SSB4: SSB for Wii U and 3DS, maybe the NX and also your toaster!

[Great Geargia Gateway]

Yeah, I get input lag online a lot too. And movement lag as well. Meaning, my character just plain moves slower than normal. Slower walking, slower running, etc.

I get input lag, but the game speed problem? I dunno. I played with my friends locally, save a replay and realize how fast it actually was. I thought it because I was in deep focus and concentration.

While that would be an interesting mechanic, I highly doubt that competitive smashers would be willing to implement it into tourneys. People are still upset over the rage mechanic, since it gives too much advantage to the losing player. Being able to pull off a super attack just because you're getting hit too much would make matches closer, but in a manner that many would consider against the competitive spirit. I can't imagine the endless complaints. If people really wanted it legal, the devs would need to heavily rebalance either stock counts and/or FS strengths. In a 2-stock game, having a super that can KO at as low as like 10-20% would be outrageously unbalanced. Granted, the player does need to surivive long enough to build up the meter. But imagine the leading player in that scenario: one second you're dominating your opponent and leading by like 100% in your final stock, the next second you're KO'd by a single easy attack. It would be infuriating.

This FS guage would significantly buff the heavies, though, since they generally take lots of damage every stock while KOing at relatively low percents themselves. And despite subtle improvements in SSB4, the heavies still do still need buffs.

I personally hate the Rage Effect. Got a Bowser on 230+ online and just couldn't get the ko off, but then he one-shot my Falco. Was pretty butthurt. I don't like how someone still won and didn't work for it. The other player even left thinking he was tops. Getting pluses for getting punished? I think it needs to be removed. Heavies, and Lucario benefit to much if they can't kill. For when someone get's a KO, when they look over why, the Rage Effect reason is always looked on last.

[Anacybele]

Yeah, I noticed in one match that Luigi started moving slower than normal. My Frederick Mii has been hit with this problem too. In fact, I get input and movement lag more often with my Miis than any other character, for some reason...

[Jotari]

I get input lag, but the game speed problem? I dunno. I played with my friends locally, save a replay and realize how fast it actually was. I thought it because I was in deep focus and concentration.

I personally hate the Rage Effect. Got a Bowser on 230+ online and just couldn't get the ko off, but then he one-shot my Falco. Was pretty butthurt. I don't like how someone still won and didn't work for it. The other player even left thinking he was tops. Getting pluses for getting punished? I think it needs to be removed. Heavies, and Lucario benefit to much if they can't kill. For when someone get's a KO, when they look over why, the Rage Effect reason is always looked on last.

I'm not sure it's right to say he didn't work for it. I mean if he managed to survive when he was at 230+% then clearly he was doing something right. And it's not like buffing heavier characters is a bad thing since they're usually considered weaker outside of free for alls.

[Tamarsamar]

While that would be an interesting mechanic, I highly doubt that competitive smashers would be willing to implement it into tourneys. People are still upset over the rage mechanic, since it gives too much advantage to the losing player.

I'm sorry, I couldn't finish reading your post because my head a splode after reading this.

What the crap is wrong with the fighting game community? Can I just give them all a collective slapping? "COMEBACK. MECHANICS. ARE. GOOD. GAME. DESIGN."

[Comet]

yeah, people should be disadvantaged when they win neutral game and hit the other person. that's great game design.

[Tamarsamar]

yeah, people should be disadvantaged when they win neutral game and hit the other person. that's great game design.

Not nearly as good as your game effectively ending with a single hit-confirm, mind you.

[Great Geargia Gateway]

Didn't Mario Kart 8 remove the Rubber banding? It's hard to get up to 1st place again. To catch up, you must earn it.

[kingddd]

Didn't Mario Kart 8 remove the Rubber banding? It's hard to get up to 1st place again. To catch up, you must earn it.

No they reduced rubber banding compared to the other series. They never eliminated it since the original Mario Kart. Mario Kart 64, Wii and 7's rubberbanding was atrociously too good though.

If you're talking about online multiplayer, no there never was any rubber banding in any of the online multiplayer.

Edited August 7, 2015 by kingddd

[Kiseki]

What the crap is wrong with the fighting game community? Can I just give them all a collective slapping? "COMEBACK. MECHANICS. ARE. GOOD. GAME. DESIGN."

Well, it makes the game more intense and down to the wire faster. And when a game isn't fast, it isn't interesting (see: Brawl), so why remove something that makes the game more interesting and suffer the complaints the last installment dealt with as a result?

Besides, I actually like the Rage mechanic. And I personally think it's one-sided to nobody, being equal to both winning and losing players. The winning player knows it's easier to finish off the opponent while the losing player knows they have a chance to make a comeback. I think it's pretty balanced and I can't think of a scenario where it isn't.

[Comet]

Not nearly as good as your game effectively ending with a single hit-confirm, mind you.

don't get hit

[kingddd]

don't get hit

You must recover!

[Tamarsamar]

Well, it makes the game more intense and down to the wire faster. And when a game isn't fast, it isn't interesting (see: Brawl), so why remove something that makes the game more interesting and suffer the complaints the last installment dealt with as a result?

Besides, I actually like the Rage mechanic. And I personally think it's one-sided to nobody, being equal to both winning and losing players. The winning player knows it's easier to finish off the opponent while the losing player knows they have a chance to make a comeback. I think it's pretty balanced and I can't think of a scenario where it isn't.

Your main point was right, but regarding Brawl's many problems, IMHO being "too slow" was not one of them.

don't get hit

This exact kind of toxic attitude (among many other reasons) is exactly why I do not get into other fighting games.

