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Touhou NOCfia - Game Over


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I think Shinori could be scum but he's currently less of a priority than SB and maybe even Blitz, since I'm mostly bothered by them having reads that they never bring up again. Blitz also feels off compared to his usual play, which bothers me.

@Manix since I think I forgot to respond to this: Basically when I went over Blitz's iso he wasn't really doing his usual thing of trying to get people to react to things other than Rapier who was untargetable in every way, making it a pretty pointless endeavor. I originally thought this was okay since Blitz does that but he didn't... really do much else after that. He rolespecced a bit and pushed some inactives but I don't feel like he was getting anything done, and the whole thing just feels sort of... fake. It's like he's just shuffling his vote around to make it look like he's doing stuff.

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Hello again.

Will Reread everything on Kay later, got a neutral opinion of her from D1 so I'll probably just reread D2, which shouldn't take long. Just wanted to throw a post out there beforehand. Happy with the Blitz wagon though.

Also I feel like someone might have pointed this out, but not really a fan of how both Kevin and Proto agreed with Paperblade and said that he was townie, but neither really said much on SB themselves. I guess Kevin's "I agree with Paperblade on every point" could qualify but ehhh.

I also noted myself about SB's over the top push on Proto before I even reached Paper's ISO on him. I'm sorry for not spelling out exactly what I find wrong with him when PB put it so much better.

Kevin also mentioned in his overnight post that he was most suspicious of Scorri, SB, Fera, and Objection, and wary of Proto, Blitz, and Rein. So he finds the first group of people worse than the second group, yet his first D2 post involves a vote for someone from the second group? His reasoning here is that Proto's one D2 post was so bad that it caused him to start sympathizing with SB, which is a pretty iffy reasoning for a 180. Also, he doesn't actually say anything about that post by Proto, just that it's super annoying.

It's super annoying because, as usual, he says very little in it. Also note that I said to swap those two groups around with the exception of Fera who stays in the first group because when I thought about it some more I actually disagree a lot more with the latter group than the first group. I would've kept SB in the first group but not liking Proto's content is semi-reasonable although I dislike the way it was implemented. I didn't make any kind of 180 at all, I'm not saying any of my worries about any of them have been cleared, just that I've rethought on which are the most worrying.

I'm ok with a Blitz lynch but I'd rather get rid of Fera or Proto atm.

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All right, first off I apologize for the low activity. Next week is graduation and I'm more busy and distracted than I expected. I was originally going to switch my vote off Zeem to Objection in post 309, but had to leave before I finished so I posted it. I was going to post as soon as I got back, but by then the day had ended and Baldrick had gotten himself modkilled.

I have to go eat but I'll be back in a few hours with my opinions and scum reads.

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Speaking of graduation, idr if I mentioned this but I might not be around much tomorrow because my cousin graduated yesterday and is holding a BBQ that I am obligated to go to. I should still be around by deadline but I won't be super active

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BT, one thing though. I don't understand why you choose to vote Blitz over Proto if you find Proto worse. Four votes is surely enough pressure for Blitz that a fifth one isn't really necessary if he's not your top read

I'm a subscriber of the "what the fuck, just put your vote down" method. Stronger wagon -> harder for others to avoid it & things move along faster, not including how the response may be more telling which is true only some of the time. Plus if you endorse pressure splitting you're giving scum a method to mask their true intentions. Put thy vote where it damn should be unless the game says otherwise.

Also if Xinny has posts but they're forgettable, isn't that worse than people who just don't have posts?

You vig people with as little content as possible because even when a replacement shows up you will always have less things to work with. Xinny has posts and a quick glance at them made me think there was something there (though admittedly I haven't actually read them). They looked like effort was put into them so maybe it was that.

PBlade I don't see your take on Proto anywhere. It's relevant to your vote.

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Then I realize most of the catchphrases in that first paragraph don't make sense with what I'm actually trying to say.

It's a short day. I'd rather have one big wagon (Blitz's wagon was already happening) than have voters split between Blitz and Proto.

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I think Proto is an easy target because he usually doesn't do much and prefers to play games more like they're OC (going so far as to suggest D1 no lynch). I don't think he's scum atm

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Grats on graduations and stuff.

