cheetah7071 Posted July 4, 2009 Share Posted July 4, 2009 Speaking of archetypes, here's one that I see in a ton of games, but have never seen anybody but myself bring up: the Minerva. It's not like the similarities between the characters is as superficial as "early mage". Minerva is a female Dracoknight with red hair, who is a recruitable enemy, and shows up as an enemy in a chapter before the one you recruit her in. Altenna is a female Dracoknight (missing the red hair), who is a recruitable enemy, and shows up as an enemy in a chapter before the one you recruit her in. Miredy is a female Dracoknight with red hair, who is a recruitable enemy, and while she doesn't actually show up on the map as an enemy in previous chapters, you see her flying around on said maps in the cutscenes. Vaida is a female Dracoknight (missing the red hair), who is a recruitable enemy, and shows up as an enemy in a chapter before the one you recruit her in. Cormag misses everything but recruitable enemy Dracoknight, probably doesn't qualify. Jill is a female Dracoknight with red hair, who is a recruitable enemy, and shows up as an enemy in a chapter before the one you recruit her in. I think I see enough of a pattern to at least claim the developers included deliberate throwbacks in this character set, and that's all an archetpye is, really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dondon151 Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 Don't forget Heath, a female dragon knight with- I mean, dragon knight that's a dude and recruitable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEnd Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 (edited) Except Sigurd has 10 more levels to grow than Oifaye does. Admittedly, Oifaye's bases are drastically better (like 8 more DEF and shit). Oifaye's problems were always just getting overshadowed by characters with better growths, which makes Seth all the more impressive in 8 because he doesn't get overshadowed. Or just shows how busted-ass FE4's children were. Read again. Your "except" doesn't fit anywhere. Edited July 5, 2009 by Tiena Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reikken Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 No archetypes, or 9001 archetypes. Whatever. You can have the "Jeigan" archetype of 'starting paladin who starts out stronger than anyone else but soon becomes weak', populated by Jeigan and maybe Marcus. (did I miss anyone?) You can have the "Jeigan" archetype of 'starting paladin', populated by Jeigan, Oifaye, Marcus, Seth, and Titania. You can have the "Jeigan" archetype of 'starting strong dude who rides on a horse', populated by Jeigan, Sigurd, Cuan, Oifaye, Marcus, Seth, and Titania. (maybe others?) You can have the "Jeigan" archetype of 'unit who joins near the beginning and starts out stronger than anyone else', populated by *the above mentioned plus Eyvel, Sothe, etc.* You can have the "Jeigan" archetype of 'prepromote who starts out among the strongest', populated by *all those mentioned so far, plus the likes of Zealot, Echidna, Shinon, etc.* ETC In other words, nothing is official, so don't act like it is. Arguing over who is or isn't whatever archtype is just arguing over how you yourself like to classify the units. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandjackal Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 Don't forget Heath, a female dragon knight with- I mean, dragon knight that's a dude and recruitable. Not that Legault cares. Claims Heath might not be a girl, but he can certainly squeal like one. Lulz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEnd Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 In other words, nothing is official, so don't act like it is. Arguing over who is or isn't whatever archtype is just arguing over how you yourself like to classify the units. I remember some talk about a couple archetypes being official, actually. Or do you really think everything is just a big coincidence? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ike-Mike Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 I remember some talk about a couple archetypes being official, actually. http://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?...st&p=439280 It'd be cool if someone with actual knowledge in Japanese would translate it though so we can know what IS considers to be the Jeigan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEnd Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 (edited) http://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?...st&p=439280It'd be cool if someone with actual knowledge in Japanese would translate it though so we can know what IS considers to be the Jeigan. (編注:シリーズを通して、序盤の主人公を導いてくれる強いキャラクターがいる。初代作品ではジェイガンというおじいさんキャラだったので、以降この役割を持つキャラは名前に関わらず通称ジェイガンと呼ばれている) Note: Throughout the series, there are some strong characters who guide the protagonists when they're beginning. Since the first one was an old man called Jeigan, the later characters who hold the same role are nicknamed Jeigans as well. Edited July 5, 2009 by Tiena Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reikken Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 (edited) I remember some talk about a couple archetypes being official, actually.Or do you really think everything is just a big coincidence? Eh what? I'm not implying that all unit similarities are coincidence. How are you getting that? Edited July 5, 2009 by Reikken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VincentASM Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 (edited) There are some official archetypes, but nobody cares about them : / Take IS's Jeigan for instance. Not to mention the "red and green knights", where apparently the red and green knights get swapped in some games because their stats don't match up...! I think the point is the archetypes people talk about are a pure fan derivation and thus some people (myself included) think they're an utter