DotA 2

[buttmuncher.ops]

What's up kids.

I'm currently giving out beta keys / game passes for DotA 2 on Steam, so if you'd like one, drop me a line anywhere (this thread, my profile, PM, chat) as well as adding me on Steam (the link to my profile is in my signature.) I also idle Team Liquid's In-house League IRC channel: #tlnet-dota, so if you have a quakenet.org account or IRC you can hit me up there as well (nick is hotsauce.) The amount of passes I have are in the single digits, so this is pretty much first come, first serve.

I've been playing this genre ever since it first became competitively popular (2003-2005?) with IceFrog's takeover of the mod, even delving into the new recent spin off games in the same genre such as HoN and LoL for a couple of years. Ever since I got my DotA 2 beta key though, I stopped playing the other games in the genre competitively, since they're all pretty much based off of the original DotA anyway. But I'd like this topic to be all things related to DotA 2 discussion and less about the comparisons to the other games in the genre because with how shitty all three communities are it always ends up in flame wars about what game requires more skill / is balanced etc.

I personally am playing semi-competitively in open leagues at the moment and am probably in the 4-5th bracket from the top in public match making (sitting on about +20-30 wins over losses). I'm working on getting vouched for North American DotA League or at least +50 wins over losses in pub MM to circumvent the vouch proceedings. I heard a rumor that they're running out of money to run their league though =(

My team is also currently recruiting (two) highly skilled players to round out our lineup and start practicing & playing as we'll be going hardcore scrimmaging and competitive tourneys come June / this summer. I currently am in game Team Captain (calling shots, strategies & drafting responsibilities etc.) I play in the all around / open role position, being an all around annoying flashy escape / juke player (Merlini & Demon are probably my two favorite players to watch,) hence the name: hotsauce. Once we close recruiting though, I will probably solidify into the Initiator or Roam Support role, all depending on who we recruit. Support is my strongest role and Solo Middle is probably my weakest role, which isn't really saying much since I play everything in between above average.

So, why do you play DotA? What about the game grabbed your attention? What made you stay?

But mainly, would you like a DotA 2 beta key? ;3

Thanks for reading.

[peener weener]

Yes. Very much. Sir.

I guess I should actually say something other than begging for a beta key. So there you go.

Edited April 25, 2012 by Stolypin Necktie

[buttmuncher.ops]

lol it's not begging

check your profile and let me know what your Steam account name is as well. because if you make a new Steam account for just this, i'll have to add you instead (friend's privileges are disabled on new accounts with no games attached to them)

[Silvercrow]

Been playing this a bit more recently as opposed to LoL since a bunch of my friends actually got beta invites.

I enjoy the game, the dynamic is definitely interesting, although I haven't been playing for very long by any means. Pretty much exclusively been trying to play mid lane, since it was my forte in league and holy crap I am bad at playing agility carries in this game. Like I literally cannot do it unless I am spoon fed. I can play an Outworld Destroyer or Exort Invoker just fine in a carry role, but whenever I try to play an Anti-Mage or Void or w/e I just flop, hard. Yea there's probably some irony there.

But, still learning, there's just so much to learn especially in terms of items. I still feel like I have only a very rudimentary understanding of what items are good situationally.

Either way, I definitely intend to keep playing, so there's that.

[peener weener]

Oh, right

I'm just gonna add you.

[buttmuncher.ops]

the game is all about what you can do situationally (along with prime decision making) once all the basics become natural instincts.

the biggest problem with new players learning carry is a lack of last hitting ability, and it will come with enough practice and an effort to improve in that area. the next step is to actively gauge your farm and knowing by what minute into the game you'll have an item and whether or not it'll end up paying for itself by late game if you get it within the appropriate time frame. situational grasp of farm, knowing when to build offensive or defensive item, and exceptional last hitting ability are the three most crucial aspects of being able to hard carry. i say hard carry, because the difference between OD / Invoker and AM / Void is that the first two are semi-carries and the latter two are hard carries.

for melee carries i suggest quelling blade + tango & pieces of w/e primary small item you'd like to start off with (branches for +stats are extremely good here into magic wand)

(for faceless void) practice rushing a hand of midas by minute 7 (extremely good farm) to minute 10 (decent farm). if you gauge your farm and realize the item will be finished post the 10 minute mark then it's not a worthwhile investment.