I don't like that Kay's reason for attacking the Blitz wagon was based in meta, and that's all I get from her last post. I don't know Kay's infamous schedule but am I correct in thinking that if she doesn't post soon she won't for another 2-3 days? If that's the case I might move my vote so it's doing something more useful but at this point I wouldn't mind her being lynched.

I meant to ask this forever ago, but could anyone with more experience put out a guess of the amount of mafia and third parties that exist? I don't know how relevant it is but I've never played in a game like this so personally I don't have clue.

I don't the extended vig talk is very productive right now, especially because only Rapier died last night. I'm also being super lazy today but I plan on posting something more substantial than this later (yell at me if I don't).

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I think Proto is an easy target because he usually doesn't do much and prefers to play games more like they're OC (going so far as to suggest D1 no lynch). I don't think he's scum atm

I'm a bit confused. Are the ideas described by these two sentences connected? As long as we're talking Proto meta, does he only play like this as town or do you mean he's an easy target for scum to attack?

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Posting to say I'm trying to read this up, again, since the last few days were too hectic for me to even try.

I'd try and budget my time trying to read this, but I already know if I do that I'll just end up with the game going faster then I can read it :/

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[spoiler=Pissed off]

People like NekoRex, ZM, SSG, Stolypin, Xinnidy, and Strider need to post more >_>

As promised:

~*~THE SHITLIST~*~

Kay
Liquid Snake
NekoRex
Stahlypin
Super Serious Gal
Today, vigs.

Fun fact: I was going to list Xin'dy in there but apparently they did make some substance posts. Just that forgettable.

What the hell, I am not invisible here.

Those snips frustrate me in a personal level because I've been making an effort to keep up and enjoy this game in my free time despite being in a stupid schedule, and keep the mod informed if I'll be away for a notably longer period of time. Then I receive stuff like that despite having contributed more than the people you attribute me with and some that aren't even in that list who get a free pass for some reason. I will hold zero apologies if I am away with very very short break times because of stuff that is productive to my major again.

Frustration venting aside... u_u

The lack of a second kill is grand but is also alarming that there was apparently no nightvig around, but I'll just want to stay optimistic about that for a while.

That said, I'm still picking up from marth's later posts and keep the suspicion I had late D1 past his last D1 post, which I still believe had a pretty serious misread of rein's vote on himself that I even addressed in this post. However, I think his lack of read to support his vote became more blatant as I reread his ISO, considering this seems just enough to warrant a vote but the strong misread on Rein added to no real update on Baldrick read did not at the time, which looks very lazy. The fact he's only now voting Rein, apparently missing my post, adds to my suspicion.

##Vote: Bluedoom

I don't think a single big wagon on Blitz is the best idea, should the case happen that he provides good reason to prevent a lynch and let the voters without enough focus to take late in the game, and iirc we can hammer to end the day anyways. So I'm going ahead with what I find more scummy.

That is not to say I don't suspect Blitz more after his final D1 post. I find the last sentence quite passive-aggressive and doesn't seem like a proper reaction test to employ late in a day phase to vague recipients, with an yet vaguer uncommited rebuttal to marth's info. But my read on him is much weaker and I'd like to get reactions from more people and THEN consolidate on a wagon as phase nears its end.

Pedit: I am mistaken, it's deadline... >_____>

Blitz: In addition to the post above, your content also summed up on a reaction test against the unvotable person that wasn't likely to ellicit a reaction, a pretty noticeable misrep on scorri (she was mentioning the people that were 'wagoning' those two, as opposed to saying they were the only ones getting lynched), a vote on Zeem that served more as a prod than anything if your last D1 post is a reference, and some pretty harmless but inconclusive rolespec. I think that warrants some expectation of a good reply.

##Unvote

##Vote: Blitz

And just so that it isn't overlooked.

##FoS: Bluedoom

I still have to read proto, but I remember that his play is generally different than the norm for NOC from SF2 mafia, though I do know he was mafia in there so that might be a bit counterintuitive...

more on whenever.

