Marston Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Beat C14, wasn't to hard after I found out where I could place Anna without her dying (she survived one attack, but a second would have killed her in most cases). Donnel got quite a few level ups, I reclassed Nowi into a Wyvern and gave her a forged Bronze Axe. Chrom had to face tank quite a bunch of the enemies, but the others still got quite a few exp. Well, Lucina wasn't there, which is sad, but I think it will be okay. Kjelle's Paralogue seems to be the easiest one (at least level and stat wise). Maybe I try Lost Bloodlines 1 again, but I don't think I can beat that yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ownagepuffs Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 The Lost Bloodlines series is among the harder set of DLC chapters. It's not the challenge pack or Future Past series, but it does have a fair bit of difficulty. LB3 is especially bothersome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marston Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Yeah, but it still has the lowest enemies (aside from Scramble Pack and Champions of Yore) I could do with my "each DLC only once". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted January 14, 2015 Share Posted January 14, 2015 Cordy and Sumia are never in need of speed, so while I'm not someone that's super amazing at optimal resource distribution, I'd say Cherche would be a good candidate for those speedwings to help her start. You know this series more than I do, so I don't have to say why having a flier with durability is pretty awesome. Frederick probably appreciates them too. I WISH THIS WAS TRUE! Believe it or not, I got a Speed-screwed Cordelia - 15/6 Dark Flier with 20 Speed (she should be at 21/22, on average). I had to give her a Speed Tonic so she wasn't doubled by the faster enemies in Chapter 17. Sumia, on the other hand. . .13 Strength and 11 Magic at 13/8 (gave her two Energy Drops so she'd stop sucking so hard). The only reason why she's getting kills is because Chrom's Dual Strike+ is amazing. Paired Avatar with Lucina, and the latter is doing a fine job, even though I haven't promoted her yet. I'm seriously thinking of draining the reinforcements on Chapter 17. Yes, Avatar can basically take on the entire chapter and win, but the rest of my team needs some love. This is so that Chapter 18 doesn't bite me in the ass - the next-best unit after Avatar is Panne, and she's axe-locked! I can try to postpone training to Chapter 19, as well, but I'm not as familiar with the reinforcement pattern. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Czar_Yoshi Posted January 14, 2015 Share Posted January 14, 2015 The Lost Bloodlines series is among the harder set of DLC chapters. It's not the challenge pack or Future Past series, but it does have a fair bit of difficulty. LB3 is especially bothersome. While it's true that the Spirit Talisman maps scale with difficulty... They're still perfectly doable. I've cleared LB3 fresh out of Cht.4 on Lunatic+ before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vorena Posted January 14, 2015 Share Posted January 14, 2015 (edited) It's totally possible, Vorena. Veteran is capable of great things. You got really lucky with the Anna shops, eclipse. I'm kinda jealous. Get that Beastkiller and forge it. With either a +2 or +3 Mt forge,it should OHKO Cavaliers in C6 and C8. It'll also help in C12 since there are horses everywhere and C14 to OHKO those annoying Pegasus Knights. It'll start losing its beastly OHKOs in C15 since all horses get kinda bulky by then but it will definitely 2HKO at the least. Cordy and Sumia are never in need of speed, so while I'm not someone that's super amazing at optimal resource distribution, I'd say Cherche would be a good candidate for those speedwings to help her start. You know this series more than I do, so I don't have to say why having a flier with durability is pretty awesome. Frederick probably appreciates them too. That's actually kind of low, believe it or not. If you've only been training one other unit, you can promote at 20/20 in Cht.8. What Czar Yoshi said is why I had my surprise. Not the surprise that Avatar was that high, but the fact that avatar was that low for a lunatic run. I am commonly use to seeing Avatar at level 18-20 by the time chapter 5 hits because of veteran and the fact that Robin is incredibly useful. Usually, its sent Avatar with some defensive character like Fredrick or the invisible knight and have them KO stuff in some part of the chapter. Afterwards using the other characters to rout a smaller group of enemies for experience without worrying about huge waves of enemies coming to overwhelm them due to Robin killing them elsewhere. I WISH THIS WAS TRUE! Believe it or not, I got a Speed-screwed Cordelia - 15/6 Dark Flier with 20 Speed (she should be at 21/22, on average). I had to give her a Speed Tonic so she wasn't doubled by the faster enemies in Chapter 17. Sumia, on the other hand. . .13 Strength and 11 Magic at 13/8 (gave her two