omglmaowtf Posted December 1, 2011 Share Posted December 1, 2011 (edited) Worst: Hilda<br><br>EDIT: changed my mind, Best: Ishtar. Edited December 2, 2011 by omglmaowtf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renall Posted December 1, 2011 Share Posted December 1, 2011 Regarding Trabant, someone remind me again what part of ambushing your opponent in the desert, killing his wife, and then threatening to murder his daughter if he doesn't surrender is "honorable?" Trabant was a pragmatist, always, exactly the opposite of honorable. He doesn't fly out to fight Celice's army because he's honorable, he does it because he (1) feels guilty, and (2) knows the only way to save Arion's life and ensure he remains on the throne of Thracia is to die in battle so Arion can be the one that makes peace with Celice, as Trabant himself has too much baggage. Feeling guilty about your dishonorable acts doesn't make you honorable, it just means you have a conscience. Alvis is the same way and nobody thinks of him as honorable, do they? That said Leidrick is infinitely worse, because at least Trabant has a little self-respect. Leidrick was nothing more than a sniveling toady who sucked up to an evil regime for his own safety and power, and he got played like a chump in the end exactly as he deserved, used up and killed, then revived as an undead speedbump and used up again. So I'd vote him the worst, because at least other dishonorable characters could be viewed as having more pragmatic objectives and some semblance of loyalty to anything other than pure power. For most, I think you have to go with Camus. More explicitly chivalrous characters are always like that, although he's hardly perfect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caliban of Sycorax Posted December 2, 2011 Share Posted December 2, 2011 The issue with Alvis and Trabant is that the two of them were pawns in Manfroy's grand scheme of things to revive the Lopto cult. So, unlike other villains in the dishonorable section, they really had no choice, and both of them eventually sacrificed themselves for the better good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renall Posted December 3, 2011 Share Posted December 3, 2011 The issue with Alvis and Trabant is that the two of them were pawns in Manfroy's grand scheme of things to revive the Lopto cult. So, unlike other villains in the dishonorable section, they really had no choice, and both of them eventually sacrificed themselves for the better good. I seem to recall Trabant attacking Cuan and Ethlin's army had nothing to do with the Lopto Cult's plans, as Alvis would've probably killed them anyway once the "rebel" Grandbell forces were subdued. He played ball with the cult in the future, for sure, but I don't think that ultimately makes his sacrifice noble. And Alvis, well... he conspired against one of his best friends and arguably his entire country with a shady enemy in exchange for personal power. Yes, he wanted to do it for the greater good, but no one can call his double-betrayal in Chapter 5 honorable. He got a bum deal after that and regretted it, but again, that doesn't exactly make him honorable. I just think it would be a bit weird for them to win over guys whose only crime was being on the wrong side and who took their role with dignity and restraint. Oh yes, that reminds me: The Black Knight threatened a harmless old man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor Odinson Posted December 3, 2011 Share Posted December 3, 2011 Hence why I only had Trabant as a honourable mention, while my vote went to Camus. However, while Trabant used some...quite unorthodox methods, all he really wanted was for his country to be strong. He didn't really care what happens to himself, as long as Thracia could prosper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wen Yang Posted December 3, 2011 Share Posted December 3, 2011 Best: Camus Worst: Schaeffer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anouleth Posted December 3, 2011 Share Posted December 3, 2011 (edited) Alvis took another man's wife, that's not really honourable, in any way, shape or form. Hence why I only had Trabant as a honourable mention, while my vote went to Camus. However, while Trabant used some...quite unorthodox methods, all he really wanted was for his country to be strong. He didn't really care what happens to himself, as long as Thracia could prosper. You could say the same thing about Naesala: but Naesala is clearly not honourable at all. Would you say that Micaiah is honourable, given that she did all that stuff (sneak attacks in the night, using traps and boiling oil) to protect Daein? Edited December 3, 2011 by Anouleth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caliban of Sycorax Posted December 3, 2011 Share Posted December 3, 2011 Alvis also had no idea that Diadora was Sigurd's wife. For all he knew, Diadora was just some hot chick that Manfroy showed to him. Alvis had no clue until right before Sigurd's death that there was any relation between the two, and byu that point his mind was already made up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NinjaMonkey Posted December 4, 2011 Author Share Posted December 4, 2011 This ends this round. Next round up shortly. Oh yes, that reminds me: The Black Knight threatened a harmless old man. If you are talking about Greil, then this "old man" is hardly "harmless"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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