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Day 2.2 - Votals

Blitz (6) - scorri, Shinori, Boron, Manix, BT, Xinnidy

Kay (2) - BBM, Strege

Proto (1) - kirsche

Reinfleche (1) - Bluedoom

Serious Bananas (1) - Paperblade

Zeem (1) - Objection!!

Not Voting (10): Blitz, Fera, Kay, NekoRex, Proto, Reinfleche, Serious Bananas, Stahlypin, Super Serious Gal, Zeem

With 22 alive, it takes 7 to deadline lynch and 12 to hammer. You have 33 hours left in the day.

Edited by Witch
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Huh? We've still got more than 24 hours left in the phase; we're not nearing deadline.

And yeah, I don't really like the idea of one big wagon. I don't think that town should spread themselves out over like 5-6 people, but 2-3 wagons is good for the first few days, particularly in a game as large as this.

I think Proto is an easy target because he usually doesn't do much and prefers to play games more like they're OC (going so far as to suggest D1 no lynch). I don't think he's scum atm

I don't think this addresses the case on Proto particularly well. First off, his play is like that as either alignment, so setting him aside due to that makes little sense. And yeah, Proto is often not very active with fewer reads in NOC, but right now even the few reads he does have are filled with inconsistencies (IIRC, Manix pointed out something about what he said about Kevin and Marth).

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It's super annoying because, as usual, he says very little in it. Also note that I said to swap those two groups around with the exception of Fera who stays in the first group because when I thought about it some more I actually disagree a lot more with the latter group than the first group. I would've kept SB in the first group but not liking Proto's content is semi-reasonable although I dislike the way it was implemented. I didn't make any kind of 180 at all, I'm not saying any of my worries about any of them have been cleared, just that I've rethought on which are the most worrying.

I'm ok with a Blitz lynch but I'd rather get rid of Fera or Proto atm.

Kevin, why do you now disagree more with the latter group than the former group? If your opinions about who was scummier changed, why did they do so?

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Posts catching my attention after Page 10

Zeem 221
Useless post? Passive on-the-fence opinion followed by rolespec

Essbee 222
"These lurky players are suspicious or fluffy, I have nothing else to say"

Bluedoom 223
Thx for summary m8

Bluedoom 227
How could you not have a scumread after all that?

Esbee 278
Finally stopped mindlessly scrolling down the page of text to see this.
"Attacking someone for voting your townread isn't great, no."
I want to know who he is talking about so I can vote him.

Strege 280
Note to self: ISO on Paperblade

Shinori 293
He sure seems hung up on my lack of presence. Don't blame him, but annoying to see in every post of his, when there are other inactives too.

~Jesus fucking christ this game goes on forever~

SSG 309
Another newbie with no solid opinions, which make me susupcious anyway :/

Objection 310
Meta always catches my attention, at least. Dislike meta "Blitz is Blitz" excuse for avoiding vote.

Paperblade 315
Someone said something about Paperblade being scummy earlier but I'm getting the feeling they're wrong.

Paperblade 320
God I wish I could "get into Mafia" again like that. Fucking two month hiatus.

Shinori 328
More Shinori implying I'm scum for ~not existing~

Paperblade All of his posts
ilu

Shinori 336
Backtracking after pressure

Shinori/Baldrick/Paperblade
wow lots of flak at Shinori now, Shinori makes a smug post, Acidic Defense on Bladrick

Baldrick 360
This is why ever making a rule that allows you to post modquotes is bad because almost nobody likes it.

CONTINUED ON DAY 2

##Vote: Shinori

Seems like a pretty easy choice so far, Zeem also has my suspicion at the moment for lack of reads and lack of trying, but I may need to go back or see if he has stuff later.

Need to ISO Objection but that post of his still comes to mind.

Will start working on D2 now.

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Huh? We've still got more than 24 hours left in the phase; we're not nearing deadline.

I meant to say it's a deadline lynch day, so it's more passable to focus on one person without the risk of a quicklynch. Which means to say I see the point he made now.

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Esbee 278
Finally stopped mindlessly scrolling down the page of text to see this.
"Attacking someone for voting your townread isn't great, no."
I want to know who he is talking about so I can vote him.