Energy Drops so she'd stop sucking so hard). The only reason why she's getting kills is because Chrom's Dual Strike+ is amazing. This is my main issue with Cordelia from what I recall. She usually seems to borderline on getting just enough speed to double the things she needs while possibly getting doubled if she is not keeping up a good amount of speed. How many units are you trying to field by the way? Edited January 14, 2015 by Vorena Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volke29 Posted January 14, 2015 Share Posted January 14, 2015 Just an update on my first Lunatic run .... it's been one giant grind fest. I'm trying to recruit Noire, who is perhaps my first kid I'm trying to recruit. Really excited about having a sniper with Galeforce, Aptitude and Armshift. ANY WHO ... The map is not impossible, but to beat it I need to do ... more grinding! I'm about 10 hours in. Lon'qu, Summa, Chrom, MU and Fredrick are among the units that can actually hang with the enemy on that map. They still get damaged, but in a fair way. I have a few second tier units that can survive a hit, but not more. Too many enemies, not enough space to escape them. They eventually get devoured. My main units fall, too, as there are just too many enemies. I'm basically stuck to grinding some more. I can see how much fun the game will be once I'm done grinding, but man, it's been like eight hours grinding, two hours actual game play so far for me. A little less grinding would be cool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gradivus. Posted January 14, 2015 Share Posted January 14, 2015 @eclipse C19 guys look really tough to abuse, since they spawn four turns w/o a break (unless you 5-turn, but less exp), so you get exposed if you nuke them on PP. I recall the upper (8) forts being on 4 and 5, the lower (also 8) ones on 6 and 7. Lowest 4 forts have dracoknights, otherwise horse guys IIRC. Note that I figured that out on an HM run, so it might not be right for loony. Though it would only be harder on loony if it's different. (also SS'ing MU to General, but not saving can help finding it out exactly) I'd definitely do C17 reinforcements and C19 as much as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marston Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 So, I've beaten Kjelle's Paralogue and was actually able to let her and Lucina both gain 2 levels (I think Kjelle even gained 3). Of course I was totally stupid and only saw the chests when the Reinforcements stopped spawning. Since I didn't die, I just thought "fuck this shit" and finished the map. I luckily had a single chest key, so I grab the Bullion (M) for 5,000 gold instead of the short spear. Bought a reduced Master Seal since I only have 1 at the moment and Donnel, Nowi, Kjelle and Lucina all need promotions sooner or later. Donnel is already level 7 mercenary and got D swords. Nowi is level 2 or 3 as a wyver and still has E axes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 This is my main issue with Cordelia from what I recall. She usually seems to borderline on getting just enough speed to double the things she needs while possibly getting doubled if she is not keeping up a good amount of speed. How many units are you trying to field by the way? Core: Chrom/Sumia, Avatar/Lucina, Lissa/Owain, Panne/Gregor As needed: Cynthia, Morgan, Frederick/Cordelia, Nowi/Gaius Will probably do something stupid like Chrom/Sumia, Avatar/Morgan, and Lucina/Cynthia instead. . .if I can train Cynthia and Morgan (the former looks to be a lot harder than the latter). @eclipse C19 guys look really tough to abuse, since they spawn four turns w/o a break (unless you 5-turn, but less exp), so you get exposed if you nuke them on PP. I recall the upper (8) forts being on 4 and 5, the lower (also 8) ones on 6 and 7. Lowest 4 forts have dracoknights, otherwise horse guys IIRC. Note that I figured that out on an HM run, so it might not be right for loony. Though it would only be harder on loony if it's different. (also SS'ing MU to General, but not saving can help finding it out exactly) I'd definitely do C17 reinforcements and C19 as much as possible. Oh FFS. . .everything's on a mount in that chapter. And they're bloody accurate, too. ;/ I found a way to abuse the reinforcements on Chapter 17 - have a single unit that can dodge reliably stand right in the doorway of the boss room, while everyone else huddles in a treasure room - most of the reinforcements will target the lone unit in the door, while a manageable amount will go after the rest of your army in the treasure room. The trick is that the lone unit must wield a bow. What you want to do is to kill off anything with a range greater than 1, and then leave the rest of the reinforcements stacked in the hall. Once the enemies stop spawning, you can lure out one or two enemies at a time away from the pile, and kill them in peace. Found this out by accident when I reclassed Avatar in the middle of the chapter (I went Bow Knight because my eventual goal is to have him Brave Bow Grima). Chapter 18 wasn't