Neon Genesis Evangelion

[Ether]

Neon Genesis Evangelion,an older mecha anime considered kinda fanservicey,and controversial.Discuss.

[Emeraldfox]

The ending made little since to me. Guess if I see it again it'll make sense. It's also hilarious when Shinji is around an unconscious Asuka.

Edited February 27, 2010 by Emerald Jealousy

[Amelia]

Ah, I saw this before. But I don't watch it.

[Candlejack]

This is probably one of THE worst animes I have seen.

It was pretty much dependent on fanservice, made little sense (Especially the ending), and the damn characters were all stu's/sue's.

[Esau of Isaac]

This is probably one of THE worst animes I have seen.

It was pretty much dependent on fanservice, made little sense (Especially the ending), and the damn characters were all stu's/sue's.

Fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you FUCK THE LOT OF YOU TO HELL

[Midnight Nightmare]

I don't like it for its crappy ending

<_<

BUT...

its a good anime it made me think about human existence and all that... (eventually made me depressed for weeks... :o)

Good anime...

Edited February 27, 2010 by Pahn's Imoutou-chan

[Ether]

Well,the ending is kinda sketchy,but it's also one of the things that defines the series,as well.being newly enrolled in a psychology course,i'm looking forward to finding out more ways to interpret it myself.

[Magical CC]

As I remember (I remember very well), this anime contains no fanservice (grind at Code Gay Ass and Seed Des). It's purely a combination of huge characters delevopements (no, they are not stu/sue), twist but beautiful storyplot (not sucks and rush like...cough...CG), heart striking soundtrack and songs. And finally, it's animation and great details of designing are just better than most anime even at this time.

But of course, not everyone can fully understand the awesomeness, what a pity...Not to mention that there's somepeople who dont understand what is stu/sue.

Edited February 28, 2010 by Ga-rei Sulley

[Candlejack]

Hooray for blind condescension amirite

[Esau of Isaac]

Hooray for blind condescension amirite

On behalf of Ga-rei Sulley, and at the risk of sounding repetitive, fuck you bro.

In all seriousness, how about some examples of your claims?

[Ether]

Well,some things could be considered fanservicey,which is why i put it up there.Some scenes with Asuka and Katsuragi get a little risque at times,and a couple with Rei,but I know it wasn;t meant to be fanservice,but i thought i'd mention it just in case.

[Esau of Isaac]

Well,some things could be considered fanservicey,which is why i put it up there.Some scenes with Asuka and Katsuragi get a little risque at times,and a couple with Rei,but I know it wasn;t meant to be fanservice,but i thought i'd mention it just in case.

Having portions involving nudity doesn't necessarily mean fanservice. That's not relevant, though, since Evangelion does possess fanservice, in multiple areas; what is relevant is that the areas that do involve it don't significantly detract from the plotline. I mean shit, this is Gainax we're talking about here. We got off comparatively light in the realm of titillation.

Edit: Oh, and if I never hear the terms "Mary Sue" or "Gary Stu" again for the rest of my life, it won't have been long enough. If there's one goddamn problem with TVtropes, it's everyone acting as though their articles are gospel and spouting them about like they can note a thousand fucking tropes in any given show. For the record, calling anyone in Evangelion a Mary Sue is beyond moronic; it is in fact so utterly braindead that I am right this moment trying to think of a term to describe it.

Edited February 28, 2010 by Esau of Isaac

[Candlejack]

Alright fine. I'll give it to you that I exaggerated when I said that everyone was a sue/stu.

Rei is the ONLY remotely Mary-Sueish character on the show and there is evidence pointing towards that. And not even a goddamn "OH BUT SHE IS DISTANT" excuse can save her.

And it appears I am not the only one who is disappointed in this series.

An actual quote: "This is a giant robot saga the same way Twin Peaks was a cop show".

