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Touhou NOCfia - Game Over


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Guess who's back...

Anyway, I haven't read much of the thread since I'm gone but it seems like there's multiple redirectors.

As I'm a Town Redirector (yes, this is a claim). But I don't remember redirecting anything to Blitzy, so SB wasn't me.

Anyway, since there's 2 votes on me, I'm gonna go reread the thread as well as confirming my scumreads so that's it for now, seems like I may have to write a long paragraph after all...

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That claim was out of the blue (@objection)

##Unvote

##Vote: Blitz

I think it's obvious why I did this at this point. Also:

voting doesn't do anything afaik
no it doesn't, lol so will anyone pick a topic to talk about?

Does anyone else read this like it's a scumslip, because it looks to me Blitz got confirmation on how PB's card works? If Blitz does flip scum then we should look into PB.

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@Paperblade Objection is me and Me is I. So, Objection is I.

@Xin'dy You foresaw right. ##Unvote ##Vote: Xin'dy

Now, for serious talk

Alright, first @SSG, the reason I didn't respond to Shinori's question is because I skimmed passed the first one and only saw the second one and your reminder after my posts.

@BBM I did have an opinion on Blitzy although briefly, here

@Kay if I get you right, you're voting me out of lack of scumreads, so I'll do my defense and scumread at the same time.

And finally the moment you've all been waiting for, scumreads!

@Blitz if you didn't want the situation to end up like this, don't act scum intentionally. I'm actually more suspicious of you more than I was before.

@Bluedoom I don't like being voted but that's not why I listed you here. Besides you're post on me is basically baseless, while nobody expected Baldy to get modkilled, keeping the pressure isn't a reason I can accept, since I figured you knew about the Baldrick wagon you could've at least explain why'd you keep your vote on him.

For now I'm gonna ##Unvote ##Vote: Bluedoom since Blitz have enough vote on him.

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Don't really see that as a slip Kevin. Mafia could have a rolecop or something, and Blitz is probably trying to screw with us anyway.

Don't like Objection's last post. He pretty much votes Marth over a single thing that he didn't like, and doesn't even cite the damn thing.

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Guess who's back...

Anyway, I haven't read much of the thread since I'm gone but it seems like there's multiple redirectors.

As I'm a Town Redirector (yes, this is a claim). But I don't remember redirecting anything to Blitzy, so SB wasn't me.

Anyway, since there's 2 votes on me, I'm gonna go reread the thread as well as confirming my scumreads so that's it for now, seems like I may have to write a long paragraph after all...

Idle tonight and we can test your multiple redirection theory. And I was redirected to Paperblade, not Blitz.

Not fond of the last line since it seems like an overreaction to a pretty insignificant number of votes (especially after what Blitz has just done.)

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Ah well, it's not the number of votes I'm worried about, it's the fact that people's suspicious of me that I am.

And in case you're wondering, last night I didn't redirect to Paper either, although I read your post wrong, my point still stands.

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Proto's post on P25 doesn't impress me. His reads look formulaic in a sense that I can't honestly buy "Kevin is a little scummy: he did some stuff but then he started contributing so maybe not" and him mulling over his own points is just about half of his scumhunting. Scum like doing this because they know the Ultimate Truth - if someone's town but playing badly they're able to guess the reason (busy irl etcetera) and raise it for free content, without the usual uncertainty that haunts your average townie.

I don't get how Kay's able to say that Manix's ISO looks extremely fluffy and such without elaborating. It's a nontrivial point seeing as she's the only one to bring it up, plus it looks awfully misreppy here.

Marth's post here is interesting considering he displays dislike of the "vote stacks" (on Baldrick and Blitz in this case) without once giving his opinion on Blitz in that entire post.

Gotta agree with BamBamMan's (ahahaha) post on Fera. When a post's a defense and the defense turns out to be contradictory and likely to have been made up... it's pretty bad news! I don't see how Blitz being the man wagon made him shy away from voting him but Baldrick being the man wagon tipped the scales in his favor.

I'm feeling better about SB after this post.

Blitz's shenanigans are hilarious. My favorite part has to be "it's a fake modscene" because no scumteam would blow a perfectly good future mislynch utility (by you flipping + the modscene revealed as fake) when you were being run up so hard anyway.

