Emperor
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Posts posted by Emperor
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Just now, Levant Mir Celestia said:
Saying that a game needs to be hard to be enjoyable is laughably narrow-minded.
Well for the most part yea. If the game offers no challenge and you can just breeze right on through it does not make for a thrilling and engaging experience does it?
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19 minutes ago, Armagon said:
Marissa? Did you mean Mareeta? Because she's in Thracia. Marisa? Sacred Stones. There is no Marissa in FE4. Azelle gets a horse after promotion so he wasn't the best example.
I meant Larcei I dont know why I got them confused. Shannan is another example. Infantry are not that bad in FE4 as some people make them out to be. since they were slower they can make it in time to defend your castle and thats what I used them for and they still got good levels.
And by modern mario I meant stuff like the mario games on the hand helds/wii/wii u that are rehashes. And the cat mario game. I dont know if Oddesy will be as hard or have some hard stages like N64 or sunshine. But anyways well yea no duh a casual game will sell more. It appeals more to a broader audince hence why CoD sells so well. That does not make them good though. Or enjoyable if a game is piss poor easy what is the point of playing it you know?
And as for the specifc instances you mentioned you were griping about how it rushed you. That sounds like a complaint about it being hard though. To me atleast. And yea ow elitist edge lmao but its true dude. If you cant handle the game pushing you to rush for them stat bonuses in chapter 11A of FE6 and would rather it be nerfed to make it easier, then thats casual. Nothing wrong with it (until it hurts the game) but dont deny it.
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6 minutes ago, Jingle Jangle said:
True, Tharja is not a good mother. But why would be a good mother in the first place? Most of the mothers in Awakening are on good terms with their sons and daughters. But Tharja? She's from a country where people are sacrificed to Grima to he can one day destroy to world. Being raised from a family of dark of dark mages.Besides it make her distint from other parents.
As for the rest of the supports between Tharja and Norie. It is not about Norie being tested as a lab rat, but instead Tharja seeing Norie's potential power in the dark arts.
In her A she says she does not want her to be a Dark magic users though? And there are other ways to make your daughter a dark wizard then using hexes on her me thinks. And even if she is born in Plegia and her parents did the same to her its still does't parden her. But atleast its a reason I guess.
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Just now, UNLEASH IT said:
She hot yo
only correct answer.
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1 minute ago, Jingle Jangle said:
Well in Awakening, Tharja is really the one person that wants to be with Robin before a S-rank support not really a harem.
I meant she acts like a girl FROM a harem not that all the girls in awakening are like harem girls that want the Robin D. Should have specified a bit more
1 minute ago, Jingle Jangle said:As I said in the edit of my post, most of Norie, treatment of Tharja comes from her future self. Tharja in her A support flat out says she love Noire. Just not normal motherly kind.
She says she loves her yea, but actions speak louder then words and in her C and B she does practice hexes and stuff and her supports with her father do indicted that she is STILL being treated like a lab rat last I remembered. Her saying I love you means nothing if she abuses the child you know?
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2 minutes ago, Azz said:
@Emperor I don't see why you are getting so annoyed at the fact people are just stating an opinion. You don't have to play a game to dislike it. I have never played a CoD game, but I know I dislike them. Just leave it off, cause you ain't gonna change no ones opinions.
I was not getting annoyed though?
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1 minute ago, Glennstavos said:
Well the most straightforward answer is that players have no idea about her treatment of Noire before wife-ing her up, or anybody. Everything about Children units comes out of nowhere during Act 2, and the Avatar is the most likely character to get paired up first beyond Chrom's forced relationship.
I waifued her up in my first awakening run because just like Brendan from FE7 I listened to my dick. Massive regrets after.
11 minutes ago, Jingle Jangle said:Devoted to Robin.
She is a bit more then devoted lets be real here. Reminds me of those Harem shows where the girls for no real reason all want the MC's shlong
13 minutes ago, Jingle Jangle said:Her conversation with Noire in Future Past is rather touching.
Yea if you ignored everything she did to her. Actions speak louder then words.
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5 minutes ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:
I could literally say the same thing, except replacing "Awakening/Echoes" with "FE4", and switching words around to match. Except Armagon did that already.
