Radiant head Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Yeah I was going to make a Twilight comparison too. Next RD playthrough, I'm going to feed him to the Disciples as soon as I get the Matrona. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florete Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 She really only wins out by virtue of healing. Before promotion, she can Sacrifice which is useful. (cuz Laura is made of wet tissue) Thani bombing is fun cuz who doesnt love a weapon that smushes armors? If Soren has the same speed growth, why the hell does he always get speed faster than Micaiah does? Im not even talking about his bases either. I dont think "Because GMs" is a good enough answer for that. Micaiah's healing isn't a big deal. It's Thani bombing. It's his base, as well as his other stats capping quickly (his Spd cap is low enough that this still isn't a big deal, though). The GMs also fight weaker enemies in part 3 than the DB. So yeah, it's basically "bases and because GMs." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Laufeyson Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Micaiah's healing is a big deal though. Cuz its so Very Useful or should at least be a part of her edge as a unit in arguments about her performance. Bases is better than just "Because GMs" tho. Are you sure the enemies are weaker in their chapters though? Part 3 DB enemies seem to be the same as the GM enemies (and in some cases, much weaker). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florete Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Tigers in DB maps rival bosses in GM maps. It's pretty rough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mighty Kamina Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Tigers in DB maps rival bosses in GM maps. It's pretty rough. Yeah the tigers are really brutal in the DB chapters. They are much more dangerous than anything the GMs have to face. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Laufeyson Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Hmmm. I see! I wonder if they did that intentionally to help power-level the DB team. Like Nolan swinging Tarvos and every other time he did, he leveled up despite not having Paragon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintessence Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 I've never known why Sacrifice is praised when it is such a bad ability. Why would you go down to 1Hp or such and stay prone to a OHKO? Sacrifice is actually not zomg useful unless it is maaaaaybe 1-8 and you want to restore status afflictions, nothing more. Why would you use Sacrifice instead of spamming Heals with Laura when she's 1st Tier or spam Physic when she's 2nd or 3rd Tier? The only way I see Sacrifice being kinda useful is spamming it with Paragon and making her get some quick levels, otherwise Sacrifice is just a decoration ornament on her skill slot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Laufeyson Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 I've never known why Sacrifice is praised when it is such a bad ability. Why would you go down to 1Hp or such and stay prone to a OHKO? Sacrifice is actually not zomg useful unless it is maaaaaybe 1-8 and you want to restore status afflictions, nothing more. Why would you use Sacrifice instead of spamming Heals with Laura when she's 1st Tier or spam Physic when she's 2nd or 3rd Tier? The only way I see Sacrifice being kinda useful is spamming it with Paragon and making her get some quick levels, otherwise Sacrifice is just a decoration ornament on her skill slot. Sacrifice is nice to have when Laura doesnt exist. Not only that, but it still can level both characters up. Micaiah gets exp from Sacrifice and Laura (when she shows up) can heal Micaiah. /shrug Its Micaiah's second tier and up that is Really Useful because she can staves and that massive Mag growth means she can Physic from all over the fucking place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radiant head Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 (edited) Sacrifice is best used as a free Restore. Especially in 4-E-1. Edited January 31, 2015 by Radiant head Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bookofholsety Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 gotta love how micaiah is routinely accused of being a sue for... doing shit that ike already did almost word-for-word in fe9. GEE I WONDER WHAT THE MOTIVATION HERE COULD POSSIBLY BE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radiant head Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 I didn't know Ike was the secret theocratic king that know one knew about that's worshipped by everyone like a god. