FE Dragun
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Posts posted by FE Dragun
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2 hours ago, ping said:
List of all stats that Oscar caps on average at Lv.20/20:
- Skl
List of all stats that Titania caps on average at Lv.20/20: nothing and not even close
Id appreciate you trying to provide more view points rather than just trying to discredit mine. And if you think you've said enough in favor of Titania over Oscar leave it to the other member's to decide plenty of other characters to discuss, such as my 6-10 selections
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9 minutes ago, Shadow Mir said:
One, I don't give a damn about ironman runs. It does nothing to change my viewpoint. Second, you're exaggerating Oscar's importance. Third, you're too fixated on the lategame and SHINY GREEN NUMBERS. Anyway, the fact that you stated that you had Oscar at level 14 by chapter 8 tells me you deliberately favored him. He starts at level 3 and would need two levels a chapter at least to get there when two of those chapters are heavy on axes (factoring in the fact that he's not available in chapters 3 and 4). That sounds rather dicey when even Ike, who's advantaged in those chapters, isn't doing so well.
You just seem ignorant Im just stating thats the way I do my tier list its an opinion on a videogame lets maybe be more civil. Out of curiosity how many Maniac playthroughs have you done?
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1 minute ago, Shadow Mir said:
I did start posting before you did, to be fair (or at least, I think I did). It took me a while to think of a phrasing that I consider satisfactory. And in the meantime, I was probably fooling around on other tabs as well.
Seth is still considered the best unit in Sacred Stones despite that. Admittedly, Sacred Stones is one of the easiest FE games, but still....
Also this is Maniac mode with Ironman being heavily involved in my decision making since that is technically the way the game works, and this is my thread. And yes if you get Titania killed in chapter 4 you are screwed but if Ike dies you lose the game so by that logic Ike is also the best. This game is so damn hard that not having Kieren or Oscar will be the death of you in late game and Titania doesnt need to kill everything to make it through those chapters she is there to clean up what the rookies cant. If Oscar dies Kieren and Ike become worse (Ike almost Useless unless he got maxed strength). So yes You cant win the game without Titania from chapters 1-7 but I dont think that makes her the best character. And Seth would get rocked In manaic mode that games too easy I think Titania could easily be Number 1 or 2 on hard mode but Maniac she just gets rocked late, you truly need every stat maxed out to perform at a high level.
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13 minutes ago, Crime and Punishment said:
Titania is hardly being competed against in all those first chapters, and it really takes Oscar a while to get going unless you're deliberately going out of your way to get him all those kills and Exp, which makes it easier to neglect the rest of your team (especially detrimental in MM, where there are like twice the amount of enemies). He definitely ends up better, but my point is that, at the end of the day, no one is competing against Titania for like 8 chapters straight, while Marcia/Oscar/Kieran/Jill are all competing against each other past that with the only real difference between them is having or not having flight.
Titania is easily the best character in the game in probably the hardest part of the game. You essentially need her, while past these points of the game, you can wing it with other characters and not really need to have to use Marcia, Oscar, Kieran or Jill.
I also don't recall BEXP being that huge until that jailbreak chapter (assuming you do things right)...
I dont think a prepromote carrying you through the first 8 chapters with 12 base strength makes them the best in the game, I think thats where we fundamentally disagree! The games built to have a unit hold the trainees hand during the beginning like FE 7 and FE 8 but it doesnt make Titania the best unit for the rest of the game thats 20 more chapters of Maniac mode. And its totally not true, you can not wing a Ironman play through on maniac mode with just any characters, you need those 4 mentioned, Im not saying Titania is trash obviously but dont you think you're over valuing a unit for being necessary through the early game?
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1 minute ago, Shadow Mir said:
I honestly think this is a tough sell because in general, being good early on is looked at as being better than being good late.
Thats not the case for Maniac mode in this game the enemies are just as strong as you in the last handful of chapters from 22 on this game does not hold back anything, and Oscar passes Titania around chapters 11-14 which is still early game I think Serenes Forest chapter 17 seperates boys from Men and Titania will end up being dragged along in the final chapters. Titania is good early but if you kill everything with her its a pitfall and you hinder your other units that need the EXP as soon as possible to surpass her and snowball which isnt that hard not saying you shouldnt use her but she gets almost the same exp as weakening a unit for Oscar or Soren to kill. So you can strengthen them together but if you lost Oscar at chapter 20 you'd poop your pants where as if Titania died youd say well atleast I still have my core of Oscar Kieren Marcia and Jill who I have trained and passed Titania.