You could, you could do alot of things but that wouldt make a whole lot of sense since, you know, FE4 maps arent just a jpg of tree roots with nothing but has defense tiles, forts, castles, terrains, etc etc. And if me saying git gud makes me an elitist then whatever at this point. Maps that push me to get a bonus incentive are the best but if you people want to remove those incentives or make it easier which is casual lets not beat around the bush I will say you are a casual. If the game confirms to the player shit gets boring. (Skyrim, Modern Mario) but if the world/game gives the player the middle finger at every turn and you come out of it gloriously shit is fun and feels good as well (Morrowind/ Your first Souls game)
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if you dont want to rush and would rather the game reward you for sitting on your ass and turtling that is a casual MCwhooper with a side of fries. I dont know what else to tell you.
Git gud, to get the stat boosters or dont and not get them. Its meant to be a challenge. And you complaining about it being to hard is a casual deluxe.
And you would not have to back track that much if you left some troops to guard the palace or near enough to run back. they want you to split the army and I never thought it was a big deal until the very last chapter when leif's sister who has the fucking Gae Bolg (how that wepon kills you and how you use it is fucking metal as fuck in irish lore) comes. But I see why some people are turned off by it and I already said why I see why people dont like FE4 maps many times. And I never understood this whole "infantry does not get a chance to shine in fe4" statment. Marissa and Azelle were both my top dogs in the first gen.
Its 100% skipable chapters and mechanics that are easy as hell to get by/avoid that I dont get but I said already and before we are going in circle and just agree to disagree since this is getting boring since we are going in circles.
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Never understood why people waifu up Tharja. I dont have a waifu and I find it odd but, out of all the awakening cast why her? She is hot but she is a horrible person and mother who caused Noire to have a split personality due to all the curses and hexes. How do you people justify that? I want to see your mental gymnastics at work. But if she is your waifu just because she is hot then whatever.
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8 minutes ago, Armagon said:
Ooh, this gave me a good laugh. IS doesn't agree with anyone. They decide what's best for each game. If we're going by your logic, then IS heavily disagrees with you because Dismounting hasn't returned and probably never will
inb4 FE16 has dismounting.Well recently ISIS has been doing stupid decisions like splitting up fates into 3 parts and having no good writers work on it etc. But still removing skills from FE6 was a dumb move.
9 minutes ago, Armagon said:Also, you're kinda a hypocrite for calling SoV a lesser game for not having the Weapon Triangle, when the Weapon Triangle matters the least in Thracia.
Simple =/= bad.
Well it still does in Thracia and it does and an element of what weapons to use and the like.
9 minutes ago, Armagon said:Because why should i have to rush if i don't want to? Thankfully, it only happens rarely in FE6 but in FE4, the game basically just forces you to rush. What if, perhaps, the player doesn't want to rush? A game shouldn't punish people for preferring a different playstyle.
And yes the game should punish you if you are just going to sit on your ass in the corner. Why sould the game reward you by just taking your time. No the game should reward you if you hurry up. Why shouldt I do that in every map? Its the best way to beat any map BUT the incentive is you should hurry up and get the promotion item, or stat booster or even a gaiden chapter. It adds another layer to FE. You are the first person I have seen complain about being rushed to an objective for a sweet reward. You dont have to but giving speed wings to Lilina so she can double/not get doubled is the bomb. That complaint is super casual honestly. Like git gud. getting all the villages in FE6 on hard mode was not even hard. Getting to atleast three villages in I forgot what map in CQ on Hard mode was alot tougher for me atleast. but it was dam fun. If they did not make me rush map would not have been as good.
15 minutes ago, Armagon said:Said criticism has also come with the statement that Gaiden was an NES game, and it followed the trend of having sequels uniquely different to the original.
Those "piss poor maps" are still better than all of FE4's maps.
The first FE game had alot better maps then Gaiden though so not really no.
And the people who say awakening/echoes maps are better then FE4 maps have no idea what they are talking about tbh. moving your mounted units up takes a while, a turn or two but how is that worse then a fucking grind over jpeg and SOMETIMES haveing a defensive tile? Compared to fighting over a country or two?
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Just now, Hardin said:
Four pages of inane arguing about the merits and demerits of warp tiles and staff accuracy.
Well, what did you expect from a forum about video games?
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6 minutes ago, Hardin said:
Why are you making such a big deal on people not liking or being interested in Thracia? People will have their preferences about the games they like and dislike. There's no need for this much drama over defending the honour of a game that's nearly 20 years old.