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Laufeyson Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 gotta love how micaiah is routinely accused of being a sue for... doing shit that ike already did almost word-for-word in fe9. GEE I WONDER WHAT THE MOTIVATION HERE COULD POSSIBLY BE Its actually not as nefarious as you think. Its because Ike had FE9 to develop as a character. Micaiah is kinda crammed into one game and doesnt get to hold the spotlight for all of it. So all her plot bombs are rushed in one part and it looks bad. If Micaiah had more time to develop, she'd likely be thought of as a pretty great character. If Ike wasnt in FE9, people would call him Sue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HF Makalov Fanboy Kai Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 speaking of sues, i find it really amusing. i ran all the lords threw a mary sue test, Ike scored the highest, with Micaiah only making 4th highest, Ephraim and Lyn beating her, but both of them still didn't score "Sue" only Ike did. and i know "Lol tv tropes is a bad site" and it is, but i find it amusing that Ike and Ephraim are both under "Canon Sue" catagory in the YMMV tab. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luchi Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Like many here, I used to think she was a Sue when I played the game back in 2011, but she's not. Poor Micaiah is a not only a victim of stat-hate, but also a victim of poor writing, bad game balance, and a certain spotlight stealing Lord in Part 3. :\ And yes, I am one of that tiny minority that thinks Ike is a borderline Gary Stu ( even if it wasn't for FE9 ). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B.Leu Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 (edited) TVtropes is bad ? How so ? It's not because a character is a Mary-sue that said character is bad, it's how you use it that matter, I don't think that Ephraim and Ike are Gary-sues, but crap, best Gary-sue ever then ! Micky is more complicated, she is in a game where the writing is bad, and where she is a part of the bad writing. And who the heck thought it was a good idea of create Corona anyway ?Everything is crappy, best answer ever. :P Edited January 31, 2015 by B.Leu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mekkah Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 (edited) I think the thing with Micaiah is that she's just not written very well and the first thing that comes to mind with poorly written female characters is "Mary Sue", especially with the Yune thing at the end. Things I didn't like personally that have to do with Micaiah: 1. Her relationship with Sothe. Since their long time being together is mostly offscreen, I find it feels forced. Sothe is ridiculously overprotective. Sothe: All right. I trust you. More importantly, I believe in you. I won't resist anymore. But let me just say one thing.Micaiah: What?Sothe: I will protect you.Micaiah: I know that! Why do you think you need to say it?Sothe: I just wanted to make sure you knew. [leaves] Since Micaiah rarely if ever returns what I suppose has to look like White Knightly Affection, it feels so off. 2. She makes really questionable decisions Micaiah is under more and more stress as the game goes on, but this is no excuse to reduce yourself to to the level of thinking of a five year old. Examples: - Being out there all alone (why did Sothe and Pelleas let that happen?) at the start of 1-9 - Letting Jarod, a man with nothing to lose and a huge want for revenge go after 1-9. The Black Knight is the one with the power to make the decision, but even he is surprised. Black Knight: My sword is not made for killing those who will not raise their weapons. (...) Micaiah: Stop! Stop it, both of you! A man has died protecting you. Don't waste his sacrifice! Black Knight: You would simply let him go?Micaiah: He is not ours to judge. He belongs to the apostle now. I suppose he must bury his fallen friend and pray before facing her. 3. Her prediction abilities People love these but we have no idea how exactly they work. Micaiah doesn't either. Edward: Hey, I have an idea... Micaiah, why don't you use your farsight to see when Leonardo will arrive? Micaiah: Edward, you know that's not how it works. I foresee some things, but I don't get to choose what I see. This is some very convenient writing as it lets the army follow Micaiah's plans on every whim even though there's other people around that are or feel qualified to lead. Nolan the "leader of the Dawn Brigade" who hasn't led it a single time, Tauroneo, Izuka. But then when Micaiah needs to stop having success it stops working in part 3. 