PAIRINGS The Pairing Thread

[Alastor15243]

Why do you suggest Nowi as a possibility?

Chrom x Sumia and Avatar x Cordelia make sense to me. The character you're forced to deploy and the character who is likely leveled the most paired up with (eventual) Galeforce wives. Not to mention that both Sumia and Cordelia are fast and are likely to be able to double quite a lot. And if for some reason you recruited the children you'd be able to grab 4 Galeforce girls from the children of these two couples (potentially passing Galeforce itself immediately down to them).

But what's so great about Nowi as a unit (as I assume we're only considering gameplay here) to make it as Avatar x Cordelia/Nowi? I mean, sure, Avatar can grant Nah Galeforce, but then I see topics arguing that even then that Avatar!Nah is still not that great of an idea.

You seem to be more knowledgeable about the game's theory than I am, so I'm interested in hearing what your reasoning is. I could very well learn something.

Nowi's friggin' amazing for lunatic nogrind. Barricade off the middle of her recruitment map and you can slowly feed her most of the map. She has excellent growth rates, and if you get her an early dragonstone+ from tiki spotpass (and eventually even if you don't), she'll be an excellent tank.

Postgame, yes, Nowi's a pretty crappy wife for the avatar, though not unsalvageable if you proceed to put the avatar in a platonic pairing with Lucina to use DS+ to simulate an S rank pairing. Really, if you're going postgame, you wouldn't want to marry any first-gen anyway, seeing how second-gen gets you much better stats and the ability to let female Morgan have aether if you marry Lucina or Chrom!Cynthia (or I suppose Chrom!Kjelle, but that's a horrible pairing).

[Ownagepuffs]

Why do you suggest Nowi as a possibility?

Chrom x Sumia and Avatar x Cordelia make sense to me. The character you're forced to deploy and the character who is likely leveled the most paired up with (eventual) Galeforce wives. Not to mention that both Sumia and Cordelia are fast and are likely to be able to double quite a lot. And if for some reason you recruited the children you'd be able to grab 4 Galeforce girls from the children of these two couples (potentially passing Galeforce itself immediately down to them).

But what's so great about Nowi as a unit (as I assume we're only considering gameplay here) to make it as Avatar x Cordelia/Nowi? I mean, sure, Avatar can grant Nah Galeforce, but then I see topics arguing that even then that Avatar!Nah is still not that great of an idea.

You seem to be more knowledgeable about the game's theory than I am, so I'm interested in hearing what your reasoning is. I could very well learn something.

Take it from someone who's actually doing the pairing. It rocks for Lunatic no grind. Galeforce is pretty far away unless you aim for it.

Avatar x Nowi gives you veteran manaketes. Manaketes count as a base class, which means they grow pretty fast. Lunatic has an internal level cap of 50, which means they'll grow fast basically forever. Veteran makes them grow 50% faster. See where I'm going with this?

You get high defense units with innate 1-2 range than don't need master seals and grow incredibly fast. It's... pretty awesome.

[izanagi61]

well obviously i don't want to use old information, but the idea for this kind of thing is to keep the first post updated with new information so that newcomers ( like me ) don't have to sift through hundreds of pages in the awakening general thread and this thread to find what they need. just a suggested pairing list and a brief explanation why would be great for casual players wanting to dig deeper. i understand that there's no definitive pairing set up. but you can make multiple lists and explain the difference between them. just the more information and the easier it is to find, the easier it is to get into the deeper mechanics of the game.

EDIT: found an example of what the first should be like. it's not entirely fleshed out and the format isn't the best but you get the idea.

http://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=50454

Edited January 4, 2015 by izanagi61

[Ownagepuffs]

I'm pretty sure OP has long since abandoned this thread. There's really a lot to explain all at once, so it's better for you to just list your individual questions.

[Alastor15243]

Well, first off, are you going for apotheosis or lunatic/lunatic+ nogrind?

[izanagi61]

well i want to do lunatic apotheosis. i don't mind grinding though.

[Alastor15243]

well i want to do lunatic apotheosis. i don't mind grinding though.

Apotheosis is the same on any difficulty. At any rate, what's important to keep in mind is that you should make sure that your frontliner units have galeforce, a reliable proc (Luna, Ignis, or vengeance if you're into that) and maybe a faire (it depends, sometimes other skills are better suited than it). Units in the back need to make sure they have a faire, a good damage class that can use it, and if they're a berserker, hit+20. All male units, ALL OF THEM, should be equipped with aggressor. It's more complicated than that, but that's the basic concept.