What drama are you talking about dude?
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9 minutes ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:
Because you go out of your way to downplay or outright sweep Thracia's flaws under the rug.
Well thats because with the exception of warp tiles, everyone agrees that, healing staves missing, and fatiuge are a non issue. Its not just me but everyone who put in the effort into playing Thracia say it. Because shocker, its not. Everyone in this thread that have played Thracia has said the same thing.
Gaiden having piss poor maps and no axes have always been a point of criticism even amongst old school gaiden fans. But the point of Echoes for me atleast was the writing and the writing is maybe the best in FE.
Not having weapon triangle is another big thing that almost turned me away from getting echoes from the first place but I heard it had great writing so I figured why not and there is only like, 3 or 4 FE games I can say I dont like anyways so odds are I would have liked this one. -
Just now, Levant Mir Celestia said:
Maybe because it just reeks of that mentality? It also makes you look like a hypocrite.
How am I hypocrite for listing a flaw in echoes?
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1 minute ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:
Ha. If you're friends with people in IntSys, I'm the Emperor of Japan.
Doesn't change the fact that there are people who won't agree, and people who consider them dealbreakers (and guess what? Yours truly happens to fall under both of those categories). I find the wind map annoying, but I find that slow and steady wins the race (and I even use the wind to either screw up enemy formations, to get out of a bad position, or as a supplement to my offense).
Being simple doesn't mean they're bad. I'd much rather have the simple maps from SoV than Genealogy's bloated maps that are a huge slog to go through any day of the week.
Elitist response. That's all I have to say here.
How the fuck is saying Echoes is a lesser game for not having a weapon triangle/no weapon degrade make me an elitist? I liked Echoes and it was clear from my statement/background picture you rude twat. And I said its cleared they agreed with me because they added back in Skills. They agreed with my though processes that skills are the shit.
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1 hour ago, Armagon said:
It's not the darkness (well, that's part of the reason). The main complaint with Fog of War is that the enemy is unaffected by it, giving the player an unfair disadvantage.
Well if FoW did effect the AI it would make the maps alot easier. The point of it is to give the player a challenge
1 hour ago, Armagon said:More mechanics =/= good gameplay. You can have all the gameplay mechanics you want, if the gameplay itself is shit, then why bother? The GBA games still win in the gameplay department because they aren't filled with bullshit, unlike the Jugdral games.
. Yes I know more mechanics dont make a game have better gameplay but FE6 is alot less for not having skills and the like. And even IS agreed with me which is why they added back in Skills in PoR.
1 hour ago, Armagon said:You do realize that the entirety of SoV is built around it's handling of weapons, right? Having weapon durabiltiy means adding more weapons. More weapons=weapon triangle. Weapon triangle=completely reworking the game to the point where it might as well be a new game and not a faithful remastering of Gaiden.
Ik echoes was meant to be like gaiden a very faithful remake and all that jazz because the devs loved Gaiden and you can feel the love that was put into it, but echoes is still a lesser game for not having a weapon triangle and weapon durability
1 hour ago, Armagon said:A lot of that stuff is dealbreakers for people. Especially since some of it is stuff that just shouldn't happen. And you keep saying it's not a big deal but i could just as easily say that SoV's desert and swamp maps aren't a big deal. Just because it's "not a big deal" doesn't mean i have to agree.
The maps are shit becuase they are very very very simple. Just some defense tiles and a bridge repeat 10x over. I was't even talking aboout the desert or the swamp maps I was more complaning about how basic they are.
The bullshit mechanics you keep on mentioning are not an issue not because I say it is, but because they are if everyone who has played Thracia and gave it a fair shot saying, fatiuge is a non issue and heals that miss, while suck, are a non issue should say something. I personally liked Fatigue though but stam pots are sold rather cheaply just kidnap some dudes (want this mechanic back in for reals this time) and sell of their shit. And mention 24x as being another deal breaker seems very petty since you can just skip it. Unlike the fucking winds map in Conquest which is pure ass.
1 hour ago, Armagon said:Dismounting sucked anyway.
A lot of that stuff is dealbreakers for people. Especially since some of it is stuff that just shouldn't happen. And you keep saying it's not a big deal but i could just as easily say that SoV's desert and swamp maps aren't a big deal. Just because it's "not a big deal" doesn't mean i have to agree.