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41 minutes ago, Aircalipoor said:
Everyone needs/wants the first BEXP dump to snowball. It is much better than distributing it. Kieran could become the best unit in an instant, but giving the bexp to Oscar or Marcia beforehand makes much more sense.
If you want Oscar to be good, you give him all BEXP on chapter 7 to get him to level 17-18. Then he kills stuff there (he can barely ORKO the southern cavaliers with forged javelin) and then he can reach level 21 halfway in chapter 9 when he is killing all the southern enemies on his way to the boss.
This makes him indeed one of the best units as you all noted. He is already better than Titania with 2 in the important stats and just gets better. I'm not ignoring that and put ranked him second, even above Jill (who has the flying advantage but has trouble reaching certain stats at the right time, especially speed and resistance).
Now why is Marcia better? Because flying and she can mostly mimic his offense. 23 Strength may seem like a low cap, but Oscar isn't surpassing it until level 20/18. He may get a few ORKOs in chapter 26 against those sick Paladins with a forged Silver Lance, but it is a minor thing as a whole (and not reliable, I'd rather let Kieran do it). Her defense isn't lacking behind, either. 20/5 Marcia has 14,75 defense, 20/5 Oscar 17,35. Draco-Shield and Angel Robes help. Marcia has 5 points more Resistance, making her one of the sturdier units against magic attacks. Oscar has to rely on having Ike in reach, which isn't always feasible.
11: Can avoid the hellish passage in the west that are blocked by ton of enemies (takes Oscar a long time to beat them), by flying slightly north over the river.
12: To be fair, even an unpromoted Marcia can kill Seeker fairly quick, but a promoted one can do more stuff.
15: The best unit to reach and kill Muarim, aside form some weird shove strats that get a Laguzslayer or magic unit to him.
17-2: Easy ecape
17-4: Only a flyer can reach the heavily guarded Oliver, the other units have to take the long route to the swamp.
19: Can reach Homasa easier
20: Can skip the whole mountain pass and even if reaching and killing Shiharam with flyers alone is difficult, at the very least she can attack some of the long distcane mages and retreat.
21: Incredible important to have the other units fly over the water, has a better resistance against the sleep users.
23: No issues with the pitfalls
24: Reaching the castle asap is top priority. She can dodge fairly reliable, considering that maniac mode enemies mostly use steel weapons and javelins.
25: Pretty obvious. She can attack and retreat, beating many long distance enemies. Regarding the quote, arrow weakness is almost never an issue as the Full Guard comes before ballisticas and wind magic become an actual threat.
Finale: Can transfer Ike to Ashnard with little issues.
Oscar being better in an iron man run because of earth avoid, sun and better HP, I can see that and I would let him snail through the game then. Iron Man isn't my criteria, if there are some risky strats to low turn a chapter fairly reliable within a very short time for each approach, I would go for it. Enemies in maniac mode have still hit issues and dodge tanking is a thing.
I think you nailed Marcia's strengths to a T but you are not acknowledging her lack of front lining ability which goes hand in hand with receiving exp and snowballing, Marcia is simply a lethal offensive Unit that will most likely be the best up until last couple chapters (at killing), Jill with A axes and higher damage and Speed destroys Marcia but its not a for sure thing with Jill whereas I feel Marcia is very Consistent in doubling, Marcia isnt stopping the 10 Wyvern Lords on Maniac mode rushing you with all silver on clash where as Units Like Oscar, Kieren, and Gatrie can handle them, Im not saying that makes her bad I just think she cant do as much as Oscar or Kieren on the defensive end and its not like Oscar and Kieren have a problem with offense, its not like they cant start running amok on the enemy lines just like Marcia just little more restricted. In summary Marcia is #1 in offense for the majority of the play through but her lack of defense holds her back from being taking the top spot. And I dont expect everyone to Ironman but when Discussing a units tier in the game I think survivability should be a big factor
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9 hours ago, Aircalipoor said:
Didn't know a Tier List discussion only deals with five units, a bit more to work with would be preferable.
My intuitive take would be Marcia>Oscar>Kieran>Titania>Jill.
Ill for sure add more to the list and give detailed explanations.
And I see we got the same top 5 they are all great units but I think your favoritism shows a bit with Marcia she is lethal but she cant handle as much attacks as Oscar or Kieren so that is why I think she isnt as good, she cant front line like the red and green rangers
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10 hours ago, ping said:
I think I'm done here.
10 hours ago, ping said:
I think I'm done here.
