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Fia

By Fia
in Far from the Forest...

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Colonel M Contributor

Colonel M

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STOP THE PRESSES!!!

Grandjackal turned down an Armor Knight!

P.S. Oh yeah finished Battle 19. I almost beat it last time but used the Power Ring one too many times.

Edited by Colonel M
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Colonel M Contributor

Colonel M

Posted
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:O

Did he play the SNES FEs yet?

Nah he was just playing Shining Force. He turned down Guntz.

Good Jackal. He is learning very quickly.

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Rodykitty Newbie

Rodykitty

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Did he play the SNES FEs yet?

No I'm not jumping the gun, I easily see him bottom tier. I just wish to ask, how much action is he seeing? Way I see it...

Prologue-He could be near the left side by the time Sigurd captures the south castle. He basically just goes left. Maybe I'm misremembering the size of the map, but I don't think it's that troublesome. There are random bandits strewn about the left side, he could cut up a couple people on the way.

Chapter 1-Well, he goes south for the first wave, and from there he will see probably no action. That is unless he goes back up north to help the cross knights fight Elliot's group. They don't show up till later in the chapter, Arden's got plenty of time to twiddle his thumbs. Perhaps Azel could help, if he weren't so flimsy.

Chapter 2-Well like every foot soldier, he's probably not seeing action until Makeley (third castle?). So he's up there being tough, fighting various foot soldiers, laughing at the ballistae and swordfighters. Once all's said and done, he could go north to help fight Zane's force and then warp him to the first boss's castle, or just warp him immediately, as the pursuit ring is just a stone's throw away from that area.

Chapter 3-Well there's a group to the right that's annoying that he could help take out with other noob characters. Immediately, he can head back left for when the cross knights invade. Money says he's never going north unless you purposefully exclude him fro the cross knight skirmish and just have him head up north. Until someone gets the money to buy his ring, he has no reason not to keep it until then.

Chapter 4-Lol, Sylesia. Can Arden even climb mountains? He's helping rescue citizens and fighting a couple of the southern axers, that's it.

Chapter 5 Finale-He's close to doing very little. I suppose he can charge the generals on the left side, but someone has to rescue those villages first, so he's not even sole claimer to that. He might not see any action outside the arena. Only thing he can really do is go to his special spot if you're having someone make babies with him to get a measily 5 skill.

I dunno, maybe I just have a soft spot for armor knights, but he is able to see some action at least. Speaking of though, the arena isn't really a bad place for him. Starting with a slim sword, he's packing 21 mt, which is almost Noish with a lance. 36 HP and 13 Def make him the most durable of your team outside of perhaps Sigurd. At base, he has 100 hit. If the enemy has 0 avoid, he can't miss (thank you weapon weight system). 9 avoid ain't pretty, but it's the hit that matters. Chapter 1, he can't even start missing until the 4rth fight, of which he still has 80 hit on. The dude has 20 mt, doing 7x2 damage to Arden, a 3RKO. This is assuming he's still at base, with his 90 HP and 40 Def growth. He could have seen a bit of action in prologue, and the past 3 arena fights were a cinch. He could easily have gotten and HP and Def proc, 37 HP and 14 Def. 6x2=12, a 4RKO. Arden could have gotten a strength proc as well for 22 mt to this dude's 8 Def and 40 HP. 14 damage, a 3RKO. If he proc'd two Str, that's a 2RKO. Bacchus is an axe armor with 86 hit, adding Arden's 9 avoid and WTA, that's 57 hit. 30 mt seems scary even to Arden, but basically he's missing every other shot. Arden's 22 mt to this dude's 13 Def is 9 to his 53 HP, 6RKO. Considering missing factors, Bacchus is liekly needing 6 attempts to pull the same, but the fact luck might not be on Bacchus's side shows that Arden at least has a chance here. Emil the wind mage with the speed ring and Elwind? Yeah, not gonna get past that. 5 kills. That's about a level and a half.

Chapter 2, axe fighter's cake, fire mage is cake, lance knight is cake. Swordfighter just seems like a clone of Shark, but generally changes little. Heltsok might be a different story, as now lances are the problem as now Arden's not dodging. Doesn't hit as hard, but the fact he probably won't miss and is far tougher poses a roadblock for Arden here.