I don't get why he wasn't modkilled after "I literally asked if it was a joke or not" in #sforestmafia reportedly. Unless it wasn't in the CHAT but he said it was in the chat sooo. He then goes on to say that it was lost because his electriticy went out but if it wasn't private then anyone else could confirm/deny.

Proto's post right after is super awkward and I'd totally ship them as scumbuddies. It's a dandy monologue on how disappointing Blitz is.

Scratch that, not fullclaiming is the best part. You have a dude who modkilled himself on purpose to give town maximum info and a second dude who was annoyed by that move. Then the second dude doesn't get why fullclaiming is the way to go. Go second dude.

Objection, why did you feel like you should claim? You're suspicious but still. Whatever.

Kevin: I don't know if that's a scumslip simply because I'm not sure if I'm parsing half of what Blitz is saying correctly anyway. This is English, right?

SB how would idling help?

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Manix's ISO is always somewhat fluffy, since his posts are spammy, but that doesn't mean he doesn't have content. So I'd like Kay to clarify that too.

Objection's Marth vote cherrypicks one thing that Marth said out of his entire wall of text posts and uses it as a basis, which I dislike. His claim is also an overreaction. While there is a decent amount of suspicion on him, Blitz seems to be the pretty obvious lynch candidate today, so I can't see the need for it.

And lol I don't think there's anything to say about Blitz that hasn't been said already. He really should fullclaim though. Seeing as full role PMs don't get flipped and it's already been shown in Baldrick's role PM how much extra stuff can be in there, if he's town, hiding that info when pretty much everyone in the thread thinks he's mafia is a bad move (on top of all the other stuff).

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Fine, my reason for voting Bluedoom was lacking.

I guess I'm gonna have to add the rest:

@Xinnidy: I agree I didn't say much about Baldrick but that was because I wanted to sustain my vote on him and keep the pressure, whereas had I voted Rein it'd have just been another single vote people would've ignored at that time (although in hindsight we really did end up with only one wagon tl;dr) Obviously I didn't expect Baldy to modkill himself, go figure.

This, keeping the pressure on a nearly hammered lynch candidate. Not an acceptable reason.

I disagree that my read on him is a misrep: What was the point of him saying that scum tracker/watcher point is dumb? It wasn't even a 'point' by kirsche, and that really looks like filler content. The fact that he's talking about ninja modifier(and this is wrt me so it still is relevant) comes under rolespec anyway, and as I said- if he can talk about some small point that someone said, then that means he read that someone's posts, so he should be able to give a darn read about that person, at the least.

I voted Rein yesterday since I thought since new wagons and scum reads were popping up(well D1 was mostly baldrick now), I could push for this and pressure him into posting content, but it seems no one agrees with me(and that apparently he flaked again). And we want more lynch options, so now I'll ##Unvote ##Vote: Objection Pretty good choice at this point.

And why am I the one get lectured for voting inactives.

Also I may have worded it badly, but when I said I had no scumreads after my summary, I meant I didn't get any other new scumreads. I still had the off reads on whoever I said I had a problem with earlier, in case it hasn't been clear to anyone. If I addressed anyone else at that point, it means I noticed something off with them.

In any case, I didn't really get the cases on Kay or Paperblade- Kay's point of Blitz wagon being dumb, while not explained, doesn't exactly warrant a vote. I suppose BBM's point on Kay is valid in that there were no votes on me when she thought I was pressured. EDIT: Cut, she's posted some content, gotta read that after this.

Somebody once tried to keep the pressure on Liquid Snake. And what do you don't get about Paperblade's case? Care to explain?

PB's points on SB, as I said before, are valid, but I'm not sure what to think of SB's claim and I still want to see SB's new content. Still find him scummy though. PB having no other concrete reads during D1 was valid- no one really tried hard at doing anything else and there was lots of inactivity and votes thrown here and there.

I don't think Proto is scummy as of yet although I'm kinda annoyed that he's talking about the popular lynch/ scum reads. I suppose the reads on Zeem and Shinori are ok but they're kinda... I dunno, thrown off there? What do you think of the rest of the players, Proto, do you have any new opinions on them?

I'll need to read Shinori since I haven't exactly got a good idea what's he done this game besides talking about NNR. Zeem seems meh in terms of content but I agree with Paper, Objection seems worse. I also don't get why SSG has been focusing on mostly Zeem,care to talk about others, SSG? Stoly's vote on Blitz is just meh, the vote stacks are starting to get annoying but tl;dr I can only hope he posts something else.