See, that's the thing about Thracia. It's fun if you don't go in blind (supposedly) but why shouldn't you be able to go in blind and have fun?
Dismounting adds another layer of strategy since you can do more things. Air drop your peg night to take down a ballista and the enemies surrounding it was cool as hell for me in Thracia 776. Avoiding horse slayers is another thing.
The bullshit mechanics you keep on mentioning are not an issue not because I say so, but because they really arent. Everyone who has given thracia a fair shot will say the same thing. Game gives you a scroll to increase skill and a skill ring in the beginning, give it to your healer and they stop missing the moment they get 10 skill. and these scrolls are OP.
The maps are shit becuase they are very very very simple. Just some defense tiles and a bridge repeat 10x over. I was't even talking aboout the desert or the swamp maps I was more complaining about how basic every maps were.
1 hour ago, Armagon said:See, that's the thing about Thracia. It's fun if you don't go in blind (supposedly) but why shouldn't you be able to go in blind and have fun?
Mmm, i don't know if i'd use Ch.8 as an example. Ch.11A is a better example, because that once chapter somehow managed to carry over FE4's problem of having to rush at top speed just to save the villages. And that's not counting how somewhat stressful it is to recruit Thea without having her and her Pegasus Knights suicide on the enemy. Would've been a lot easier if both Klein and Shanna could recruit her as opposed to just Klein.
It is fun blind. Many people found it very fun going in blind, frustrating but in a fun way.
And why is having to rush to save villages in FE6 chapter 11A a bad thing? Its meant to incentives you to not turtle, I dont know how you can say thats a bad thing by comparing it to FE4.
But anyways we have gone full circle again lets just agree to disagree.
9 hours ago, Valkama said:Your not supposed to know, that's the point. The player during the manster arc is supposed to feel disadvantaged and needs to scrap together anything they can and play the maps cleverly to win. It's what makes the whole thing great. The game still gives you everything you need though through the inventories of the new recruits and the 3 guaranteed chests though so even a player coming in with an unoptimized setup isn't screwed.
Thats why I love that arc the most. And honestly kinda miss that run away chase feel the beginning had.
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4 hours ago, Armagon said:
10/10 elitist comment.
I legit dont know what to tell you if fog of war bugs you. I prefer the FoW of thracia but my favorite GBA is FE6 so am just a masochist. I never understood how anybody has an issue with a bit of darkness. Its a nice spice
4 hours ago, Armagon said:Did you use a guide? Because said warp tiles are invisible. I doubt you skipped all of them on your first playthrough, unless you went in using a guid
Nah I meant by skip I skiped the maps. I said I did not do 24x and I chose another route, the route with the best maps in FE. Like I dont get the complaint of warp tiles yea they are shit but just avoid the route. And the game gives you alot of warp and rescue staves AND a hammerine staff so it gives you alot of options.
4 hours ago, Armagon said:But compared to the SNES games, the GBA games have better gameplay. On that note, Mystery of the Emblem has better gameplay than Jugdral.
FE6 only had Seize and FE8 was fucking piss poor easy(Dont know what they were thinking with Seth). So eh. I was talking about in terms of mechanics and innovations the GBA pushed out, which were alot. I am not saying FE6 7 or 8 are better or worse, just they removed alot and added nothing other then support convos that FE6 brought in. PoR adding some of the stuff that was lost from FE6 and Shove and fixed how gaining support worked, thank goodness. But Then the franchise removed alot of those once again by the time NM came out.
4 hours ago, Armagon said:Because map design is the only thing that matters amiright?
I won't deny SoV's map design is pretty mediocre but i'd much rather have them over the massive slogs that are Geneaolgy's maps. I'd also rather have SoV's maps over Thracia's Ch.24x.
And map design is not the only thing that matters you are right. But it is a big deal in FE. but Echoes also has no weapon durability since Gaiden had it, which is pretty lame. And you keep on going about 24x every other map in thracia is great. Other then 16b I think it was.
4 hours ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:I did NOT say "quit while you're ahead"; also, I said that because your statement is literally the Fire Emblem equivalent of Genwunner talk. Anyway, gameplay wise, FE3 might not have had all the bells and whistles that the Jugdral games had, but as far as I'm concerned, it didn't need them. And I'd say the GBA games have better gameplay relative to the SNES games.