He was talking about BBM, but this is based on a bit of confusion which is starts at post 268 and is discussed right afterward and then resolved. BBM said that he was confused with another game and tired, and I don't have much choice but to believe him. I could see scum intent in it but it's also pretty conspicuously bad logic for not much personal benefit, so I don't care much either.

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Not sold at all on the Kay wagon. One of the criticisms is that she didn't elaborate on her reasoning but now she has done so and I'm ok with that. BBM made a good point about how scum would try to defend town to give themselves cred, but I'm not sure if that alone is wort ha lynch. I also don't think we'll get much out of her because lolweekends.

Kevin, why do you now disagree more with the latter group than the former group? If your opinions about who was scummier changed, why did they do so?

Just by thinking things over more and weighing things in my head. I'm just changing my mind on what actions are scummier than others. Also, as promised:

##Unvote

##Vote: Fera

Put proto on the shit list and if Fera doesn't respond to this put him on the shit list too. Might actually be worth lynching some of these scummy inactives to save our vig a shot.

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@Paper: I had my own suspicions on SB on D1, and some answers that I want from him. I could support an SB lynch if he doesn't do anything to change my read on him.

Also, SB, for the record, you stated that you felt that there was scum on Baldrick's wagon yesterday. Do you still think this, and if you do then who do you think is scum on that wagon?

@Xinnidy: I'm not trying to piss you off, and I don't know what's going on in your life because we don't seem to be online at the same time nowadays. All I knew was that by the end of D1 you had three posts and that I wasn't get a good read off you. I'm not trying to single you out or make a smart remark. I simply feel that there's a significant portion of the game I am getting little to no reads on, and would like these people to post.

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On the top of page 21 but I gotta go to Dungeons and Dragons

Still think Shinori is scum, he was hellbent on me all day when I wasn't actually around, while he could have been looking for other players to get scumreads on, his vote on me looks like an ugly votepark.

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So ive been trying to read d1 and one thing I wanted to comment on was blitz's flip-flopping and generally being kind of a douchebag, and I was really excited to do this but then I noticed this was already a thing everyone had been talking about for a pretty long time now, and apparently that is just the way he plays according to some people and ugh

In any case ill keep reading back and will come back with something originally for once, and then not-skim through d2 (has blitz posted yet?)

Right now im gonna switch from my phone to the laptop for less awkward posting so bear with me for a second

I honestly don't have an excuse for my inactivity so chastise me all you like

Additionally: something I forgot to mention d1 was I didnt like the way nekorex's first post was almost immediately after my vote, but that might just be an unfortunate coincidence

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@Xinnidy: I'm not trying to piss you off, and I don't know what's going on in your life because we don't seem to be online at the same time nowadays. All I knew was that by the end of D1 you had three posts and that I wasn't get a good read off you. I'm not trying to single you out or make a smart remark. I simply feel that there's a significant portion of the game I am getting little to no reads on, and would like these people to post.

And I still think two actual content posts warrants actual addressing to the content I had instead of seeing "Xinnidy is inactive/needs to post more".

But I did put in spoilers because I don't want it to have significant weight on my reads as emotion.

I would like more people to comment on my SB case since I feel like only 1-2 people have

I would like to wait for the follow up to this post, as it's also the reason I'm okay with wagon focus for now. The hindsight is that he did admit to voting proto for not existing in a sugar-coated way, and hasn't worked on elaborating his proto read enough, considering proto in fact had a read, even if not the most revolutionary, on baldrick. Which means someone didn't read the wall of text they're criticizing right.

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Alright, I'm on, so here we go:

Objection: First off, he seems to have selective responses and he does not explain much of his actions. Why did you want to see what Bluedoom did after Baldrick voted? The only reason people didn't really like your summary is because of the fact that you could have included your opinions, and you don't have to write long paragraphs for all of your opinions. All you need is an explanatory sentence or two. I feel odd that you left your vote on Zeem so she'll respond. (I know I did the same thing on Day 1, but if you are going on a trip and might not be able to post often, why didn't you change your vote if you felt that others were scummy?) Once again, you seem to have completely ignored some of the attacks/questions towards you and I needed to remind you about Shinori's question after he had already asked it twice. I'm not liking your play and your selective reading/responses.

##Vote: Objection!!

More coming soon...

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