(for anti-mage) practice rushing a ring of health by minute 2 (extremely good farm) to minute 3 (decent farm). at this point it gets more situational because with extremely good farm you should have a perseverance at minute 6, boots minute 8, battlefury minute 15. with decent farm aim for vanguard minute 10, but you'll have to forgo the quelling blade at the beginning for a stout shield instead, which means you'd have to look at the enemy lineup and realize ahead of time whether or not you will be receiving heavy harass / ganks in the lane.

these are pretty much cookie cutter starters for these two heroes, but they can be applied to any hero. ranged carries primary farm item is a bit different, some people opt to go 7-10 minute hand of midas or 10-12 minute maelstrom rush.

of course, some carries come with their own unique attack modifiers (also known as orb effects) so maelstrom is not an option. examples are drow and huskar where efficient orb walking skill allows the above average player to rush a 7-10 minute helm of the dominator => allows you to stack ancients for even more farm in the mid-late game. this is a less noob friendly build for obvious reasons.

p.s. if you want to really want to get good at last hitting, play 1v1 solo mid practice games non stop (first blood wins obviously, but mirror lineup is unfortunately not available yet). better yet, play 1v1 solo mid vs sniper bot on unfair with no starting items (the sniper bot will average 50+ denies by 10 minutes if left unhindered)

[Silvercrow]

Meh, I feel like I've got a decent grasp of last hitting (having played about 2k games of LoL, although it is almost universally easier to last hit in that game) so I don't really feel that's the biggest issue. I generally have around 50 give or take a few CS by the 10 minute mark on a ranged hero provided I don't get demolished in lane. It's more like playing carry is just different in this game... in LoL playing carry is basically an exercise in kiting and animation cancelling, in DotA it's quite different due to turning speed and the general unresponsiveness of heroes.

That said, I feel like I do alright on semi-carry roles. Queen of Pain has been my go-to hero, been sporting a fairly good win ratio on her. Can usually get upgraded boots, magic wand, bottle and one big item (Scepter, Scythe of Vyse, etc) by the 25 minute mark on her unless I end up dying a whole lot which is difficult to do.

So yea, maybe I should just stick to my guns. Or practice more.

Edited April 25, 2012 by Silvercrow

[buttmuncher.ops]

general unresponsiveness of heroes? you should check your video / game settings or internet connection, i've had a friend complain about this before and his settings were way off from what his computer could handle so he always complained about "lag." it's also possible that you're feeling the effect of each hero having their own special attack animation speed, as opposed to LoL's almost standardized attack animation speed across all heroes.

the trend icefrog implemented is that semi carries tend to have a very strong early - mid game due to easy farming abilities whereas hard carries have weak early game due to a lack of specialized damage dealing / disable abilities but a very strong late game due to item / stat scaling extremely well. hence the emphasis on a carry being able to farm extremely well during the weak early game phase so they actually make it to late game. game's are way shorter than they used to be (30-40 mins as opposed to 50-60) due to a general skill level rise amongst the public community from the original WC3 mod, so in the current meta if your carry doesn't have the big item by minute 10, 12 or 15, that person probably failed hard individually or the team just failed to protect the carry's farm.

the biggest difference between LoL and DotA concerning farm are the two mistake punishable game mechanics: primarily losing gold when you die (amount going up depending on length of game / level etc.) & secondarily allowing creep denies in the early game phase. hence the major emphasis on carries having exceptional last hitting and farming ability, due to the current gank heavy metagame (supports start roam ganking as early as level 2-3 / minute 3-4). game's at high ELO tend to center around highly tankable & mobile carries for this very reason to supplement easy farm.

i haven't played LoL in about 6 months but iirc you don't lose gold when you die nor are creeps denyable, i don't know if they've changed it. basically the only time you can lose out on gold is while you're dead, being absent from lanes. so when you're playing hard carry in DotA it's possible you're just feeling the effect of x2 more ways to lose gold and thus flopping. plus, pubs don't usually subscribe to a strict metagame of support / hard carry side lane etc. and you might have to compete with your own team for CS as well. basically, when i play a carry in LoL, if i died i can still be working on my rush item and have it by the reasonable timeframe np; but in DotA the timeframe / rush item is a variable and gold supply might take hits depending on the situation both ways: harass, last hitting, gank presence, tower pushes, side safe lane stack pulls vs side suicide lane position, deaths, kills etc. all make your xp & gold per min a total variable.

