and only post of this day because I'm actually being sociable and seeing people. I'm really not happy with Shinori's actions but I'm also willing to lynch BBM as then nothing is lost and I really don't like his recent posts. He seems too focused on Cam and I disagree with that, Boron has already cleared his role and I doubt there'd be both a scum and a mafioso with anti-role cop protection. To me one of the ninja claimants is probably scum as that seems like the sort of thing the godfather would hide. Like, Marth would be ninja godfather who only outs that he's a ninja upon inspection. With that in mind.

##Unvote

##Vote: Bluedoom

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re ninjadoc: yeah here's the thing it's a case of there's a flipped tracker which implies that it was likely it was included to be negative utility. we don't know if the mafia have a track/watch/what have you, so it's kinda moot to be trying to push on that point.

also when i made my vote on kirsche i did forget he was nonmafia to the cop, but considering we have been told there's a harmful third (from cam, assuming it's true, and there's always the unexplained kills anyway), it's still possible he's antitown. consider this an acknowledgement of the factors in play rn

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and cut by a few posts

kirsche, understand that my vote is gutbased at this point because yes i haven't reread, but i do have vague memories.

for example, when you made your proto case earlier (whichever day it was, pretty sure it was ED5), i got a bad vibe from it. i'll go dig it up and point out stuff after this post.

and seeing as how it's gutbased, it is possible that it will change. also see post before about you being "cleared" by the cop, considering they got results in the form mafia/not mafia and there's a harmful third.

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now given proto was dedified earlier today the case was proven wrong, but here's a few things that stood out. (also I was asleep when the case was presented, and proto was deded so i couldn't comment yesterday as it happened (but blame my laziness for not addressing it until now))

I feel that now PB is dead and their spokesperson is gone Proto feels like he needs to take the lead to get a victory.

this felt like it was trying to fit "facts" into the case (sharpshooter fallacy and such)

Also you almost seem like you're trying to divert attention away from a possible cult by saying that "this isn't the time to be worrying about a cult" which is rubbish: this is the PERFECT time to be worrying about a cult.

I can actually understand the sentiment here; i probably would have said something similar.

I wouldn't be surprised if PB and Scorri's result were hidden because of being in a cult too.

did seem a little baseless, considering there is a claimed massjan card (which is a problem in it's own right that i still haven't addressed yet)

so. i'll get the rest of a reread done soon enough.

now about the massjan; the only possible way that marth massjanned is if and only if one of two things: 1) he lied about being able to only use one at a time, or 2) marth and cam are both scum and are covering for each other.

2) is unlikely, given the circumstances around it, although as such isn't quite conclusive as of yet. if neither are the case, then something else is going on behind the scenes which is a bit concerning.

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To me one of the ninja claimants is probably scum as that seems like the sort of thing the godfather would hide. Like, Marth would be ninja godfather who only outs that he's a ninja upon inspection. With that in mind.

this bothers me a bit; "so i'm being suspected because of rolespec" and then votes marth because of (what i can see) rolespec
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kirsche i've done my reread of you, and i got quite a few things to note/questions

[spoiler=kirsche]

From that reread I am most suspicious of Scorri, Fera, SB and Objection, and wary of Blitz, Bizz and Rein.

Okay, this is fine at all. I'm aware that you were suspicious of Fera until Paperboard said "they" were town, which was acknowledged

-I trust PB so I'll trust his word on Fera and Proto.

here, and then also there's this interest little tidbit

Want an actual reason to not vote him other than "Paper says not to".

in relation to voting Fera, so the opinion has been kinda flip flop. moving on to Shadoweh,

I'm not going after Shadoweh, I'm going after Proto; however part of the reason I find you gusy suspicious is because the majority of your members haven't been pro-town for the majority of the game. If I can trust Shadoweh to be town then I know that Proto is town because I don't believe that godfather and scan-preventing neighbourizer work well together.

i got this, which is followed in his next post by

Why is Vig so pro town? So pro town that it made Fera look "less scummy than Proto" in PB's eyes?

Pedit2: Ok well that settles that question then.

*snip*

##Vote: Shadoweh

which i don't quite understand. considering that kirsche then goes and does this during D5

Shadoweh's responses are ok and if she ever puts herself under suspicion again we can lynch.

so i'm really really confused right now as to what actual stance he's taking on this playerslot because it keeps changing :/ So I have a question for you right now kirsche, what do you actually think of Shadoweh right now?