Chapter 3-Well, no reason he shouldn't have the pursuit ring for this one. Tragedy is, first dude he fights has 5 AS, and Arden starts with a base of 3. He needs 10 levels to double that. It's possible, though it's not like the dude's 19 mt is a problem to Arden by now. Axe fighter's an even bigger joke now that Arden's got the ring. Next dude is a swordfighter who is an exact clone of the last guy, except now he has a steel blade. The dude has 8 AS so he will be doubling, and 27 mt is actually sort of scary to Arden. Then again, if we assume 10 levels, he's got 45 HP and 17 def. It's a defense shy of making it a 5RKO. Arden still with his short sword would have about 26 mt to this dude's 9 Def and 45 HP. 3RKO. So actually, he's not doing that bad, but that's if we're assuming Arden's basically level 13. Steel armor with 30 mt shows up, Arden's got the pursuit ring now. With assumed stats above, this enemy having 58 HP and 15 Def, it's a 4RKO vs a 4-3RKO. Since Arden strikes first, he could actually win this one. Then comes the asshole with Jormungand...Either way, 4 kills for a level and aproxamately a fifth.

Chapter 4-Already runs intoa problem with the first fight, some asshole with Elwind. 24 mt sounds like a dealbreaker. Maybe after he rescues some survivors, he can pull off a win. Either way, Pursuit ring is starting to look useless on him anyways, so he might as well sell it. After him, he could easily eat through the paladin. But then comes the asshole forest knight with a 29 mt attack and Adept, of which has a 14% chance of activating, then Nikita with the hero lance, then friggin' mage knight. At best, he's getting 2 here.

Chapter 5-First dude is a swordfighter named Jackal, a slightly stronger clone of the following assholes. Arden won't have a hard time. Arden also shouldn't have any problem with the warrior. General Geese he can double if he still has the pursuit ring, but it's a questionable fight. 32 Mt, high HP with 18 Def and Great Shield might be trouble. No wall in hell he's beating the forrest knight with his Adept, high mt (19 Str with a thunder sword), and 42 sickening avoid. 2, 3 is a maybe.

I dunno, I guess what I'm trying to see is that at least when Arden sees action, he's not liable to die. His hits also tend to be painful (hits almost as hard as Noish with a lance at base), and he at first doesn't have too hard a time in the arena. I'd say this is better than Tltyu who basically has the same problems, except A. She needs to be attacked to have "offense", and from there, B. she is a magical archer versus a tank. I could send Arden on a couple solo missions if I pleased, I have to have a babysitter for Tiltyu at all times.

He also has plenty of time to develop a relationship for financial reasons, though the chances of that are incredibly slim...

I dunno, I just did a playthrough. After taking the first fort in the prologue, Arden was close enough to help Lex tank the left side. The bottleneck strategy is slow, If you're gonna draw them out, you need someone tough. Lex is generally as durable as your other cavs save Alec, but then again he's probably the worst dodger, so whatever hits he takes, he has to suck it down. I should note I took the fort at turn 9.

There's a huge swarm, and they generally have 19 ATK the axers. The archers have 17 ATK. Arden has 36 HP, 13 Def base. Arden is 6RKOd. axes have 70 hit. WTA, drops it down to 50 (because the triangle in this game is insane). Enemy skill is negated by Arden's speed, the 3 luck drops them to 47 hit. It's not reliable, but it's safe to say this will dodge some attacks. 6RKOd by axers, 9RKOd by archers, and he has decent chances at dodging axes. Needless to say, he can safely draw them out while keeping them pinned at the river, so I don't have to fight them out in the open. Thus, I have them trapped, and easily taken out. I beat prologue in 16 turns.

I'm pretty sure without Arden having drawn them out, this chapter either wouldn't have gone as quickly, or wouldn't have been as easy. So Arden can actually help in prologue by a measurable deal. When Tiltyu arrives, those with that low a move probably are never gonna see much action, and even if she did I doubt she's speeding up any process to make a chapter go any faster.

Basically, at least Arden has a bit of prologue.

I still say Arden's better than Tiltyu...But yeah, Diedre can be above both. Silencing a Fenrir boss, a Sleep Staff boss, sounds better than what the other two do (prologue tanking for Arden, masturbation for Tiltyu, or might as well be ince she adds nothing special to the team, nor does anything noteworthy to make up for it any time soon).

Canto is nice. However, I do believe we overrate move. Allow me to describe.

Basically move means how important you are in PART of a chapter, not all of it. Granted it's much more important in Gen 1 than 2 (chapter 1 is good until the forest of which they are at the forest first despite being slowed down severely), chapter 3's bargain ring being a fate decided by mounts, and the fact chapter 5 is pretty much over after Langbart), but it still has the aspect of "mounts can't be everywhere" deal. It's especially true for this game due to map size and how the game functions.