protip: if you die as a carry before the 12 minute mark, buyback immediately and tp / head to lane; the buyback cost is so cheap that early in the game that you can farm it all back in one creep wave.

if solo mid with QoP it's extremely easy to have the big item by minute 10 or 15 in addition to all the small items. her attack animation and farming / harassing / ganking & rune control potential, along with high mobility makes her the best solo mid & 1v1 hero in the game hands down; possibly only contested by invoker / furion / storm. potential first blood, along with +6 potential side lane double kills (could be RNG dependent every 2 mins depending on runes / push) and solo mid free farm would usually net me a 20 minute aggy's / linkens followed by a 30 minute linkens / scythe, situationally depending on which item is more relevant to enemy lineup.

p.s. to the anyone else viewing, i'm all out of beta keys and game passes. that shit went out like hotcakes lol.

[peener weener]

I played a bot game as Skeletong King.

I have no idea what the fuck I am doing.

[Original Alear]

Leoric?

I used to play as him a really long time ago...basically you just tank damage like crazy. Usually got ring of health early, and then make it a perseverance (make it a battlefury later) to keep his mana up so he can use storm bolt a lot and still reincarnate. You generally (this goes for plenty of heroes besides leoric) try not to use bolt at maximum range, so you can hit the guy more before he runs. I tended to go a lifesteal build with something like satanic.

But, I have no idea if Dota 1 is like Dota 2 that much? Or if I even know what I'm talking about?

[buttmuncher.ops]

the meta is a lot different now, but yea, dota 2 is basically dota 1 on a whole new revamped engine and updated graphics. essentially still the same game.

lol that build worked a really long time ago. most people forgo the pers for a soul ring + armlet now, mana on demand for ult + tanky as hell early game. then build orb of choice or defensive item like bkb depending on the game.

but i think stolypin was talking more about he had no idea how to lane or what he's supposed to basically be doing. i'd explain it all here but you're better off reading the beginner's section here. lol you should hit me up when you play though, i can teach you a lot in game pretty easily.

[buttmuncher.ops]

Dreamhack DotA 2 tournament being streamed live and shoutcasted by Tobi for all you nerds out there: http://www.twitch.tv/dreamhackdota

Try to ignore the horrible music as Tobi is actually one of the best shoutcasters for the game at the moment. For the current series AL is up on Quantic winning a best of one. I've actually had the pleasure of being able to play regularly against AL reserves in public matchmaking, they're really solid players.

Enjoy~!

Edited June 16, 2012 by bllllllllllllack.mamba.ops

[buttmuncher.ops]

DotA 2 International Livestreams

Enjoy

Edited August 27, 2012 by blllack&goldmedalmamba

[peener weener]

i'll be gone for the week

welp kik

[Kiriane]

Where do you suggest I go to find a DotA2 beta key now, then? I'm interested in trying this out.

[Esme]

I am going to be a brave little boy and somehow get this to work on my Mac.

The Crossover website says that I can run Steam + DotA2 with Crossover and CrossTie apparently, so I have a chance at getting this to work successfully... although I have no idea whether or not I'll have issues with speed or graphics. Still, I'm sure I can find a way to play this with you guys. :P

inb4 stop using a mac

Good god, I honestly wish I could.

Edited August 27, 2012 by Esme

[Silvercrow]

Where do you suggest I go to find a DotA2 beta key now, then? I'm interested in trying this out.

http://www.dota2.com/survey/experience/

Or the better option is to find someone who is willing to give a key away

[Paperblade]

DotA 2 International Livestreams

Enjoy

http://store.steampowered.com/app/570/

Spectator client is better

[Esme]

Oh jeez.

So apperently DotA and all that is already available on Mac.

ughghghghg

Well at least I can play now.

EDIT: Wait, shit, DotA doesn't have Mac support.

Nooooooooooooooo! :<<<<<

Edited August 28, 2012 by Esme

[buttmuncher.ops]

+1 for spectator client paper, thanks, the quality's much better on that if you have steam guys, so check it out

most people either have the game or don't, much less steam, so the livestreams are nice if you're looking for a quickie stream fix, but if you want quality, definitely invest in the stand alone spectator client

don't worry spike, these initial 3 days are just prelim gaymes to determine the winner and loser bracket playoff settings. after the half day on wednesday be sure to be here on the 31st next week for the

[spoiler=MAIN EVENT]paper, feel free to correct me here if i got anything wrong.

winner's bracket teams play a best of 3 where the losers get dropped to the loser's bracket for a second chance at the money whereas loser bracket is all elimination at best of 1 (but loser bracket's finals are bo3). then the last remaining teams from each bracket compete for $1 MILLION first place prize in an epic best of 5 (top 8 finish in the money).