There was no reason to remove skills or dismounting in FE6. The series went back by removing it. Thankfully PoR brought it back in. And like I said I understand why people dont like FE4 maps I really do. What I dont get is when people say FE5 is not that good, or sucks or etc etc because the FoW cant let you see terrain or stamina or heals missing, when once again its not a big deal.
There is alot more to a game then one fucking map.
And that last statement is just fucking wow. Speechless.
4 hours ago, Armagon said:Because map design is the only thing that matters amiright?
I won't deny SoV's map design is pretty mediocre but i'd much rather have them over the massive slogs that are Geneaolgy's maps. I'd also rather have SoV's maps over Thracia's Ch.24x.
Find it funny you say this but keep on harping about one map. Anyways we are going around in circles again ill check out that FE4 manga did not know it was a thing.
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14 minutes ago, Von Ithipathachai said:
Perhaps you're right if we're talking solely about story, but there are simply too many issues with both Jugdral games for that statement to be agreeable except to other Jugdral fans.
Genealogy of the Holy War's story is very good, but if the game itself is sloggy to play through with oversized maps and atrocious balancing issues. Further elaborating on the maps, making them less fun to actually play for the sake of storytelling is absolutely bass-ackwards design. If I may insert my two cents, if your game design decision is going to negatively impact it being fun to play for the sake of something as utterly secondary as story, then you probably shouldn't go through with it. The story should bend over backwards for the game, not the other way around. If your story is good, but the game surrounding it is not fun to play, then you're honestly better off simply reading a book instead. (Conveniently, Genealogy of the Holy War has a manga that I'm seriously considering checking out for this very reason.)
As for Thracia 776, I certainly like it more than Genealogy of the Holy War for its challenging and memorable map design and significantly improved balancing, but not even I can ignore that it has its share of seriously unfair moments that detract from the overall experience. I won't go into further detail about Chapter 24x (and to a lesser extent Chapter 16B) since we've already talked about those enough. What I'm really upset with is the Escape from Manster arc. How the heck is anyone supposed to know without a walkthrough or other prior knowledge that only Leif and Lifis out of all your current units would be usable in the next map, and furthermore that whatever items they may have had (which may or may not even be useful) will be taken from them and randomly scattered in chests?
...You know what? Maybe we should just stop arguing. We've derailed this "underrated FE games" thread plenty.
Nah lets keep on going and see what happens.
Nah I fucking loved the chase and there is nothing wrong with the game throwing you a curve ball. I did not know that was gonna happen and I got by just fine. Then again FE6 is my favorite GBA so maybe I am just a masochist. Thracia was my, like 10th game or so in the series so I loved how different that arc was and it was actually my favorite. Running from the law and all that. I wont get into FE4 that much but I just think its a matter of taste. Some people hate big maps, some love em. I love horse units so I love the big maps. But I see why you and others dont. I do agree the story should bow to the game play though but I personally did not mind it. Can't wait until the Echoes team remakes FE4.
And when I say decline I meant more so they dont add anything new and take out to much stuff. Like dismounting. Sending Karrin with a levin sword to take down a ballista after dismounting felt great. And there was no reason to remove skills in FE6
But if they would have removed everything near the end, then I think that would have crossed the line into bullshit since you wont have enough time to restock. It happend rather early so there was plenty of time to restock on items.
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14 minutes ago, Valkama said:
Not to turn this into an SoV hate thread but it's quite easy to make a map better than an SoV map. Simply add anything remotely resembling a side objective and you have a better map. When your game is entirely made of rout maps with 0 things to do other than kill enemies and half your maps have little to no terrain worth speaking of it's pretty easy for any game in the series to have better maps. While the game still has merits to it the maps are easily of the worst in the series, well that or OG Gaiden.
Awakening some how did the impossible and made a worse map. And fates brought it up in DLC for some reason. No defense tiles at all. Its just a grid. A lousy 21x28 grid on a jpeg of tree roots...
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Why should I quit while am ahead? Did GBA games not remove skills? This is a fact I love them but compared to the SNES they are lacking. And yes Ik fates had Shelter but its no where NEAR the same thing as rescue. Shelter is Pair up but you dont pair up with that unit, that unit goes to you (I dont know how to word it any better but you get the idea) Rescue has sever draw backs and can get that unit killed. The skill shelter is not the same as rescue so you cant compare them as they have different out comes on both units. A unit is hindered greatly with Rescue.