4. Yune Her lines make me cringe so much. I think we have to assume Micaiah just met that bird one day and the name Yune magically appeared in her head just like her visions. Except the goddess Yune was sleeping all along so I don't really know how that works. Edited January 31, 2015 by Mekkah Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anacybele Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 (edited) I hate that some people like to compare Micaiah's story to Ike's because what Florina/Loki says is totally true, but honestly, how is being the secret-whatever of something a bad thing? I mean, Lyn was the secret heir of Caelin and a lot of people love her. That's not a bad thing in itself. Now in Micaiah's case, it was kinda written badly. It seemed completely out of nowhere. All of a sudden, Sanaki has a sister? Where did that come from? Edited January 31, 2015 by Anacybele Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radiant head Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Yeah, they start trying to hint at the apostle thing when the Senators are all "She's not the true apostle!!" but it's so random and out of nowhere that I just assumed they were getting desperate their ploy to strong-arm Sanaki was no longer working. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Laufeyson Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 (edited) 1. Her relationship with Sothe. Since their long time being together is mostly offscreen, I find it feels forced. Sothe is ridiculously overprotective. So much. Why the hell does she want to stick by him if he treats her like fucking dog shit? Hes constantly lecturing and mansplaining her. Speaking for her in some instances, which is just no. Its like, no wonder she bailed on him in the events of PoR. Fuck. I really have a problem with Sothe. Yeah, they start trying to hint at the apostle thing when the Senators are all "She's not the true apostle!!" but it's so random and out of nowhere that I just assumed they were getting desperate their ploy to strong-arm Sanaki was no longer working. I feel like there was a plot bomb missing from the previous game, tbh. Like they didnt really think about that particular bomb until RD's development. Everything else in the game plot-wise is foreshadowed in PoR. Lets take a look at the plot bombs: [spoiler=Tellius Wall of Text]Ashnard being involved with members of the Dragon tribe. Ena was working with him because of Rajaion. What was Rajaion doing in Daein? Ena gives us a bullshit answer of "He left Goldoa in pursuit of knowledge." but it becomes increasingly obvious that thats the bullshit answer Rajaion gave her. So what was Rajaion doing there? RD answers that question. So there was the foreshadowing that Almedha existed. There's also that nagging weirdness as to why Soren and Kurthnaga share an uncanny resemblance... Wtf is going on with Kilvas and why. Naesala is backstabbing everyone thrice over. Why? He sells Reyson to Oliver. Now, other than money, why the living fuck would he do that? Because Naesala is just a big asshole? Nope. It also wasnt just a ploy to extort Oliver either. Something funky up with that. Why is Naesala so reluctant to join in the fight against Ashnard? Hmmm....? Well RD answers that too. Naesala continues to backstab and it becomes obvious as to why once Lekain drops a plot bomb on Pelleas' dome. "That country remained under the senate's control for a very long time." Begnion senators were the ones who fucked up Serenes Forest and assassinated the Apostle. You can tell there was something fishy going on because of Oliver's overt actions in PoR and why arent his fellow senators doing anything? Cuz they are all in on it. Ashnard never ever mentions how hes the one responsible for that business. All we learn is that he took a heron. He wanted to revive Yune. Ok. But no mention of the massacre or owning up to Apostle murder. Hmm...The protags come up with the conclusion that Ashnard was responsible. Sephiran's "wtf" in the Epilogue when Ike explains is also telling. Blood pacts in general. Aside from Naesala's weirdness, Ashnard owns up to the fact he wiped out the bloodline. Tanith tells Ike about a bizarre plague that struck Daein before Ashnard took the throne. Hmmm...RD answers this. Ashnard used the blood pact to his advantage. Almedha knew about it cuz shes a witness. Elincia might have a hard time with things. Because in PoR, we are constantly reminded that the people of Crimea arent exactly in the know about her existence. So the scuffles she faces in part 2 are actually not out of nowhere. Zelgius = The Black Night. Greil says "I remember you...You think you can best me? The man who taught you how to fight? Come boy, try me." BK will go on about Gawain and junk. And BK's odd compliance to Sephiran. Whoa whats up with that? RD answers that. Sephiran in general. Hes pretty mysterious in PoR. He drops a massive foreshadow bomb during the Epilogue. Hints that hes not what he seems at all. Yune is not actually evil. Mist being able to touch the medallion and the herons being able to control it is foreshadowing this. Mist's song, etc. Micaiah and the DB guys actually exist. This is blink-and-you-miss-it though. Sothe mentions searching for someone who is very close to him. He also tells Ike about roaming his old stomping grounds when they are in Nevassa and meeting his old buddies. Dheginsea is Ashera's creature. His neutrality speaks a lot of volumes and his lecturing of the laguz kings in PoR is enough foreshadowing. Nasir's relationship with Goldoa ("I am uncomfortable