[Comet]

This exact kind of toxic attitude (among many other reasons) is exactly why I do not get into other fighting games.

if you think it's toxic, then you're not cut out for fighting games. your goal in fighting games is to hit the other person. you should not let yourself be hit. if you get hit, you're put into a worse state than before, due to the other person's superior skill.

[Great Geargia Gateway]

if you think it's toxic, then you're not cut out for fighting games. your goal in fighting games is to hit the other person. you should not let yourself be hit. if you get hit, you're put into a worse state than before, due to the other person's superior skill.

Seems like you don't know your fighting games either. You don't need to hit you opponent to win, you just need to beat them.

[Comet]

Seems like you don't know your fighting games either. You don't need to hit you opponent to win, you just need to beat them.

and you beat them by dealing damage to them by hitting them

[Knight]

Getting hit is generally a bad idea. However, I've never found rage to be a very frustrating mechanic in my own experience, it can make a difference, but then again...

your goal in fighting games is to hit the other person. you should not let yourself be hit.

Rage is only an issue of you're getting hit, don't get hit, rage can't affect you. It's definitely not as frustrating a mechanic as tripping in Brawl. If you're a stock ahead, and you're skilled enough, rage should only give you an advantage. It still seems like something pointless, I don't think narrowing the skill gap in such a way is a good idea. If people want to get good, they'll just have to put the effort into getting good and learn all the mechanics that the game has given to you.

[Jedi]

I'm sorry, I couldn't finish reading your post because my head a splode after reading this.

What the crap is wrong with the fighting game community? Can I just give them all a collective slapping? "COMEBACK. MECHANICS. ARE. GOOD. GAME. DESIGN."

Not when they are poorly implemented.

Like look at me playing someone like Peach, who is more difficult to KO with, I get punished for having tons of combos because I don't have the most reliable finishers, but here is my opponent getting stronger as I'm wailing on them, who by all means could have a stock lead on me because of the exact same thing.

Edited August 7, 2015 by Jedi

[Great Geargia Gateway]

and you beat them by dealing damage to them by hitting them

If I said "Don't try to beat me, try to win." Would you get it?

Edited August 7, 2015 by Great Geargia Gateway

[Kiseki]

Well, if people don't like the Rage mechanic so much that they want it rebalanced, then I'd say...

A) Either tone down the knockback multiplier so that reversals don't become BS.

or

B) Give certain attacks different multipliers so that moves that are already powerful aren't boosted as much as others.

I'm sure someone who is actually knowledged on the competitive scene could think of something more workable other than "just remove it".

Your main point was right, but regarding Brawl's many problems, IMHO being "too slow" was not one of them.

Whoa there, I never said anything about Brawl being a slow game, nor was I trying to imply it. All I'm saying was that it was generally harder to get a quick K.O. because of the game's physics and that matches naturally took longer because of it.

Like look at me playing someone like Peach, who is more difficult to KO with, I get punished for having tons of combos because I don't have the most reliable finishers

How is KO'ing with Peach a problem when there's Stitch-Face and Bob-ombs? Her F-Air and Back Throw are more reliable finishers now, so there's that too.

[Jedi]

How is KO'ing with Peach a problem when there's Stitch-Face and Bob-ombs? Her F-Air and Back Throw are more reliable finishers now, so there's that too.

You act like the former 2 are reliable options to get, and f-air doesn't even KO that well unless you're more near the edge, she doesn't KO early enough, hows that for clarification?

She doesn't get reliable options until maybe around 100/120%, unless you manage to get the drop on an opponent and get them earlier.

Edited August 7, 2015 by Jedi

[Kiseki]

You act like the former 2 are reliable options to get, and f-air doesn't even KO that well unless you're more near the edge, she doesn't KO early enough, hows that for clarification?

Well of course the first two are obviously not reliable. I'm just saying if you got lucky then that was an option.

And yes, Peach still has a problem with KO'ing early, but at least it's not as bad as before.

[euklyd]

fair isn't exactly ezpz to hit with; bair is better but it's not exactly strong

you're not landing any of her killing smashes without hard reads

turnips don't even work well for gimping in this game

she can chase you offstage and gimp you like that OKAY but it's not exactly reliable

and relying on RNJesus for a bob-omb or stitchface, even if they were guaranteed to land and not get blocked (which isn't at all likely) is not exactly a solid gameplan

e: greninja'd

peach can't kill for shit

Whoa there, I never said anything about Brawl being a slow game, nor was I trying to imply it. All I'm saying was that it was generally harder to get a quick K.O. because of the game's physics and that matches naturally took longer because of it.

and yet brawl was played like, 3 stock 8 min (maybe 4 stock at the beginning), and SSB4 has trouble being played 3 stock like ever

that being said, I don't really have strong feelings about rage, beyond "it makes my life slightly more complicated when it makes my combo%s and kill%s in constant flux"

I don't think it's a terrible mechanic, tho

EDIT2:

Enex's latest vid tho:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JKLbf7GSvOQ

Edited August 7, 2015 by Euklyd

[Jedi]

Well of course the first two are obviously not reliable. I'm just saying if you got lucky then that was an option.

And yes, Peach still has a problem with KO'ing early, but at least it's not as bad as before.

It's still the main reason she isn't considered that viable in this game It sucks as someone who has used her since Melee to be all like, well I love how she plays and how she combos, but I can't kill worth a damn unless I go all tryhard on it.

Edited August 7, 2015 by Jedi

[euklyd]

I thought she was viable, just not like, top tier.

[Jedi]

I thought she was viable, just not like, top tier.

She is like, stuck in Mid-Tier until she gets something more reliable imo.

Viable yes, but its difficult to play at high levels with her.

Edited August 7, 2015 by Jedi