And Genealogy maps are not bloated they are meant to really capture the size and scope of the country you are in. I liked it personally but I can see why some dont. Cavs are also my favorite unit. Compared to Awakening/echoes where its just one huge empty lot (that fucking tree map in awakening with NO defense tiles aka just a fucking grid). Echoes was saved by its writing which was great and I recommended just for that. Favorite 3ds game by far.
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Also saying SoV as your favorite but going on about the same map in Thracia being awful is weird since Echoes/gaiden has the worst maps in the franchise. ALL being open grass lands. Maybe awakening beats it but its been a while so I dont know which one was worse.
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10 minutes ago, Armagon said:
No offense but this is the most elitist thing you've said. I don't even know if i should take you seriously anymore.
Well it has, dude. GBA removed Skills did it fucking not? and I fucking love the GBA games
Does fates and awakening have gaiden maps and/or split routes? Did they also remove rescue AND shove? And I started with awakening. it has gone backwards. PoR went in the right direction and is the only game that added something new other then awakening with pair up which is awful. And people who complain about FoW in other games are casuals. it really is not that big of a deal and adds the unknown into the scene. I always liked FoW maps but that is just me. And all the maps that you dont like with warps are skippable their bad but unlike the wind map which is pure bullshit, I cant skip that one. First time playing thracia I skipped all the warp tiles. I keep on saying its not a big deal becuase it is not a big deal if you can just skip the shit maps which there are a grand total of 2. I dont get the deal with not being able to see the terrain of the map honestly though. Shit is dark deal with it and git gud. Or use a tourch like every other game. At least it does not have a sneak mission.
8 minutes ago, Levant Mir Celestia said:Bold: Ha. I can't see it when two of the SNES FEs are among the worst in the series IMO. The stench of elitism this statement reeks of is so nauseating, you're starting to look like you're not worth taking seriously any more...
Read above. Being an elitist has nothing to do with it. FE6 added Support convos and 9 added in Shove, both great additions but what did the awakening and fates add? Pair up which is an awful mechanic and replaced a great one (rescue) and face touching? While removing weapon weight, durability etc etc.
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The fact that being """forced""" to use other units because of the fatigue system bugs you, because the games wants you to use other units which once again anyone who has played the game will say its not a big deal turns you off and an optional chapter that is not that good turns you off is a petty and casual. Plenty of FE games have bad chapters. conquest has that fucking wind map which is pure cancer. and that's not optional. I get heal staves missing is lame and I agree but like anyone who has played FE5 will say it, just like the fatigue system is a non issue. you can buy stam pots ignoring the whole problem. And I never personally understood the hate of the FoW in Thracia, yea you cant see anything but so what? Get a torch and its a non issue. every one of your problems with the exception of warp tiles which is bs I will agree. But only chapter 24x and that one map in the forest have it, both optional. And yea I got confused with map 24 and 24x. I dont think I met the requirements to do it and/or just ran away from it. But its still optional and every game has a shit map or two. Like conquest. I dont understand how that is even a point against thracia when every game has a bad map.
Also to say the core of FE was improved upon by thracia is funny. GBA removed Skills and slightly brought them back in SS with some promoted classes having a skill or 2 and Kidnapping. Also Awakening removed Weapon weight AND rescue AND split routes AND gaiden chapters. I really dislike awakening and hate fates. The franchise has been on the decline after the Snes. Exception being PoR since it has skills, rescue and shove and support convos which I forgot to mention FE4 kinda laid the foundations for it. Also most lords have to work to get their weapon, Corrin just some how, because of fates awful writing gets his Yato because lol. But I dont want to get off topic here. But yea honestly I think we are just gonna end up going in circles and have been already.
The most underrated Fire emblem game
in NES and SNES Era
Posted · Edited by Emperor
Pretty sure half if not more maps of FE4, and if not maybe a third need you to defend it atleast once. And even then infantry dont suck as much as people say they do.
I love how liking hard games makes me an elitist. And I never played a Kirby game but if they the game is trivial then yea, it will hurt how I view it and how much I will like it. Which is why I prefer the old school Mario games then lets say, the Mario 3D world or the super Mario world line of games for the DS/3ds/Wii/Wii U.
And its not that it has to be hard, its just they cant be easy or atleast give me a nice challenge.