too bad, once I figured out how to keep those stupid flying things away from my squishy units. Chrom was able to double them, and somehow didn't get hit. Then I took a detour to Paralogue 19, and cheesed it hard. For that strategy to work, I had to feed Chrom my last Speedwings, and give him a Speed Tonic - this put him at 32 Speed, which is the minimum amount required to double the Griffons. Thanks to some positioning shenanigans, I was able to have Chrom and Sumia attack while standing next to each other, which triggered Dual Strike, which in turn allowed me to kill off the extra enemy unit that I needed to. Lucina was strong enough to take on the Wyverns, unpaired. The detour gave me an unexpected bonus - Libra and Lissa hit S! I needed Sumia to gain one more level for Galeforce, so I grabbed Owain. He's. . .awful, to put it mildly, but he makes a better magical booster than Libra. I passed on Tomefaire and Rally Luck (I WILL need the latter on the final chapter). Sumia got Galeforce, and I opted for the Speed Tonic in place of a sword I'd never use. Lucina gained some levels, as well. With Galeforce in hand, I reclassed Sumia to Great Knight - she's mediocre, but at least she's more likely to kill stuff. Picked up Cynthia, and used Avatar/Lucina to distract half the map, while everyone else picked off Cynthia's side. Killed the boss, got my loot, and Avatar/Lucina hit S. Picked up Morgan, and had no problems whatsoever - the enemies were scrubs compared to my team. Managed to shove some levels into Gregor and Morgan. That Fortify is going to save my sorry ass. NOW I will attempt Chapter 19, with Sumia/Chrom doing their best to sponge damage, Avatar/Morgan breaking half the map (which half is irrelevant), Lissa/Owain being typical staffbots, Panne/Gregor blicking things because Avatar can't be in two places at once, Cynthia/Lucina for training, Nowi/Gaius for luring, and Frederick/Cordelia to kill a stray General or two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Czar_Yoshi Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 They're still a few chapters before Hit+20 and Silver++ weapons, so Cht.19 should be tankable with some work. But don't aggro anything you don't need to. Bows are great. Everyone thinks they're just for Counter, but limiting EP combat is the real reason why Bows are great. Owain does indeed generally wind up as a support bot in my Lunatic(+) runs. Fortunately, there are a lot of very good girls that are easy to come by in Lunatic, so that's not exactly an unwanted position. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 BUT EVERYTHING HAS GIANT RANGE! I need to figure out how the aggro ranges work, because the last time I tried this, most of the map chased me. ;/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Czar_Yoshi Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 It's fairly possible that all but Walhart's group eventually come automatically. Your best bet if you can't hold your ground (requires a lot of Galeforce) is to rush to a corner and turtle there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 (edited) Figured it out, and used something similar to Chapter 17. I had Avatar/Morgan rush the center, which attracted most of the enemies. The stragglers came to the western forts, which were occupied by units that could actually make use of the terrain bonuses (Lucina and Nowi, to be exact). By abusing Sumia's Galeforce, and using that Fortify staff I got from Morgan's chapter, I was able to keep everyone alive, somehow. Eventually, there weren't enough reinforcements to trap Avatar, who ran up to Walhart and smacked him around. The next two chapters are gonna suck. I'm going to do another Golden Gaffe run (that makes five since the game started), because the Risen skirmishes are Anna shops instead, and she's still selling stat boosters. Speaking of. . .need to figure out who Naga's Tear goes to. Thinking about putting it on Lucina. EDIT: Suck it, Chapter 20! Between a run in the Golden Gaffe and the last of Walhart's cronies, Cynthia managed to get enough levels to promote (I used a Second Seal to turn her into a Cavalier, because I am insane like that). Hell, even Owain managed to roast a couple of mooks! I had to end the chapter early, because I remember that reinforcements come from the side doors, but didn't remember what turn they start. Edited January 15, 2015 by eclipse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awakener_ Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 http://i.imgur.com/RvoC5Zj.jpg?1 What your guys final gameplay time for L+? The patient I had with this game really REALLY surprised me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuroi Tsubasa Tenshi Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Depends on the run. I think it was 30-40 for my first no grind, then around 15-20 for subsequent challenges. The story run where I streamed the campaign, Future Past and Apotheosis (with some offline grinding to make Apotheosis and showing all the best Future Past endings doable with all those suboptimal pairings) went something like... maybe 80-90? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interceptor Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 http://i.imgur.com/RvoC5Zj.jpg?1 What your guys final gameplay time for L+? The patient I had with this game really REALLY surprised me. Somewhere around ~45 hours. I don't really make any attempt to cut down on map idling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Time, schmime. Congratulations on beating L+~! I decided to cheese Nah's Paralogue, and Morgan got a LOT of levels (reclassed her to Dark Mage for sniping purposes, she left as a level 7 Sorcerer). Reclassed Avatar to Sniper (yes, I'm nuts). Then I went to Chapter 21, which wasn't as bad as I remember it - finished in five turns with the worst "abuse" being the Fortify staff. Chapter 22 is giving me grief - not because I can't one-turn it (Avatar is a sniper, and I have a Lissa who can get his ass there in a hurry), but because Avatar does stupid things like get hit in the face twice with a Brave Bow, despite having Bowbreaker equipped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Czar_Yoshi Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Well, that BK has Bowbreaker as well, so you're going to tie at best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Well, that BK has Bowbreaker as well, so you're going to tie at best. That explains it. ;/ Realized that I had Rally Skill/Rally Luck at my disposal, so abused those on Chapter 22. Managed to kill off everything (er. . .didn't stick around long enough for the reinforcements). Currently on Chapter 23, but it's doable. Apparently, my time spent training Gaius' staff rank has come in handy - he's another rescuebot (albeit a terrible one). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Czar_Yoshi Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 22? I don't think that chapter has any reinforcements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Got that mixed up with another chapter. . .the one I'm on now (Chapter 25). Chapter 23 was somewhat cheesed by Morgan with Nosferatu. As odd as this will sound, the chapter isn't big enough for me to kite effectively, and my strategy of plopping Avatar down somewhere and letting the enemies swarm him is too risky (as they can hit him somewhat consistently). Chapter 24 wasn't as bad as I thought it would be - blocked some of the forts, so I only had to deal with a handful of reinforcements. Panne was a godsend here - with Swordbreaker on the Wyvern Lords, she was able to get consistently high hit rates on them, even if she's 2HKO'd (thank you Rescue staff). I'm on Chapter 25, and am on the second reinforcement wave (four Generals, four Dark Fliers). It looks like there's several more reinforcements. Which direction do these enemies come from? If possible, I'd like to drain the map of reinforcements, but not if it'll kill the staffbots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyon's Dirge Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 I'm gonna start a Lunatic mode file. Now let's experience what everyone has been complaining about firsthand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Missile Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Is it me or there are no complete Lunatic + playthrough on youtube (or another site) ? I'm really interested to see how people managed to make it without grinding especially in chapter 2, 18, 23 and 24 (the hardest for me). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cat1803 Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Well, I'm an idiot. I was stalling chapter 5 because I hate it and messing around in another file and accidentally saved over my no-DLC L+ file. And I didn't have it backed up. At all. I've done this before. I really need to start backing up my saves. Is it me or there are no complete Lunatic + playthrough on youtube (or another site) ? I'm really interested to see how people managed to make it without grinding especially in chapter 2, 18, 23 and 24 (the hardest for me). None I can see on video. Chapter 2 is the same whether you grind or not (and is now far more manageable thanks to Interceptor's strat). As for nogrind L+ in general... EXP distribution is key. Bows are valuable for once but not entirely required. The general idea is training up a small but strong army, with early chapters focusing on stuffing Avatar with kills thanks to Veteran (the water trick works well for this, as do forts and other terrain advantages that can help keep you alive while you're squishy). SoC has some random Lunatic+ stuff on his YouTube channel, but his LP is on Normal. There's another Lunatic+ LP floating around YouTube (LucarioMaster I think?) but his is full-grind and incomplete as of yet. Makes me wish I had enough money for a capture card. I'm not an expert by any standard, but I'd at least like to record a visual for getting through the early chapters with a Def flaw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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