Entire plot:

Constant themes deal with him subconsciously wanting to fuck the shit out of his dead mom, his problems having a vital life affirming relationship with his father who is too busy fucking the underage clone of Shinji's dead mom to notice him, and his having to pilot an alien/robot life form (that's secretly his dead mom in disguise) in order to attempt to defeat nearly invincible, huge alien life forms (who are actually biblical angels) who are hellbent on awakening the final angel Lilith (who is Adam's slut on the side) so she can turn the planet's inhabitants into a huge ball of cherry Kool Aide for no readily apparent reason. WTF?

In Japanese, "Shinji" means "whiny Oedipus-complex bitch boy". Also the word "plot" doesn't mean anything in Japanese and hence this show just defined anime for the next generation. The highlight of Shinji's career as a pilot was fapping to an unconscious Nazi (which actually does happen during the first 10 minutes of the second film). Later, while still unconscious, Earth's defenses send her out to fight the giant alien whatevers and she gets eaten alive because Shinji was too busy curling up in a corner and BAWWWing. The show is also about a penguin who lives in a refrigerator and a blue haired dick named Rei Ayanami, who is a clone of his dead mom. Kinda like Star Wars really, except everything that goes unexplained just turns up to be Shinji's mom.

Evangelion is notable for having over 9,000 final episodes, not to mention the 2 new movies recently released with alternate, alternating endings after the three movies already released. The show was created by some 1337 azn who was put into a mental hospital because he would slam the door on his dick. Every fangirl and fanboy just hate him because of the shit endings he keeps on throwing at them like a monkey would throw scat in a zoo. One day, last Thursday, he heard the doctors talking about Latin/Greek medical terms and freudspeak. The bat shit insane director thought it was "deep" and "philosophical" so he added some shallow references to Jesus and agnosticism and he came up with this shit. Also see Xenoshit if you would like the copied yet makes more sense version of this non sequential bullshit.

By the end of the series, Shinji is so emo that he single-handedly causes his clonemom Rei to rape the world, causing every person on it to turn into a mysterious liquid. Good going. Also the movie End of Evangelion should be noted for having the biggest pair of tits that you will ever find anywhere. It should also be noted that in the last episode, we find out that Shinji's dad is, in fact, Shinji's mom. Go figure. Cheer up, emo Shinji.

TL;DR version:

Comedy response images are not allowed outside introductions and FFtF.

~ Love from Shuuda.

Edited March 7, 2010 by Shuuda

[Esau of Isaac]

Rei is the ONLY remotely Mary-Sueish character on the show and there is evidence pointing towards that. And not even a goddamn "OH BUT SHE IS DISTANT" excuse can save her.

How is she a Mary Sue-ish character?

And it appears I am not the only one who is disappointed in this series.

Few people are perfect.

Constant themes deal with him subconsciously wanting to fuck the shit out of his dead mom, his problems having a vital life affirming relationship with his father who is too busy fucking the underage clone of Shinji's dead mom to notice him, and his having to pilot an alien/robot life form (that's secretly his dead mom in disguise) in order to attempt to defeat nearly invincible, huge alien life forms (who are actually biblical angels) who are hellbent on awakening the final angel Lilith (who is Adam's slut on the side) so she can turn the planet's inhabitants into a huge ball of cherry Kool Aide for no readily apparent reason. WTF?

In Japanese, "Shinji" means "whiny Oedipus-complex bitch boy". Also the word "plot" doesn't mean anything in Japanese and hence this show just defined anime for the next generation. The highlight of Shinji's career as a pilot was fapping to an unconscious Nazi (which actually does happen during the first 10 minutes of the second film). Later, while still unconscious, Earth's defenses send her out to fight the giant alien whatevers and she gets eaten alive because Shinji was too busy curling up in a corner and BAWWWing. The show is also about a penguin who lives in a refrigerator and a blue haired dick named Rei Ayanami, who is a clone of his dead mom. Kinda like Star Wars really, except everything that goes unexplained just turns up to be Shinji's mom.

