Fort Hood

[General Spoon]

Something's happened there. A news conference is expected shortly. In the meantime, here's the AP.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5ihGepAkECGoDagETVBMpPb3w7Y3gD9BPJO100

[Hero]

The media will probably blame this on PTSD for the next few days at least, but I'm betting now that whoever perpetrated this attack has connections with some kind of terrorist organization.

PTSD doesn't cause you to randomly kill people, much less to make the kind of intricate plan that killing such a number of people would require. Security is tighter at a huge base like Fort Hood than it is at a federal prison, even if you were allowed to carry your gun around in there loaded there are still thousands of soldiers who will be alerted by the sound of a gunshot.

The recruiting standards of the US Army have been way too low since 2003. You don't even have to care about the government you're enlisting to serve, just pass some silly intelligence test, prove that your body is strong enough to go through basic training and sign the contract.

[Candlejack]

So they killed a guy who they THOUGHT was the suspect and somehow, the suspect of Arabic origin is now the prime suspect?

Go local authorities! Fail some more, please! I'm just gonna say Al Qaeda/Hamas has a mole. Dunno where but it implies such a thing.

[Phoenix Wright]

If the article I read was correct, the current one posted here is not.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_fort_hood_shooting

Regardless of the "correct" article, this guy's going to prison for life/death sentence. Sure, the guy might have had an anxiety attack, but there's no way he can get a PTSD attack if he hadn't gone to Afghanistan yet; unless another traumatic effect happened earlier in his life. In any case, this man, of whom is stable right now in the hospital, was obviously not thinking straight when he thought of doing this.

Edited November 6, 2009 by Ben Stein

[lolDeath]

I'll just stick with this. Not too big of a deal, just a few more dead people. Or maybe just because it happened in America I should be O U T R A E G G G E D.

[Chalis]

It happened in Tekshas; what America do you speak of?

Edited November 6, 2009 by Chalis

[Hero]

So it sounds like this guy was a devout Muslim, prayed every day, who was protesting an upcoming deployment to Afghanistan.

This makes me think he was planning to do such an attack for a long time, being a psychiatrist with an officer's status in the army is a hundred times cushier than what most people who enlist have to go through, even in Afghanistan. To even get into a base like Fort Hood with two non-military weapons and lots of ammunition takes careful planning. I really wouldn't be surprised if he had made contact with the Taliban or something similar and they urged him along with the attack or even helped him plan it.

It will be interesting to see how this one unfolds. No matter what the reason behind the attack was, someone majorly fucked up along the line.

It happened in Tekshas; what America do you speak of?

Texas is one of the United States, and one of the most important economically due to how the interstates are built and where our natural resources come from--if Texas seceded it would make an even bigger impact on prices and availability of just about everything than if even California did.

[lolDeath]

Nidal Malik Hasan

i kill and mash naa~

fuck I must be bored. At least something interesting finally happened this week.

[WyvernSageLord]

A military psychiatrist going on a crazy rampage and shooting people? What in the world is going on here!? Dammit, just when I had hoped that things couldn't be worse in the US too...

And what's more, I can feel it in the air: The WBC is gonna have a fucking field day with this one. -_-

Edited November 6, 2009 by WyvernSageLord

[Candlejack]

Am I the only one who still wants the local enforcement to be brought to justice? Have we forgotten an act of negligence in the forces that PROTECT US?

[Altera the Hun]

Am I the only one who still wants the local enforcement to be brought to justice? Have we forgotten an act of negligence in the forces that PROTECT US?

He was still shooting people at the time. Local Enforcement had nothing BUT right of way here.

Also, as it turns out, he's been in the military since before the WTC fell. And the local authorities say that he did this on his own.

[Hero]

He was still shooting people at the time. Local Enforcement had nothing BUT right of way here.

No, the local security and law enforcement was definitely at fault.

There are a few things about this attack that show the security system isn't perfect, but most telling are the weapons Hasan used. He used two handguns, neither of them military issue, one semi-automatic and one revolver. He was somehow able to bring both of these in either on the day or to hide beforehand (in which case he had a hiding spot nobody checked or an accomplice.) He would also have needed to bring a lot of extra ammunition in order to kill and injure the number he did. Fort Hood has such tight security regulations that soldiers without special exemptions aren't even allowed to carry the guns they're issued inside! Somebody fucked up here.

Also, as it turns out, he's been in the military since before the WTC fell. And the local authorities say that he did this on his own.