Ok it was more of an example of how Oscar can snowball early not always but can, that has to count for something, and ok look up the stats for when Titania is level 7 and Oscar level 1 Paladin I got Oscar to Paladin at chapter 11 and he clearly out scales her judging by how you use averages to compare units, and lets say it took you to get to chapter 14 to get Oscar Promoted Titania would have to be around lvl 9 at most and there bases are very similar with Oscar having a little less speed and more defense. So id argue that the remaining chapters from 15 on are more important than the previous 14 so its pretty clear Oscar is the better character going off of how you rate characters would he not? I think Im done here 🙂
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12 hours ago, Julian Teehee said:
It's not a tier list, if the list isn't explained.
Fair enough ill give a detailed explanation for my top 5 and add the rest of the list for Maniac mode and My tier list is based on an Ironman mentality, so characters that die easy arent as good due to survivability issues as well as no forge glitch abuse or tome crit glitch, I also do not include stat boosting items, and I expect you to use maxed damage forged weapons.
1.Oscar - Oscar in Maniac Mode is the totem for your team. Oscar is a staple on any team but what makes him the best unit Is his early join time combined with good growths. Oscar can snowball unlike any other early game character(Due to him being a paladin), If you commit into Oscar which you should since you will use him anyways. Early game you have a lot of chapters to feed this guy experience and can get Oscar promoted to a paladin around the time Kieren Joins in chapter 11. Being a low level early unit Oscar has potential to get great level ups and spiral out of control whereas Titania is on a more linear path of usually having the same output. Once Oscar promotes to paladin and lets say you didn't get him promoted at chapter 11 lets say chapter 14, thats still 18 chapters of outpacing Titania and Id argue that the last 18 chapters are more important than the first 14. If thats not enough Oscar has earth affinity which raises EVO by high amounts, can pair it with Ike since both have the great affinity(Pretty much only way Ike does anything till Ragnell), and Kieren who becomes insane due to the overall avoidance gained from being close to Oscar, and yes its crucial when you play Ironman and have to eat 2 long range tome attacks a turn. Oscar will be your best character up until whenever Kieren Stats catch up, then Kieren with the normally higher stats and earth affinity support bonus from Oscar will be one of the toughest units to kill.
2. Kieren - Better Oscar but Joins later! Kieren joins chapter 11 at level 12 and is ready to go out the gate. By the time you get him he can already hold his own and in a short while can take on hoards of enemies. Being a paladin makes you an amazing unit in general especially in this game. Paladins have it all, they have canto and great stats all around. Kieren gets Axes which is a sizable early game damage buff, he also comes with rather good bases and great growths. You will find Kieren to be your best Unit late game if supported with Oscar he can tank enemies like crazy and his avoidance is really high so its tough to get him killed. Kieren will stay ahead of the pack easily being level 12 and having a lot of utility, you will find he is most likely 1 of your earliest promotions due to how much he can contribute. Knights ward also ensures Speed growths and more survivability.
3. Marcia - She is loved by many and misunderstood by few, Marcia is the standard for a good Pegasus Rider. Flying and Canto obviously great. Its hard discussing units because this game on maniac is so hard its almost like comparing who has less flaws. Marcia is great only issues is ballista's or long range tomes and on maniac mode there are several. The main reason Oscar and Kieren are better than the 2 flying girls is due to them being able to tank everything a lot better and earth affinity. Marcia also has a chance to get strength screwed she is pretty dependent on every strength lvl up to snowball efficiently. Marcia is great though she is one of few units that can traverse the map as a flyer, can rescue drop, 9 move, really fast and comes at a early enough time to get her going right after Oscar. Marcia does look like crap at first that cant hit hard but we all know what she turns into once trained.
4. Jill - Tough calling this one due to Jill being overall a lot more tanky than Marcia, but Jill suffers from join time, and getting speed screwed or not being able to double as efficiently as Marcia. If Jill does get good speed growths wow will she devour souls. Jill is very similar to Marcia and looks better on paper but the fact Marcia will always double makes her the better character. Jill hits very hard and is tanky like Cavaliers she just has less speed and HP both are crucial and Oscar and Kieren are rolling at this point before she joins, you cant really snowball with Jill because there are a lot of units to train when she joins but clearly she is great being top 5.