1. powerhouse teams to watch out for: LGD, DK & iG (all these team's are chinese LOL)

2. fan favorites by region

USA: coL

literally put NADotA back on the map after EG fell off the wagon

Europe: Na'Vi

last year's winners, but lost a great captain in ArtStyle and suffered a bit for this year's run of tournaments / this International because of it

Asia: EHOME

runner ups from last year

3. wildcard team's to watch out for: mTw, mouz & aL

LGD currently stands undefeated at 12-0 in Group A with iG leading Group B at 10-1 (i wasn't awake for this, but i think iG vs TF's last game didn't update or happen, so they're at 11 games for the day). in my personal opinion, group B has a tougher, competitive environment of challenging teams than group A, so i feel iG > LGD, but any fan you talk to can argue the other way. top 4 teams in each group after 14 games makes it to the winner's bracket and these two teams are almost guaranteed shoe ins for each group after today.

in terms of players it's hard to tell who's creme of the crop with so much talent in this tournament but without a doubt Na'Vi.Dendi probably has the biggest fanbase. my personal choices to watch closely in this tournament are

1. mouz KuroKy

currently playing as a stand-in for mouz since ComeWithMe didn't make it to Seattle LOL, but might officially replace & stay on after The International, who knows. one thing to note is that SingSing has been relegated to a quasi Support role because of the lineup change, but the team is functioning at a very high level because of the roster change

2. DK.BurNIng

currently holds tournament record for closest to perfect creep score by minute 10 at 78, a perfect score is 82

3. iG.Ferrari_430

biggest playmaker for any single team i've seen in the tournament thus far with attention to detail, map awareness, macro and micro skills; doing almost everything and anything perfectly. it's too soon to give him an MVP award, but in terms of individual player skill i rate him a 9 or 10 in almost every category. Chinese teams break the metagame every time we see them on the international stage as it is, but this guy alone will break the Rubick metagame wall in my opinion and you know he's saving the real stuff for the playoffs with the amount of confidence that he plays with.

i'll check with my cousin at playdota for beta keys for the guys interested. i'll keep you posted. enjoy the half day of prelims tomorrow !

Edited August 28, 2012 by blllack&goldmedalmamba

[Paperblade]

Favorites going into this for Asia were LGD and iG for sure, maybe Orange too because Yamateh. EHOME did well last year but a lot has changed since then, since a lot of Chinese teams weren't taking Dota 2 seriously then. iG has spent like 3 months preparing for the tournament.

DK is also poised to win it, although going into the tournament people seemed to think BurNing was washed up since his glory days of 2010.

EU is difficult since Na'vi has been having internal issues ever since Dreamhack and none of the other teams really stand out to me. CLG had an amazing Day 1 but had a Day 2 that was equally terrible (6-0 and 0-6 respectively), M5 and Darer are awful, mouz has incredibly inconsistent and risky play

coL is probably the best NA team but that's not saying much, NA has been basically irrelevant since Merlini retired

Realistically I think that a Chinese team is going to win it, their coordination and technical skill is just so much better than the EU and NA teams because they actually make enough money off their sponsors to treat it like a full time job (have you seen the DK mansion? What the fuck), so they can afford to practice all the time

[buttmuncher.ops]

lol yeah i heard some chinese teams that got invited to last year's international didn't go because they thought it was a scam (even though valve organized it). a lot of asian teams get scam invites where they end up playing for free for a lot of spectators and the organizers don't end up paying them, so they didn't think the $1 million first place prize was real till they saw Na'Vi cut the check.

LGD vs iG for an epic best of 5 finals would be really crazy awesome to watch

don't count DK out though

Edited August 28, 2012 by blllack&goldmedalmamba

[buttmuncher.ops]

MAIN EVENT

Enjoy through Sunday, and be sure to pick up the spectator client app if you want to watch in better quality.

[buttmuncher.ops]

i've got two extra dota 2 invites for whoever needs them

add me on steam: EP5| Sexy Strikes Back

or hit me up on IP.Chat, my profile or PM

Edited September 30, 2012 by blllack&goldmedalmamba

[Kiriane]

Thanks! I'll be able to play when I get to my gaming computer on the weekend. =D