So the first thing to do is to make sure that the two (not counting the avatar) fathers who can give girls galeforce, Gaius and Donnel, marry mothers of girls who have Luna, because neither galeforce father has any procs aside from Gaius's Astra. Donnel generally goes with Sully because Sully already has Luna AND Astra, and Gaius goes with Tharja because Noire only has Luna. Nah is left without galeforce because only the avatar can give her galeforce and a proc.

That's pretty much rule one of pairings. The next part is checking which mothers have procs, which fathers give procs, and making sure every child who isn't both male and without galeforce has a proc. Yarne, Laurent and Gerome are hard supports, which can be obscenely useful if you build them right, don't discount them as rubbish just because they can't fight up front. They will be the primary punch behind their wives' attacks. Also be sure to keep in mind what their ultimate class would be.

Edited January 5, 2015 by Alastor15243

[Nic]

Yeah, don't do that. This topic is so old that the posts halfway through would openly scoff at how bad the early posts are, and yet would merit raised eyebrows even now.

That said, fewer is better. Either use Avatar x Chrom or Chrom x Sumia and Avatar x Cordelia/Nowi as your core pairings. Any of Cordelia, Nowi, Panne and Lissa are fine to bring along as well, along with their husbands, but don't try to use too many units (five pairs max, three is better).

Then pair Gaius x Olivia and Gregor x Panne.

Thanks Yoshi, I didn't read in anywhere about the minimum/maximum pairs to have a nice experience.

ChromxSumia

MaMUxCordelia

OliviaxGaius

PannexGregor

I will try to make a nogrind (I like the idea~).

Those pairs are good? Are they good for the children? (I saw Alastor's explanation about Apotheosis, I think I won't do that for now, but I value the information from him).

Again, thank you guys~!

[izanagi61]

ok so donnelxsully and gaiusxtharja. what about the other pairings?

[Alastor15243]

ok so donnelxsully and gaiusxtharja. what about the other pairings?

ChromxSumia is by far the best option for both Lucina and Cynthia (barring the avatar for Lucina. Yes, only for Lucina, Chrom is a better father for Cynthia than the avatar, that's how good aether is), so do it.

Brady has all the skills he needs to be an excellent magic unit, all he wants are some stats, because the stats he gets from his mother are less than spectacular.

Owain just needs a proc, either vengeance or Luna, and he wants to be a mage. Libra and Henry can provide him with vengeance, while Ricken (and technically Kellam, but at a harsh speed penalty) can provide him with Luna. Ricken's probably his best option, because vengeance... well, I consider it pretty useless, especially on no-brave runs, and that's the only time you even need procs.

Inigo just wants Luna and tomefaire if he's gonna be magical. He's absurdly versatile and can be magical or physical. My favorite father for him is Frederick, and Frederick lets him also be one of the best dodgetanks in the game.

Laurent has pretty much everything he needs. Gregor is often recommended for him because it doesn't hurt his magic much and also gives him a lot more utility in-game, but giving him a leftover mage father is good too.

Gerome has no faires, which he desperately needs, so give him a father with a faire. My favorite is Henry because it lets him be a berserker with an accuracy bonus skill.

Yarne is the best hard support in the game. All he needs is hit+20 from either Stahl or Virion, or anathema from Henry or Libra, and he can be a fantastic berserker, which will raise the damage output of whatever pair he's in through the roof.

Nah can be physical or magical, and probably wants a proc too, because while she can't get galeforce, she can still end rounds, and if you're doing brave weapons, that increases damage output thanks to aggressor being in the back. Some good parents for her are Henry, Stahl, Vaike, Virion (doesn't offer a proc but lets her be a great bride support for owain or Brady or a magical Inigo or Male Morgan, just be warned that Nah's supports with Inigo are... how shall we say... distasteful at best, and vomit-inducing at worst.)

Severa has vengeance already, but if you don't like that, she needs Luna and maybe a faire. She does well fathered by Stahl (though her hair color with Stahl as her father is widely reviled) and Vaike. Frederick and Kellam are also options, but they hurt her speed and that's one of her strong suits. If you don't mind working with vengeance, you can have Lon'qu or Virion father her and she'll be fast enough to reach 75 speed with the right pair-up bonus and AS+2 as the incredibly slow wyvern lord class.