And all this time, he's been an opponent of the operations in Iraq and Afghanistan, has avoided deployment to either of those places. He's also expressed sympathy for the terrorist organization Hamas and its tactics, and is on record as saying that "Muslims should stand up and fight against the aggressor" in the context of America. You wonder why he didn't leave the military as soon as possible after Afghanistan started if he held these views. To me, it's obvious that he'd been planning this attack for awhile.

[Doom103]

I'll just stick with this. Not too big of a deal, just a few more dead people. Or maybe just because it happened in America I should be O U T R A E G G G E D.

Not a big deal?

Dead people is always a big deal especially if its a bunch of dead people killed by the same guy and since it could possibility be connected to a terrorist organization

I'm surprised by what you just said

[Hero]

I'll just stick with this. Not too big of a deal, just a few more dead people. Or maybe just because it happened in America I should be O U T R A E G G G E D.

Not a big deal?

Dead people is always a big deal especially if its a bunch of dead people killed by the same guy and since it could possibility be connected to a terrorist organization

I'm surprised by what you just said

I don't think his post was serious. Most of his posts aren't. Death claims to be 20, so he probably already understands that what he said is bullshit.

This topic really should have been in the Serious Discussion forum, General has been moving Farther From the Forest lately.

[lolDeath]

Well I wasn't being entirely serious, I recognize it as something important and bad to many people, I just happen to not think it's anything special personally.

[Hero]

Well I wasn't being entirely serious, I recognize it as something important and bad to many people, I just happen to not think it's anything special personally.

It seems kind of important to me.

I mean, I'm not a soldier, but if I was one I'd want to know positively that when my commanders bring me somewhere they say is secure and take my gun away I would be safe. I'm sure that this has put on edge every American who lives or works on a base or is in training right now, as well as all of their millions of family members.

Usually it's all the same to me which country something like this happens in, I don't feel much more emotional connection to the people of Connecticut than to the people of Latvia, but for something like this to happen in a military that is supposed to be among the best in the world and is certainly by miles the most expensive in the world is unthinkable. You don't even hear about security being breached so completely at military bases in countries like Tajikistan!

When a family member dies in an earthquake or of a sickness, it's easier to be calm. You can say that God took him, or that it was inevitable. But when there's a security breach like this and that family member dies of a terrorist attack in a place that's supposed to be safe, without any notice or preparation, there is no way to soften the blow because you know it could have been prevented. If you ask me, half of the Fort Hood security personnel should be fired and a lot of them should go to jail.

Every time I hear about predatory terrorist attacks like this, I hate them even more. No matter whether Hasan had connections with a terrorist group or not, and I think he did, he definitely became a terrorist himself with this attack.

[Phoenix Wright]

Well I wasn't being entirely serious, I recognize it as something important and bad to many people, I just happen to not think it's anything special personally.

It seems kind of important to me.

I mean, I'm not a soldier, but if I was one I'd want to know positively that when my commanders bring me somewhere they say is secure and take my gun away I would be safe. I'm sure that this has put on edge every American who lives or works on a base or is in training right now, as well as all of their millions of family members.

Usually it's all the same to me which country something like this happens in, I don't feel much more emotional connection to the people of Connecticut than to the people of Latvia, but for something like this to happen in a military that is supposed to be among the best in the world and is certainly by miles the most expensive in the world is unthinkable. You don't even hear about security being breached so completely at military bases in countries like Tajikistan!

When a family member dies in an earthquake or of a sickness, it's easier to be calm. You can say that God took him, or that it was inevitable. But when there's a security breach like this and that family member dies of a terrorist attack in a place that's supposed to be safe, without any notice or preparation, there is no way to soften the blow because you know it could have been prevented. If you ask me, half of the Fort Hood security personnel should be fired and a lot of them should go to jail.

Every time I hear about predatory terrorist attacks like this, I hate them even more. No matter whether Hasan had connections with a terrorist group or not, and I think he did, he definitely became a terrorist himself with this attack.

Uh, what? What Death means is only 13 people are dead. Yeah, it was sad, but it's not the end of the world. That's all he was saying.

As for the "breach," I disagree. As of right now, we don't know if what he did was a planned or if he acted on impulse. For a devout Muslim, it's kinda hard to help kill your brethren. But a question about that arises: how long has this man been in the military? If he knew we were at war with Middle Eastern people, then this points to it being a planned terrorist attack.

What if that wasn't it though? What if this was just a panic attack? What if he thought he'd be fine with going to war, but in the very end, he wasn't?

In my opinion, this attack isn't so simple to "decode."

[lolDeath]

I love it when I don't have to speak for myself.