Paper never stated why I seemed worse, and you never did either and just voted me without any clear reason.

And finally, Xinny's vote on Blitz was unnecessary since Blitz already had 5 votes on him, and he himself agreed that we shouldn't have one single wagon this phase, so why hop on to the Blitz wagon when you could've voted me?

What stuff would you like me to talk about? I can't keep track of everything that happens in this thread and its easy to forget some stuff, plus the general time gap between my content posts is 9-10 hours. Also you didn't need to 'prod' me- the only new read I even got from my summary was Strege; the rest of them, I had already stated, although not specifically "THEY ARE SCUMREADS", constantly that day- and I find that hypocritical of you, because if you ask me to 'try harder' at figuring out your scumreads, why couldn't you make that same consideration while reading my posts?

And YES, its hard to get more reads when people lack content. I have nothing to say about the Baldrick wagon; all of its voters (including me to an extent) were people who lacked on content badly, so I can't really get any reads on the wagoners. Whoever I mentioned in my last post who was on the wagon. you know what I think of them; So really I have nothing to say about it otherwise.

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This, keeping the pressure on a nearly hammered lynch candidate. Not an acceptable reason.

One vote into deadline lynch isn't nearly hammered. We kind of needed the vote there if we were going to lynch him at all?

And why am I the one get lectured for voting inactives.

Pointing fingers and yelling "he did it too" isn't good play.

Somebody once tried to keep the pressure on Liquid Snake. And what do you don't get about Paperblade's case? Care to explain?

What's this meant to mean: "Somebody once tried to keep the pressure on Liquid Snake."

Paper never stated why I seemed worse, and you never did either and just voted me without any clear reason.

Marth did say that he didn't like you early on, off the top of my head.
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@BT: I was in the channel and he didn't ask, but he could've asked via PM since they were both there. I asked Prims the same questio

n and he confirmed it to me (although he added that factional abilities would count for this)

Also you seem worse because you seem to have more of a clue than Zeem but the whole thing seems kind of phony.

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Objection, the difference is that you were voting for an inactive because they were inactive, while Marth was voting for Rein due to an actual issue with his posts, on top of the inactivity.

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Bookkeeping.

first of all, my entire scummy play has been so that I can find an excuse to claim (I can't use my abilities without showing it)

Extremely lame excuse. I don't understand why you can't use the abilities you've claimed (just mayor unless I missed something) without claiming them. Also, *vote*.

Uhhh... Necktie really shouldn't be talking about that on IRC? Not sure if scumslip or pardonable rulebreaking.

[...]

It was really not much like RVS at that point...

I'd like someone to address this. I'm okay if it's BBM or Stahlypin to speak up, but ideally someone else who's been on IRC and might have seen something.

Not a fan of this because it was Bluedoom's first post and two posts above it Rein's first post vote's Stahlypin (for president, though, and accompanied by no scumreads). In retrospect I may have believed too easily that Bluedoom's vote was mostly RVS-motivated, but the position of the vote in the thread isn't a good reason to believe it was serious in this case. Gotta reread Bluedoom with my naivety in check.

from quicktopic:aka the manix syndrome of being town and mafia just don't really nightkill you at all for whatever reason

the logic here is a little dubious but i can kinda understand what you're getting at with this. would you have voted blitz if he was a leading wagon at the time, or if something else came up past the ~meta~ stuff?

Self-meta defense eh.

I'm on the same boat regarding Fera's logic. Still have to reread. Would still like some elaboration from him.

uh, what

I did not say this

I only stated that Blitz was the main wagon at the time, nothing more

I did not state that my reason I didn't vote him was because of this

Point of contradiction: you said that because he was the main wagon at the time you were looking for someone else to vote. If I'm wrong please clarify.

it is worth it when you can make up for the loss of everyone's reads by using your own reads, however it doesn't work so well in a 24 player game for having too many players.

as for the easy out thing, do you really think everyone voting me is town?

I don't see you analyzing the people on your wagon, despite that being the lion's share of the goal here?

>bulletproof mayor

Yeah I don't see this as a town role.