As for Morgan... Sumia!Lucina's the best mother if you're playing a male avatar, and Laurent, Gerome and Yarne make good fathers if you're playing female avatar, as long as you've built their specialty stats up properly.

Edited January 5, 2015 by Alastor15243

[Czar_Yoshi]

well obviously i don't want to use old information, but the idea for this kind of thing is to keep the first post updated with new information so that newcomers ( like me ) don't have to sift through hundreds of pages in the awakening general thread and this thread to find what they need. just a suggested pairing list and a brief explanation why would be great for casual players wanting to dig deeper. i understand that there's no definitive pairing set up. but you can make multiple lists and explain the difference between them. just the more information and the easier it is to find, the easier it is to get into the deeper mechanics of the game.

We'd try to do something like that if any of us had the OP. This thread is over a year old, though.

But what would you even put in the OP? A summary of the entire metagame? That would be better off as a full guide (which this game currently has none of (good ones, at least)), and there wasn't even much to summarize back than.

Anyway...

Avatar-M x Lucina > Chrom!Cynthia > Henry!Cynthia, Lon'qu/Virion!Severa, Gaius!Kjelle

Avatar-F x Chrom/Yarne/Owain/Laurent

Chrom x Sumia/Maribelle/Olivia

Lissa x Stahl/Ricken/Libra/Henry

Sully x Donnel/Gaius

Miriel x Ricken/Lon'qu/Gregor

Sumia x Chrom/Henry

Maribelle x Chrom/Virion/Lon'qu/Ricken/Libra/Henry

Panne x Fred/Virion/Stahl/Lon'qu/Gregor

Cordelia x Virion/Vaike/Stahl/Lon'qu/Ricken

Nowi x Virion/Vaike/Stahl/Gregor/Henry

Tharja x Donnel/Gaius

Olivia x Chrom/Fred/Stahl/Ricken/Libra/Henry

Cherche x Virion/Vaike/Stahl/Gregor/Henry

That's as close to a concise summary as there is.

Edited January 5, 2015 by Czar_Yoshi

[Alastor15243]

Hey Czar, is there anything cool that a galeboy with lancefaire can do? It just recently occurred to me that Morgan with a galeboy as a father can actually have both galeforce AND lancefaire if you have a FeMU marry Brady, Owain or Inigo (inigo, probably, because physical). I'm drawing blanks, it honestly seems like this niche is useless, and it sure sounds useless.

[Czar_Yoshi]

Lancefaire's main uses are as an alternate to SF for Paladin if you lack SF (Sumia!Lucina) and for Wyverns if you lack AF and/or a +Hit skill. But Morgan has SF and male Wyverns generally aren't that good, so Morgan doesn't need it.

[ShadowSlayer]

Need skills for Vaike!Nah and Fred!Yarne.

I have finished all the kids, except for Nah and Yarne (which I'm trying to find skillets for now.)

I'm using filler skills, that will shortly be replaced with Limit breaker, once i get the dlc.

Lucina-Great Lord: Filler,Aegis,Pavise,Galeforce,Aether

Cynthia-Falcon Knight: Galeforce,Aether,Luna,DG+,Filler

Brady-Sage:Galeforce,Luna,Lifetaker,Tomefaire,(and as a filler), Vengeance

Laurent-Sorc:VV,Tomefaire,DS+, Filler

Gerome-Wyvern Lord:Filler, AT,DS+, Axefaire,Sol

Severa-Hero: AT, Luna, Galeforce, (Vantage, as a filler), Swordfaire

Inigo-Hero:AT, VVW, Galeforce

Morgan-Sorc:VV,AT,Aether,Galeforce

Noire-Sniper:Counter,Lifetaker,Filler,Galeforce,Luna

Owain-Dread Fighter: Luna, Vantage, Galeforce, Astra, Swordfaire (thinking of Astra being the filler)

Kjelle-General: Filler, Luna, Aegis, Pavise, Galeforce

Nah- TBD

Yarne-TBD

Thanks!