Evangelion is notable for having over 9,000 final episodes, not to mention the 2 new movies recently released with alternate, alternating endings after the three movies already released. The show was created by some 1337 azn who was put into a mental hospital because he would slam the door on his dick. Every fangirl and fanboy just hate him because of the shit endings he keeps on throwing at them like a monkey would throw scat in a zoo. One day, last Thursday, he heard the doctors talking about Latin/Greek medical terms and freudspeak. The bat shit insane director thought it was "deep" and "philosophical" so he added some shallow references to Jesus and agnosticism and he came up with this shit. Also see Xenoshit if you would like the copied yet makes more sense version of this non sequential bullshit.

By the end of the series, Shinji is so emo that he single-handedly causes his clonemom Rei to rape the world, causing every person on it to turn into a mysterious liquid. Good going. Also the movie End of Evangelion should be noted for having the biggest pair of tits that you will ever find anywhere. It should also be noted that in the last episode, we find out that Shinji's dad is, in fact, Shinji's mom. Go figure. Cheer up, emo Shinji.

All of this was funnier on Encyclopedia Dramatica.

[Hatari]

Given that this is considered the classic mecha anime and that I'm a massive fan of gundam, I checked it out.

It was a pretty decent anime, I'd give it an 8.5/10.

Favorite Main Character: Shinji

Favorite Supporting Character: Kaji

Favorite Unit: Shinji Unit

[Original Alear]

It's so weird to hear Evangelion described as an "older" anime, then I thought about it and realized I did in fact see it rather shortly after .

As I remember (I remember very well), this anime contains no fanservice (grind at Code Gay Ass and Seed Des).

I assume "grind at Code Gay Ass and Seed Des" means you are joking to some extent, right?

I'm pretty sure there's some drunk misato fanservice, bathing suit fanservice, etc. But the series promises fanservice in the previews of the next episode more often than it actually delivers, IIRC (doesn't misato promise more fanservice in the next episode during each preview?)

Edit: Oh, and if I never hear the terms "Mary Sue" or "Gary Stu" again for the rest of my life, it won't have been long enough. If there's one goddamn problem with TVtropes, it's everyone acting as though their articles are gospel and spouting them about like they can note a thousand fucking tropes in any given show. For the record, calling anyone in Evangelion a Mary Sue is beyond moronic; it is in fact so utterly braindead that I am right this moment trying to think of a term to describe it.

Wow, bashing TV tropes. Can I have your children?

(actually I don't dislike TV tropes for one reason, which is that so much effort has been put in to recording "instances" of their "tropes" that it is a pretty good database on media information. however, the actual "tropes" they've created are pretty useless, and as far as I can tell often misapplied in any case. They also no longer confine themselves to either TV or to tropes, and only seem aware of the former for some reason).

Evangelion is notable for having over 9,000 final episodes, not to mention the 2 new movies recently released with alternate, alternating endings after the three movies already released.

I actually do agree that the constant attempts to remake the series indicate the devs really do realize they mucked up the original ending (even though I'm pretty sure they have denied this), and it's always rather pathetic when writers have to admit stuff like that.

Also see Xenoshit if you would like the copied yet makes more sense version of this non sequential bullshit.

Xenogears also melds some character types and ideas from FF6 and Chrono Trigger which makes it a kind of interesting tribute to (IMO) the two landmark SNES RPGs (I don't like Chrono Trigger very much but that doesn't mean it's not important). Also I think that Fei is a more compelling wuss than Shinji is, to some extent because he's not a total wuss in all respects - in fact, Grahf was the biggest wuss before turning into the biggest badass.

I actually think two of Square's best games - Xenogears and Tactics - are successful because they so willingly and without anxiety offer tribute/steal from other games.

I personally felt the "deeper" aspects of Eva which I was familiar with (i.e. I am not familiar with Kabbalah at all, and only know a bit about Freud) were kind of half-baked like Candlejack indicated, however I felt that to some extent they were correctly applied to mech anime. Ultimately, I prefer shows that aren't completely obvious about this and I think Eva showed its hand a little too much.

Edited March 29, 2010 by SeverIan

[Le Communard]

I personally felt the "deeper" aspects of Eva which I was familiar with (i.e. I am not familiar with Kabbalah at all, and only know a bit about Freud) were kind of half-baked like Candlejack indicated, however I felt that to some extent they were correctly applied to mech anime. Ultimately, I prefer shows that aren't completely obvious about this and I think Eva showed its hand a little too much.