No sarcasm, I really do. I still let my mom order for me when we go places to eat and shit.

[Hero]

Uh, what? What Death means is only 13 people are dead. Yeah, it was sad, but it's not the end of the world. That's all he was saying.

My point was that this isn't just 13 people dead, there're also 29 injured but most important, this attack will lower the morale of people connected in some way to the military around the world and send the message to terrorists that it isn't impossible to directly attack US bases, similar to the effect 9/11 had but on a smaller scale.

As for the "breach," I disagree. As of right now, we don't know if what he did was a planned or if he acted on impulse. For a devout Muslim, it's kinda hard to help kill your brethren. But a question about that arises: how long has this man been in the military? If he knew we were at war with Middle Eastern people, then this points to it being a planned terrorist attack.

Hasan was in the military since 1988, and like everyone who doesn't live under a rock he certainly knew where the current conflicts are. He had been protesting an upcoming deployment to Afghanistan as a psychiatrist for a couple months prior to his attack.

What if that wasn't it though? What if this was just a panic attack? What if he thought he'd be fine with going to war, but in the very end, he wasn't?

It wasn't an impulsive attack. The route he took, the weapons he used, and the things he did before the attack show that he had been planning and preparing for it for a long time. PTSD doesn't work that way, and a lot of statements he's made, such as "the War on Terror is a War on Islam" and "I'm a Muslim before an American", along with the fact that he attended the same mosque as two of the 9/11 hijackers in 2001 and cited the radical imam there as a major influence point to a pretty clear motive, regardless of what the FBI is saying. Everyone in the government and army is going to say that things are unclear until the official investigation confirms things, since this issue could turn political.

In my opinion, this attack isn't so simple to "decode."

Certainly we can't know why and how it happened with 100% certainty. But the evidence we have so far does point strongly in a certain direction.

[lolDeath]

Forgot I wasn't allowed to disagree with you, my bad bro.

[Hero]

A lot of the time when you hear about shootings like this, it's not a big deal. The Virginia Tech shooting got more coverage than this. It was a crazy guy acting on his own. A very tragic incident, but in the end not a big deal to the people not directly involved in it.

The Fort Hood attack is a lot more sinister. There are probably people involved in its preparation that have not been caught, and unless the military's reaction is effective and fast we can expect to see repeats. Nothing like this has ever happened before, even in Iraq.

[lolDeath]

People are being killed, raped, robbed, beaten, and shit on all of the time. Well maybe not shit on. I don't care if this situation is uncommon or even completely unique, it's just more dead Americans to me. You join the military you are accepting certain possibilities, top of the list being death. At least this snapped people out of their false sense of security, thinking that somewhere is safe.

Godwin's Law in 3, 2, 1...

Edited November 10, 2009 by Death

[Phoenix Wright]

If what you say is true, you REALLY can't even call it a security breach. The Americans were stupid on this one.

"I'm a Muslim before an American" pretty much says that he really didn't give a fuck when he had to swear allegiance to America. I agreed with you before, and I still agree, the answer is leading towards the big-bad-terrorism. This could have been avoided if they kicked his ass out of the army.

[Hero]

If what you say is true, you REALLY can't even call it a security breach. The Americans were stupid on this one.

"I'm a Muslim before an American" pretty much says that he really didn't give a fuck when he had to swear allegiance to America. I agreed with you before, and I still agree, the answer is leading towards the big-bad-terrorism. This could have been avoided if they kicked his ass out of the army.

From what people are saying in the last few days it sounds like he was under some pretty serious investigations by the army a couple of times, but they never saw all the information at once and ultimately decided the risk he presented was outweighed by his extensive experience and training in a field where everyone agrees the army is lacking.

In something as big as the army, there will always be snakes in the grass, and they will always be painful to remove because every soldier represents a significant investment after training.

I'll be honest, I don't know how the army could keep people like this out without also keeping a lot of good people out. But this attack could never have happened if the base had had better security.

[Der Kommissar]

What's also of note here is that the shooter was, by all accounts, a lazy worker and a poor performer...and yet he was a military psychiatrist holding an officer's rank.

Leaving aside the matter of his homicidal spree, this man should have been busted down to an enlisted rank and sent to stand on a corner in Iraq years ago. It's a small wonder the enlisted despise the officer corps; I remind you of that captain who recently (to her detriment) worked with Orly Taitz in attempt to escape her deployment by claiming that Obama, as a foreigner, had no authority to order the military.

Edited November 12, 2009 by Der Kommissar