Chapter 2's a perfect example. It's huge, but also road heavy. Gets the mounts up north quick. The map is theirs for this time. However, thanks to roads and the hugeness of the map, it still takes about 22 turns to take over McBeth (dickhead general with the defense ring...). I have gotten Arden to the ring and back to Mackeley in that time, ready to fight in that particular battle. The mounts are still all the way back in McBeth. Now you might say "Sigurd still has to march his ass all the way back", and I say he could take Mackeley almost lightning quick thanks to the foot soldier effort without the need of mounts thanks to the Return Staff, as Evans is closer to Mackeley than McBeth. You could do this with other mounts, but this doesn't stop the fact that Sigurd is first priority, and they will be a turn behind Sigurd. By the time they arrive with Sigurd, the action's already over.

Chapter 3, Madino and Silvall. One's north, one's west. One is far away enough to require mounts. The other is perfect for the foot soldiers. Ethlin returns Sigurd for Silvall, Edin Warps him back to Madino afterwards. Ogrehill I suppose is for the mounts. Though as a note to help the chapter go faster while reaping ultimate reward, Warping Dew to Madino and returning Bridget for Edin to talk to that much easier. Either way you can warp whoever you want to Madino simply because it's better to wait for the Wind Sword (hey, it's helping someone).

Chapter 4, Mounts have north, but foot soldiers have south. It's hard not to justify this. The only excuse is Return Staff.

Chapter 5...Well, the chapter's pretty much over after you beat Langbart.

Ok, so mount is nice, but there are times where foot soldiers are you only option. Essentially, think it this way. For some castles, your deployed units are mounts, with a couple foot soldiers. Other castles it's foot soldiers. Both cannot be with one another at times due to different missions. At times mounts can't do anything because they are too far away.

Ok, maybe I have come to the weirder conclusion of this topic. I think Ethlin and Edin should be a bit higher simply due to nature, map function, and that Return/Warp speeds up things immensely. Ethlin is pretty much the reason Sigurd is able to be everywhere (and some other mounts), Edin is the same except it's when foot soldiers are the main group rather than mounts.

Like..Ethlin in top and Edin in upper mid. I don;t see Bowulf able to pull off Warping hax, which shaves a good number of turns off. Ethlin in top due to nautre, Return, and such saff use helping Bridget get her ungodly weapon while still completing hte map efficiently. Return staff makes chapter 2, 3 and 4 go by like greased lightning.

It's not really an advantage, because the other half the mounts are too far away. It's like a catch 22. Foot soldiers during that other half of "waiting" are helping out their part of a chapter just as much as mounts would be in their parts. It's not really an advantage when you're not helping the other half of the map. You can't have both I guess is what I'm trying to say.

Granted for some first generation, it does sort of favor mounts in the sense that it gives you the prize of a Bargain Ring in chapter 2, and that they still go through the forest faster since they got there first (though foot soldiers I've had catch up, all while not slowing myself down. Even Azel got there, meaning Arden could too. Granted, not having a range option at that time makes it a bad choice for Arden who should go north and just start punching Augustrians in the face). Chapter 1 is rather chaotic in nature of which I'd say it's a hard call and just say both cooperate beautifully, and chapter 5 the chapter's pretty much over after Langbalt. 2 (save the bargain ring), 3 and 4? Both are equal pay off you could say. I suppose it's a bit hard to explain...

However, my conclusion for this is that the Warp and Return staff are better than you think for these maps, as it helps Sigurd capture castles that much faster, and can help aliveate the "I can't make it to the next source of action" problem. Therefore it really effects Edin and Ethlin more.

Go take McBeth, Return Sigurd to Evans and look how much closer to Makeley he is. Take Madino, return him to Agusty, see how much closer he is to Silvall. Return Bridget, look how closer she is to Edin. Return Sigurd back to Sylesia's home base castle, look how closer to the south castle he is after the loooong treck north.

Do you see how much effort and time she saves you? This IS an efficiency list after all, correct?I don't see many who are just able to use a staff and just shave turns off like that except for Edin during the foot soldier moments.

Mor elike around 4, even 5. Evans is THAT close by.

Are you talking of Mackeley? Of course he can't solo it. That's why your foot soldiers are there to handle it by the time he shows up. This also allows him to show up and perhaps aid them with his awesomeness. Sigurd is top priority due to castle capturing. Even a single turn, another mount might not see the action.

I do not see others shaving off turns just with a single action.

FFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUU-

...I don't think a single piece of equipment has ever destroyed my entire argument before x.x

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BEST TRYNDAMERE PLAYER Newbie

BEST TRYNDAMERE PLAYER

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A Nazi sniper then. Pretty sweet idea.

Yep, although unfortunately we can't reskin armor in this game so I can't have this set on all the time and it's still earlygame, pvp doesn't happen till lategame.

Although it is funny though, playing an archer on this game reminds me of FE in the sense that most archers start off pretty bad. This game is pretty much the same way although in the end though Archer is a very fun pvp class.

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