[Kamui vi Britannia]

Vaike!Nah [Hero]- AT, Luna, Axefaire, All Stats +2, LB

Fred!Yarne [berserker]- Axefaire, Aggressor, All Stats +2, LB, Filler

Also if Virion is still available, use Virion!Yarne with Hit Rate +20 as the filler.

I think this is right, wait for someone else to back these up before you implement these.

Also pavgis is bad, Lucina's skills should be Luna/Aether/DS+/Gale/LB as a GL. Dark Flier Lucina can run Luna/DS+/Aether(or TF)/GF/LB.

Cynthia should be running Lancefaire over DG+ as a falco.

Brady should take Agg over Lifetaker and Luna over Vengeance (no setup required, all guys should have agg)

Laurent should take Agg over DS+ and use LB as filler.

Gerome should be a berserker with a set similar to yarne's.

Severa's good, take LB over Vantage.

Morgan's too good to be a sorc tool. Also which morgan?

Noire's counter is useless on Apo. Assuming Gaius!Noire: Luna/Astra/Bowfaire/GF/LB (Sniper)

If Owain has Luna, he should be a Sage with Luna/Agg/TF/GF/LB

General is a bad class for Apo, and pavgis is bad. Assuming Donnel!Kjelle: AT/Luna/Lancefaire/GF/LB (Paladin); can replace AT with Astra.

Judging from your planned Owain, you have dread fighter DLC. Make use of aggressor on every male unit. In addition, what exactly were your pairings? I was guessing based on certain listed skills (Cynthia having Aether, Kjelle having GF, etc.).

Edited January 5, 2015 by CloudJumper

[Owain_the_swordsman]

Vaike!Nah [Hero]- AT, Luna, Axefaire, All Stats +2, LB

Fred!Yarne [berserker]- Axefaire, Aggressor, All Stats +2, LB, Filler

He's missing a proc, that filler should be Luna.

[Kamui vi Britannia]

Luna's good, but if you don't want to bring him up front, Str+2 works well.

[ShadowSlayer]

Luna's good, but if you don't want to bring him up front, Str+2 works well.

I really want to keep Nah as a Manakete though, so what skills would work for that?

[Kamui vi Britannia]

Are you sure you want to use Nah as a Manakete? Manakete's are a no brave class, lack a -faire, and are kind of inferior to every class but GK, Taguel, and Trickster (unless you are doing a no-brave run, which if you are direct your questions to Alastor15243 since he is in the middle of one). Nah is actually better as NOT being a manakete. However, if you are set on this go with: Luna/All Stats +2/LB/Str+2/AT (filler or +Hit skill like Tantivity).

Also, my previous suggestion of Luna/Str+2 that you quoted was for Yarne not Nah.

Edited January 6, 2015 by CloudJumper

[Alastor15243]

Are you sure you want to use Nah as a Manakete? Manakete's are a no brave class, lack a -faire, and are kind of inferior to every class but GK, Taguel, and Trickster (unless you are doing a no-brave run, which if you are direct your questions to Alastor15243 since he is in the middle of one). Nah is actually better as NOT being a manakete. However, if you are set on this go with: Luna/All Stats +2/LB/Str+2/AT (filler or +Hit skill like Tantivity).

Also, my previous suggestion of Luna/Str+2 that you quoted was for Yarne not Nah.

Yeah, he mentioned his desire to use Manakete to me. I told him one important thing was to make sure her boyfriend could, at the very least, make the most out of the pair-up bonuses, so I recommended something like Dread Fighter Owain. As for skills...

Str+2, AS+2, LB, Luna, and... Hm... Usually the last spot would go to a faire...

I'd say either deliverer or acrobat to take advantage of her ending turns and thus being in front and making the first move.

[Kamui vi Britannia]

Yeah, he mentioned his desire to use Manakete to me. I told him one important thing was to make sure her boyfriend could, at the very least, make the most out of the pair-up bonuses, so I recommended something like Dread Fighter Owain. As for skills...

Str+2, AS+2, LB, Luna, and... Hm... Usually the last spot would go to a faire...

I'd say either deliverer or acrobat to take advantage of her ending turns and thus being in front and making the first move.

Okay, now his DF Owain makes sense. Deliverer would be the best use of the open slot since there's no point in using AT to preserve dragonstones.

[Czar_Yoshi]

He's missing a proc, that filler should be Luna.

Luna does nothing in the back, so no.