Showed it's hand? The entire last two episodes were done "on the couch"--I'd say it did more than show it's hand. On top of that, I'm pretty familiar with Kabbalah, and I can tell you it had little to nothing to do with it beyond gratuitous symbolism. Even then, though, I will admit, it did have some depths, and can be fun to pick apart in a sort of post-modernist exercise.

The one thing I really wonder about this show is why its so popular. I mean, I liked it, but I'm not exactly normal even in these sort of circles.

Edited March 29, 2010 by Le Communard

[Original Alear]

The one thing I really wonder about this show is why its so popular. I mean, I liked it, but I'm not exactly normal even in these sort of circles.

Probably had something to do with the ridiculously awesome battle scenes where Eva Unit 01 chows down on an angel. (or maybe where the mass produced evas chow down on asuka).

Lots of shows had pilots going berserk. Eva has Shinji melt into 01 as it/they go berserk. IMO that's a hell of a lot cooler.

Not much has been said about the battle scenes, but I think they are definitely part of the charm.

[Esau of Isaac]

Showed it's hand? The entire last two episodes were done "on the couch"--I'd say it did more than show it's hand. On top of that, I'm pretty familiar with Kabbalah, and I can tell you it had little to nothing to do with it beyond gratuitous symbolism. Even then, though, I will admit, it did have some depths, and can be fun to pick apart in a sort of post-modernist exercise.

The one thing I really wonder about this show is why its so popular. I mean, I liked it, but I'm not exactly normal even in these sort of circles.

A lot of teenagers grew up watching the show along with other mecha series that were completely different; it became popular because it turned a lot of commonalities in mech anime --and anime in general-- on its head. Going from mainstays such as Mobile Suit Gundam (in this case Wing) to NGE displays the kind of differences it tends to put out; it was in many ways the opposite of what a mech anime embodied. In addition, the symbolism and lack of strong, direct storytelling also contributed to at the least a deeper-looking storyline, even in areas where it was not.Finally, it did damn well with its shitty budget, which served to turn heads.

I don't think the re-writes necessarily mean the creators understand they fucked up, so much as are now given proper resources to better explain what was happening.

Not much has been said about the battle scenes, but I think they are definitely part of the charm.

I can agree with that, but not so much about how badass they were; the first battle between the Third Angel and Shinji's Unit 01 is extremely memorable in anime for its badassery, however I think the reason that the battles in general were part of the charm was because the enemies were so unconventional. It wasn't about a bigger, badder mech, it surrounded a surreal being that used some supernatural ability to try and fuck up humanity's day. As a kid I found creatures like the Fifteenth Angel, which mentally raped Asuka while Handel's Hallelujah played in the background, quite frightening.

[Original Alear]

I don't think the re-writes necessarily mean the creators understand they fucked up, so much as are now given proper resources to better explain what was happening.

Well, maybe it was a budget issue. Even some parts of Eva that work pretty well during the last few episodes (long pause before Shinji crushes Kaoru) can kind of damage one's ability to take the show seriously if we see figure they did it to save space on animation costs :) At least they played some music during the pause, I suppose.

I think there's a strong burden of proof on you to prove that "End of Evangelion" is an 'improved rewrite' that is a "better explanation" of what was happening, because this implies that "End of Eva" was attempting to "better explain" what the last two episodes of Eva already explained. I would say that isn't the case, as the last two episodes of eva made (almost) no attempt that I am aware of to explain anything that was going on with any individual other than Shinji, or any world external to Shinji's. Admittedly, "End of Evangelion" IIRC affirms the same overall conclusion in regards to the main character (Shinji is accepts his individuality) but besides that is almost completely different, and even Shinji's circumstances are different. In episode 26, I think we are supposed to feel happy for him, in "End of Eva" he's still pretty obviously fucked up.