waste of time. That and the archetype specifications and character inclusions are horribly inconsistent to say the least. Edited July 5, 2009 by VincentASM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capracanis Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 Titania's deconstruction is that not only is she a woman, but A female Paladin that isn't subpar, compare to Midia or Isadora, and also isn't an old geezer like Jeigan or Marcus. Jaigen is laughable and the achetypes are indeed useless. A Lv20 Jaigen get's skull-fucked by a Lv1 Seth any day. There's only so much you can do before it's repetitive. For example, Radd is a low-lv Myrm with short hair and does not ahve a Killer weapon. Does that mean he's not an 'archtype'? I mean, shit. Even the Final Fantasy series has it's own. Each game has their own similarities. I mean, Guy, Joshua, Zihark, Navarre, Rutger all come with Killer Swords. But really, to make it a pain in the ass, what else can you really give them? FE9 did detach from some archetypes. For example, Rolf was...something to behold...in comparison to previous archers. If they wanted to change shit, they could give us a long-haired horse rider early in-game (unlike Arran in FE:SD who joins late and still sucks). I think, to make FE more interesting, they should start you off with a Draco Knight or a Wyvern Lord instead of a Paladin. I mean, it's bad enough that every game has your enemy being the continent where the Wyverns are from. Even in Fe10 the bastards move back to Begnion, ffs. It's getting pretty boring having the same shit over again but hey, as a fan of the series, I'm still gonna buy this shit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodykitty Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 Rolf is a spiritual successor to FE3's Ryan... And far worse due to not joining in Ch. 1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capracanis Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 Rolf is a spiritual successor to FE3's Ryan... And far worse due to not joining in Ch. 1. Yeah but he looks really gay. That's why I choose Seth over Franz. I have this thing with children in Fire Emblem being stronger than adults. I mean, Rofl is 14 and to 20/20 him makes him better than Shinon who's 27 and taught him to use a bow...Franze looks like a frigging tweenager and yet at lv20 Cavalier has about 5-7 more Hp than a lv1 Seth. I'm all about the growth rates and shit but get fucking real. If you're going to do that, at least give our prepromotes some Growths over or near 100% or extend their cap to lv30. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodykitty Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 You seem to have a thing against pre-promotes that aren't overpowered or broken/borderline-broken. I never mentioned any pre-promote, though. I only mention Ryan, who is Gordin's younger brother, and in fact, an Archer, not a Sniper or any form of pre-promote. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alacalibur Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 How the hell has Sirius not been mentioned AT ALL??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodykitty Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 I don't think Sirius is his own archetype. He's probably the first uber Jeigan, maybe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just call me AL Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 But say if Sirius had his own archtype, do you think the list would be FE3: Sirius FE4 part I: Cuan FE4 part II: Finn FE6: Percival FE9: Geoffrey FE10: Renning I'm not sure about any other similar units, but say if there were a Sirius archtype, would these guys qualify? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodykitty Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 Didn't even think about any of them... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RPG Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 But say if Sirius had his own archtype, do you think the list would be FE3: Sirius FE4 part I: Cuan FE4 part II: Finn FE6: Percival FE9: Geoffrey FE10: Renning I'm not sure about any other similar units, but say if there were a Sirius archtype, would these guys qualify? Well, a Sirius archetype would have to join much earlier than Percival, Geoffrey, and Renning. I think the Sirius archetype doesn't exist, it isn't really well defined. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodykitty Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 Actually, Cuan is a pretty nice fit. Both him and Sirius are excellent units and are Paladins, and Cuan has good join time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dondon151 Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 Cuan isn't that good =_= Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alacalibur Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 (edited) If people discuss an Oifaye Archetype, It needs to be named after Sirius, and Include: FE3: Sirius FE4 part I: Cuan FE4 part II: Finn, Oifaye FE6: Percival FE7:Marcus* FE8: Seth FE9: Titania *Meh, He is borderline Jeigan, Borderline Sirius. Edited July 8, 2009 by TheCilver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roxas Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 Finn could be a Sirius, he could not. Depends if you promoted him in the 1st gen or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEnd Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 There's only one Sirius. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DragonBladeSniper Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 There's only one Sirius. and he is on this forum site. From the looks of it, the Sirius archetype = strong paladins (pre-promoted) who come early, if that's the case then Renning and FE9 Geoffrey don't go in that since they come late. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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