around dragons") hints to this as well. Thats just about every major plot bomb on Tellius and yet theres nothing about Sanaki having a sister. Not one hint of foreshadowing. So i guess that one came only in development of RD. And it was rushed... Edited February 1, 2015 by Loki Laufeyson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radiant head Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 Tbh the Ashnard blood pact thing felt contrived to me. How does Ashnard control who dies? What if he died in the plague? I just prefer the idea that he used some kind of magic poison or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Laufeyson Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 Tbh the Ashnard blood pact thing felt contrived to me. How does Ashnard control who dies? What if he died in the plague? I just prefer the idea that he used some kind of magic poison or something. He owned up to it in PoR to Bryce. He goes on to say how all the royals dropped dead and he did it. We are lead to believe that he offed them one by one, but Tanith's comment (i believe its in chapter 21 base convo) about a strange plague that afflicted the royal family as well as others in Daein is interesting and leaves you going "huh?" Almedha talks about how Ashnard deliberately initiated the blood pact to get rid of that lot and that Ashnard's father signed a blood pact. Its not as contrived as it seems. While i dont think its the best plot device ever, its not like it came out of nowhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florete Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 Thats just about every major plot bomb on Tellius and yet theres nothing about Sanaki having a sister. Not one hint of foreshadowing. So i guess that one came only in development of RD. And it was rushed...Didn't Sanaki say since PoR that she'd never heard the voice of the goddess and just assumed she was too young? It's subtle, but it's something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 He owned up to it in PoR to Bryce. He goes on to say how all the royals dropped dead and he did it. We are lead to believe that he offed them one by one, but Tanith's comment (i believe its in chapter 21 base convo) about a strange plague that afflicted the royal family as well as others in Daein is interesting and leaves you going "huh?" Almedha talks about how Ashnard deliberately initiated the blood pact to get rid of that lot and that Ashnard's father signed a blood pact. Its not as contrived as it seems. While i dont think its the best plot device ever, its not like it came out of nowhere.It is chapter 21 and yeah, the whole blood pact deal didn't come out of nowhere I was a bit irritated in how the Ravens were dragged into it (this is coming from someone who doesn't like Naesala even), but they made his motivations confusing to me (in both games not even just RD). I know deep down he does care but still.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radiant head Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 (edited) He owned up to it in PoR to Bryce. He goes on to say how all the royals dropped dead and he did it. We are lead to believe that he offed them one by one, but Tanith's comment (i believe its in chapter 21 base convo) about a strange plague that afflicted the royal family as well as others in Daein is interesting and leaves you going "huh?" Almedha talks about how Ashnard deliberately initiated the blood pact to get rid of that lot and that Ashnard's father signed a blood pact. Its not as contrived as it seems. While i dont think its the best plot device ever, its not like it came out of nowhere. I'm not denying it coming from somewhere, I'm saying the idea is dumb. It is chapter 21 and yeah, the whole blood pact deal didn't come out of nowhere I was a bit irritated in how the Ravens were dragged into it (this is coming from someone who doesn't like Naesala even), but they made his motivations confusing to me (in both games not even just RD). I know deep down he does care but still.. Speaking of this, I've always wondered how someone like Naesala who builds a reputation of being really cunning would be tricked into signing a blood pact. At least with Pelleas, we know he was naive to a fault. (Although I also wonder how Jill, Zihark, and Tauraneo, etc. didn't recognize Izuka from PoR). Edited February 2, 2015 by Radiant head Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florete Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 Speaking of this, I've always wondered how someone like Naesala who builds a reputation of being really cunning would be tricked into signing a blood pact. At least with Pelleas, we know he was naive to a fault. (Although I also wonder how Jill, Zihark, and Tauraneo, etc. didn't recognize Izuka from PoR).If I recall correctly, Naesala inherited the blood pact from the previous ruler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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