5. Titania - The Queen herself is a crucial part of the early game and using her correctly can be the difference. It is best to feed kills to Oscar or Soren with Titania, use poleaxe or some other heavy weapon you get early and you will never double so she can feed kills by using that awful weapon. Titania is overpowered first half and falls off heavy late in Maniac mode, Hard Mode she is fine the whole way through. In maniac every stat counts trust me its that tough, you will find your units with maxed out damage and speed fail to even one round most enemies. Titania can just not deal with the late game onslaught like Oscar and Kieren can due to earth affinity and higher stats due to them being trained. Titania has really no flaws other than the massive difficulty curve on Maniac. Titania is also not a unit that can randomly have amazing growths like the top 4, she is on a more set path due to the lack of level ups she receives.
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1 minute ago, ping said:
Oscar barely catches up to base level Titania before promotion. His stats are a bit better, but Titania's +1 move and weapon triangle control make up for that. The claim that Oscar overtakes her as early as chapter 8-10 is dubious at best.
Well Im more going off of Maniac mode the sheer amount of EXP Oscar can get is insane it makes him snowball like crazy where as Titania does not get that EXP like oscar so yes you can use Titania easily to navigate through the early parts but investing it into Oscar will give you a far better unit through the mid game and he surpasses her easily before promotion any Cav leveled to 21 will have better bases than Titania. At Chapter 8 on Maniac Mode my Oscar was level 14 and Titania was Level 4 Oscars stats have surpassed her by alot at this point and the lack of weapon triangle and movement range doesn't really hinder him as much due to map restrictions and the fact its still early game My oscar had maxed damage 20 at level 18 before being able to promote, Titania is safe and reliable top 5 sure but she cant do what Oscar can do, not to mention the very overpowered earth affinity that he shares with Kieren another amazing unit and Ike a must deploy.
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12 minutes ago, ping said:
Having played only western HM:
1-3 - Marcia, Titania, Jill (which is the order I would pick, but I can see arguments for any other one)
4 - Oscar
5 - Reyson
6 - KieranAfter that, I'm already rather unsure how to weigh things. Boyd and Soren have excellent availability and, after a couple levels, great combat. How does that measure up against Astrid or Makalov, who join in the midgame, with more average combat (which means that they're still able to 1v10 enemies) but are mounted?
I think hard mode and maniac mode are different when discussing a units viability i lean towards an Ironman mentality of how easy it is to keep them alive. On hard mode since its the only version you played (Understandably) I can see your tier list being pretty accurate to a lot of people I still think Oscar Kieren and Titania are better then Marcia and Jill due to growths and Overall Tankyness. but as for after #6 it gets interesting, on hard mode Id say Astrid and Makalov are realllly good. Boyd's growths kinda doo doo I mean 25% defense as a front liner? Thank god he comes so early but he will fall off and has no horse, you will find that you will need to invest a speedwing or something like that to keep Boyd as relevant as other Units. Soren is good but Mist is better Mages arent Mages in this game they are healers that can occasionally stop healing, also Soren has laughable defense Mine had like 8 at Clash on Maniac and I trained the crap out of him. Astrid on hard mode is easy money just poke with bows canto away and pick up some easy kills with paragon she will outpace other units in levels and once she promotes you have another Cavalier with good stats all around that you put minimal effort into. Makalov is a little harder to use due to his join time and the next map being a desert map which ruins his movement, he will suck for a little bit but use him right in chapter 17 and he can snowball into an amazing cavalier like Kieren, I think Makalov trained for end game is the 2nd best unit behind Kieren. On maniac mode Makalov is insanely hard to get going and Astrid is very easy to get killed, both still very good but a lot harder to use whereas Oscar and Kieren are easier to use on Maniac.
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43 minutes ago, AnonymousSpeed said:
Is okay.
When analyzing the quality of Jeigans, though, we must consider the effort they save in the early game, before Oscar and Kieran achieve notable competency.
Understandable but in maniac she doesnt hold up (from chapters 22 or 23 till endgame something like that)which is a big chunk of the late game you will find she is not nearly as good as your other trained units, she clearly is necessary for an early part of the game but I just did a Maniac play though and am uploading it with live commentary on my channel of the same name (FE Dragun) I actually got her killed in chapter 8 and am still continuing the Ironman run currently on chapter 27 (ive only uploaded up until chapter 10 so far as im typing this). Oscar has already surpassed her at this point and once Oscar passes her which isnt hard he snowballs uncontrollably as for Kieren it can be debatable but Kieren comes at lvl 12 with good bases and a good join time (CH11) and will most definitely be your best late game unit. Pretty much how it usually works Titania is best unit for chapters 1-9 Oscar from 10-23 and Kieren for late game
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Im also gonna throw up my rankings from 6-10
6. Reyson 7. Mist 8. Gatrie 9. Soren 10. Maurim
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2 hours ago, Dark Holy Elf said:
I agree with that top five offhand (Reyson is also good, but does join later and plays a different role so is hard to compare), although I think Titania should be higher if that list is in order. I haven't played Maniac but from what I gather that's especially true there.