I'm not nearly as experienced as you all, but role =/= alignment and it seems like it could be a town leader type thing. Then again, if Blitz had a toolkit for being a town leader he wouldn't go in the opposite direction and fake scum. I'd like to see him fullclaim too because I don't see much of a town motivation here, and of course because Blitz looks really, really scummy.

Okay, this is getting ridiculous. Blitzy, I know you like doing stupid stuff on purpose, but this is too much.

Previously, I didn't think Blitzy was genuinely scum. I know he did a lot of stupid stuff as usual but I thought he would arrive and claim they were all suspicious looking tricks to achieve some objective (like how he tried getting Domu active) and then we'd be back to square one. But his intention was to become scummy so that he could claim? What the hell? What was stopping you from claiming earlier? What was the point of acting scummy on purpose? If you simply wanted to build up discussion by being a target, congratulations, you've done a very fine job. Too bad all this extra discussion is useless for analysis because their votes on you are all justified; after all, you were intentionally acting scummy, right? That was truly a horrible move, Blitzy.

If you came up with any other silly excuse, I'd leave you alone. But no, intentionally acting suspicious is not something I see a Townie doing. Answer me this question, Blitzy. How exactly are you hoping the current situation to turn out? If you were intentionally acting scummy, you must have anticipated this bandwagon on yourself. If you intend to cancel the lynch somehow, it'd be a waste of your ability and a waste of our lynch while the Mafia gets their free kill tonight. If you thought you could get someone else lynched instead, how exactly did you plan to achieve that when you clearly tried to look scummier than everyone else?

Well-worded but nothing terribly original here, and he hasn't addressed my points or the points of a few other people against him, so I'm still scumreading Proto. His fullclaim request doesn't seem as scummy as Blitz says (maybe a bit based on the phrasing), but it's not like only town can ask someone to claim either.

Does anyone else read this like it's a scumslip, because it looks to me Blitz got confirmation on how PB's card works? If Blitz does flip scum then we should look into PB.

I don't read it like that. It's weirdly worded, but Paperblade's original phrasing seemed to make it pretty clear that he wanted abilities on him. Speaking of which, that seems sketchy. Even if Paperblade isn't scum, a scum watcher or tracker still gets a ton of information here.

If someone else gets redirected in the night, we see if there's another redirector.

There will be 21 living players tonight and everyone has roles and spellcards. I can guess that someone else has a redirection ability of some kind. Also, if/when someone gets redirected we don't know if they'll want to speak up that they can target, and I don't see a lot of need to encourage it.

@BT: I was in the channel and he didn't ask, but he could've asked via PM since they were both there. I asked Prims the same questio
n and he confirmed it to me (although he added that factional abilities would count for this)

What are factional abilities?

I'm not sure if Blitz and Proto both being scum makes sense but I'm okay with lynching either one. Something something long post is long; I have a pile of ISO's I promised to read and not a lot of time today so yeah.

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Uh, Objection, why did you claim and out who you targeted last night? Was there any point to it? :/

Also, while Marth isn't looking particularly clean to me, your vote on him is pretty bad as well. Also, do you have other scum reads or suspicions besides the guy who's most likely going to get lynched today and the guy you're voting?

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@BT: I was in the channel and he didn't ask, but he could've asked via PM since they were both there. I asked Prims the same questio

n and he confirmed it to me (although he added that factional abilities would count for this)

Well yeah, but the way he said it made me think that wasn't the case. Why not "I asked the mod" or similar?

Also you seem worse because you seem to have more of a clue than Zeem but the whole thing seems kind of phony.

This is to...?

Also no one has stepped up to say they tried to kill Blitz so I would assume it's fake

Not even 12 hours passed so s'hard to say.
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that was to Objection

Also pretty much everyone who gives a shit (ie isn't Rein) has been around so eh.

@Strege: The mafia kill is a factional ability. Basically it's an ability that anyone in an informed faction can use but (typically) only one person can use at a time.

Also also I get a lot more useflu info than a scum watcher would

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Necktie said that he was feeling in over his head on the main channel, though I'm not sure how many others saw it. I didn't really think it was a big deal since it was just a small, fairly public complaint.

I ~think I'll be here for phase end, but I'm not sure, because my family is celebrating my birthday tonight now that my sister is back.

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Okay, I have to leave now because my family is going to a colleague's homecoming party or something. I will most likely be back for phase end and I will have my laptop with me, but just don't expect me to be around too much today.

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