Also re proto, regarding the post that I dissected earlier (here), i'd also like to note that ever since

-I trust PB so I'll trust his word on Fera and Proto.

this post, i'm fairly sure kirsche didn't push on proto much at all (reading is getting hard right now, so i could be wrong) until the D5 case, which i find quite weird.

so now i want to go address his stance on Cam

Also Cam and Shinori aren't responding to anything directed at them and I don't like that.

*snip*

I wouldn't object fiercely to a Cam lynch though.

and then in his next post, 2 and a half hours later,

Tbh I'm leaning Cam town simply because I can't think of another explanation for the mass jan.

next, a single post that doesn't make a lot of sense

-Elie is a little suspect but I don't want to lynch before he's caught up. If he hasn't caught up by D5 though I'll be annoyed with him.

*snip*

##Vote: Elieson sorry :/

i'm just wondering how you say the first part, then decide to contribute to his lynch, and not give him said chance to catch up? it looks bad, in any case.

okay analysis done (for the most part, the rest is just too much), and everything is a big mush right now i need sleep

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still awake oh boy

and i just remembered something else i wanted to bring up, but forgot

hey so remember this? at the time, I thought it pertinent to force kirsche to react and take a definent stance on what he was saying, instead of hiding behind statements that can be tampered to fit future content. that's about where i was starting to get a bad vibe off him, but decided not to pursue it further as it would probably be grasping a bit at that time.

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Day 5.35 Votals

Bluedoom (1): kirsche

Essbee (1): Strege

Shadoweh (2): Boron, Marth

kirsche (3): Shinori, Manix

CT075 (2): Shadoweh, BBM

Not voting (4): CT075, SSG, Xin'dy, Essbee


The day ends in 13 hours, 20 minutes. With 12 alive, hammer is required and it takes 7 to lynch.


Lemme know if I mussed something up.

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Strege, kirsche somehow has 3 votes on him although only two people are listed as voting him.

Also, I have to leave and I'm not going to be here for most of the day, but I will be back a few hours before phase end so I'll say stuff when I get home.

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Yeah, should be 5.4 instead of 5.35.

I don't really understand Kirsche's defence of Cam, nor do I understand Kirsche's argument against me. We've just received proof of a harmful third. How does that make a mafia BPV less likely? And the rolename doesn't describe his role fully. "BPV" could mean like infinite BPV or something, or could have something else attached to it that the rolename doesn't hint at. Our Tracker was also our Watcher, if you've forgotten Baldrick's role.

As for me being scummy because my role is even weaker than your's, so? Someone has to have the weakest role. And if SSG and I had ever been neighbourized together, before she got outed, I could have used my Announcer to out clears. It's not completely useless. And my spellcards are better, so it balances out anyways. If you've got an issue with my posts, say which ones. Don't just say "oh some of his posts this phase are bad". As for me doing some of the same stuff as you, like moving my vote around a lot, I have, but not quite to the same degree. Yeah, I voted and unvoted Marth because of Cam, but then I went back to my original vote, whereas you seemingly dropped that for no reason.

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Strege, kirsche somehow has 3 votes on him although only two people are listed as voting him.

Oops, should just say 2 and the people who are voting him are correct.

Yeah, should be 5.4 instead of 5.35.

Tough crowd. Gotta watch your footing though eh, or else you're likely to slip. Damnit Prims!

I am obfuscating because of reasons, don't no one worry.

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So since strege is is one third party and apparently someone was told there is at least one harmful third party and Apparently kirsche was inspected to be "Not mafia" I'd be willing to bet he is the third. Or he could be godfather. I dunno. I need to finish getting caught up but we need to pick who we are gonna lynch today.

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Well, we've got less than 12 hours to consolidate. Out of the three wagons at 2 votes, my preference would be Cam > Kirsche > Shadoweh.

I have two extra votes and SB should also be here for deadline, so I don't think that we should have trouble getting to a lynch if the people not voting for one of the three aforementioned people start doing so.