It is in order and I can tell you have a high IQ on this game throwing Reyson in the mix, Personally i think Titania is very overrated and is worse on maniac compared to hard, Id argue she might be better than Jill and Marcia on hard mode, but on Maniac her bases do not hold up for late game you need maxed out stats to be able to perform at a high level and Titania rarely reaches them, Every single paladin in the game will have better stats then her and she does not provide a earth affinity like Oscar does which indirectly buffs Kieren as well. Titania is obviously good for many reasons but I think she gets too much credit for being the best unit when Oscar and Kieren are miles ahead in my opinion.
Sorry For double posting Im learning how to use Serenes Forest Im new haha
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It is in order and I can tell you have a high IQ on this game throwing Reyson in the mix, Personally i think Titania is very overrated and is worse on maniac compared to hard, Id argue she might be better than Jill and Marcia on hard mode, but on Maniac her bases do not hold up for late game you need maxed out stats to be able to perform at a high level and Titania rarely reaches them, Every single paladin in the game will have better stats then her and she does not provide a earth affinity like Oscar does which indirectly buffs Kieren as well. Titania is obviously good for many reasons but I think she gets too much credit for being the best unit when Oscar and Kieren are miles ahead in my opinion.
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Curious to hear everyone's top 5 and Discuss our choices personally i believe the top 5 characters for maniac and hard mode are
1.Oscar 2. Kieren 3. Marcia 4. Jill 5. Titania
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Hello I am a new Fire Emblem Content Creator and am currently doing an Ironman lets play of Path of Radiance Maniac mode, and look to continue doing ironman runs of all the Fire Emblem games hardest difficulties. Here is a link my channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqIqqSKFIx806GBptkW98cQ
and this is the link to the 1st video of the lets play
I hope some of you take the time to check out the channel and subscribe, I love Fire Emblem and I hope you like the content enough to stick around!
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Hello I am a new Fire Emblem Content Creator and am currently doing an Ironman lets play of Path of Radiance Maniac mode, and look to continue doing ironman runs of all the Fire Emblem games hardest difficulties. Here is a link my latest video https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqIqqSKFIx806GBptkW98cQ
I hope some of you take the time to check out the channel and subscribe, I love Fire Emblem and I hope you like the content enough to stick around!
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Im always down for a debate! Currently Doing A maniac Ironman on my channel of the same name so I know my stuff!
Path of Radiance Maniac Tier List Discussion
in Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance
Posted · Edited by Parrhesia
Well I think when discussing Viability personally I think you should include an Ironman mentality, because Marcia or Jill are amazing and can fly all the way to the objective and or boss, then complete the chapter easily, but if you fail you just restart so that's my issue, restarting is kind of cheating when discussing how good a unit is if you have to risk getting them killed for them to actually be good. It doesn't change what they are capable of but you most certainly add more of a chess strategy and really dissect your Units down to who is the most useful. And swiftly winning on Maniac mode is a death sentence unless you are in late game and have good EXP all around, the EXP is crucial due to the enemies having really high bases and all silver with 2 range, So I think Maniac Mode swift Wins are primarily out of the question until late game chapter 24 on something like that.
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I feel like I put a solid case up for Oscar over Titania, its fine you disagree but you are completely disregarding the points I put up, so to say I don't have much of a leg to stand on, doesn't make sense, or both, seems Ignorant to me but maybe what Im saying makes absolutely no sense and Oscar is bottom 5, its debatable is all im saying, and I never said Ike was best im confused by your wording here but Ike is doo doo and not even top 20 or 25 most likely, which sucks because he is the coolest main character in the series. Maurim is very debatable and I would down grade him on Hard but Maniac, If you are Using Maurim (surely you gave him the Demi Band so transforming is not an issue) he is very basic but his bases and Join time just make him super usable throughout most of the game. As a unit you dont need to train and hits pretty hard as well as being a potential front liner he easily fits into a team, also the lack of forging on him is kind of a buff on maniac because I always find that you can never forge for everyone, and there as so many enemies with high bases you cant tear through without maxed out damage weapons so they dont last long, but its debatable whether Id put Volke or Geoffrey at 10 but Maurim grabs the spot for the reasons I mentioned, If Volke could do any Damage or didnt get Held back till CH 19 I would bump him way up.