It's kind of hard for me to believe that they didn't think about stretching the budget thin towards the middle of the show rather than the end. End is normally the most important part, I'm pretty sure what they did in episodes 25 and 26 is exactly what they wanted from the show at the time. Maybe they made them unsatisfying (in terms of extra-Shinji plot) in order to make people demand an alternate ending in the form of a movie.

I can agree with that, but not so much about how badass they were; the first battle between the Third Angel and Shinji's Unit 01 is extremely memorable in anime for its badassery, however I think the reason that the battles in general were part of the charm was because the enemies were so unconventional. It wasn't about a bigger, badder mech, it surrounded a surreal being that used some supernatural ability to try and fuck up humanity's day. As a kid I found creatures like the Fifteenth Angel, which mentally raped Asuka while Handel's Hallelujah played in the background, quite frightening.

I still think that the end of the first episode does a good job of putting Shinji - a character you know won't die - in a situation where he really seems fucked for sure despite the absolute certainty that he will survive.

I personally thought that the "fucked up" nature of the fights you bring up is of the same general nature as the "badass" parts I talked about. It's pretty creepy when the main it's just a different take on the same thing.

Edited March 30, 2010 by SeverIan

[Phoenix]

Misato has the longest legs I've ever seen, and that's all I have to say about Evangelion

[Original Alear]

Misato has the longest legs I've ever seen, and that's all I have to say about Evangelion

A worthwhile observation, duly noted.

[Defeatist Elitist]

A silent clone in a long line of clones goes in the place of a mentally unstable boy who's father she has been having sex with, in a giant bio-robotic suit to throw a biblical relic at an alien life form called an angel hanging in orbit and dropping globs of acid on the earth with deadly precision in this show.

That's fucking awesome.

[Esau of Isaac]

Well, maybe it was a budget issue. Even some parts of Eva that work pretty well during the last few episodes (long pause before Shinji crushes Kaoru) can kind of damage one's ability to take the show seriously if we see figure they did it to save space on animation costs :) At least they played some music during the pause, I suppose.

There's also practically every scene that involves an elevator, escalator, or what have you. This includes the rather infamous scene involving an awkward silence between Rei and Asuka for a period that is (if memory serves) actually over a minute long. Though I find them, along with the bad bouncing the animation has --another result of bad budget-- rather charming.

I think there's a strong burden of proof on you to prove that "End of Evangelion" is an 'improved rewrite' that is a "better explanation" of what was happening, because this implies that "End of Eva" was attempting to "better explain" what the last two episodes of Eva already explained. I would say that isn't the case, as the last two episodes of eva made (almost) no attempt that I am aware of to explain anything that was going on with any individual other than Shinji, or any world external to Shinji's. Admittedly, "End of Evangelion" IIRC affirms the same overall conclusion in regards to the main character (Shinji is accepts his individuality) but besides that is almost completely different, and even Shinji's circumstances are different. In episode 26, I think we are supposed to feel happy for him, in "End of Eva" he's still pretty obviously fucked up.

http://www.evaotaku.com/html/rcb-production.html

"Episode 25' "Air" is based on the original episode 25 script which was completed during production of the TV series. Due to production time limits and other problems, this script was not used and the TV episode 25 "Owaru sekai (The Ending World)" instead became a drama which unfolded within an inner universe like episode 26. In this sense, episode 25' could be considered a return to the originally intended contents. In contrast, episode 26' adds much more story and dramatic content to TV episode 26, thus deepening the theme.

This movie was created as the remake of the last two TV episodes, so the TV episode format is followed, with each episode having its own subtitle and eyecatch scenes."

End of Evangelion is now often regarded as the outside result of the final events of NGE, whereas the initial broadcast is the inner turmoil during the process of Human Instrumentality.

I still think that the end of the first episode does a good job of putting Shinji - a character you know won't die - in a situation where he really seems fucked for sure despite the absolute certainty that he will survive.

I personally thought that the "fucked up" nature of the fights you bring up is of the same general nature as the "badass" parts I talked about. It's pretty creepy when the main it's just a different take on the same thing.

I can agree with that.