Also, Cam still hasn't put down a vote, despite a few arguments against Shadoweh and Kirsche. I'd like him to take a definitive stance. What also sort of irks me is that both the people he's argued against are the counterwagons to him, so it gives me the hunch that he's just trying to push them to make his lynch less likely, rather than actually scumhunting.

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I would rather lynch Bluedoom then kirsche. I still think it's really weird that anyone wants to lynch someone who has a not-guilty on them. What was the point of asking the alignment cop to peek at kirsche if people were going to lynch that direction anyway? I know, godfather + third party etc, but usually you lynch people with a better chance of being mafia before eliminating those.

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I personally feel that I'd rather lynch Marth over cam. But I can go with either one I guess.

Idk though. I'm all over the place. I think the scum is amongst SB/boron/Xindy/marth/Cam.

Kirsche is also most likely to be a harmful third. Either that or Strege is harmful third and his other claim is some sort of safe third party claim.

##Unvote:

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Responding to prod

Life is terrible

Okay, let's see what we've got.

[spoiler=argh]

If cam did have his card traded with, who's the one that got it? (unless I missed it somewhere)

Ok I still don't trust Xinny's claim because ninja doc sounds pretty pointless. Ninja doesn't make his role seem THAT scummy and if you're gonna say mafia don't have any voyeur/follower kind of role I'm really gonna doubt that. And I don't think I've seen him this phase? >_>

It does, and I know especially so because I made sure I wouldn't get it out in-thread anytime too soon. Ninja makes me unprovable unless I'm scanned.

I suppose being immune to a supposed mafia voyeur/follower lets me live longer if I go unnoticed, but doesn't change how I can't prove my role myself. The closest thing to that would be using my spellcard, I guess.

People who haven't voted should.

Frankly I think xin'dy is also likely to be scum but my reads are shit.

Hello that's the first time you ever had a semblance of a read on me, mind elaborating?

Idk to be fair your play hasn't bene very memorable for me either. Same with Xin'dy. I keep forgetting Xin'dy is in the game at all.

You keep forgetting me so much you gave me two potions at early night phases and even a purple potion so I could use my spellcard on BBM. And I don't think you've made an effort to read me at all in phases I were actually vocal.

Are you just taking advantage of my inactivity...?

Honestly, if it's that thing about attacking inactives all over again, I'd rather see you lynched, because all I see is you trying to defocus attention from other reads and main wagons for wishy-washy stuff. Not to mention stuff like the potion you gave proto in such a deceitful manner. I'm starting to find you very scummy.

---

I honestly don't see what's so objectionable about cam...?

I get that he wasn't contributing that much before but I don't see what's actually so wrong with what he posts, also I think he has a point

By the way this my last and only post of this day because I'm actually being sociable and seeing people. I'm really not happy with Shinori's actions but I'm also willing to lynch BBM as then nothing is lost and I really don't like his recent posts. He seems too focused on Cam and I disagree with that, Boron has already cleared his role and I doubt there'd be both a scum and a mafioso with anti-role cop protection. To me one of the ninja claimants is probably scum as that seems like the sort of thing the godfather would hide. Like, Marth would be ninja godfather who only outs that he's a ninja upon inspection. With that in mind.

The last part is a bit hard on the rolespec side just to finish a vote

Also, what do you mean in the last few sentences? What exactly is the godfather hiding and showing?

What does the info giver telling BBM about a godfather have to do with Boron being town? I don't see the connection.

Apparently, the info was more specifically about a role-godfather, which gives her role more sense.

also

Why are you suspecting he's a bp third party <_< Why can't he just be scum? Maybe they're both scum! LYNCH BP CLAIMS THEY ARE BAD FOR YOUR HEALTH.

I am aware you're not giving this line of reasoning as much an emphasis as of late, but why the obsession with BPVs? I'm afraid I don't follow.

Wait, with the protection we know, there might indeed be a problem.

I'll be reading the cam wagon soon, I suppose.

[spoiler=part two]

hah, got you

*mumbles about uni*

kill me tonight whoever you douches are

I can't ;.;

##Vote:Shinori

Elaborate or elaborate. I can't fly with you putting weak reads relegated to one's activity as the core of your scumreads. I see quite a bit of pushes for boron too, but your vote is ultimately on kirsche, whom you think is 'just scum'.

I won't be here for deadline at all, but I'll try to be here for about 3 hours prior.

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