General is a bad class for Apo

It has some pretty massive weaknesses (Spd and Mov) but if you can find a way to make those not matter it's actually pretty good.

As for that team... There's a ton of stuff there that's not "optimal" but trying to fix it would basically change your whole team and you'll be able to beat Apo anyway so I doubt you'd want me to do that. The only really egregious stuff I see is that you're using AT without LB (you'll still lose your stuff, so it's not helping) and Wrath (Apo stuff has very high Dge, so crits won't help you much).

Be warned as well that VV Sorcs smell in general in Apo. The rest of your team will be able to carry you so they're not crippling or anything, but they'll mostly just be dead weight.

Oh, and Counter has no effect in Apo.

Edited January 6, 2015 by Czar_Yoshi

[Kamui vi Britannia]

I was just generalizing about the general class (no pun intended), It just didn't seem like the General Class would be useful on Kjelle specifically. Also, how good is Henry!Nah?

[Alastor15243]

Need skills for Vaike!Nah and Fred!Yarne.

I have finished all the kids, except for Nah and Yarne (which I'm trying to find skillets for now.)

I'm using filler skills, that will shortly be replaced with Limit breaker, once i get the dlc.

Lucina-Great Lord: Filler,Aegis,Pavise,Galeforce,Aether Why? She can do sage and you're a +Mag avatar, why would you do a physical class for her?

Cynthia-Falcon Knight: Galeforce,Aether,Luna,DG+,Filler DG+ is arguably less than worthless in Apotheosis, as it interferes with vengeance use if that's your thing. Falcon Knight is not the first class I'd recommend, I'd go for either DF or Sniper. Maybe General if you know what you're doing (But since you're just starting out, you don't).

Brady-Sage:Galeforce,Luna,Lifetaker,Tomefaire,(and as a filler), Vengeance Luna and Vengeance is superfluous, just use Luna (or I suppose vengeance, but I prefer Luna)

Laurent-Sorc:VV,Tomefaire,DS+, Filler VV isn't all it's cracked up to be honestly.

Gerome-Wyvern Lord:Filler, AT,DS+, Axefaire,Sol Gerome's gonna be in the back, he doesn't need a proc, much less sol.

Severa-Hero: AT, Luna, Galeforce, (Vantage, as a filler), Swordfaire Drop vantage.

Inigo-Hero:AT, VVW, Galeforce VV's barely worth it on mages, it's awful on something like a hero who can't use a brave two-rage weapon.

Morgan-Sorc:VV,AT,Aether,Galeforce Sniper's the way to go. Give your daughter a berserker boyfriend, load her out with LB, GF, Luna, Aether and Bowfaire, and she'll lay on serious hurt.

Noire-Sniper:Counter,Lifetaker,Filler,Galeforce,Luna Sniper's a good class for her, but you wanna put Luna/Astra on her.

Owain-Dread Fighter: Luna, Vantage, Galeforce, Astra, Swordfaire (thinking of Astra being the filler) Drop vantage, go LB/GF/Luna/Astra/Agg. No need for a faire since you'll likely be switching between swords and tomes often depending on the defensive skill the enemy has.

Kjelle-General: Filler, Luna, Aegis, Pavise, Galeforce Astra/Luna, don't go for defensive skills, tanking is useless in Apo.

Nah- TBD See my comment on the previous page

Yarne-TBD He generally wants LB/Agg/Axefaire/AS+2/Hit Skill as a berkserker

Thanks!

You seem to not be taking Limit Breaker into account in these skill sets. Also, none of the boys seem to have the incredibly awesome Aggressor skill. It's a must have on every single unit with a Y chromosome anywhere ever. Seriously.

I was just generalizing about the general class (no pun intended), It just didn't seem like the General Class would be useful on Kjelle specifically. Also, how good is Henry!Nah?

Heeheehee... don't get Czar_Yoshi started on Henry!Nah. He has a rather high opinion of it.

Edited January 6, 2015 by Alastor15243

[Kamui vi Britannia]

I think he said he was getting LB but didn't have it yet somewhere. I noticed the agg thing too, I thought he didn't have that DLC till I saw the DF Owain. Henry!Nah seems really cool...anathema with natural tomefaire access, a female magical hard support with excellent pair-up bonuses for a galeboy. What would be her exact set though? (Anathema/TF/As+2/LB/??)

Edited January 6, 2015 by CloudJumper